Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads

[Tigerick]

Wildcat Lake (WCL) Specs

Intel Wildcat Lake (WCL) is upcoming mobile SoC replacing Raptor Lake-U. WCL consists of 2 tiles: compute tile and PCD tile. It is true single die consists of CPU, GPU and NPU that is fabbed by 18-A process. Last time I checked, PCD tile is fabbed by TSMC N6 process. They are connected through UCIe, not D2D; a first from Intel. Expecting launching in Q1 2026.

		Intel Raptor Lake U	Intel Wildcat Lake 15W?	Intel Lunar Lake		Intel Panther Lake 4+0+4
Launch Date		Q1-2024	Q2-2026	Q3-2024		Q1-2026
Model		Intel 150U	Intel Core 7	Core Ultra 7 268V		Core Ultra 7 365
Dies		2	2	2		3
Node		Intel 7 + ?	Intel 18-A + TSMC N6	TSMC N3B + N6		Intel 18-A + Intel 3 + TSMC N6
CPU		2 P-core + 8 E-cores	2 P-core + 4 LP E-cores	4 P-core + 4 LP E-cores		4 P-core + 4 LP E-cores
Threads		12	6	8		8
Max Clock		5.4 GHz	?	5 GHz		4.8 GHz
L3 Cache		12 MB		12 MB		12 MB
TDP		15 - 55 W	15 W ?	17 - 37 W		25 - 55 W
Memory		128-bit LPDDR5-5200	64-bit LPDDR5	128-bit LPDDR5x-8533		128-bit LPDDR5x-7467
Size		96 GB		32 GB		128 GB
Bandwidth				136 GB/s
GPU		Intel Graphics	Intel Graphics	Arc 140V		Intel Graphics
RT		No	No	YES		YES
EU / Xe		96 EU	2 Xe	8 Xe		4 Xe
Max Clock		1.3 GHz	?	2 GHz		2.5 GHz
NPU		GNA 3.0	18 TOPS	48 TOPS		49 TOPS

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.

 

[poke01]

I feel like Intel are going to bring their "A" game back for Lunar Lake. They have a bit of swagger about them, nice to see.

Yep, Lunar Lake is a great product. No else not AMD not QC has what Intel has with Lunar to compete with M4.

Intel played it smart.

 

[Markfw]

Yep, Lunar Lake is a great product. No else not AMD not QC has what Intel has with Lunar to compete with M4.

Intel played it smart.

If it had SMT and avx-512, I could consider one. But I think both are missing, right ?

 

[gdansk]

If it had SMT and avx-512, I could consider one. But I think both are missing, right ?

Arrow Lake is the one you'd consider if it had those.
But it doesn't. I think, though, some future Skymont swarm product should be right up your alley even without those. Is it Clearwater Forest? Something like that.

 

[poke01]

If it had SMT and avx-512, I could consider one. But I think both are missing, right ?

Yes they are missing but SMT going away is fine with how Skymont is doing.

 

[Ghostsonplanets]

Arrow Lake is the one you'd consider if it had those.
But it doesn't. I think, though, some future Skymont swarm product should be right up your alley even without those. Is it Clearwater Forest? Something like that.

CWF should be Darkmont.

 

[gdansk]

CWF should be Darkmont.

Oh didn't know it was different. There's no Skymont one?

 

[Hulk]

It got deleted but it will be announced officially in a few hours.

ARL-S
5.7ghz 1T boost clocks
5.4ghz nT boost clocks
4.6ghz e-core clocks

Z890 boards at computex are shown to be supporting CAMM2 memory.

As of now it appears that

Thanks. Clocks are a bit better than expected. I was thinking 10% regression. This is more like 5% and of course an increase for Skymont, which makes me think there was a big architectural overhaul for Skymont.

Okay, seems like they've got the clocks. Now they need that enormous IPC increase on Skymont, at least 10% on Lion Cove, and some efficiency/power improvements.

 

[poke01]

Now they need that enormous IPC increase on Skymont,

They got one.
Intel might be goood. It’s giant u-turn from 2 weeks ago.

 

[Saylick]

It got deleted but it will be announced officially in a few hours.

ARL-S
5.7ghz 1T boost clocks
5.4ghz nT boost clocks
4.6ghz e-core clocks

Z890 boards at computex are shown to be supporting CAMM2 memory.

As of now it appears that

Dang, kudos to Intel if true.

 

[H433x0n]

Best part about ARL-S is Z890 IMO. The CAMM2 support is super cool, it apparently nets an additional +400Mts memory support alone over SODIMM.

 

[poke01]

Best part about ARL-S is Z890 IMO. The CAMM2 support is super cool, it apparently nets an additional +400Mts memory support alone over SODIMM.

One of the advantages of having to refresh platforms every 2 gens

 

[gdansk]

One of the advantages of having to refresh platforms every 2 gens

What stops e.g. Z790 from using CAMM2?
I thought MSI showed off such a thing.

 

[adroc_thurston]

What stops e.g. Z790 from using CAMM2?
I thought MSI showed off such a thing.

Nothing, they're bolting LPCAMM on MTLs just fine.
It's a form-factor, not platform-related.
The same way socketed ITX mobos have SODIMMs here and there.

 

[StinkyPinky]

What stops e.g. Z790 from using CAMM2?
I thought MSI showed off such a thing.

Yes, this is the board

https://us.msi.com/Motherboard/Z790-PROJECT-ZERO

 

[poke01]

What stops e.g. Z790 from using CAMM2?
I thought MSI showed off such a thing.

What I meant was since Intel makes you upgrade every 2 generations, that means you have to get a new motherboard along with your new CPU and this time ARL boards come with newer memory standards.

AM5 will last a long time and most Zen 4 users will likely not upgrade their motherboard because of AMDs long platform support. There are advantages to both strategies. If I had to choose I would prefer AM5, cause motherhood upgrades are a pain. I prefer a CPU upgrade on the same platform unless the other team brings massive improvements.

 

[Mahboi]

If it didn't take me 15 hours, I'd be making a "The Arrow Lake Hype Tomb" video right now.
I'm not telling you not to believe, believe all you like. Just remember, hype trains crash, ours just did, and hype mines sometimes crumble on you too.

Spoiler

Yes it would be Indiana Jones based. I could probably make a great scene of Pat pulling the heart out of the P Core dev team screaming KALI MAAAAAAAA

Spoiler

 

[Ghostsonplanets]

Sneak Peek: AI Playground, AI Made Easy For Intel® Arc™ GPUs – Intel Gaming Access

game.intel.com

Intel announced AI Playground for Arc Graphics (>8GB VRAM) and Arc Graphics integrated (>= 16GB RAM) from Lunar Lake and beyond( except MTL-U, ARL-U and ARL-S/HX due to usage of XMX)

 

[Hulk]

I care not for AI. Show me the CPU's!!!

 

[Saylick]

I care not for AI. Show me the CPU's!!!

But... but you can use AI to hallucinate show you the CPUs.

 

[Hulk]

But... but you can use AI to hallucinate show you the CPUs.

The AI in CPU's is a scam!

 

[Joe NYC]

I care not for AI. Show me the CPU's!!!

I wonder if AI could create a digest, stripping away all the AI fluff...

 

[tamz_msc]

Chadmont in action.

 

[Saylick]

AT has the LNL slides up:

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[SarahKerrigan]

Skymont looks quite fierce.

 

[SarahKerrigan]

Also, not too sure about calling a 4-cyc 48K d-cache an "L0" but maybe there's something I'm missing. Their "L0" sounds to me very much like an L1, and their "L1" sounds very much like an L2.