Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads

[Tigerick]

Wildcat Lake (WCL) Preliminary Specs

Intel Wildcat Lake (WCL) is upcoming mobile SoC replacing ADL-N. WCL consists of 2 tiles: compute tile and PCD tile. It is true single die consists of CPU, GPU and NPU that is fabbed by 18-A process. Last time I checked, PCD tile is fabbed by TSMC N6 process. They are connected through UCIe, not D2D; a first from Intel. Expecting launching in Q2/Computex 2026. In case people don't remember AlderLake-N, I have created a table below to compare the detail specs of ADL-N and WCL. Just for fun, I am throwing LNL and upcoming Mediatek D9500 SoC.

		Intel Alder Lake - N	Intel Wildcat Lake	Intel Lunar Lake		Mediatek D9500
Launch Date		Q1-2023	Q2-2026 ?	Q3-2024		Q3-2025
Model		Intel N300	?	Core Ultra 7 268V		Dimensity 9500 5G
Dies		2	2	2		1
Node		Intel 7 + ?	Intel 18-A + TSMC N6	TSMC N3B + N6		TSMC N3P
CPU		8 E-cores	2 P-core + 4 LP E-cores	4 P-core + 4 LP E-cores		C1 1+3+4
Threads		8	6	8		8
Max Clock		3.8 GHz	?	5 GHz
L3 Cache		6 MB	?	12 MB
TDP		7 W	Fanless ?	17 W		Fanless
Memory		64-bit LPDDR5-4800	64-bit LPDDR5-6800 ?	128-bit LPDDR5X-8533		64-bit LPDDR5X-10667
Size		16 GB	?	32 GB		24 GB ?
Bandwidth			~ 55 GB/s	136 GB/s		85.6 GB/s
GPU		UHD Graphics		Arc 140V		G1 Ultra
EU / Xe		32 EU	2 Xe	8 Xe		12
Max Clock		1.25 GHz		2 GHz
NPU		NA	18 TOPS	48 TOPS		100 TOPS ?

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.

 

[Tigerick]

Lunar lake is a next year product? A year after MTL?
Then next year Arrow Lake is only a desktop product, right?

ARL and LNL are similar in CPU and GPU architectures: ARL uses tiles based design and LNL uses monolithic design (CPU + PCH). You can refer to this thread Arc GPU for more info regarding GT3 on Lunar Lake and ARL (ARL might need ADM). They could complement each others, below is lineup that I think Intel would provide:

• Core Ultra 9 Processor 2xxU: LNL 4P+4E with Intel Arc Graphics GT3 (made by TSMC N3B)
• Core Ultra 7 Processor 2xxU: LNL 4P+4E with Intel Arc Graphics GT2
• Core Ultra 5 Processor 2xxU: ARL 2P+8E with Intel Arc Graphics GT2 (tCPU is made by Intel 20A)
• Core Ultra 3 Processor 2xxU: ARL 2P+8E with Intel Graphics GT1

 

[mikk]

ARL-P GT3= 320 EUs according to the old Intel slide. GT5 does not exist. Also keep in mind LNL is using Xe2 instead of Xe1.

No mention of Lunar Lake in any of Intels future nodes:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1669696670282690560

It is pretty obvious LNL is using some external node. I would guess 18A future Lake Client refers to Panther Lake?

 

[Geddagod]

ARL-P GT3= 320 EUs according to the old Intel slide. GT5 does not exist. Also keep in mind LNL is using Xe2 instead of Xe1.

No mention of Lunar Lake in any of Intels future nodes:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1669696670282690560

It is pretty obvious LNL is using some external node. I would guess 18A future Lake Client refers to Panther Lake?

Never saw this slide before.
Weird how SRF is shown with the same setup as GNR, thought it was all but confirmed it was just one compute tile with 144 E-cores.

 

[Exist50]

ARL and LNL are similar in CPU and GPU architectures

Reasonably sure that's not true for the GPU.

 

[nicalandia]

Interesting..

Top Processor Arithmetic Ranks

ranker.sisoftware.co.uk

 

[msj10]

ARL-P GT3= 320 EUs according to the old Intel slide. GT5 does not exist. Also keep in mind LNL is using Xe2 instead of Xe1.

No mention of Lunar Lake in any of Intels future nodes:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1669696670282690560

It is pretty obvious LNL is using some external node. I would guess 18A future Lake Client refers to Panther Lake?

also no Diamond Rapids on 18A?

 

[mikk]

Arrow Lake-S: 2024Q4-2025Q1

TSMC N3 Up to 8P+16e

https://twitter.com/x/status/1669765306993238017

 

[Glo.]

Arrow Lake-S: 2024Q4-2025Q1

TSMC N3 Up to 8P+16e

https://twitter.com/x/status/1669765306993238017

The only thing that is interesting for me: are we going to see 8+16 in configuration with 256 EU iGPU in any way, shape or form.

 

[aigomorla]

Refresh usually comes with thermal improvements, and on X chips, better overclocking.
Refreshes are also typically 1 yr, but Saph Rapids, wasn't even formally launched until april, with parts not even being available outside OEM partners late earily June without price gouging.

Now its going to give people a reason not to buy until the 3500 series are out, and were back in this waiting cycle all over again.

 

[ondma]

Arrow Lake-S: 2024Q4-2025Q1

TSMC N3 Up to 8P+16e

https://twitter.com/x/status/1669765306993238017

Disappointing. I thought AL was supposed to be on Intel 20A and the GPU tile was TSMC. Also was hoping for an earlier release than 2025. (I am assuming if they say Q4 24 to Q1 25, it will actually be the later part of that window. Was also hoping for 8+32 configuration. Zen 5, if it comes out on time, and it is supposedly on track, is going to kill RL refresh.

 

[Geddagod]

Disappointing. I thought AL was supposed to be on Intel 20A and the GPU tile was TSMC. Also was hoping for an earlier release than 2025. (I am assuming if they say Q4 24 to Q1 25, it will actually be the later part of that window. Was also hoping for 8+32 configuration. Zen 5, if it comes out on time, and it is supposedly on track, is going to kill RL refresh.

ARL is rumored to be on both 20A (laptop) and TSMC 3nm (desktop)
Q4 2024 to Q1 2025 might also mean K series in Q4 2024, and the non-K parts in 2025. ADL followed the same pattern. I highly doubt Intel won't paper launch ARL in Q4 2024 just to hit deadlines.

 

[Exist50]

Never saw this slide before.
Weird how SRF is shown with the same setup as GNR, thought it was all but confirmed it was just one compute tile with 144 E-cores.

I wouldn't read too much into those images. Whoever assembled that slide wasn't going for pinpoint accuracy. Probably just reusing existing "stock" images. Having said that, between GNR and SRF, there will likely products on 1, 2, and 3 tiles, if you believe the 2x144c SRF AP rumor.

Fun fact. That "Custom Networking ASIC" on Intel 4 has been pictured and posted to social media by its customer, if you're interested in a scavenger hunt.

 

[A///]

cisco innit?

 

[Exist50]

cisco innit?

Nope.

 

[A///]

Nope.

give it up exist. some of us might croak in our sleep.

 

[itsmydamnation]

well there are only a few company that make networking chips

nvidia
broadcom
HP/aruba
Cisco
Juniper

and i have pretty much run out of names.

 

[Exist50]

give it up exist. some of us might croak in our sleep.

This seem to fit the bill ? Not a leak or anything. Just grabbed a pic off social media. And cropped it to keep things interesting .

 

[A///]

2 bottles of wine in and he expects me to figure it out.

 

[clemsyn]

Nope.

Amazon? Broadcom?

 

[hemedans]

well there are only a few company that make networking chips

nvidia
broadcom
HP/aruba
Cisco
Juniper

and i have pretty much run out of names.

Dont Forget Nokia, they have Strong collaboration with Intel for years, Also they have been reported to use Intel Foundry.

 

[clemsyn]

Dont Forget Nokia, they have Strong collaboration with Intel for years, Also they have been reported to use Intel Foundry.

Interesting, you could be right about Nokia. Looks kinda similar

 

[Exist50]

None of the above

 

[Abwx]

well there are only a few company that make networking chips

nvidia
broadcom
HP/aruba
Cisco
Juniper

and i have pretty much run out of names.

AMD as well, as far as we re talking of cloud dedicated networks.

AMD: Pensando gives us better-than-AWS networking tech

Equip Amazon rivals with flexible networking chips? Sounds Epyc

www.theregister.com

 

[Joe NYC]

Lunar Lake is supposed to be a 2024 product. As in, if they don't hit post-silicon delays, it will launch in 2024, full stop.

The latest roadmap on Tom's Hardware that goes to 2025 does not have Lunar Lake on it:

Raptor Lake Refresh CPUs Reportedly Launch In October

Refresh season is right around the corner.

www.tomshardware.com

 

[Joe NYC]

Disappointing. I thought AL was supposed to be on Intel 20A and the GPU tile was TSMC. Also was hoping for an earlier release than 2025. (I am assuming if they say Q4 24 to Q1 25, it will actually be the later part of that window. Was also hoping for 8+32 configuration. Zen 5, if it comes out on time, and it is supposedly on track, is going to kill RL refresh.

MLID had multiple CPU dies of Arrow Lake in one of his leaks. 3 high end dies on TSMC (including 8+32), 2 low end dies on Intal 20A.

There is still enough time to make adjustment to the Arrow Lake roadmap. It is possible Intel is cutting costs and reducing the number of different CPU dies Arrow Lakes will have to choose from...