Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread

[DrMrLordX]

Shouldn't this be in the video section ?

IceLake = Gen11

Though Intel's Xe dGPU will also be based on Gen11, I think . . .

 

[jpiniero]

Though Intel's Xe dGPU will also be based on Gen11, I think . . .

No, Gen12.

 

[DrMrLordX]

No, Gen12.

You mean Xe?

I'm seeing some conflicting info here. Actually it looks like Intel will rebrand its graphics generations entirely after Xe comes out.

 

[Dayman1225]

You mean Xe?

I'm seeing some conflicting info here. Actually it looks like Intel will rebrand its graphics generations entirely after Xe comes out.

Yes. After Gen11 they are changing to Xe which was formerly Gen12.

Just in case it wasn’t clear tho, Chris Hook clarified that Xe is just an arch nomenclature

https://twitter.com/x/status/1091725862926336000

 

[Markfw]

Yes. After Gen11 they are changing to Xe which was formerly Gen12.

Just in case it wasn’t clear tho, Chris Hook clarified that Xe is just an arch nomenclature

https://twitter.com/x/status/1091725862926336000

So to be clear for those of us in the fog, this is the graphics of the video on the CPU chip, right ?

 

[Dayman1225]

So to be clear for those of us in the fog, this is the graphics of the video on the CPU chip, right ?

Yes, Gen11 is still integrated graphics only.

 

[Gideon]

Lenovo 2019 refresh specs, release dates, and comparison charts: X series, T series, L series, P1

X1 Yogo with Icelake launching in June
X1 Carbon with Icelake launching in August

 

[jpiniero]

Lenovo 2019 refresh specs, release dates, and comparison charts: X series, T series, L series, P1

X1 Yogo with Icelake launching in June
X1 Carbon with Icelake launching in August

Sure kind of confirms that Icelake isn't going to be that widely available. The other 10 models that are being refreshed are all Whiskey Lake or Coffee Lake-H. But it will be interesting to see if they do actually get a laptop out in June even if it's in minuscule quantities.

 

[amdfan111]

Pretty much goes to show that Ice Lake is a paper product. They can barely produce enough for two super-niche products, and meanwhile the bread and butter is still on the "well-aged" 14 nm variants (Whiskey, Coffee, Vodka...). The "improving" 10 nm yields are a slight of hand, and meanwhile we already have 7 nm products from the competitor...

 

[jpiniero]

The "improving" 10 nm yields are a slight of hand, and meanwhile we already have 7 nm products from the competitor...

I'm sure the yields are much better but still horrifically bad. Not sure if I totally believe him, but Charlie was saying that Cannonlake's yield was in the single digits % even accounting for the IGP being disabled which is like 2/3 of the chip. So this is an improvement in that they are actually able to ship enough for actual products even if it's only a very small fraction of sales.

My guess is that the i5 is either 40 or 48 EU btw.

 

[tamz_msc]

It looks like the Gen 11 iGPU smokes Vega Mobile in performance on GFXBench.


https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?be...AMD+Ryzen+7+2700U+with+Radeon+Vega+Mobile+Gfx

 

[NostaSeronx]

GG, AMD. Went Zen and lost the GPU lead.

Isn't even the integrated Xe, nor is it Willowcove. Which are obviously going to be better than Sunny/G11.

So, while Intel goes revolutionary; Tigerlake is Xe. AMD is stuck in evolutionary design; Renoir is Vega.

 

[Gideon]

It looks like the Gen 11 iGPU smokes Vega Mobile in performance on GFXBench.


https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx50&did1=72347583&os1=Windows&api1=gl&hwtype1=iGPU&hwname1=Intel(R)+Iris(R)+Plus+Graphics+940+ReleaseInternal&D2=AMD+Ryzen+7+2700U+with+Radeon+Vega+Mobile+Gfx

Yeah I mentioned it a while back as almost assured, after it became clare that Icelake is using 3200 Mhz LPDDR4 (it's a shame that Picasso doesn't support that).
Worth to keep in mind that Vega is heavily BW bound as well as 2500U is actually faster than the 2700U you compared to.

Still AMD really needs Zen 2 and Na'Vi in mobile to be competitive with Icelake

 

[LTC8K6]

Render quality seems to strongly favor AMD.

 

[tamz_msc]

Still AMD really needs Zen 2 and Na'Vi in mobile to be competitive with Icelake

AFAIK Navi APUs will come with Zen 3. Zen 2 APUs are still Vega.

 

[DrMrLordX]

GG, AMD. Went Zen and lost the GPU lead.

Just think, they could have stayed with Con cores and lost on both fronts!

It looks like the Gen 11 iGPU smokes Vega Mobile in performance on GFXBench.


https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx50&did1=72347583&os1=Windows&api1=gl&hwtype1=iGPU&hwname1=Intel(R)+Iris(R)+Plus+Graphics+940+ReleaseInternal&D2=AMD+Ryzen+7+2700U+with+Radeon+Vega+Mobile+Gfx

Heh.

https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?be...hwtype2=GPU&hwname2=Apple+Inc.+Apple+A12X+GPU

 

[jpiniero]

http://ranker.sisoftware.net/show_r...efdbe2d6e6d7e5c3b18cbc9aff9aa797b1c2ffc7&l=en

Icelake 24 EU version spotted?

 

[coercitiv]

Heh.

https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx50&did1=72347583&os1=Windows&api1=gl&hwtype1=iGPU&hwname1=Intel(R)+Iris(R)+Plus+Graphics+940+ReleaseInternal&did2=69121342&os2=iOS&api2=metal&hwtype2=GPU&hwname2=Apple+Inc.+Apple+A12X+GPU

Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!

 

[DrMrLordX]

Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!

Indeed.

Truth is that AMD's iGPUs haven't really improved much in . . . awhile. It's obviously no longer a priority for them. They don't care and/or don't have the resources to keep improving performance. Apple had them whipped months ago. Now it's Intel's turn.

 

[coffeemonster]

It looks like the Gen 11 iGPU smokes Vega Mobile in performance on GFXBench.


https://gfxbench.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=gfx50&did1=72347583&os1=Windows&api1=gl&hwtype1=iGPU&hwname1=Intel(R)+Iris(R)+Plus+Graphics+940+ReleaseInternal&D2=AMD+Ryzen+7+2700U+with+Radeon+Vega+Mobile+Gfx

need to know what machine the tested 2700u is in. If you follow the ryzen laptop market at all you'll know a lot of OEM offerings with raven ridge underperform for various silly reasons.

I'd be interested to see how the Gen 11 igpu compares to mobile vega when techepiphany gets his hands on one. Here's what the desktop vega APU can do when tweaked.

 

[Thunder 57]

Shouldn't this be expected? Iris Plus means some sort of eDRAM, right? Tom's has a piece on it compared to Vega 10/11. Vega 11 does much better, but of course also has much more TDP to play with.

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-ice-lake-gen11-gt2,38673.html

 

[jpiniero]

Shouldn't this be expected? Iris Plus means some sort of eDRAM, right?

No, but it has much higher bandwidth. It could be as high as LPDDR4 4266.

 

[Thunder 57]

No, but it has much higher bandwidth. It could be as high as LPDDR4 4266.

Ah, OK. Well then, hopefully AMD put a lot of work in to there IMC and can reach speeds higher than 2400. At least 3200 should give it a huge boost, but obviously the more than squeeze out of it the better.

 

[jpiniero]

Ah, OK. Well then, hopefully AMD put a lot of work in to there IMC and can reach speeds higher than 2400. At least 3200 should give it a huge boost, but obviously the more than squeeze out of it the better.

I should add that I wouldn't expect the 64 EU model to be close to Vega 10, let alone faster in actual games, even with the bandwidth difference. Maybe in some titles close to Vega 8. I just don't think AMD bothers to optimize the drivers for Gfxbench at all compared to what is normally done for a title.

 

[NostaSeronx]

Just think, they could have stayed with Con cores and lost on both fronts!

I have thought about it. They most likely would have been ahead since 2014. If they kept the commitment to their earlier roadmap. Also, GlobalFoundries wouldn't have taken such huge losses in 2014/2015 to pay out Samsung.

They missed out on Posits/Valids in the late decade for GPUs. https://posithub.org/about
They missed out on the QuadFMA. AMD got AVX in only two quarters after Intel, and AMD could probably have implemented AVX512 in 2015~2016 on the exclusive 14nm GlobalFoundries process.