Beemster
Member
- May 7, 2018
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He only said your dots are annoying as hell, but he typed ...... instead of the word "dots".
OK. It's my bad. I didn't pick up on it. I apologize to EUG
He only said your dots are annoying as hell, but he typed ...... instead of the word "dots".
Might have to be a little conservative on base clocks for quality yield reasons, even if functional yield is close to 100%. I imagine the 8C Turbo will be pretty high.
Remember that there isn't going to be any i5 models yielded from the 8C die unless Intel changes their mind.
It's crazy if intel just throw away the die if it can't qualified as 8 core chip. And no matter how much mature the process the yield can't be 100 %, there must be some defective die in the waffer, heck even console Apu must reserve some die space to be sacrificed to achieve near perfect yield.
Do you have any numbers backing that up, or are you projecting your own wishes to the rest of the population?
I can imagine MANY uses for a powerful CPU with an IGP. Business professionals for example. Accountants; engineers; programmers; scientists; multimedia editing; anyone who does number crunching in simulations, models, etc. A large number of use cases don't need any GPU power at all, but no one wants their $100K+/year employees sitting on their hands waiting for their computer to finish its task. Sure some of those uses may also need a GPU (if the multimedia editing goes into video encoding for example), but most do not need any GPU when the IGP is plenty powerful enough.
I see. So 8 core is miraculously going to be in high demand from all these 'business professionals'? Or is that 8 core just wasn't in high demand until intel side saddled one with their brutal igp? Nah, today an 8 core with an igp will fill a small niche but nothing of substance. Most needing 8 cores will be looking at attaching a dGPU.
I see. So 8 core is miraculously going to be in high demand from all these 'business professionals'? Or is that 8 core just wasn't in high demand until intel side saddled one with their brutal igp? Nah, today an 8 core with an igp will fill a small niche but nothing of substance. Most needing 8 cores will be looking at attaching a dGPU.
You have been given numerous examples of situations where an iGPU is very much useful, but you are simply doubling down. You are stating your opinion as fact.
An enormous amount of OEM PC's can be sold with a 6 or 8 core chip and benefit from an iGPU. It space, power, and money. How many Zen CPU's were sold by OEM's before Raven Ridge? Probably not a ton. An iGPU is basically required except for special cases.
OEMs do want the IGP though. Plus it'd be helpful for power saving if Intel does do a 8C mobile part.
Having an iGPU is extremely handy/useful, as it allows testing/troubleshooting if there is a problem with your GPU.
I wish there was a small iGPU on Ryzen's mainstream for example
Do you have any numbers backing that up, or are you projecting your own wishes to the rest of the population?
I can imagine MANY uses for a powerful CPU with an IGP. Business professionals for example. Accountants; engineers; programmers; scientists; multimedia editing; anyone who does number crunching in simulations, models, etc. A large number of use cases don't need any GPU power at all, but no one wants their $100K+/year employees sitting on their hands waiting for their computer to finish its task. Sure some of those uses may also need a GPU (if the multimedia editing goes into video encoding for example), but most do not need any GPU when the IGP is plenty powerful enough.
Probably musicians too. (Are you including that in multimedia editing?) Multicore, with fast single-core and dual-core Turbo speed and lots of RAM. GPU basically irrelevant as long as it can display everything on-screen properly (2D) on multiple monitors.
The iGPU will be useful in business PCs, which make up a large chunk of the desktop market. Don't underestimate the value of the iGPU for people who will benefit from more CPU grunt and only need minimal GPU/media capabilities.
Sure there is a use for an iGPU in some niche markets like i said.
Oh I'm sure there will be a small niche that will only require 8 CPU cores and a display out, but most interested in an 8 core CPU are going to be adding a discrete card. For those people that anemic igp is just wasted die space.
I don't see any numerous examples, all i see are theories based on nothing and certainly not fact. Sure there is a use for an iGPU in some niche markets like i said. Although those markets become even smaller given the poor performance of intel's graphics. .
I don't see any numerous examples, all i see are theories based on nothing and certainly not fact. Sure there is a use for an iGPU in some niche markets like i said. Although those markets become even smaller given the poor performance of intel's graphics. Doubling down? lol you are just repeating what seems like a marketing pitch, and if i'm stating my opinion as fact, so are you. Pot meet kettle.
The die space taken up is kind of silly in Cannonlake and Icelake though.
We don't really know this, even though its likely a good guess. Based on early Purley documents, even some Xeon server chips were going to have Cannonlake's iGPU. Expect iGPU usage to increase, not go the other way around.
Pretty sure that was just QuickSync, and it was on the Server's PCH.
Are you somehow invested in being against iGPUs? Or are you just slow to change your way of thinking?
Motherboards, systems, even the chip design of the LGA115x processor is based on having the iGPU. You can cut the connectors for the iGPU display out from the motherboards, but the circuits will be there, unless they design from the ground up.
Why do you think a 8 core chip with an iGPU is a niche market? What's "niche" in your definition? 5%? Certainly the 8 core Coffeelake will be more towards enthusiasts than the rest, but there's enough that need a good CPU without needing discrete graphics. The thing is the iGPU provides an extra feature.
-Enthusiasts: Troubleshooting, extra display out, power saving
-Multi monitor support is a market by itself
-AIOs which happen to be a fast growing market
-Office PCs, those that only do 2D work, those that just want a fast general PC
We don't really know this, even though its likely a good guess. Based on early Purley documents, even some Xeon server chips were going to have Cannonlake's iGPU. Expect iGPU usage to increase, not go the other way around.
An 8 core 16 thread chip is a waste of money for these purposes, and the only way they would sell more than niche is from 'aggressive' marketing and a dominant position in the industry.
So far my experience with Intel's video decoder has been pretty bad. The quality has been subpar compared to Nvidia. From image processing to deinterlacing (and motion).It is an interesting discussion. My wife and I use 4-6 cores but iGPU's, not dGPU's. Our kids use four CPU cores and dGPU's. My wife and I do not play games; our kids do. There seems to be a place for both. Intel's iGPU's play streaming video, so they are adequate.
What Intel decoder have you tried?So far my experience with Intel's video decoder has been pretty bad. The quality has been subpar compared to Nvidia. From image processing to deinterlacing (and motion).
I mean the hardware decoder, using Microsoft's codecs.What Intel decoder have you tried?
Are you somehow invested in being against iGPUs? Or are you just slow
This one?I think you are confusing QuickAssist on the server chipsets with QuickSync. The presentation said "Cannonlake graphics and media". They put that in the accelerator section along with FPGAs.