If the US defaults (doesn't raise ceiling in time) who would get the fall out?

[spacejamz]

Nope. Ask the public who caused the shutdown in the 90s.

There was a shutdown in the 90's???

The attention span of the American public has been reduced to nano seconds now and the majority probably won't even remember what happened in the 90's....

 

[Munky]

What have the Repugs done? They said employment was their top priority. It seems like they've submitted bills for every nutball cause they have but haven't submitted even one bill to help unemployment. They are liars and are trying to hurt the economy for their own political gain.

Again, what have Obama and the Dems done while they had control of WH and Congress to fix unemployment? Pointing fingers at Repubs doesn't count.

 

[Blackjack200]

There was a shutdown in the 90's???

The attention span of the American public has been reduced to nano seconds now and the majority probably won't even remember what happened in the 90's....

I remember that shutdown pretty clearly and I was in high school - quite possibly the age of least political engagement. I remember it all but destroyed Newt Gingrich, although Clinton was a much more savvy politician than Obama, so Boener might still have hope.

 

[Ldir]

Again, what have Obama and the Dems done while they had control of WH and Congress to fix unemployment? Pointing fingers at Repubs doesn't count.

I'm sure it doesn't in your book. Stop dodging the question. The Repugs said it was their top priority. The Repugs attacked Obama about employment. What have they done? Not one thing and you know it. They are liars and they are sabotaging our economy to hurt Obama. They are more anti-American than any terrorist. They should all be impeached.

 

[Blackjack200]

Again, what have Obama and the Dems done while they had control of WH and Congress to fix unemployment? Pointing fingers at Repubs doesn't count.

Tax incentives to businesses that hire unemployed workers.

 

[spacejamz]

I remember that shutdown pretty clearly and I was in high school - quite possibly the age of least political engagement. I remember it all but destroyed Newt Gingrich, although Clinton was a much more savvy politician than Obama, so Boener might still have hope.

So you think MOST of the American public recalls it this as vividly as you do? That was my point...

Ask 10 people off the street and I would be amazed if even 1 of them remembers...

The only thing that matters now is "What have you done for me lately???"...

 

[Blackjack200]

So you think MOST of the American public recalls it this as vividly as you do? That was my point...

Ask 10 people off the street and I would be amazed if even 1 of them remembers...

The only thing that matters now is "What have you done for me lately???"...

These are not vivid memories, but they were in the news, so I remember them. I remember Clinton getting elected (it's the economy, stupid), I remember the health care fight (Hillarycare), I remember his re-election, I remember the shutdown, I remember Monica, I remember Bosnia/Serbia and "Wag the Dog". I imagine others would remember them just the same.

 

[Munky]

I'm sure it doesn't in your book. Stop dodging the question. The Repugs said it was their top priority. The Repugs attacked Obama about employment. What have they done? Not one thing and you know it. They are liars and they are sabotaging our economy to hurt Obama. They are more anti-American than any terrorist. They should all be impeached.

And it does in your book? I asked the question what have the Dems done, and you point the finger at Repubs, as usual.

As to the second part of your sensationalist riot of a post, the US economy can not and will not sustain the runaway drunken deficit spending that Obama is pursuing. Just because you refuse to acknowledge that we have a debt problem, doesn't make it go away. You sound just like all the hacks in 2007 proclaiming that our economy is fundamentally sound. It is not.

 

[soulcougher73]

They only favor his approach because they are being misled about the numbers.

Returning to Clinton tax rates on the 'rich' (those making over $250,000) would only bring an extra $70 billion a year.

Our current deficit is over $1,000 billion per year.

Do the math, the additional taxes don't even come close to solving our problem.

The reason Obama keeps going to back to the taxes is because it is easy to fool Americans into thinking that they are the solution. This is because Americans fall for the 'rich' don't pay their fair share BS. That is why he focuses on things like the private jet tax even though the amount of money involved in it is so tiny you wouldn't even notice if it was repealed.

Even if that is true, its still 70B more than we had. Have to start somewhere. And it doesnt hurt the rich any so they are the easy target. They will suffer no ill effects or lifestyle change. Hell they wont even notice the extra money is gone.They cant just erase the debt overnight in one year no matter what they do.

 

[Fern]

I remember that shutdown pretty clearly and I was in high school - quite possibly the age of least political engagement. I remember it all but destroyed Newt Gingrich, although Clinton was a much more savvy politician than Obama, so Boener might still have hope.

I remember it too.

IMO, the gov shutdown wasn't the real cause of the downfall. It was Newt's arrogance. He acted like he was more important than the President. He made some arrogant & stupid comment about having to sit in the back of the plane etc. He looked like an arrogant azz (and he was).

But to the OP's question. Default won't happen, no possible way. We went 4 or 5 months past the debt ceiling in 1995 and didn't default. However, if it did they'd all get some blame. Since everyone hates Congress, except when it comes to THEIR Congressperson, Obama might take the biggest hit at election time, and I'm thinking with independents and that's who really counts.

Fern

 

[theeedude]

The Senate and the WH will..... the House has been pushing and actually passed budget bills and such..... the Senate is just sitting there with their thumbs up their butts...

it has to happen.... it's a wake up call for everyone.... bad timing and a little over the top, but it's better to happen now than latter

The GOP Congress passed a bill that Clinton vetoed in the 90s shutdowns too. Gingrich and GOP still got the blame. Simply passing a bill that president vetoes is not enough to avoid the blame.

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

btw, the thread title is very awkwardly worded.
fallout isn't the word i would use.

 

[MovingTarget]

Ummm.....Fuck the poor!

Seriously, the rest of us have-nots will be boned. I voted Bohner and the GOP though, as Obama has been the only one trying to actively build a compromise in line with what most Americans feel is acceptable - a balanced combination of targeted tax increases combined with spending cuts.

 

[Blackjack200]

btw, the thread title is very awkwardly worded.
fallout isn't the word i would use.

Yeah, when I saw the title I was like 'The Japanese, of course.'

Then I felt bad.

 

[Ldir]

And it does in your book? I asked the question what have the Dems done, and you point the finger at Repubs, as usual.

As to the second part of your sensationalist riot of a post, the US economy can not and will not sustain the runaway drunken deficit spending that Obama is pursuing. Just because you refuse to acknowledge that we have a debt problem, doesn't make it go away. You sound just like all the hacks in 2007 proclaiming that our economy is fundamentally sound. It is not.

I never denied there is a debt problem. I'm just not stupid enough to think the Repuglicans care about solving it. Are you?

The Dems haven't done enough about employment. Now stop dodging the question Mr Hack Apologist. What have your repugs done since unemployment is their top priority?

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

Is the US defaults, what will happen to bitcoin? Should I horde my bitcoin til Aug 2 at least?

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Yeah, when I saw the title I was like 'The Japanese, of course.'

Then I felt bad.

for me, i was thinking who would bear the brunt of the consequences, which is all of us.

 

[Munky]

I never denied there is a debt problem. I'm just not stupid enough to think the Repuglicans care about solving it. Are you?

Apparently, they care more than the Dems who are outraged at the very thought that we need to put a stop to ever-increasing debt.

The Dems haven't done enough about employment. Now stop dodging the question Mr Hack Apologist. What have your repugs done since unemployment is their top priority?

And I never claimed the Repubs have been addressing unemployment. Right back at you, sparky.

 

[edro]

Why is a huge debt bad?
If it were really a problem, the government could have 0 debt in a matter of a year.

 

[Jhhnn]

They only favor his approach because they are being misled about the numbers.

Returning to Clinton tax rates on the 'rich' (those making over $250,000) would only bring an extra $70 billion a year.

Our current deficit is over $1,000 billion per year.

Do the math, the additional taxes don't even come close to solving our problem.

The reason Obama keeps going to back to the taxes is because it is easy to fool Americans into thinking that they are the solution. This is because Americans fall for the 'rich' don't pay their fair share BS. That is why he focuses on things like the private jet tax even though the amount of money involved in it is so tiny you wouldn't even notice if it was repealed.

It's a start in the right direction. The true Bush constituency wants everybody but them to take a hit, when they're the ones who'll suffer the least from doing so. Sacrifice is for the little people, you silly, silly boy.

They're desperate to do so, with figures like Steve Schwarzman going so far into hyperbole as to claim raising capital gains taxes would be like the invasion of Poland by the Nazis. Really.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/taibblog/the-new-let-them-eat-cake-20110713

Get a grip on reality, OK?

 

[mchammer187]

They only favor his approach because they are being misled about the numbers.

Returning to Clinton tax rates on the 'rich' (those making over $250,000) would only bring an extra $70 billion a year.

Our current deficit is over $1,000 billion per year.

Do the math, the additional taxes don't even come close to solving our problem.

The reason Obama keeps going to back to the taxes is because it is easy to fool Americans into thinking that they are the solution. This is because Americans fall for the 'rich' don't pay their fair share BS. That is why he focuses on things like the private jet tax even though the amount of money involved in it is so tiny you wouldn't even notice if it was repealed.

if it is only 70 billion why are you so against it then?

Its like saying we should not cut a wasteful program because it would only cut X billion

IIRC you defended gutting Planned Parenthood and the whole stink the House Republicans made in the whole budget showdown when there funding for that amounted to 80 million or .11 percent (not 11% .11%) that 70 Billion this measure would raise.

70 billion x 10 years = 700 Billion which is 700 BN/4 Trillion = 17.5% of the 4 Trillion (not that I agree with the number 4 Trillion)

BTW I am in favor of letting the Bush Tax Cuts expire for everyone not just the rich even though I would be in a position to lose more than most (upper middle class).

 

[Jhhnn]

if it is only 70 billion why are you so against it then?

Because it demands sacrifice (not much) from America's wealthiest, and Repubs can't stand the idea. Everybody else is expected to sacrifice, not them. It'd be Un-American, & would make the baby Jesus cry, too...

 

[GT1999]

I'm surprised most people aren't saying Obama, most people like to blame the President. It doesn't matter who's fault it really is, the question is, who will take the blame.

 

[a777pilot]

If there is no agreement to raise the debt ceiling by 2 AUG, it will be the fault of our current Fool, Bobo, the Post Turtle, however, the MSM will protect him and blame the GOP.

 

[matt0611]

Obama would cause he controls it.
But we're not gonna default so it doesn't matter.