I'd like to see Google jump into phone manufacturing

[poofyhairguy]

it was a horrible, expensive mistake.

No it wasn't. Do you know why Google bought Moto?

Google didn't buy Moto for the phones, Google bought Moto because they were failing and they threatened to go full patent kamikaze on the rest of the Android OEMs (it already sued Apple) in a desperate attempt to survive. Moto was in the mobile game for a long time and had more patent than almost anyone so they could have really put a hurt on someone like Samsung.

Google bought them to prevent this situation, and when they sold Moto's phone division to Lenovo they kept these patents. With the leverage of these patents not only did Google prevent a Moto-led civil war, but it was able to achieve this:

“Apple and Google have agreed to dismiss all the current lawsuits that exist directly between the two companies,” Apple and Google said in a joint statement. “Apple and Google have also agreed to work together in some areas of patent reform."

http://recode.net/2014/05/16/apple-google-settle-motorola-patent-dispute-but-broader-issues-remain/

Prior to buying Moto, Google itself didn't have enough patents to cause a stalemate like that. At the end of the day the Moto purchase was a huge success because it finally gave Android real legal stability.

 

[Capt Caveman]

None of the above, Google can contract the manufacture of the phones out to manufacturers overseas, owning Moto is beside the point, and it was a horrible, expensive mistake.

Not sure if you understand how Apple makes phones.

And why would you compare Google to Apple when can command top dollar for their phones and people look at the Nexus line for value. Having Moto's phone engineers would have been an asset.

Keep on harping b/c it will never happen.

 

[Artdeco]

And why would you compare Google to Apple when can command top dollar for their phones and people look at the Nexus line for value. Having Moto's phone engineers would have been an asset.

Keep on harping b/c it will never happen.

I'd bet it's already in progress.

The Moto purchase was a mess, and it's water under the bridge.

http://www.theverge.com/2015/11/5/9676320/ctrl-walt-delete-podcast-episode-7-google-nexus

 

[Anon_lawyer]

No it wasn't. Do you know why Google bought Moto?

Google didn't buy Moto for the phones, Google bought Moto because they were failing and they threatened to go full patent kamikaze on the rest of the Android OEMs (it already sued Apple) in a desperate attempt to survive. Moto was in the mobile game for a long time and had more patent than almost anyone so they could have really put a hurt on someone like Samsung.

Google bought them to prevent this situation, and when they sold Moto's phone division to Lenovo they kept these patents. With the leverage of these patents not only did Google prevent a Moto-led civil war, but it was able to achieve this:

http://recode.net/2014/05/16/apple-google-settle-motorola-patent-dispute-but-broader-issues-remain/

Prior to buying Moto, Google itself didn't have enough patents to cause a stalemate like that. At the end of the day the Moto purchase was a huge success because it finally gave Android real legal stability.

All those lawsuits were against Motorola to begin with though. Google took a different view towards settling them, but it was all Apple v. Motorola.

 

[poofyhairguy]

All those lawsuits were against Motorola to begin with though.

Not corect. Moto fired the first shot back in 2010:

http://allthingsd.com/20101006/motorola-sues-apple-over-everything/

 

[Anon_lawyer]

Not corect. Moto fired the first shot back in 2010:

http://allthingsd.com/20101006/motorola-sues-apple-over-everything/

I wasn't referring to who started it, but that it was all between Motorola and Apple. Motorola's patents didn't give Google extra leverage to settle those suits, because Google was only a party to the lawsuits because they acquired Motorola.

 

[poofyhairguy]

I wasn't referring to who started it, but that it was all between Motorola and Apple. Motorola's patents didn't give Google extra leverage to settle those suits, because Google was only a party to the lawsuits because they acquired Motorola.

Google didn't buy Motorola to get in the middle of already occurring lawsuits. Google bought Motorola to create a mutually assured destruction situation if Apple wanted to to aggressive about going after the Android ecosystem in future lawsuits going forward.

Larry Page was very clear the whole purpose of the deal was to get legal leverage:

Motorola’s patents have helped create a level playing field, which is good news for all Android’s users and partners … Google will retain the vast majority of Motorola’s patents, which we will continue to use to defend the entire Android ecosystem.

https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2014/01/lenovo-to-acquire-motorola-mobility.html

Google was also following this plan when it cut the patent deal with Samsung:

https://gigaom.com/2014/01/26/google-and-samsung-reach-global-deal-on-patent-license/

And the plan worked- Apple has given up Steve's strategy of trying to force Android off the market via lawsuits. Android as an ecosystem now has enough patents to completely shield itself from a broken patent system.

 

[bgstcola]

I agree with OP.

Also, I don't think it would hurt the OEMs if Google made a phone.

Here in Denmark nobody owns Androids because most people can afford iPhones. If there was a polished well made Android I think it could open the marked for the OEMs.

Imagine if Apple open sourced iOS. Do you think no one would make iOS devices because the couldn't compete with Apple? Google should make no compromises expensive phones and let the OEMs fight in the low end.

I'm sick of crap Android phones. I have money burning a hole in my pocket but no phone to buy

 

[Red Storm]

I agree with OP.

Also, I don't think it would hurt the OEMs if Google made a phone.

Here in Denmark nobody owns Androids because most people can afford iPhones. If there was a polished well made Android I think it could open the marked for the OEMs.

Imagine if Apple open sourced iOS. Do you think no one would make iOS devices because the couldn't compete with Apple? Google should make no compromises expensive phones and let the OEMs fight in the low end.

I'm sick of crap Android phones. I have money burning a hole in my pocket but no phone to buy

Couldn't find anything to backup your claim, best I could find is that Apple has 38% of the smartphone market in Denmark. Not sure how accurate that is either, but I'm willing to bet there are Android users there.

Nexus 6P, Note 5, Galaxy S6/Edge/+/Active, G4, Nexus 5X, HTC A9, OnePlus 2, OnePlus X. There are plenty of good Android phones out there. I don't know which of those you can or can't buy in Denmark.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Google should make no compromises expensive phones

You mean like the 6P?

 

[Anon_lawyer]

Google didn't buy Motorola to get in the middle of already occurring lawsuits. Google bought Motorola to create a mutually assured destruction situation if Apple wanted to to aggressive about going after the Android ecosystem in future lawsuits going forward.

Larry Page was very clear the whole purpose of the deal was to get legal leverage:



https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2014/01/lenovo-to-acquire-motorola-mobility.html

Google was also following this plan when it cut the patent deal with Samsung:

https://gigaom.com/2014/01/26/google-and-samsung-reach-global-deal-on-patent-license/

And the plan worked- Apple has given up Steve's strategy of trying to force Android off the market via lawsuits. Android as an ecosystem now has enough patents to completely shield itself from a broken patent system.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say. All I said was that since the lawsuits and the patents came as a package deal, buying them didn't change the leverage on the Google/Motorola side. Before the acquisition, Motorola had lawsuits and leverage from patents. After the acquisition, Google's subsidiary Motorola had those same lawsuits and that same leverage from the patents.


Speaking of Google's overall leverage from the patents though, it's hard to see how they have much. The Microsoft-Motorola lawsuit ended with Motorola paying damages for making unreasonable royalty demands that were a multiple of the royalties Microsoft owed. According to the Recode article you posted, Google and Apple settled by agreeing to walk away from the lawsuits without licensing anything. Those were lawsuits Motorola initiated, so if Google is walking away it doesn't sound like they got much leverage. Then Google cross-licensed with Samsung. Fine, but all that means is Google and Samsung won't sue each other. Since they're major partners, that was a fairly remote possibility to begin with.


After five years and hundreds of millions of dollars in legal fees, it seems to me that far from mutually assured destruction the smartphone patents wars were mutually assured legal fees for nothing. Apple didn't give up because they're afraid of counter-suits. They gave up because the lawsuits proved expensive and ineffective. What did Apple's big win against Samsung get them? An injunction against a few phones that had been off the market for years already, and damages that when appeals and post-trial motions are done probably won't even cover their legal fees? That's the closest thing to a big win that has come out of all of these lawsuits, isn't it?


I'm hard pressed to name a single situation where anyone (except patent trolls) achieved a significant business advantage from a smartphone patent lawsuit. Perhaps Microsoft. But they mostly got lucky by signing license agreements with almost everyone right around the time the fear of patent litigation was at it's highest. No doubt if all those agreements were being negotiated today, they would be a lot less favorable.

 

[Artdeco]

I've seen/read the Moto purchase spun half a dozen ways, honestly, I don't think Google knew what it was doing.

 

[theeedude]

Has Google ever designed or made any impressive quality hardware in house?
Huawei Nexus 6P looks like a higher quality device than anything Google has ever made, by a country mile.
Look at the Chromebook Pixel. It's Google's effectively cost-unconstrained price point design. Free reign to design the best. It looks like a bad joke copy of a MacBook.
Chromecast? Plastic junk. Their idea of cool design is to make Chromecast Music textured like a vinyl record. Cringe worthy.

 

[bgstcola]

You mean like the 6P?

No, it may have the specs but it is ugly. Personally I think Google should go for simple industrial design like Nexus 5. And 4.7 inch size. I know this is like last year phones but this is what Google needs now. Refinement and polish.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

No, it may have the specs but it is ugly. Personally I think Google should go for simple industrial design like Nexus 5. And 4.7 inch size. I know this is like last year phones but this is what Google needs now. Refinement and polish.

I think what people want is a iPhone 6 / 6 Plus option where you have a smaller phone and a larger phone both with flagship specs.

The 5X comes close but I suppose 32GB is a turn-off for some. The battery could be larger too perhaps?

Also I personally find the 6P has grown on me. The frost is beautiful. The hump is far more subtle than some leaks made it seem

 

[StrangerGuy]

Why would Not Evil (tm) Google want to be in a loss-making industry when they already got so many OEMs by the balls that all except Samsung gotta eat losses to move ever-more devices?

Google doesn't care one bit about whether their Android revenue stream comes from a Gameboy monochrome screen or a 4K one. The installed base matters to them, but not the quality of hardware used to make said base.

 

[lopri]

Going by the title of the article, it is an idea that Verge can come up with.

Google do not grow profits in a walled garden. Their business relies on the knowledge of not just those who agree with them but also those who do not agree with them, detest them, and even those who are not aware of them. They are not another Apple or Microsoft.

Can they change to be like Apple? Sure. But that company would not be the Google we know of today.

 

[bgstcola]

Couldn't find anything to backup your claim, best I could find is that Apple has 38% of the smartphone market in Denmark. Not sure how accurate that is either, but I'm willing to bet there are Android users there.

Nexus 6P, Note 5, Galaxy S6/Edge/+/Active, G4, Nexus 5X, HTC A9, OnePlus 2, OnePlus X. There are plenty of good Android phones out there. I don't know which of those you can or can't buy in Denmark.

I don't have any numbers so you might be right. I think that those who buy android buy them because they are cheaper. I only know one person besides me who like android over iPhone. And he is a geek like me. I think a lot of mom's and old people buy android because they don't know the difference.

It's true that there are decent androids but I think it's been a while since the last *exciting* android was released. I wrote a post about this recently.

 

[Artdeco]

Has Google ever designed or made any impressive quality hardware in house?
Huawei Nexus 6P looks like a higher quality device than anything Google has ever made, by a country mile.
Look at the Chromebook Pixel. It's Google's effectively cost-unconstrained price point design. Free reign to design the best. It looks like a bad joke copy of a MacBook.
Chromecast? Plastic junk. Their idea of cool design is to make Chromecast Music textured like a vinyl record. Cringe worthy.

The Pixel Chromebook, and the OnHub router, they're both pretty slick, I think they build their own server too.

 

[slackerinabox]

Going by the title of the article, it is an idea that Verge can come up with.

Google do not grow profits in a walled garden. Their business relies on the knowledge of not just those who agree with them but also those who do not agree with them, detest them, and even those who are not aware of them. They are not another Apple or Microsoft.

Can they change to be like Apple? Sure. But that company would not be the Google we know of today.

You make Google sound so revolutionary and altruistic... They're just an ad company selling penis pills

 

[theeedude]

The Pixel Chromebook, and the OnHub router, they're both pretty slick, I think they build their own server too.

Pixelbook looks like a brick. Compare to Samsung and Apple ultrabooks, and I wouldn't call it slick. For it's limited functionality, it's too thick and bulky looking.
And it's a plain boring design, IMO.
OnHub looks interesting, but for the space it takes up, I wouldn't say it packs a lot of functionality. And it's made by TP-link.

 

[Artdeco]

https://www.theinformation.com/google-discussing-building-phone

If they're going to work with custom chips, sort of follows that they'll have to make some phones to demo them

http://bgr.com/2015/11/06/google-android-processor-design/