I have to pay for a car dealerships mistake?

[waggy]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: Andrew111
Bah, if I pay it I'll pay them in $150 worth of pennies Where do I find local laws on sales tax and stuff? Leejai also brings up an interesting idea.....the contract is wrong.

NO IT IS NOT.

the contract IS NOT WRONG. you agreeed to pay X for the truck. you paid it. Taxes are something diffrent.

fvck. get over it. go pay the money.

Actually, you are wrong. The tax was part of the deal in the paperwork. The dealership pays the state. They fvcked up and put the wrong amount on the form. They should pay the difference. You signed a contract with the dealership for x amount. Tell them you aren't paying for their mistake and if they don't like it they can have the truck back and you want a full refund of all money paid.

NO i am not.

the tax is based OFF the sale of the truck. THe dealership may pay the state but you give that money to the dealer. YOU are responsible for the Tax NOT the dealership.

the contract is for X amount for the truck. Tax is a seprate issue. You cant have a contract for taxes.

Edit: I DO have some knowledge in this. i own part of two car lots and my father owns the rest of it.

 

[Spencer278]

Originally posted by: Vic
Your JAG officer is shockingly wrong. YOU as the buyer are responsible for the taxes, not the dealership. For example, some people think that just because a store doesn't collect the sales tax on an item at point of sale that they are not responsible for tax. Wrong.

Originally posted by: dirtboy
Because state law supercedes your contract and since you made a purchase, you are liable for the sales tax on that purchase.

Exactly.

And how do you know what the dealership made off the vehicle? You can guess, but that's about it. And no one will be fired at the dealership, as they are simply not liable, and aren't the ones who will get in trouble here if the taxes aren't paid.

That isn't true. The state will go after the dealership for the sales tax. The only time when an individual has to pay sales tax when they import the item from another state or buy it throw the mail.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: Andrew111
Bah, if I pay it I'll pay them in $150 worth of pennies Where do I find local laws on sales tax and stuff? Leejai also brings up an interesting idea.....the contract is wrong.

NO IT IS NOT.

the contract IS NOT WRONG. you agreeed to pay X for the truck. you paid it. Taxes are something diffrent.

fvck. get over it. go pay the money.

Actually, you are wrong. The tax was part of the deal in the paperwork. The dealership pays the state. They fvcked up and put the wrong amount on the form. They should pay the difference. You signed a contract with the dealership for x amount. Tell them you aren't paying for their mistake and if they don't like it they can have the truck back and you want a full refund of all money paid.

NO i am not.

the tax is based OFF the sale of the truck. THe dealership may pay the state but you give that money to the dealer. YOU are responsible for the Tax NOT the dealership.

the contract is for X amount for the truck. NOT THE TAX.


Edit: I DO have some knowledge in this. i own part of two car lots and my father owns the rest of it.

Yes, you are. They need to adjust the price of the truck. Either way, the dealership screwed up and he should not be held liable for their mistake.

I do know a little about contracts.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

So, they need to adjust the price of the truck. Either way, the dealership screwed up and he should not be held liable for their mistake. I know a little about contracts.

I agree. the dealership needs to adjust the sale price or something.

But if they decide to do nothing then they will be fine. The buyer will get screwed.

 

[Andrew111]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: tkotitan2
it depends on your local tax laws.

I thought in general though, that sales taxes tax SALES, i.e, the people who sell goods. It's just that the tax gets transferred to the buyer every time, well, almost every time. I think the seller has to pay the extra tax which is why they are upset and bugging you. Until they drop a small claims lawsuit on you or something, I'd just ignore them.

With sales tax, the buyer is ALWAYS legally responsible for the final tax. The seller collects the tax as a required service to the state, but the buyer is legally responsible. Make sense? No? Welcome to the world of taxation. This is how the state guarantees that they get their money.

It is extremely unlikely that failure to pay the tax will nullify the contract in any way. If you don't pay, what will most likely happen is that either (1) it will hold up the legal transfer and you getting plates and registration for the vehicle, or (2) they will process the transfer but lien your vehicle for the deficient amount.

That's interesting.....I had no idea how sales tax was calculated for stuff like cars yet I'm responsible for paying it if the dealer messes up? Just seems weird....

Guess it's time to go to the bank and get that $150 worth of pennies. I bet they'll be surprised when they get a big box in the mail with 15,000 pennies, hehe.

 

[Viper GTS]

You're responsible, not the dealer.

Technically even if the dealer collected no tax you would be responsible to calculate & submit the appropriate tax.

This includes online purchases made from vendors out of state too, if you purchase from someone who doesn't collect it YOU are responsible.

The real question becomes how many people actually do it?

If anything the dealership did you a favor by letting you know about the error.

Viper GTS

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Andrew111

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: tkotitan2
it depends on your local tax laws.

I thought in general though, that sales taxes tax SALES, i.e, the people who sell goods. It's just that the tax gets transferred to the buyer every time, well, almost every time. I think the seller has to pay the extra tax which is why they are upset and bugging you. Until they drop a small claims lawsuit on you or something, I'd just ignore them.

With sales tax, the buyer is ALWAYS legally responsible for the final tax. The seller collects the tax as a required service to the state, but the buyer is legally responsible. Make sense? No? Welcome to the world of taxation. This is how the state guarantees that they get their money.

It is extremely unlikely that failure to pay the tax will nullify the contract in any way. If you don't pay, what will most likely happen is that either (1) it will hold up the legal transfer and you getting plates and registration for the vehicle, or (2) they will process the transfer but lien your vehicle for the deficient amount.

That's interesting.....I had no idea how sales tax was calculated for stuff like cars yet I'm responsible for paying it if the dealer messes up? Just seems weird....

Guess it's time to go to the bank and get that $150 worth of pennies. I bet they'll be surprised when they get a big box in the mail with 150,000 pennies, hehe.

OHH take pics!

But complain a LOT. no reason why you shouldnt get a few free oil changes at least.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Originally posted by: Andrew111

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: tkotitan2
it depends on your local tax laws.

I thought in general though, that sales taxes tax SALES, i.e, the people who sell goods. It's just that the tax gets transferred to the buyer every time, well, almost every time. I think the seller has to pay the extra tax which is why they are upset and bugging you. Until they drop a small claims lawsuit on you or something, I'd just ignore them.

With sales tax, the buyer is ALWAYS legally responsible for the final tax. The seller collects the tax as a required service to the state, but the buyer is legally responsible. Make sense? No? Welcome to the world of taxation. This is how the state guarantees that they get their money.

It is extremely unlikely that failure to pay the tax will nullify the contract in any way. If you don't pay, what will most likely happen is that either (1) it will hold up the legal transfer and you getting plates and registration for the vehicle, or (2) they will process the transfer but lien your vehicle for the deficient amount.

That's interesting.....I had no idea how sales tax was calculated for stuff like cars yet I'm responsible for paying it if the dealer messes up? Just seems weird....

Guess it's time to go to the bank and get that $150 worth of pennies. I bet they'll be surprised when they get a big box in the mail with 15,000 pennies, hehe.

Tell you what - send me the 150,000 pennies, and I'll give the dealership the $150 dollars for you.

 

[Ynog]

Originally posted by: mchammer187

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mchammer187
don't you pay tax when you register the car?

yeah. and when you buy from a dealer you register the car there. at least at every dealership we have ran.

i wasnt sure if that was the case since i havent ever bought a car for myself yet

though i'm planning to soon


i was just thinking about instances where you buy your car in one state and want to register it in another

From my experience, you are not required to register a car at the dealership. You can do all
the registration and tax info yourself. The thing is, most dealerships over to do this as part of the
sale. While not extremely difficult, registration is a pain in the butt IMHO. Dealerships basically have
this down to an exact science, so for them its quick and easy. Not to mention if you trade a car in,
you can save on sales tax. So thats why most people have the dealership do all this work.
Its not required, but IMHO you're making a mistake if you don't let the dealership do it. Who actually enjoys
more hassle in life.

As for the mistake on sales tax. Like everyone else has said its the buyers responsiblity. If you don't pay it,
the state will come after you, not the dealership.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Andrew111

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: tkotitan2
it depends on your local tax laws.

I thought in general though, that sales taxes tax SALES, i.e, the people who sell goods. It's just that the tax gets transferred to the buyer every time, well, almost every time. I think the seller has to pay the extra tax which is why they are upset and bugging you. Until they drop a small claims lawsuit on you or something, I'd just ignore them.

With sales tax, the buyer is ALWAYS legally responsible for the final tax. The seller collects the tax as a required service to the state, but the buyer is legally responsible. Make sense? No? Welcome to the world of taxation. This is how the state guarantees that they get their money.

It is extremely unlikely that failure to pay the tax will nullify the contract in any way. If you don't pay, what will most likely happen is that either (1) it will hold up the legal transfer and you getting plates and registration for the vehicle, or (2) they will process the transfer but lien your vehicle for the deficient amount.

That's interesting.....I had no idea how sales tax was calculated for stuff like cars yet I'm responsible for paying it if the dealer messes up? Just seems weird....

Guess it's time to go to the bank and get that $150 worth of pennies. I bet they'll be surprised when they get a big box in the mail with 15,000 pennies, hehe.

If the dealership did any of those things they would be extremely negligent. Go read the laws regarding contracts. This has nothing to do with sales tax and everything to do with legal contracts.

 

[Viper GTS]

Originally posted by: Andrew111
Guess it's time to go to the bank and get that $150 worth of pennies. I bet they'll be surprised when they get a big box in the mail with 15,000 pennies, hehe.

Why would you go out of your way to give the dealer sh!t over such a stupid little mistake?

They're not the ones asking for the money, they're just forced to ask on behalf of the state.

Write them a check & call it good, no sense being a dick over $150 in tax that YOU owe.

Hell, you should be more aware of the tax in your county.

Viper GTS

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
If the dealership did any of those things they would be extremely negligent. Go read the laws regarding contracts. This has nothing to do with sales tax and everything to do with legal contracts.

you are still missing the point.

the contract is to purchase the car at X price. thats it. its not X+tax.

tax is extra. you can't negotiate tax's. they always have to get paid. IT is ALWAYS the buyers responsibility to pay them.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Spencer278
That isn't true. The state will go after the dealership for the sales tax. The only time when an individual has to pay sales tax when they import the item from another state or buy it throw the mail.

No. As I already pointed out, the buyer is always responsible for sales tax. Had he purchased the vehicle private party, the private seller would not have had to even collect the tax. As part of being a dealership, the dealer collects the tax for the state as a service, but they are not legally obligated for the final amount. Once again, the final tax amount is the buyer's responsibility.

 

[Ynog]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
You're responsible, not the dealer.

Technically even if the dealer collected no tax you would be responsible to calculate & submit the appropriate tax.

This includes online purchases made from vendors out of state too, if you purchase from someone who doesn't collect it YOU are responsible.

The real question becomes how many people actually do it?

If anything the dealership did you a favor by letting you know about the error.

Viper GTS

Actually I live in New England and NH is one of the few states that doesn't have a sales tax.
So you find some people in NE states buying and registering their car in NH while they actually
live in another state. But I know for a fact most of the states have hotlines for during people in
who do this, and will go after those people.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
If the dealership did any of those things they would be extremely negligent. Go read the laws regarding contracts. This has nothing to do with sales tax and everything to do with legal contracts.

you are still missing the point.

the contract is to purchase the car at X price. thats it. its not X+tax.

tax is extra. you can't negotiate tax's. they always have to get paid. IT is ALWAYS the buyers responsibility to pay them.

The hell you can't!!! EVERYTHING is negotiable in a car purchase!!! I've had car dealerships tell me that they will WAIVE the tax entirely. What really happens is they eat the tax and pay the state for the negotiated amount.

God, I can't believe the posts in here. :roll:

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
If the dealership did any of those things they would be extremely negligent. Go read the laws regarding contracts. This has nothing to do with sales tax and everything to do with legal contracts.

you are still missing the point.

the contract is to purchase the car at X price. thats it. its not X+tax.

tax is extra. you can't negotiate tax's. they always have to get paid. IT is ALWAYS the buyers responsibility to pay them.

The hell you can't!!! EVERYTHING is negotiable in a car purchase!!! I've had car dealerships tell me that they will WAIVE the tax entirely. What really happens is they eat the tax and pay the state for the negotiated amount.

God, I can't believe the posts in here. :roll:

they claim they will eat the tax. Fact is they are not. they are just reducing the cost of the car.

it is just a way to get people in and looking at cars.

TAX is NOT NEGOTIABLE. not going to happen. nope never ever ever.

but they do have "tax-free days".

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Ynog
Actually I live in New England and NH is one of the few states that doesn't have a sales tax.
So you find some people in NE states buying and registering their car in NH while they actually
live in another state. But I know for a fact most of the states have hotlines for during people in
who do this, and will go after those people.

Oregon has no sales tax (or excise tax for vehicles) as well. Yet I grew up just across the state line in Washington state (which has relatively high sales taxes) and saw this type of tax fraud, both for vehicles and regular merchandise, all the time. Many people would cry about how the dealership in Oregon didn't collect it, but that never stopped WA state from reaming their asses out and getting their money from the buyer.

Get this through your heads, people. The buyer is responsible for the sales tax. Always. The dealership collects it for the state as a required service. His contract with the dealership is for the vehicle sales price, the taxes being incidental to that (nothing more).

 

[3chordcharlie]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
The hell you can't!!! EVERYTHING is negotiable in a car purchase!!! I've had car dealerships tell me that they will WAIVE the tax entirely. What really happens is they eat the tax and pay the state for the negotiated amount.

God, I can't believe the posts in here. :roll:

You just supported the statement that tax is non-negotiable. 'Eating the tax' is just a convenient way to pick a relatively small number as a discount.

They are NOT waiving the tax; they are lowering their price so that when tax is calculated the total is the same as the original sticker price.

The contract has a purchase price on it: tax needs to be calculated for this price, and if it's wrong, it needs to be fixed.

There's no reason to think anyone is out to screw anyone here... it's an unfortunate mistake.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Call the state attorney general and ask them or call a lawyer. Tell the dealership you are calling a lawyer also. See if they change their tune then. It doesn't cost anything to call a lawyer. Look in the phone book and call the one with the biggest ad. Explain the situation and see what they say. Tell the dealership you will sue them if they don't stand by their agreement.

I guarantee they will back down!!!

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
The hell you can't!!! EVERYTHING is negotiable in a car purchase!!! I've had car dealerships tell me that they will WAIVE the tax entirely. What really happens is they eat the tax and pay the state for the negotiated amount.

God, I can't believe the posts in here. :roll:

The time to negotiate for the OP came and went 2 months ago when he drove the car off the lot.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Call the state attorney general and ask them or call a lawyer. Tell the dealership you are calling a lawyer also. See if they change their tune then. It doesn't cost anything to call a lawyer. Look in the phone book and call the one with the biggest ad. Explain the situation and see what they say. Tell the dealership you will sue them if they don't stand by their agreement.

I guarantee they will back down!!!

And i gurantee it will cost him more then the $150 AND he will still have to pay the tax. heh

 

[fredtam]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
If the dealership did any of those things they would be extremely negligent. Go read the laws regarding contracts. This has nothing to do with sales tax and everything to do with legal contracts.

you are still missing the point.

the contract is to purchase the car at X price. thats it. its not X+tax.

tax is extra. you can't negotiate tax's. they always have to get paid. IT is ALWAYS the buyers responsibility to pay them.

The hell you can't!!! EVERYTHING is negotiable in a car purchase!!! I've had car dealerships tell me that they will WAIVE the tax entirely. What really happens is they eat the tax and pay the state for the negotiated amount.

God, I can't believe the posts in here. :roll:

I can't believe them either. Which is why I have stayed out of the thread so far. You are wrong. They don't negotiate anything as far as tax. They simply pay it out of rebates or profit. Read the fine print. It usually says "dealer retains all rebates" when they have deals like that.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
The hell you can't!!! EVERYTHING is negotiable in a car purchase!!! I've had car dealerships tell me that they will WAIVE the tax entirely. What really happens is they eat the tax and pay the state for the negotiated amount.

God, I can't believe the posts in here. :roll:

You just supported the statement that tax is non-negotiable. 'Eating the tax' is just a convenient way to pick a relatively small number as a discount.

They are NOT waiving the tax; they are lowering their price so that when tax is calculated the total is the same as the original sticker price.

The contract has a purchase price on it: tax needs to be calculated for this price, and if it's wrong, it needs to be fixed.

There's no reason to think anyone is out to screw anyone here... it's an unfortunate mistake.

It needs to be fixed at the dealer's expense. THAT IS ENTIRELY MY POINT!!!

Again, this isn't about tax law, it is about contracts. Think of it this way, if you bought a TV from Best Buy and they rang it up but forgot to include tax do you think they can or should be able to come after you to pay it after the fact? They can try but ultimately they are responsible to pay the state. Not you.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
The hell you can't!!! EVERYTHING is negotiable in a car purchase!!! I've had car dealerships tell me that they will WAIVE the tax entirely. What really happens is they eat the tax and pay the state for the negotiated amount.

God, I can't believe the posts in here. :roll:

The time to negotiate for the OP came and went 2 months ago when he drove the car off the lot.

Well, call a lawyer and prove me wrong then.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It needs to be fixed at the dealer's expense. THAT IS ENTIRELY MY POINT!!!

Again, this isn't about tax law, it is about contracts. Think of it this way, if you bought a TV from Best Buy and they rang it up but forgot to include tax do you think they can or should be able to come after you to pay it after the fact? They can try but ultimately they are responsible to pay the state. Not you.

Legally, the buyer of the TV, and not Best Buy, would be responsible for the tax. Ultimately, the buyer is responsible to pay the state. ALWAYS. The sales contract is for the sales price, not the sales price plus taxes. Why is this so hard to understand?