I have joined Nvidia's Focus Group.

[tuteja1986]

explains :
-The love for hardocp
-The aggreves monitor of ATI fanboys
-Bashing of computerbase
-Use of unreliable benchmarking website that get 9800GX2 NDA expiry date.

So nrollo was taken out by nvidia for being beaten up by few member in anandtech and they replaced by keys :!

 

[will889]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Being a moderator while simultaneously being an active member of this forum wasn't a problem. Why should this be different?

I had to separate the two, and it was easy for me to do it. Just step outside of myself, and become a mod when appropriate. That takes a bit of discipline.

With due respect, it isn't hard to do both but you're making it sound like it is to make the illegitimate comparison of being a normal member and also a mod (which many mods are anyway) next to being a mod while being an nVIDIA focus group member (IMO). Think if it this way. What if Prof_John or Palehorse74 were to be mods in in the political forums? I mean it's like they're nearly members of The Heritage Society as it is, and consider if they really WERE right wing think tank members and you have to advertise that fact in the political forums there -- there would be no way for them to be mods, and in the same way the nVIDIA Focus Group is a sort of think tank for nVIDIA hardware affectionados (if you will).

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: WelshBloke

Out of interest if asked to do this would you :-

1) Say 'I've been asked to say by Nvidia 'blah blah blah''
2) Say 'OMFG you guys will not believe it but 'blah blah blah''

And would those PR statements refer only to nvidia products or to other manufacturers as well?

I'm not a "OMFG" type of person, but:

1. When asked to post something by NVIDIA I just quote it directly, don't expand on it. Usually this is mainly done on NZONE. (e.g. I just posted an apology for a driver error that causes a few power supplies to not be recognized as high enough power, with a statement they are working on this)

2. They don't ask us to post OMFG type stuff. Like when they gave me the 780i board and 3rd GTX, they didn't ask me to post anything at all about 3 way, that's usually the way of it.

3. NVIDIA PR statements I post never reference other hardware vendors at all. When you see me compare ATi to NVIDIA, those are my own thoughts, and often just re-gurgitating what I've read from various sources.

4. As far as "helping people" goes, I do every now and again, but you have to remember this is my hobby. If I spent my leisure time constantly trying to do tech support for NVIDIA, it would be a lot like my work where I'm a team leader of people who do software support/training/implementation, and I do all of these things as well.
I do report issues to NVIDIA though, and sometimes give advice on things that have worked for me.

So there you have it.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: tuteja1986

So nrollo was taken out by nvidia for being beaten up by few member in anandtech and they replaced by keys :!

Hardly.

 

[will889]

Originally posted by: nRollo

3. NVIDIA PR statements I post never reference other hardware vendors at all. When you see me compare ATi to NVIDIA, those are my own thoughts, and often just re-gurgitating what I've read from various sources.

Rolls, the problem with that is that you can still cherry pick the regurgitation you wish, and then frame, and slant in any way you choose, but ironically that's what normal members here do all the time. The difference is that they're not NV think tank members.

 

[BFG10K]

As a mod I fully respect Derek's decision.

As a poster I am not happy with this. IMO the most important attribute of a mod is total neutrality, both through actions and through public perception.

As a focus group member paid to promote a company, neutrality is simply not possible as there's always a conflict of interest.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: will889

Originally posted by: nRollo

3. NVIDIA PR statements I post never reference other hardware vendors at all. When you see me compare ATi to NVIDIA, those are my own thoughts, and often just re-gurgitating what I've read from various sources.

Rolls, the problem with that is that you can still cherry pick the regurgitation you wish, and then frame, and slant in any way you choose, but ironically that's what normal members here do all the time. The difference is that they're not NV think tank members.

You're right, and I don't go out of my way to find positive ATi info. (OTOH, I won't stand by while false negative info is posted about ATi either)

You're also right in that how a lot of people post anyway, and I certainly did for years before joining the group.

On other forums, you can see me recommend Browning shotguns (never Remington), Lund boats (never Tracker), and GM trucks (never Dodge).

 

[Hauk]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: TroubleM

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Think before you post. That's all I'm saying.

One more reason to NOT come here anymore. This is turning into a pathetic move by Nvidia and is as disgusting as can be. I can understand those of you that benefit from this, but don't expect some congrats or whatever.:disgust:

This forum is turning into a joke, it's just fair that people should ignore ANY of your advices/open propaganda.

The first post was soley intended to keep things civil, and discuss everything in an appropriate manner. Was that wrong of me? To want people to think before they post? Like you should have done for an extra few minutes before your post here?

I mean:

Pathetic and disgusting move by Nvidia? Why would you say that? Do you not understand the purpose of the focus group?

This forum turning into a joke? This is the best forum on the web. Video alone has improved ten fold in the last year alone.

And what makes you say people should ignore my "advice"? You haven't even seen any yet. And probably won't for a while yet. I am just starting out in this group. Feet still need to get wet. Judge not lest ye be judged my friend.

You're predetermined to think the worst. That's your choice. Doesn't have to be that way.

Keys has always been on the level. If anything, he's been a voice of reason. When the bickering goes on for three pages or more, who's stepped in kindly asked those in debate to step back and take a breather?

Dude, you've earned whatever someone throws your way. Take it.

 

[BigMoosey74]

Originally posted by: toslat
Seeing the way guys treat nRollo (even when he is right), personally, I will think twice b4 joining any focus group, particularly Nvidia

Anyway, this will be an opportunity to find out who the culprit was: nRollo or Nvidia Focus Grp.

Keys:
On the Moderator issue, I also feel u shld take the high road and step down voluntarily.

I think everyone with this view is seeing it the wrong way. First off, Nvidia is more business savvy than AMD/ATI and this is proof of it. TWIMTBP was just a smart step to take...people hate it because it squeezes out ATI, but the bottom line is that gamers, developers, and Nvidia all benefit from it.

Having focus group members that are forum mods is another smart step just like TWIMTBP. They not only can set things strait when people start posting utter crap, but they can provide feedback to Nvidia regarding what people want to see changed. It is a win win situation for everyone...once again however, except ATI but only because they fail to see the importance.

I think everyone should reserve their judgment and stop the paranoid accusations that this will turn into an Nvidia forum and that you are going to lose your right to voice your opinion against a certain company. IF that does happen then just leave the forums but I think it will work for the best to help keep accurate information throughout the threads.

I haven't been a member of the AT forums for too long so no one probably cares what I say but seriously, why is everyone so negative about this?

Originally posted by: cubeless
i just have to chuckle at these posts...

i couldn't care less what his bias is, everybody is biased for some reason...

Exactly. I trust that key will do his best to stay neutral as a moderator, but if he has good and most importantly CORRECT information about Nvidia then why would you not want to hear about it?

 

[ronnn]

Sad day for anandtech forums. Loses some of the neutrality shine and just looks more advertising focused.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: BFG10K
As a mod I fully respect Derek's decision.

As a poster I am not happy with this. IMO the most important attribute of a mod is total neutrality, both through actions and through public perception.

As a focus group member paid to promote a company, neutrality is simply not possible as there's always a conflict of interest.

And as a moderator, I have total neutrality. It's you who cannot separate mod from member, not I. As indicated by your second paragraph.

And it's not to promote BFG. Nobody asked me to promote anything. Not even close. Not even hinted. I get to evaluate hardware and software, and report problems I find here in the forums. And correct any FUD when I see it (which is something I do anyway). I already have a short list of things to discuss with the group. One of which is JAG's VSYNC issue with latest drivers.

And still, nobody has really made it clear how this would effect moderation. All I see is "conflict of interest" over and over again, with no real explanation of what this "interest" is.

 

[BFG10K]

TWIMTBP was just a smart step to take...people hate it because it squeezes out ATI, but the bottom line is that gamers, developers, and Nvidia all benefit from it.

No, people hate it because it doesn't deliver anything it promises.

As an example, 18 months later we're still waiting for a driver fix for UT2004's stuttering in XP with the 8xxx/9xxx series, a TWIMTBP title I might add.

Meanwhile ATi cards run the game without issue.

How has TWIMTBP helped me - an nVidia user - in this situation?

It hasn?t; it has hindered me.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: ronnn
Sad day for anandtech forums. Loses some of the neutrality shine and just looks more advertising focused.

What's really sad is not being able to see the good things about it. Others can, why not you? Give it a chance, you just might be surprised.

 

[ronnn]

Not surprised at all.

 

[formulav8]

There are quite a few people that doesn't like the idea of you being both it seems. You need to make a Poll and let the members decide which would probably be the fair thing to do about you.


I personally don't care since I wouldn't really use your advice on any hardware to sway me either way anyways. Could be be different for some other members though...



Jason

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

TWIMTBP was just a smart step to take...people hate it because it squeezes out ATI, but the bottom line is that gamers, developers, and Nvidia all benefit from it.

No, people hate it because it doesn't deliver anything it promises.

As an example, 18 months later we're still waiting for a driver fix for UT2004's stuttering in XP with the 8xxx/9xxx series, a TWIMTBP title I might add.

Meanwhile ATi cards run the game without issue.

How has TWIMTBP helped me - an nVidia user - in this situation?

It hasn?t; it has hindered me.

OK, that's one example.

Here's another:

Every major game launches with an SLi profile either built into the game or NVIDIA's current drivers. ATi waits days/weeks/months to develop, users have to hope forcing straight AFR works.

How about this? Do you think it's an accident DX10 titles play better on NVIDIA hardware, except for COJ?

THere are positives BFG, you just like to focus on the negatives. Which is your perogative, of course.

(and I realize SLi doesn't help you personally, but it's a big deal to some of us)

 

[DerekWilson]

Originally posted by: BFG10K
As a mod I fully respect Derek's decision.

As a poster I am not happy with this. IMO the most important attribute of a mod is total neutrality, both through actions and through public perception.

As a focus group member paid to promote a company, neutrality is simply not possible as there's always a conflict of interest.

Hi guys. I just want to chime in and say that some of you are really blowing this out of proportion.

Keys let me know about this when it happened. He's letting all of you know now as well. While any of you can take or leave his statements on the forum (while factoring in his NVIDIA relationship), his ability to moderate is not in question.

While I believe keys will still be a good source of testing and information, I know some of you will feel the need to distrust what he says. This is fine -- go find another source to confirm or refute and/or test things for yourself.

But his opinions or affiliations have nothing to do with moderation. Lashing out against AMD fans or being lenient on NVIDIA fans will not do anything but stir up problems both for keys and for NVIDIA. No one wants this, and I strongly believe that keys can remain fair in his moderation.

Rollo was vetoed as a moderator candidate because he consistently lied to members and moderators about his affiliation and manipulated people through deception. He was a viral marketer whether he wants to admit it or not, and AEG was a problem. This is not the same as the current NVIDIA focus group. His current participation with NVIDIA's focus group had nothing to do with him not being a moderator. His history as a member here is what sealed the deal on that one.

NVIDIA focus group members do not exist to promote NVIDIA or sell NVIDIA products.

Focus group members are actively discouraged from doing any type of marketing. Relaying press releases and information is one thing, but they do not want their focus group members to act as or be perceived as shills.

That's tough for Rollo because he absolutely did behave as a shill. He promoted NVIDIA products while conceling and denying his relationship with them, and it doesn't matter whether anything he said was what he really felt or not -- his behavior was reprehensible.

I'd take 1 keys over 10000 Rollos.

I had hoped that the time keys has been here, the work he's put into the forums, the excellent job he's done as a moderator, and the fact that he is being open and honest about the situation would go a long way with all of you. If it doesn't, let me add once again that if there is any problem with keys as a moderator, please let me know immediately and I will absolutely deal with it.

Again, NVIDIA focus group members do not exist to promote NVIDIA or sell NVIDIA products. This is not what NVIDIA wants them around for.

AEG -- different story. This is not that.

keys is still keys ... his affiliations don't matter, only his actions. his history here does a good job of illustrating who he is -- don't throw all that out because of this.

now that he's a focus group member, everyone here can weigh his forum posts with that in mind. but it really doesn't have anything to do with moderation.

 

[will889]

Who knows maybe it will be just fine business as usual =)

 

[SunnyD]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: ronnn
Sad day for anandtech forums. Loses some of the neutrality shine and just looks more advertising focused.

What's really sad is not being able to see the good things about it. Others can, why not you? Give it a chance, you just might be surprised.

No, what's really sad is that you have to endure this. Of course... I told you so...

 

[will889]

nm

 

[vanvock]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: BFG10K
As a mod I fully respect Derek's decision.

As a poster I am not happy with this. IMO the most important attribute of a mod is total neutrality, both through actions and through public perception.

As a focus group member paid to promote a company, neutrality is simply not possible as there's always a conflict of interest.

And as a moderator, I have total neutrality. It's you who cannot separate mod from member, not I. As indicated by your second paragraph.

And it's not to promote BFG. Nobody asked me to promote anything. Not even close. Not even hinted. I get to evaluate hardware and software, and report problems I find here in the forums. And correct any FUD when I see it (which is something I do anyway). I already have a short list of things to discuss with the group. One of which is JAG's VSYNC issue with latest drivers.

And still, nobody has really made it clear how this would effect moderation. All I see is "conflict of interest" over and over again, with no real explanation of what this "interest" is.

Ask New York's govenor, he had the concept explained to him recently, he was "Mr. Clean" before. Sooner or later you're going to be asked to "dance with the one that brung ya".

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: vanvock

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: BFG10K
As a mod I fully respect Derek's decision.

As a poster I am not happy with this. IMO the most important attribute of a mod is total neutrality, both through actions and through public perception.

As a focus group member paid to promote a company, neutrality is simply not possible as there's always a conflict of interest.

And as a moderator, I have total neutrality. It's you who cannot separate mod from member, not I. As indicated by your second paragraph.

And it's not to promote BFG. Nobody asked me to promote anything. Not even close. Not even hinted. I get to evaluate hardware and software, and report problems I find here in the forums. And correct any FUD when I see it (which is something I do anyway). I already have a short list of things to discuss with the group. One of which is JAG's VSYNC issue with latest drivers.

And still, nobody has really made it clear how this would effect moderation. All I see is "conflict of interest" over and over again, with no real explanation of what this "interest" is.

Ask New York's govenor, he had the concept explained to him recently, he was "Mr. Clean" before. Sooner or later you're going to be asked to "dance with the one that brung ya".

But I don't use an escort service vanvock.

 

[TheRyuu]

It's been a while since I posted anything serious on these forums. I think this needs attention. I'm not taking a sides here, just voicing my personal opinion in the matter. I've only been a member here for a little over 2 years but I've seen a lot.

I'm not going to question your moderation thing, I agree with derek in it although I'm not happy about it, I can live with it . However, I'm more upset that you still have elite member status keys.

An elite member is suppose to stand out in the crowd and be totally impartial to anything. They are suppose to help whenever help is needed. I'm not arguing that you don't do this, you probably do.

However, the fact that you sold yourself out to this "focus group" throws you right back in the crowd and as a consumer, I have to assume you will be biased now.

now that he's a focus group member, everyone here can weigh his forum posts with that in mind.

I think that statement says enough to justify the following:
Take this post however you want, take it as a flame, take it as whatever, I really don't care. Just ditch that elite member status of yours.

 

[lopri]

I haven't read all the pages so I am not aware where the discussion has been going. Said that, I'm happy for keysplayer2003 persoally, and I hope he enjoys the rare opportunity that many enthusiasts would be longing to have.

On the other hand, I can't help but think why NV had approached him.

 

[LOUISSSSS]

I would like to chime in also. not that i've been on these forums long, but i am on them quite often. i'll be trying to take keys' posts from a neutral standpoint and so should everyone else. Over time, is where the biases happen and they will be seen in his posts, the threads that he posts in, threads he makes, the links/quotes he uses from certain websites. But for now, i'll take his posts from as neutral and unbiased. (innocent until proven guilty, right?)

good luck with your positions and please try not to let your 'nVidia-side' show too much in your posts.