I have joined Nvidia's Focus Group.

[will889]

Originally posted by: Demoth

Originally posted by: will889
If you don't like to read focus group members posts just skip over them and click out as fast as you can (or as soon as you see their forum name) that's what I do.

If it was just about reading focus member posts, this would be a non-issue. The thing is Keys is lead GPU mod and can edit, delete and lock down posts as well as ban members. There is also a intangible influence a forum mod, especially the lead, would have on other people's views.

Not saying I even suspect Keys would do anything inappropriate. However, a rep hit to Anandtech will occur. You'll see posters on other sites decrying the fact that this site's GPU mod is part of a Nvidia focus group and everything here is suspect from forum posts to reviews on vid cards or even news items posted.

Really, what I am saying is I have rarely seen a situation like this develope into much more then an initial argument back and forth for a long period of time with the end result being the mod in question told by higher ups to cut their ties or step down from their position.

I agree for the most part. It's a possible conflict of interest for sure, however maybe we'll see how it really plays out over a period of time. As long as Keys has his posts checked for no bias (and now they will have to be checked for sure and more often by someone atop Keys as an admin) there might not be a problem. That said it would be sort of like having a "system builders" forum addition then having an employee of Velocity Micro moderating the forum and obviously that would not work out very well, and I'm not sure that an obligatory type of 'hey I recommended ATI cards so leave me alone" like nRollo does will work out. I would hate to see Keys lose the mod status as he's got much video technical experience but I'm sure if I told you I was working for ATI that I might have a hard time getting moderator status.

 

[will889]

^But congrats are in order for Keys I suppose for Keys so congrats

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Budarow
I think it's great that nVidia has the Focus Group program. It gives normal peeps the chance to communicate issues more or less directly to nVidia.

However, nothing personal against yourself nor Rollo, but don't be surprised if board members don't consider your opinions as credible as they once did.

It stands to reason a compensated person would not be retained for long by their "employer" if they portrayed their company's products in a negative light; earned or otherwise.

Speaking only for myself, I don't expect people to think "That guy Rollo seems to get a ton of free hardware and software from NVIDIA, but I imagine he's their toughest critic".

If they do, they shouldn't.

I've preferred NVIDIA hardware since 3DFX days, and getting to know some of the people there and getting info and stuff from them hasn't soured my opinion of them.

I will say this though:

I do post what I perceive as "bad". For example, my 3 way build went bad from the start. I used a non certified case I felt "should" have been good enough, and a non certified (but $380 for chrissake) 1200W psu I thought "should" have been good enough. The power supply failed often and gave me TDRs, the case I picked now has 6 fans pointed at the 3 GTXs. I posted this, didn't try to hide it.

When people talk about getting TDRs with Vista, I say I get them infrequently, I don't say I don't get them at all.

I've posted Crysis on 3 way is pretty much a waste so far.

Etc.

You don't see me rail against NVIDIA for not having a seven year old game working like BFG10K does over on NZONE, or about no multi-monitor support in SLi like n7 does everywhere- but only because those things aren't issues to me. I can respect they mean something to them, although I've poked some fun at BFG occasionally on the vintage of the games.

Most importantly, I try really hard to post things I believe and can back with links to other sources, because I know my posts will be scrutinized more than others. (and can understand why)


I post good information, but anyone considering spending money should read other sources, because I'm not perfect and occasionally make a mistake. (not to mention it's the smart thing to do)

 

[schneiderguy]

:thumbsdown:

Moderator and "Focus Group" member shouldn't go together, in my opinion. Yes I saw that Derek Wilson oked it, but I dont agree with it.

Congratulations though I want free stuff too

 

[cubeless]

i just have to chuckle at these posts...

i couldn't care less what his bias is, everybody is biased for some reason... most people can't give a cogent argument why they believe anything that they purport to believe... if u don't like his posts, read something else... if he starts editing out reports of the amazing things that amd is up to, then it's up to his boss to deal with it...

no evil dis on keys, but he's just a guy who probably spends too much time playing video games and reading forum posts... if he says something is amazing, i figure he might like it... if he says something sucks, i figure he must not... but he's just data point... anyone who bases their decisions on the opinion of one guy who blurbs on a website gets what they get, imho (usually a fist full of worthless penny stocks, but that's a different site...)...

and i always thought that rollo was good comic relief...

just remember that this is, to paraphrase a talkshow guy, 'a fusion of entertainment and enlightenment'... because if it were much more then u would get credit hours or paid for it...

 

[Sylvanas]

Still divided on what i think about this....on one hand congrats to keys...on the other hand two mouthpieces for Nv on the same public forum is a bit much. AT might be better off going the way of other web forums in that there are two sections for graphics related chatter, one 'ATI/AMD' another 'Nvidia' section, obviously focus group members stick to 'their' forum and address the things people bring up. Despite being a long time AT member, I think it would be the right thing to do for keys to step down as a mod, we don't want to be sending the wrong message here- thats just my opinion you may disagree with me but so be it.

 

[WT]

Hah, with my luck I'd get to be a member of the PC Chips focus group, reviewing their top notch hardware. In actuality, they'd send you an email in broken Engrish detailing their new solid steel (sic) capacitors on their boards !!

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: cubeless

and i always thought that rollo was good comic relief...

just remember that this is, to paraphrase a talkshow guy, 'a fusion of entertainment and enlightenment'... because if it were much more then u would get credit hours or paid for it...

LOL- a good perspective. This is fun time, not work time. :beer:

 

[WelshBloke]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: MarcVenice
What exactly is/does this focus group ?

We receive hardware/software/information from NVIDIA for review, and to use to correct misinformation, help with end user issues.

We are sometimes asked to post PR statements on current topics, as NVIDIA company policy does not allow employees to post on forums.

We are asked to forward user concerns with product functionality that we run across to appropriate staff at NVIDIA for correction.

Some of us moderate on NVIDIA forums.

We are asked not to market products, only to post factual information that can be verified, in a professional manner.

We are required to post our affiliation with NVIDIA in our sigs.

I fielded this question as I have experience for the last two years + with the NVIDIA run focus group, and prior to that with the AEG run focus group.

The AEG run focus group had the same intent, but was not run as rigidly structured. What we have been since NVIDIA took it over is what they wanted it to be all along.

Out of interest if asked to do this would you :-

1) Say 'I've been asked to say by Nvidia 'blah blah blah''
2) Say 'OMFG you guys will not believe it but 'blah blah blah''

And would those PR statements refer only to nvidia products or to other manufacturers as well?

 

[vanvock]

Originally posted by: AmberClad
I thought the very reason nRollo was vetoed for the position of Graphics moderator was the appearance of impropriety/bias in a position that requires neutrality. Note that I'm not implying that anyone would actually act in a biased manner, but there's a reason why the moderators in presidential debates are often members of the press and not members of the RNC or DNC. That way, there can't be any accusations that so-and-so moderator did something because of such-and-such, even when that might not be the case.

On another note - any chance of us getting some DAAMIT or Intel representation here, just to balance things out? Or are they simply not interested in doing something similar here at AT?

That's really a laughable analogy but the point is well taken. With all the rule bending to get nV people on here (transparent or not) I can see how it could be construed as a credibility ding to this forum & even the site as a whole.

 

[WelshBloke]

Originally posted by: vanvock

Originally posted by: AmberClad
I thought the very reason nRollo was vetoed for the position of Graphics moderator was the appearance of impropriety/bias in a position that requires neutrality. Note that I'm not implying that anyone would actually act in a biased manner, but there's a reason why the moderators in presidential debates are often members of the press and not members of the RNC or DNC. That way, there can't be any accusations that so-and-so moderator did something because of such-and-such, even when that might not be the case.

On another note - any chance of us getting some DAAMIT or Intel representation here, just to balance things out? Or are they simply not interested in doing something similar here at AT?

That's really a laughable analogy but the point is well taken. With all the rule bending to get nV people on here (transparent or not) I can see how it could be construed as a credibility ding to this forum & even the site as a whole.

Rollo wasn't vetoed for mod or banned because of his affiliations to NV, he was banned and vetoed because (sorry Rollo) he was a pain in the ass at the time.

 

[sandorski]

As long as it doesn't turn into a FUD factory, I think it's alright. That's what happened in the past and people were right to be pissed off about it then.

 

[Zstream]

More forums filled with NV viral scum...

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: schneiderguy
:thumbsdown:

Moderator and "Focus Group" member shouldn't go together, in my opinion. Yes I saw that Derek Wilson oked it, but I dont agree with it.

Congratulations though I want free stuff too

Being a moderator while simultaneously being an active member of this forum wasn't a problem. Why should this be different?

I had to separate the two, and it was easy for me to do it. Just step outside of myself, and become a mod when appropriate. That takes a bit of discipline. I am sure a lot of you here are having premonitions of what I would do if somebody trashes Nvidia on the forums here. If you are thinking "Oh, hell ban the guy/gal", think again. If I have information to counter the posters comments, I will post it. The same thing goes for a comment toward ATI/AMD. If I have information contrary to the poster, I will post it. All as a member, not a moderator.

Everybody has the right to their opinions. The only way I will employ moderator action is when somebody violates our guidelines or our TOS.

I am bound by forum guidelines and the TOS just as much as any other member who follows them. Those that do not, we (the moderators) deal with as that comes.

So, I would like to convey, that moderating has nothing to do with my being a member of this forum, or a member of the focus group. It is another roll entirely. And I respect it's position and responsibility.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Zstream
More forums filled with NV viral scum...

Excuse me Z. But how is this "viral" if it's all out in the open?
And please tell me why you think, I'm scum...

And here is a little light reading for you: Text

 

[Zstream]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Zstream
More forums filled with NV viral scum...

Excuse me Z. But how is this "viral" if it's all out in the open?
And please tell me why you think, I'm scum...

Every single one of the members in my sig denied being involved with NV from the start. To come and think that just because you say it out in the open makes it any better is foolish at best.

Anyone who is employed or used by a company in any way can not be objective at all. This is how human nature works and to try and distinguish between your two roles is naive and silly.

I have seen countless times you defending people and NV when they have zero proof of anything. Who got rollo unsuspended?

Countless times have you defended people and NV on this forum. Anyways I am done with this post. I wish this forum had an ignore feature...

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: nRollo
I do post what I perceive as "bad". For example, my 3 way build went bad from the start. I used a non certified case I felt "should" have been good enough, and a non certified (but $380 for chrissake) 1200W psu I thought "should" have been good enough. The power supply failed often and gave me TDRs, the case I picked now has 6 fans pointed at the 3 GTXs. I posted this, didn't try to hide it.

Posting that your case or PSU didn't work very well with your setup doesn't equate to you saying anything "bad" about nVidia. Nvidia had nothing to do with your case or PSU.

Post about something "bad" about nVidia (ie. someone said vsync doesn't work with SLI with the newest drivers...not sure if this is accurate) and then maybe you can consider yourself to be somewhat objective. Until then don't try to paint yourself in a "fair and balanced" light...please.

 

[Cheex]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Budarow
I think it's great that nVidia has the Focus Group program. It gives normal peeps the chance to communicate issues more or less directly to nVidia.

However, nothing personal against yourself nor Rollo, but don't be surprised if board members don't consider your opinions as credible as they once did.

It stands to reason a compensated person would not be retained for long by their "employer" if they portrayed their company's products in a negative light; earned or otherwise.

Speaking only for myself, I don't expect people to think "That guy Rollo seems to get a ton of free hardware and software from NVIDIA, but I imagine he's their toughest critic".

If they do, they shouldn't.

I've preferred NVIDIA hardware since 3DFX days, and getting to know some of the people there and getting info and stuff from them hasn't soured my opinion of them.

I will say this though:

I do post what I perceive as "bad". For example, my 3 way build went bad from the start. I used a non certified case I felt "should" have been good enough, and a non certified (but $380 for chrissake) 1200W psu I thought "should" have been good enough. The power supply failed often and gave me TDRs, the case I picked now has 6 fans pointed at the 3 GTXs. I posted this, didn't try to hide it.

When people talk about getting TDRs with Vista, I say I get them infrequently, I don't say I don't get them at all.

I've posted Crysis on 3 way is pretty much a waste so far.

Etc.

You don't see me rail against NVIDIA for not having a seven year old game working like BFG10K does over on NZONE, or about no multi-monitor support in SLi like n7 does everywhere- but only because those things aren't issues to me. I can respect they mean something to them, although I've poked some fun at BFG occasionally on the vintage of the games.

Most importantly, I try really hard to post things I believe and can back with links to other sources, because I know my posts will be scrutinized more than others. (and can understand why)


I post good information, but anyone considering spending money should read other sources, because I'm not perfect and occasionally make a mistake. (not to mention it's the smart thing to do)

As I said before, being a moderator and being a part of the focus are two separate duties.
I agree with nRollo on this one.

I'll admit I'm jealous of them both...

Anyway, I don't think that they can't speak out against Nvidia, its just a matter of HOW they do it.

If ATI happens to make a card now that kills off anything Nvidia throws (not likely ) then I think they are free to say, "Hey, the ATI card is better."

I don't think Nvidia will see them in any different light as long as the information they post are FACTUAL!!

I mean come on...you can't reasonably dispute cold hard facts, now can you?

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Cheex
If ATI happens to make a card now that kills off anything Nvidia throws (not likely ) then I think they are free to say, "Hey, the ATI card is better."

I'd love to see them say that...but it's unlikely since you can usually make a case for a card(s) regardless of where it stands in the performance heirarchy (lol, except for the one at the very bottom).

 

[Killrose]

Congrats Key's, I guess. You will enjoy some new kickass free hardware, but if a vote was taken today for forum mod and your new credentials were listed as an nvidia focus group member I would and could not vote for you. I have been witness to what it has done to others. I hope you are strong enough to keep centerline here and I do beleive you are

Honestly though, I don't know what kinda goodies you'll get your hands on, but how exciting and quite an honor in spite of what it may mean to others and admittedly myself.
WTFC's? It's free kickass hardware time!! :thumbsup:

 

[Sylvanas]

Thing is, the whole point of the focus group is to sell stuff, I have never seen Rollo in a technical support thread 'my nvidia blah blah isn't doing X help me' only the threads with something to do with ATI to derail the conversation. I don't see that as a valuable contribution.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: WelshBloke

Originally posted by: vanvock

Originally posted by: AmberClad
I thought the very reason nRollo was vetoed for the position of Graphics moderator was the appearance of impropriety/bias in a position that requires neutrality. Note that I'm not implying that anyone would actually act in a biased manner, but there's a reason why the moderators in presidential debates are often members of the press and not members of the RNC or DNC. That way, there can't be any accusations that so-and-so moderator did something because of such-and-such, even when that might not be the case.

On another note - any chance of us getting some DAAMIT or Intel representation here, just to balance things out? Or are they simply not interested in doing something similar here at AT?

That's really a laughable analogy but the point is well taken. With all the rule bending to get nV people on here (transparent or not) I can see how it could be construed as a credibility ding to this forum & even the site as a whole.

Rollo wasn't vetoed for mod or banned because of his affiliations to NV, he was banned and vetoed because (sorry Rollo) he was a pain in the ass at the time.

QFT

No problem dude. :beer:

 

[WelshBloke]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: WelshBloke

Originally posted by: vanvock

Originally posted by: AmberClad
I thought the very reason nRollo was vetoed for the position of Graphics moderator was the appearance of impropriety/bias in a position that requires neutrality. Note that I'm not implying that anyone would actually act in a biased manner, but there's a reason why the moderators in presidential debates are often members of the press and not members of the RNC or DNC. That way, there can't be any accusations that so-and-so moderator did something because of such-and-such, even when that might not be the case.

On another note - any chance of us getting some DAAMIT or Intel representation here, just to balance things out? Or are they simply not interested in doing something similar here at AT?

That's really a laughable analogy but the point is well taken. With all the rule bending to get nV people on here (transparent or not) I can see how it could be construed as a credibility ding to this forum & even the site as a whole.

Rollo wasn't vetoed for mod or banned because of his affiliations to NV, he was banned and vetoed because (sorry Rollo) he was a pain in the ass at the time.

No problem dude. :beer:

:beer: I should have stressed the 'at the time'

(oh and people take forums far to seriously)

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Zstream
Who got rollo unsuspended?

Derek - Keys was as surprised as you were.

You should update your sig for the sake of accuracy chief:

Chalnoth and Ailuros haven't been in the group for years, AFAIK.

AEG has been out of business for years.

"viral" has nothing to do with the way the group has been run for years.

Pretty sad- living with past hate and misinformation as the years go by, all over some video cards. Now hating on Keys who's done nothing to earn it.

I pity you.

 

[JustaGeek]

Congratulations, Keys!

And my $0.02...

It will be IMPOSSIBLE to be impartial.

I know that you'll make the best effort.

But it WILL be impossible...