Originally posted by: engineereeyore
Originally posted by: petrek
Before I attempt an explanation, lets be clear on something. I don't like to argue, discussion is good, argument is bad. For you to continue to be quick to respond, and be quick to tell me that I'm contradicting myself simply shows your not bothering to take the time to think through what I wrote, rather you are quick to repeat what you've been taught, or to reply with the first thought that comes to your mind.
So I ask you this, is God contradicting himself when He states
"Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.
Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit." Proverbs 26:4-5 KJB
Dave
So, I guess you are just a liar, aren't you? Willing to make a commitment, but not willing to keep it.
Everyone can clearly see I didn't call you a fool, I asked you if God was contradicting himself when he made what appear to be contradictory statements. That was all.
Yes, I can tell by your lack of response that that is exactly what you meant. If you ever wonder why people don't accept your understanding of things, here are two shining example. You're not willing to keep your commitments and you're a liar. Neither seems very condusive to one who claims to be a "christian". But then, I guess by your interpretation, you're not supposed to talk to a fool. How convenient that you would attempt to use that to supercede you're lies.
Nice talk. Let me know if you ever grow up and are willing to talk again like a true adult.
2 Timothy 2:
[24] And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
[25] In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
[26] And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.
1 Thessalonians 5
[14] Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men.
[15] See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men.
Romans 12
[1] I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
[2] And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
[3] For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
[4] For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:
[5] So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
[6] Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
[7] Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching;
[8] Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: he that giveth, let him do it with simplicity; he that ruleth, with diligence; he that sheweth mercy, with cheerfulness.
[9] Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.
[10] Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;
[11] Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;
[12] Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;
[13] Distributing to the necessity of saints; given to hospitality.
[14] Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.
[15] Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.
[16] Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
[17] Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
[18] If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
[19] Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
[20] Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.
[21] Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.
Romans 2
[1] Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.
[2] But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things.
[3] And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?
[4] Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
[5] But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
[6] Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
[7] To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
[8] But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
[9] Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
[10] But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
[11] For there is no respect of persons with God.
[12] For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
[13] (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
[14] For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
[15] Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another; )
[16] In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
[17] Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God,
[18] And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law;
[19] And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness,
[20] An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.
[21] Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself? thou that preachest a man should not steal, dost thou steal?
[22] Thou that sayest a man should not commit adultery, dost thou commit adultery? thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?
[23] Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?
[24] For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written.
[25] For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.
[26] Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?
[27] And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?
[28] For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
[29] But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Luke 6
[21] Blessed are ye that hunger now: for ye shall be filled. Blessed are ye that weep now: for ye shall laugh.
[22] Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you from their company, and shall reproach you, and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man's sake.
[23] Rejoice ye in that day, and leap for joy: for, behold, your reward is great in heaven: for in the like manner did their fathers unto the prophets.
[24] But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation.
[25] Woe unto you that are full! for ye shall hunger. Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep.
[26] Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.
[27] But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,
[28] Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you.
[29] And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not to take thy coat also.
[30] Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again.
[31] And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise.
[32] For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them.
[33] And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same.
[34] And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.
[35] But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.
[36] Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.
[37] Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:
[38] Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.
1 Corinthians 13
[1] Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
[2] And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
[3] And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
[4] Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up
[5] Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
[6] Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
[7] Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
[8] Charity never faileth...
Ephesians 4
[1] I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,
[2] With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;
[3] Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
[4] There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
[5] One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
[6] One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
[7] But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
[8] Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
[9] (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
[10] He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)
[11] And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
[12] For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
[13] Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
[14] That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
[15] But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
[16] From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.
[17] This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
[18] Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:
[19] Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
[20] But ye have not so learned Christ;
[21] If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
[22] That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
[23] And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
[24] And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
[25] Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
[26] Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
[27] Neither give place to the devil.
[28] Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
[29] Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
[30] And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
[31] Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
[32] And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
It is clear to most everyone that your angry, the tone of your replies to me and others clearly shows that. And while I was taking some time to patiently think through and meditiate on the issue related to the 4 commitees, you took the time to call me a liar 3 times for not responding according to your wishes, according to your timetable.
The simple fact of the matter is that whether or not some committees (which may or may not have had Believers in their midst) immediately recognized what books were or were not Scripture, has no bearing on whether or not Christians apart from those committees recognized the books as authoritative, as the Word of God. Christians apart from those committees did recognize which books were the Word of God and which books were not, as Scripture clearly indicates. As such I have faith that KJ Bible I hold in my hands today is the complete Word of God from Genesis to Revelation, from beginning to end, pure and infallible. Just because it took 4 committees to get it right, doesn't change the fact that Believers knew all along which books contained the pure words of God. The fact that it took 4 committees to get it right only underscores the human element in the decision making process on those committees, but it does not take away the fact that Believers always had the pure words of the Living God in their possession, even if the didn't have them compiled together in the order in which they currently exist, and have existed since well before I did.
Dave
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