I can't believe what I read this morning

[remagavon]

Originally posted by: frankgomez75

Originally posted by: KarenMarie

Originally posted by: frankgomez75
Really?
I bet you are either:
white
middle to upper-class
have never lived in poverty

If not.... please explain how you made it out of? Its no cake walk.

I had a helluva time finding work in the ghetto. When you do get one... its either minimum wage or dangerous. I lived in a town with 100,000 people.... no bus transportation. A city that once held the headquarters of the KKK.

I dropped out of school to help out cuz my mom couldn't pay all the bills, even though she worked 2 jobs.... paying minimum wage cuz my low life father split before I was born.... The only reason I'm alive is because another person (white caucsian/middleclass) social worker decided to make a difference in my life. I watched all my friends either die from gang violence, drugs, or go to prison cuz they didn't get an opportunity like me. Someone reached out to help me in a time of need at 16yrs old and was not afraid to come into my neighborhood... even though he could have been shot.

With his help I was able to get my GED, but only because he would take me (again no public transportation in my neighborhood).... and I'm now wrapping up my senior year in college getting my business degree.

Its so easy to tell people what to do when you're on top. Get off your high horse and help someone rather than say "Get a job"

You think its so easy.....

I am not gonna play... let's top this... with who had a worse life or a harder time... i am older than you and had a head start. And i dont feel the need to air all my horror stories on an open forum.

I will say, however... that your mom chose to have a child with a man who did not stand by her. your father chose to walk out on his family. If the ppl in your family were only capable of min wage jobs, my guess would be that there was no higher education there.. despite the long list of availbility out there.

Society, the white man or the government did not make the choices, your parents did. It is nice that you had someone to give you a helping hand. But i do not for one minute believe that you could not have done it without him. i think if you wanted it, you would have gotten it.

🙂

I want to believe that... but I just can't. I think of my life much in the same way of the Africans who were enslaved. The ones who wanted to be free but couldn't do so on thier own. The ones who made it out were helped by Harriet Tubman and a string of sympathetic white people who believed in the cause of freedom. It took a Civil War to change things.

I believe it actually may take another... but this time it will be "The haves vs The have nots"

Substitute the chains on the slaves as my oppression. I was born a slave. I was in a situation that I had no control over. I once harbored anger at my mother and father... but people are human and make mistakes. I forgave my mother.... my father I will prolly never forgive as I yet to have met him. But had I not had a Harriet Tubman like person and a support structure to help me out.... I would forever have been enslaved into a life of poverty and oppression.

I know many people feel this way... and many people who have not been there can sympathize.

Only becuase you would have otherwise quite literally 'known no other way', not because of any other listed predeterminations. It's great that there are people willing to help, irregardless. 🙂

We forget that we need to have a basic level of education in order to be able to conceptualize the value of education. A lot of people simply cannot grasp the concept that education will lead to furthered success in the future. One may make the case that there is an ever increasing push toward education in both the media and early gradeschools, however it's hard to heed that advice when you don't always have dinner on the table back at home.

 

[frankgomez75]

Originally posted by: remagavon

Originally posted by: frankgomez75

Originally posted by: KarenMarie

Originally posted by: frankgomez75
Really?
I bet you are either:
white
middle to upper-class
have never lived in poverty

If not.... please explain how you made it out of? Its no cake walk.

I had a helluva time finding work in the ghetto. When you do get one... its either minimum wage or dangerous. I lived in a town with 100,000 people.... no bus transportation. A city that once held the headquarters of the KKK.

I dropped out of school to help out cuz my mom couldn't pay all the bills, even though she worked 2 jobs.... paying minimum wage cuz my low life father split before I was born.... The only reason I'm alive is because another person (white caucsian/middleclass) social worker decided to make a difference in my life. I watched all my friends either die from gang violence, drugs, or go to prison cuz they didn't get an opportunity like me. Someone reached out to help me in a time of need at 16yrs old and was not afraid to come into my neighborhood... even though he could have been shot.

With his help I was able to get my GED, but only because he would take me (again no public transportation in my neighborhood).... and I'm now wrapping up my senior year in college getting my business degree.

Its so easy to tell people what to do when you're on top. Get off your high horse and help someone rather than say "Get a job"

You think its so easy.....

I am not gonna play... let's top this... with who had a worse life or a harder time... i am older than you and had a head start. And i dont feel the need to air all my horror stories on an open forum.

I will say, however... that your mom chose to have a child with a man who did not stand by her. your father chose to walk out on his family. If the ppl in your family were only capable of min wage jobs, my guess would be that there was no higher education there.. despite the long list of availbility out there.

Society, the white man or the government did not make the choices, your parents did. It is nice that you had someone to give you a helping hand. But i do not for one minute believe that you could not have done it without him. i think if you wanted it, you would have gotten it.

🙂

I want to believe that... but I just can't. I think of my life much in the same way of the Africans who were enslaved. The ones who wanted to be free but couldn't do so on thier own. The ones who made it out were helped by Harriet Tubman and a string of sympathetic white people who believed in the cause of freedom. It took a Civil War to change things.

I believe it actually may take another... but this time it will be "The haves vs The have nots"

Substitute the chains on the slaves as my oppression. I was born a slave. I was in a situation that I had no control over. I once harbored anger at my mother and father... but people are human and make mistakes. I forgave my mother.... my father I will prolly never forgive as I yet to have met him. But had I not had a Harriet Tubman like person and a support structure to help me out.... I would forever have been enslaved into a life of poverty and oppression.

I know many people feel this way... and many people who have not been there can sympathize.

Only becuase you would have otherwise quite literally 'known no other way', not because of any other listed predeterminations. It's great that there are people willing to help, irregardless. 🙂

We forget that we need to have a basic level of education in order to be able to conceptualize the value of education. A lot of people simply cannot grasp the concept that education will lead to furthered success in the future. One may make the case that there is an ever increasing push toward education in both the media and early gradeschools, however it's hard to heed that advice when you don't always have dinner on the table back at home.

Thank you! This is what I was trying to say.... if only others could grasp this.

 

[shimsham]

Originally posted by: KarenMarie

Originally posted by: frankgomez75
Really?
I bet you are either:
white
middle to upper-class
have never lived in poverty

If not.... please explain how you made it out of? Its no cake walk.

I had a helluva time finding work in the ghetto. When you do get one... its either minimum wage or dangerous. I lived in a town with 100,000 people.... no bus transportation. A city that once held the headquarters of the KKK.

I dropped out of school to help out cuz my mom couldn't pay all the bills, even though she worked 2 jobs.... paying minimum wage cuz my low life father split before I was born.... The only reason I'm alive is because another person (white caucsian/middleclass) social worker decided to make a difference in my life. I watched all my friends either die from gang violence, drugs, or go to prison cuz they didn't get an opportunity like me. Someone reached out to help me in a time of need at 16yrs old and was not afraid to come into my neighborhood... even though he could have been shot.

With his help I was able to get my GED, but only because he would take me (again no public transportation in my neighborhood).... and I'm now wrapping up my senior year in college getting my business degree.

Its so easy to tell people what to do when you're on top. Get off your high horse and help someone rather than say "Get a job"

You think its so easy.....

I am not gonna play... let's top this... with who had a worse life or a harder time... i am older than you and had a head start. And i dont feel the need to air all my horror stories on an open forum.

I will say, however... that your mom chose to have a child with a man who did not stand by her. your father chose to walk out on his family. If the ppl in your family were only capable of min wage jobs, my guess would be that there was no higher education there.. despite the long list of availbility out there.

Society, the white man or the government did not make the choices, your parents did. It is nice that you had someone to give you a helping hand. But i do not for one minute believe that you could not have done it without him. i think if you wanted it, you would have gotten it.

🙂

:thumbsup:

 

[Ronstang]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
How do you evacuate if you don't have a car?

How do you evacuate if you don't have money?

How do you evacuate if you have no place to go and no family to stay with?

How do you evacuate the very young, the very old, and those too sick to be moved?

The fact that a very large percentage of the city DID evacuate is a success. The smaller percentage that didn't had their reasons...some reasons were stupid, but most reasons were something that you guys who are much better off cannot comprehend.

The answers to your questions are all very simple and the same.....the state of Louisiana and the New Orleans city governments should have facilitated the evacuation. It is not the job of the Federal government to come in and do a state/city's job....they come in to clean up the mess the state/city leaves AFTER a catastrophe.

There was no plan ahead of time how to deal with the INEVITABLE disaster that befell New Orleans. Every expert on the issues facing New Orleans have been saying this for decades yet the state of Louisiana and the city of New Orleans decided to ignore them and make NO PLANS for the worst case scenario that was just a "when" and not an "if"?

The state of Louisiana and the city of New Orleans made no real attempts to get the situation under control in NO to avoid the lawlessness that has reigned all week. They let the situation get out of control and then just sat there expecting the rescuers to "deal with the mess". Where was the Mayor of NO? Where was the Police Chief? Where were any of the city or state officials? They were all in safety miles inland yet THEY LEFT those poor people in NO. Why where they not on the front lines the minute the storm subsided to take control of the situation? Why did they let NO become a cesspool of anarchy? But then again, after the destruciton there was no infrastructure which means no power and no communications so it is difficult for anyone to do much in a coordinated fashion. The people shouldn't have been left there in the first place.

The logistics of even getting to NO after the hurricane were huge. Most of the roads and bridges in were destroyed or severely damaged. The entire city was under water. There are THREE states completely devastated along the coasts and inland to a certain degree that all must be helped. The mobilization of the aid going to those areas does not take place on a moments notice. The equipment, supplies, and people are not just sitting in wait 20 miles away. The logistics are HUGE and this is going to create a delay. It is the job of the LOCAL governments to take control of the situation and do whatever they can to hold the fort until the Federal aid and National Guard can reach the area....it looks like Louisiana and New Orleans dropped the ball bigtime here. The scope of this disaste is HUGE...it is not just NO that is in trouble.

We in Houston were able to mobilize buiding a small city at the Astrodome complex to house refugees in under 24 hours. If the responsible governments in LA would have contacted our officials last week to ask for temporary shelter to house evacuees we would have done so without batting a lash.....but no one asked because they made no attempt to evacuate the people from their cities that could not on their own. The had the buses and could have forced a mandatory evacuation but they did not.

The lawlessness and complete anarchy that has reigned in NO for the better part of a week is the fault of the governments of NO and the state of LA. It is the main reason that getting help to those people has not been easier and more effective. They told people to go to the Super Dome and then just abandoned them. Rescuers have been faced with mobs and being shot at....and in instances were told to stand down until order could be restored....something the NO Police department SHOULD have done.

There is plenty of blame to go around for some to the things that have happened all week but that blame must start with the state of Louisiana and the city of New Orleans....it is that simple. The government officials involved let their state, and their people down and I do not think it is fair to blame everyone that now has to clean up the mess for not doing things fast enough when this mess was created by the inaction of others. I have spoken with a lot of people that are here from LA and no one here has any real idea of the problems facing the relief effort and the news only shows you what is sensational and they want to start point fingers for ratings.

 

[KarenMarie]

Originally posted by: Ronstang

The answers to your questions are all very simple and the same.....the state of Louisiana and the New Orleans city governments should have facilitated the evacuation. It is not the job of the Federal government to come in and do a state/city's job....they come in to clean up the mess the state/city leaves AFTER a catastrophe.

There was no plan ahead of time how to deal with the INEVITABLE disaster that befell New Orleans. Every expert on the issues facing New Orleans have been saying this for decades yet the state of Louisiana and the city of New Orleans decided to ignore them and make NO PLANS for the worst case scenario that was just a "when" and not an "if"?

The state of Louisiana and the city of New Orleans made no real attempts to get the situation under control in NO to avoid the lawlessness that has reigned all week. They let the situation get out of control and then just sat there expecting the rescuers to "deal with the mess". Where was the Mayor of NO? Where was the Police Chief? Where were any of the city or state officials? They were all in safety miles inland yet THEY LEFT those poor people in NO. Why where they not on the front lines the minute the storm subsided to take control of the situation? Why did they let NO become a cesspool of anarchy? But then again, after the destruciton there was no infrastructure which means no power and no communications so it is difficult for anyone to do much in a coordinated fashion. The people shouldn't have been left there in the first place.

The logistics of even getting to NO after the hurricane were huge. Most of the roads and bridges in were destroyed or severely damaged. The entire city was under water. There are THREE states completely devastated along the coasts and inland to a certain degree that all must be helped. The mobilization of the aid going to those areas does not take place on a moments notice. The equipment, supplies, and people are not just sitting in wait 20 miles away. The logistics are HUGE and this is going to create a delay. It is the job of the LOCAL governments to take control of the situation and do whatever they can to hold the fort until the Federal aid and National Guard can reach the area....it looks like Louisiana and New Orleans dropped the ball bigtime here. The scope of this disaste is HUGE...it is not just NO that is in trouble.

We in Houston were able to mobilize buiding a small city at the Astrodome complex to house refugees in under 24 hours. If the responsible governments in LA would have contacted our officials last week to ask for temporary shelter to house evacuees we would have done so without batting a lash.....but no one asked because they made no attempt to evacuate the people from their cities that could not on their own. The had the buses and could have forced a mandatory evacuation but they did not.

The lawlessness and complete anarchy that has reigned in NO for the better part of a week is the fault of the governments of NO and the state of LA. It is the main reason that getting help to those people has not been easier and more effective. They told people to go to the Super Dome and then just abandoned them. Rescuers have been faced with mobs and being shot at....and in instances were told to stand down until order could be restored....something the NO Police department SHOULD have done.

There is plenty of blame to go around for some to the things that have happened all week but that blame must start with the state of Louisiana and the city of New Orleans....it is that simple. The government officials involved let their state, and their people down and I do not think it is fair to blame everyone that now has to clean up the mess for not doing things fast enough when this mess was created by the inaction of others. I have spoken with a lot of people that are here from LA and no one here has any real idea of the problems facing the relief effort and the news only shows you what is sensational and they want to start point fingers for ratings.

Another brilliant post by Ronstang.
Bush called LA govenor on 8/28/05 to tell her this is serious.
Govenor says REscue first, looters later.
Mayor says he ordered Sandbags but it wasnt done.
Governor waits until 9/1/05 to Suspend bonding requirements for out of state troopers.
Governor waits until 9/1005 to, finally, officially Deploy law enforcement and national guard.
Governor waits until 9/1/05 to finally organize a special relief fund.

Everyone should know that the national guard, the military nor the state police.... none of the feds can just go into a state and take over. They need to get clearance/permisson from the state officials. And from a news program on teevee last night... one cop was yelling and crying that 1/3 of the police just ran away from the city and never came back. He called them cowards.

And finally... one of the most angering photos I have seen is THIS. I mean, this was supposed to be a MANDATORY evacuation. This is just one school bus depot. How many more are there just like this in the state? Proper leadership would have taken ALL available state troopers, town police from NO and surrounding areas and the federal assistance that was offered BEFORE the disaster hit... went building to building and put those ppl on a bus. Not leave them stranded. Oh, wait... she did that TODAY!

The state officials have a lot to answer for.

 

[kingshoc]

Originally posted by: cherrytwist
/chair

waits for the hippies to show up.

LOL