How to enable Nvidia Phsyx on Ati cards in Batman:AA

[Tempered81]

I'm posting this because it is inexplicably being taken down everywhere...

-Update on the AA:

It is owned by Eidos. It is up to Eidos to decide the fate of a feature that AMD refused to contribute too and QA for their customers, not NVIDIA.”

AMD received an email dated Sept 29th at 5:22pm from Mr. Lee Singleton General Manager at Eidos Game Studios who stated that Eidos’ legal department is preventing Eidos from allowing ATI cards to run in-game antialiasing in Batman Arkham Asylum due to NVIDIA IP ownership issues over the antialiasing code, and that they are not permitted to remove the vendor ID filter.

NVIDIA has done the right thing in bowing to public pressure to renounce anti-competitive sponsorship practices and given Eidos a clear mandate to remove the vendor ID detect code that is unfairly preventing many of Eidos’ customers from using in-game AA, as per Mr. Weinand’s comments. I would encourage Mr. Singleton at Eidos to move quickly and decisively to remove NVIDIA’s vendor ID detection.

http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=20991

how to accelerate ATi graphics cards in Batman with PhysX on:

1/install the D2D version

2/download and intall the perfect patch from TL

http://rapidshare.com/files/27757592...rtApp.exe.html

3/download and install the PhysX crack pack, put all files in the pack to overwrite the files in the game install dir according to the dir sructure.

Removed. -ViRGE

4/download and install the newest physX drv from NVIDIA

http://www.nvidia.com/object/physx_9.09.0814.html

5/go X:\Users\Your username\Documents\Eidos\Batman Arkham Asylum\BmGame\Config, modify the UserEngine, change "PhysXLevel=0" to "PhysXLevel=1", change the "bAllowMultiThreadedShaderCompile=FALSE" to bAllowMultiThreadedShaderCompile=True", but the "True" vule is not fit to me, it brings slower fps on my Q6600.

save the UserEngine file.

6/go: X:\Program Files (x86)\Eidos\Batman Arkham Asylum\Engine\Config, modify the BaseGame.ini, after modification, the "[Engine.WorldInfo]" should looks like below:

[Engine.WorldInfo]
DefaultGravityZ=-750.0
RBPhysicsGravityScaling=1.0
MaxPhysicsSubsteps=1
SquintModeKernelSize=128.0
EmitterPoolClassPath=Engine.EmitterPool
DecalManagerClassPath=Engine.DecalManager
FractureManagerClassPath=Engine.FractureManager
FracturedMeshWeaponDamage=1.0
ChanceOfPhysicsChunkOverride=1.0
bEnableChanceOfPhysicsChunkOverride=True
FractureExplosionVelScale=1.0

save the BaseGame.ini file.

7/go to x:\Program Files (x86)\Eidos\Batman Arkham Asylum\Binaries, run the BmLauncher.exe,here you can set the 3D options, but you already enable PhysX in Step 5, so leave it alone here, after setting, you can directly click "play" to star the game, or you can quit the setting window, and double click the BmStartApp.exe to start the game.

Notice:

1/right now,this method needs further improvement, it can't work 100% perfect in the D2D version, but I can say ATi graphics cards will get fps more than 30fps in 75% area with PhysX on, compared with only 5-20fps before with PhysX on.

2/Due to the Securom DNA protection in the D2D version, at some points, the game will crach with PhysX on, Securom actually protects the PhysX effects!. So when you encounter the crach problem, just turn off the game, quit to the desktop, modify the UserEngine.ini, change "PhysXLevel=1" to "PhysXLevel=0" according to the step 5, save the UserEngine.ini file, run BmStartApp.exe to start the game again, play the game untill there's a Circle Circling at the lower right corner of the screen, that means it autosave the game, after the Circle disappears, you can quit the game, do step 5 again, to enable the physX, the run BmStartApp.exe to start the game with PhysX on.

3/at some places in the game with PhysX effects, such as flowing smoke, Liquid, shape changeable Spiderweb, you can find that after killed the enemies, just stand there without any actions and movements, the fps will gradually raise up.

Also, about the AA types:

And it doesn't defy logic to see that without any form of powerful PhysX capable Nvidia hardware it is impossible to Rocksteady (the dev house) and Eidos (the publisher) to provide very complex effects such as simplier flying papers, uninteractive smoke emitters, canned animation ground/wall destructions and other clothes. Let's not even talk about the mind bending physically correct particle effects that we can see in that video as being an exclusive byproduct of the magical association of Nvidia, PhysX and love.

Nope, they just decided to remove these effects entirely. Which makes perfect sense, when you do not think about it.

Now, the amazement train didn't just go and stop at the PhysX station, no, it decided to take it straight to cuckoo land with its setting screen! Picture:

That's right, NVIDIA (TM) MSAA requires an NVIDIA (TM) 8000+ card. And when the AA is activated via the .ini (the game being an UE3 game) the game tells you to shove it, you and your unworthy Canadian MSAA capable hardware.

All in all, I love this neverending trend where ISVs add stupid limitations into the code of their product only to insult a part of their future buyers and please one IHV over another. Good stuff!
Now, with that said... The game itself is actually pretty good.

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=54786

Batman: Arkham Asylum is another brand-new PC game, and has been burning up the review charts. It?s an Unreal Engine 3 based game, something that?s not immediately obvious from just looking at it, which is rare for UE3 based games.

NVIDIA has put a lot of marketing muscle into the game as part of their The Way It?s Meant to Be Played program, and as a result it ships with PhysX support and 3D Vision support. Unfortunately NVIDIA?s influence has extended to its anti-aliasing abilities too, as its in-game selective AA abilities only work on NVIDIA?s cards. AMD?s cards can perform AA on the game, but only via traditional full screen anti-aliasing, which isn?t nearly as efficient. Because of this, this is the only game where we will not be using AA, as doing so produces meaningless results given the different AA modes used.

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3643&p=24

I'm sorry guys, but we can't have you distributing copyright-infringing material, which is what the "PhysX Crack Pack" likely is since it contains many of the game's binaries. I have removed the link, and immediately escalated this for higher-level review.

In the mean time you may discuss the process, but you cannot post links to the material in question. If you have any questions, please shoot a PM to the AT Mod account.

-ViRGE

 

[Tempered81]

Basically if the game detects ati hardware, or < 8800 nvidia hardware, it disables the ability to use frame-rate efficient MSAA algorithms, tearable cloth, fog/smoke effects, paper, sparks... etc. If you enable AA forced through CCC, you are using archaic AA methods that aren't worth a crap. GJ nvidia!

These guys are working on getting MSAA on ati cards in batman:

We remember that Batman demo version has the NV exclusive AA option, but using the old approach, rename the ShippingPC-BmGame.exe to UT3.exe, or Bioshock.exe, set 4xAA in the CCC, we can do AA in the Batman demo on ATi graphics cards.

Now, Batman retail version uses BmStartApp.exe to call BmLauncher.exe, then BmLauncher.exe to call the main program exe, ShippingPC-BmGame.exe to run the game.

So, unless somebody modifies the BmStartApp.exe, ATi graphics cards can?t do AA in Batman retail version by rename the ShippingPC-BmGame.exe to UT3.exe, or Bioshock.exe.

http://www.rage3d.com/Board/showthread.php?t=33952021


Start at 1:15 through 9:30, and see 8 minutes of in-game effects in Batman: archam asylum that select users will be missing out on:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GyKCM-Bpuw

Check out when he kicks over the trash can in the alley. With physx you get 50 interactive aluminum cans, without physx you get like 3 or 4.

Here a guy got phsyx working on his i7920 + 4870 tri-fire in batman:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUOr4cFWY-s

Edit: one more thing: in the past, if you chose to, you could render with an ati gpu while calculating physx with an nvidia gpu in the second pci-e slot. Nvidia has now disabled physx when an ati card is detected as of the 186 series drivers.

 

[dguy6789]

I really don't see how anyone could remain loyal to Nvidia when they do things like this.(If they care at all about PC gaming) They want your money and are willing to screw up the games you play to get it.

 

[MarcVenice]

Isn't it actually possible to disable AA for Nvidia cards using the launcher, and enabling it through the nvidia display panel? Wouldn't that also give FSAA for Nvidia cards?

What I noticed myself from benching in Batman, is that a HD5870 can keep up quite nicely with 1920*1200 and 8xaa vs a GTX295 with 8xaa. We're talking 53,7min / 92,3avg for GTX295 and 56,3min / 86,7avg for HD 5870.

 

[BFG10K]

Originally posted by: MarcVenice

Isn't it actually possible to disable AA for Nvidia cards using the launcher, and enabling it through the nvidia display panel? Wouldn't that also give FSAA for Nvidia cards?

Not by default, because nVidia?s stock profile doesn?t allow the forcing of AA in that title.

 

[ShadowOfMyself]

Originally posted by: dguy6789
I really don't see how anyone could remain loyal to Nvidia when they do things like this.(If they care at all about PC gaming) They want your money and are willing to screw up the games you play to get it.

This

This is what makes me hate Nvidia... They might have great technology but their practices disgust me, and yes ATI/AMD have done their share of things, but not nearly as often and not nearly as bad

Nvidia just has a horrible record of screwing up games etc to their own benefit (quake 3 comes to mind), or even the fact that 3Dmark uses physx to give nvidia cards a higher score, which is laughable

 

[imported_Shaq]

Well if Nvidia and AMD made separate consoles, Nvidia would have made the game an Nvidia exclusive and anybody with an AMD console wouldn't be able to play it at all. So Nvidia did what they could to make it run better on their hardware. They paid an untold amount of money to Rocksteady and/or Eidos to put PhysX and/or AA in the game. If they don't get a portion of the profits from the game-extremely unlikely- they need a way to make that money back plus some to make it worthwhile. If they allow people with ATI cards to run PhysX how will that help Nvidia's investment? That is a choice you make when you buy Nvidia or AMD hardware. Either live with the game as it plays on your hardware or switch graphic cards. And it is just one game. Nvidia users can't play Dirt2 because AMD paid Codemasters to put DX11 effects in the game, and thus delaying it for 3 or more months.

That's the way the video card market is becoming to boost sales and they are following the consoles lead. It would be better if they didn't lock out users with competing hardware but since they have similar performing hardware they need to find other ways of selling their own.

 

[Tempered81]

Originally posted by: Shaq
it is just one game. Nvidia users can't play Dirt2 because AMD paid Codemasters to put DX11 effects in the game, and thus delaying it for 3 or more months.

In my book, it's a little different because concerning DX11 titles, ati hardware can run it, while nvidia hardware cannot. In DX9/DX10 versions of Batman, both ati and nvidia videocards have the hardware capability to run all the MSAA modes and render sparks/fog/smoke/interactive cloth, but this rendering is limited to the geforce 8800 cards or higher. If you could edit a line of code in Dirt.exe to enable DX11 effects on a GTX280, then it would be a fair comparison.

 

[lopri]

Originally posted by: Shaq
That's the way the video card market is becoming to boost sales and they are following the consoles lead. It would be better if they didn't lock out users with competing hardware but since they have similar performing hardware they need to find other ways of selling their own.

With that logic the Raison d'être of this forum pretty much disappears. Of course corporations will do whatever they think the most beneficial to them. But I am an optimist in believing us enthusiasts can make enough noise to bring awareness of shady business tactics to the mass, which in turn can force the corporations to change their ways. And if that wasn't the case all these manufacturers wouldn't have PR teams that communicate w/ AnandTech and other tech-related forums.

That is just a principle. On this specific issue of PhysX, I am not sure if it is something worth raising my voice over so I really don't have much to say, though.

 

[imported_Shaq]

I don't disagree with that but what is the end result? Everyone gets extra features or nobody gets extra features? Is it a possibilty down the line that Nvidia or AMD will get vendor specific games? If the PC gaming market is dwindling because of piracy etc. then they will become even more aggressive in protecting their profits. There could be workarounds for that too I imagine but if they wrote it into the driver and the game it could be difficult enough that most people wouldn't bother doing it. Just to get Batman to run seems like more trouble than it is worth.

It looks like that perfect patch is already gone.

Originally posted by Tempered81
In my book, it's a little different because concerning DX11 titles, ati hardware can run it, while nvidia hardware cannot. In DX9/DX10 versions of Batman, both ati and nvidia videocards have the hardware capability to run all the MSAA modes and render sparks/fog/smoke/interactive cloth, but this rendering is limited to the geforce 8800 cards or higher. If you could edit a line of code in Dirt.exe to enable DX11 effects on a GTX280, then it would be a fair comparison.

But by the time Dirt2 is out the GT300 will probably be out too. And it might be possible to find a workaround for Dirt2 if the DX11 effects are anything like Crysis's DX10 effects-just marketing based- and can be enabled on DX10 cards.

 

[Zensal]

I can sort of understand the PhysX part, even though it seems stupid.

But I won't stand for the no MSAA on ATI hardware. That is just petty and wrong.

 

[thilanliyan]

I'm pretty sure that you can set AA in the retail version of Batman for ATI cards.

 

[dguy6789]

It's not even just the physics part of PhysX. They took out various graphical effects and claimed they only work under PhysX. Your weapons don't make any marks at all on the walls unless you have an Nvidia card for example. That's just ridiculous.

 

[nonameo]

imo the physics effects didn't even look like they were worth it. the dynamic paper was nice, although I don't think they should have done the leaves that way. The trashcan dump looked cheap and fake.

 

[TurtleCrusher]

"copyright-infringing material"

If it is sold without profit, monetary benefits or self-promotion, it is not copyright infringement. It is obviously user-made content that would only work with a purchased copy of the game. A user can create, modify or eliminate code however they desire. If they decide to share their code to others (with legitimate copies of the game) without personal gain (as stated above), no laws/copyrights have been broken.

Also, this falls under the modified ATI drivers that AT-forums used to support way back in the day. The same thing is being applied to Physx. Kind of a double standard, don't you think?

Edit: This also proves my belief that a lot of content was taken out because of nVidia. Appopin, Keys and SirPauly all didn't believe me (obviously) so maybe they should just take a good look at what has already occurred in the OP's findings.

 

[TheSlamma]

Man that's a lot of work... I wanted to replace this 8600 rag with a 5850.. is this physx stuff worth it or just stick with the ATi?

 

[SlowSpyder]

Originally posted by: dguy6789
I really don't see how anyone could remain loyal to Nvidia when they do things like this.(If they care at all about PC gaming) They want your money and are willing to screw up the games you play to get it.

What entertained me in the original thread that was posted about Nvidia removing the ability to run Physx if an AMD/ATi card was detected was some of the Nvidia guys saying things alluding to this not being a business decision by Nvidia. That Physx technology was lucky to work with an AMD card as the primary rendering unit and that Physx is getting too complex to have both GPU types in one sysem. It's fairly obvious that Physx is artificially turned off when an AMD/ATi card is detected.

This somewhat reminds me of EA, when 2KSports was making a (in my opinion a better, though I'm biased being a big Sega fan) football game as well, but it was $19.99 vs. $49.99 and starting to steal customers. So EA reacts by throwing money at the NFL to get exclusive rights instead of welcoming the challenge and innovating to create a better game.

 

[BFG10K]

Originally posted by: Scholzpdx

Edit: This also proves my belief that a lot of content was taken out because of nVidia. Appopin, Keys and SirPauly all didn't believe me (obviously) so maybe they should just take a good look at what has already occurred in the OP's findings.

It?s nothing like that. The link was removed because we (the mods) don?t know if it?s legal so we don?t know if it?s allowed. We don?t want the OP or this forum to get into trouble for copyright infringement.

But rest assured, the issue is currently being discussed and if a higher-up like Derek allows it, the link will be replaced ASAP. For the record, my personal opinion is that it should be allowed.

P.S. this post isn?t attempting moderation of any kind to this thread, I?m simply speaking as a mod about the issue.

Video Mod BFG10K.

 

[TurtleCrusher]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Originally posted by: Scholzpdx

Edit: This also proves my belief that a lot of content was taken out because of nVidia. Appopin, Keys and SirPauly all didn't believe me (obviously) so maybe they should just take a good look at what has already occurred in the OP's findings.

It?s nothing like that. The link was removed because we (the mods) don?t know if it?s legal so we don?t know if it?s allowed. We don?t want the OP or this forum to get into trouble for copyright infringement.

But rest assured, the issue is currently being discussed and if a higher-up like Derek allows it, the link will be replaced ASAP. For the record, my personal opinion is that it should be allowed.

P.S. this post isn?t attempting moderation of any kind to this thread, I?m simply speaking as a mod about the issue.

Video Mod BFG10K.

Yeah I understand. Just throwing out my .02 for anyone who needs some change.

 

[thilanliyan]

So how is this actually running? Doesn't PhysX run through CUDA or something?

 

[SSChevy2001]

Originally posted by: thilan29
So how is this actually running? Doesn't PhysX run through CUDA or something?

It's still running off the CPU, but the phyisc calculations have been reduced.

It proves that GPU PhysX effects are scalable to run on current CPUs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUOr4cFWY-s

 

[thilanliyan]

Ah I see...thanks.

 

[MarcVenice]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Originally posted by: MarcVenice

Isn't it actually possible to disable AA for Nvidia cards using the launcher, and enabling it through the nvidia display panel? Wouldn't that also give FSAA for Nvidia cards?

Not by default, because nVidia?s stock profile doesn?t allow the forcing of AA in that title.

Can't we fix this by renaming the .exe to a game that does allow the forcing of AA ? I wonder how big of a performance hit the ati cards take by doing fsaa vs the smart aa being done by nvidia cards.

 

[Qbah]

Originally posted by: MarcVenice

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Originally posted by: MarcVenice

Isn't it actually possible to disable AA for Nvidia cards using the launcher, and enabling it through the nvidia display panel? Wouldn't that also give FSAA for Nvidia cards?

Not by default, because nVidia?s stock profile doesn?t allow the forcing of AA in that title.

Can't we fix this by renaming the .exe to a game that does allow the forcing of AA ? I wonder how big of a performance hit the ati cards take by doing fsaa vs the smart aa being done by nvidia cards.

People owning the game did try it, but the game needs to be run through a launcher that has copy protection checks and passes it then to the final .exe If you change this .exe the launcher won't find it. And if you try to run it using the final file, you get a message saying to run the game through the launcher.

Anyway, as far as AA goes, apparently it does work when forcing through CCC (at least that's what the Rage3D folks say). The game needs to be patched to newest version and I think it's Cat 9.9 that work.

And LOL at the PhysX "patch". They toned down the effects a bit, with less collision detection and apparently it runs fine on the CPU. Obviously that couldn't be implemented by the devs Only "hacked" into the game by some random dudes... way to go nVidia, way to go :thumbsdown:

 

[Tempered81]

Originally posted by: MarcVenice

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Originally posted by: MarcVenice

Isn't it actually possible to disable AA for Nvidia cards using the launcher, and enabling it through the nvidia display panel? Wouldn't that also give FSAA for Nvidia cards?

Not by default, because nVidia?s stock profile doesn?t allow the forcing of AA in that title.

Can't we fix this by renaming the .exe to a game that does allow the forcing of AA ? I wonder how big of a performance hit the ati cards take by doing fsaa vs the smart aa being done by nvidia cards.

Check out the two graphs on this page that compare the AA modes & their performance:
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3643&p=15

That's for 5000 series, performance would be worse on the AA modes with 4000 cards.

-Also, the phsyx is calculated by the CPU.