Originally posted by: hatim
Originally posted by: Klixxer
Originally posted by: hatim
Originally posted by: Klixxer
Originally posted by: hatim
Originally posted by: Klixxer
Originally posted by: hatim
1. Ill leave than unasnwered
2. Think realistically. Same way; If you are msulim and have (illegal) sex you get fired...Its not a must is it? You can have a wife. Ethics? Morals? That is an islamic moral.
3. You can communicate with GOD?
4 never did :/
6. NP
Besides Whiile Islamic law is divine law it is still law and must be treated like one. It is NOT beliefs. However I do beleive that this is divine law. But still there is a difference between practices and beleifs. - There is a reason for every law...something perhaps you or me will never be able to understand.
1. Well i suggest if you do not want to comment on that you stop telling him that he is wrong.
2. I have ethics and morals, mine are not based on religion though.
3. No i cannot (not in the way i can communicate with you), that does not mean i cannot have faith. Believe me, i have been a religious man once oupon a time, the hypocracy in ALL religions turned me away from them, i have faith but i do not follow any religion, i am a believer in doing good and following my own ways, my faith has nothing to do with my morals though.
4. "Sultan; No point arguing with an idiot who says he is a muslim" There you supported Sultans views and dismissed Aimsters views as idiotic. Referring to question 1 in my previous post, do you see the hypocracy?
2. Well I guess that answeres your own question.
3. How can you have faith in someone you dont even know?
4. That brings us to point 1. Anyone claiming to follow my religion and then syaing it is crap? Is that justice? Yes I agree with Sultan on that instance. Take another example. Say the US. Someone claims to be a US citizen yet claims the US is all rubbish...And religion seems to be a more serious matter than that don't you think? And I remember Aimster starting a runnish thread about Shiahs. That made me realize what sort o an idiot he is and how much we don't need him. You know that people like him are responsible for 80% of secular killings in my country?....Those that spread hate and who donot follow their own religion themseleves? Not hypocracy. I was staying away from pointing out where he is wrong. Ill do so for your pleasure. Aimster; What are your basic beleives? Answer that! Do you beleive that there is no GOD but there is Allah? And mohammed is his messenger? That makes a muslim. And if you beleive in Mohammed as the messenger of Allah how can you say that all the laws that he imposed are crap? On what do you base your opinions on? that they are crap? why are they crap? just because you think they are crap? And just becuase western civiliations think they are crap? Who are western civilizations to judge? It seems from your posts that you date and all and since you are living in America and become like them - who are you to judge religion? back up your claims! Just becuase you think and the western world thinks or for that matter the whole world thinks something is wrong doesnt make something right ot wrong. It is facts. And opinions dont count for anything in religion. If you learn religion, learn the meanings of religion itslef you will realize the facts. You say your prophet imposed crap laws? Do you even know why they were bought and what those laws mean? Young people seem to get a feeling that America is right in everything just becuase they are dominating the world in everything; like it has never been before. I agree that the US has many good things and many great things, however they are not perfect, nor is everything about them great or good. Then you may question that why God's own religion is so far behind. There are several explainations for that also.The thing is point of view. If you look at things from a western point of view you will get a perspective based on those views. However to understand a religion properly you must first look at things from the point of view of that religion - then question - and then decide. If you do beleive in God Klixxer; do you think he is so irresponsible that he never laid down the basic dos and donts? He mustve dont you think? where? thats for you to find out. For everything there is an explaination. Why you were born where you were and when you were...There must be an explaination for that also..but if we dont understand something we have no right to call it "crap" and I dont speak from a religios perspective only. Thats for everything in life.
Ive tried to be precise so if there is anything missing do correct me or ask me.
2. Not really, you are just running from it.
3. I do not really know if i should ask you to go to hell or just tell you you are ignorant if you need to believe that i cannot know god throug faith and not through religion, i am not even sure you are not joking.
4. Hang on there a second, you think Muslims need people like YOU, who have said that homosexuality is a crime that should be punished by stoning to death and Sultan who would "hope to carrry it out" in regards to stoning his own children but not someone who is compassionate like Aimster?
You are saying that you cannot think for yourself, you have to follow the text of the Koran literally? Eh, Aimster is interpreting it in the way that fits into 2004, he is the ONLY one of the three of you who thinks for himself.
Who created God? How can you believe in a God that you cannot explain, touch, smell, see, feel? A God who set you up with rules to keep you in bondage, unfree to do what you wish to do, unfree to follow what makes you a man?
You can continue to live the rest of your life in bondage under a God who is not mercyful, i will continue to live as a free man under a God who accepts me for who i am, for what he made me to be with all desires and pleasures.
To deny yourself life while you are living is worse than to kill yourself in my opinion.
Firstly I have no need to argue about faith and religion with someeone who is insecure in his faith himself. Besides I was here to discuss Politics not religion. And my faith is strong so I donot need to worrt much.
2. With you your morals and with us ous. You must learn to respect other peoples morals even if you dont agree with them. Who gave you the right to decide who is right and wrong anyways? Only God has that right. So I beleive that Islam is the perfect religion and its laws are devine. Punishments for homosexuality are justice. Who are you or anyone to decide whether the laws are wrong? You thinking that these laws suck won't make them wrong. You cannot base religion on opinion as I said. It is based on facts. And wither something is right or wrong. Nothing is in between.
I dont beleive in opinions as being part of religion. Either be right or be wrong. Thats where learning religion itself comes. Who gave aimster the right to interpret the Quran himself? Who gave anyone the right to interpret the Quran himself. It is only the people of the Quran that can interpret the Quran correctly. There is a meaning for everything mentioned in the Quran. The Quran as it says has everything within. But there maybe 10000s of interpretions for something. Only 1 is correct though. And becuase meaings are based on religion, we must follow the religion first lean about the religion first and then about the facts and meanings.
You mean that the prophet (PBUH) just imposed these law for the sake of it? Thats where the line of prophets part comes in.
What is 2004? Why is it different from 691? There is the same land, same sun, same old people with two eyes and two hands, one head? So why is it different? Just becuase the opinions of the people of the superpower of the time is different? Thats stupid!!! The era of the same prophet means that the law for that whole time will be the same. And in our case this era expands to judgement day.
You can see and touch your God? That makes him like an ordinary mortal doesnt it? Your God is a man??? ...And Im not here to discuss gods also so I will not go into more detail.
I do respect beliefs, but i cannot respect views that condone murder and destruction, if that is what you believe in, then to hell with you and to hell with your religion, stoning people for having sex?
I asked Sultan a question, got no answer from him but do YOU believe in stoning your own children for fornication/adultery? How about if your children are underaged and involved with an underaged man, consenting to sex?
I can't see or touch my God, but i can have faith in him all the same, you don't understand that because you are so caught up in your religion that you have forgotten about your God.
As society evolves so must religion and faith, in 2004 the world has changed a lot, to keep the same beliefs in and laws in a world that has evolved this much is foolish.
You need to respect others interpretations and others beliefs, who are YOU to say that Aimsters interpretations is wrong?
Are you God?
To hell with you...I don't need your opinions. I din't come here to discuss religion, I came here to discuss politics. Fine dont't respect my laws. That just proves that the you are not what you claim to be. You say you are tolerant.
I am not going to stone anyone. It is not my right to kill anyone. However I will be a witness at court no matter who has committed a crime. Im not that unjust and I will even be a witness against my family if1 they have comiitted a crime. To hell with blood relations. Relations of hearts are those that really count.
you actually made me laugh there! Stop talking about God n00b becuase you seem to be lost!!!
Society has evolved??? How? It has devolved in my opinion.
Aimster claims to be a muslims. What is a muslim? One who says There is no god but Allah is present. And mohammed is his messenger. Im just saying he denies Mohammed is a prophet becuase the laws he bought are supposedly crap. So he only claims to be a muslim.
Anyways I dont think there is any point arguing about religion with you - who has very high opinions of himself and his so called society. You can be happy with you life and go fvck your children for all I care.
Just becuase America is superpower doesnot mean that it is always right. To hell with your respect....You speak as though I require it...I only started this becuase I was asked about it by some people. If you people cannot respect my religion and act in a civilized manner then donot request me to tell them to you! Now if you have questions I request you to use PM. Im sick and tired of having to answer quesions from trolls like Rabidmongoose, Canoworms and most recently Klixxer.
hatim
NO, actually you and Sultan are the ones who are mostly caught up in your religion, but you forget about God, you are so hellbent to be right that you forget what is important, which is to do what is right, you do not need to follow a scripture to do that if you CAN think for yourself.
I obviously hit a nerve, you probably know i am right, you have dismissed Gods will and your will for the will of your imams interpretation of your beliefs, it is sad that your beliefs are not even your own.
I never even mentioned America, so where you pulled that from i have no idea, i have respect for most people, but i do not give respect to people who prove not to deserve it, that is why i actually respect several people like burnedout, Aimster, CaptnKirk and alchemize, people of entirely different opinions but who have come to believe what they believe through true knowledge and free will.
You and Sultan, are both extremists, you do not deserve my respect nor God's respect.
What you deserve is your pathetic lives as slaves under your own religion, without free will of your own and most certainly without a God.
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