How Do You Secure The Borders?

[Newell Steamer]

I've never secured borders before - how do you do it?

 

[TheSlamma]

 

[PokerGuy]

Winnar!

I don't think a big expensive physical wall is needed, there just needs to be a fence that goes deep underground, with cameras every few feet, actively monitored, with soldiers guarding it. After all, if it can't defend your actual borders from invasion, what the heck is your military good for?

 

[SMOGZINN]

Matters what you are defending it from.
If you are talking about defending the American border from poor people, then you don't. It makes no sense to do so. Instead you change the laws to make it more reasonable for them to come here legally.
How many times do we have to keep making the same mistake before we learn from it?

 

[K1052]

But do we really want to keep out the Canadians? :hmm:

 

[TheSlamma]

But do we really want to keep out the Canadians? :hmm:

Those hosers will siphon all our gas!!!

 

[IronWing]

A good first step might be to stop waving a carrot from our side of the border. Throw employers in jail and bill them for the social costs of illegal immigration.

 

[PokerGuy]

If you are talking about defending the American border from poor people, then you don't. It makes no sense to do so. Instead you change the laws to make it more reasonable for them to come here legally.

That makes no sense. If there is no border and no risk, wouldn't everyone and their grandmother just stream into the country? Legal or not legal at that point makes no difference, they just stream in. That's a terrible idea. Instead, you need to have effective control of who can / can not come in, and THEN you can look at your immigration policies to see what works best for the benefit of the USA and allow people in as appropriate. No border means you have no control, and the actual policies are essentially irrelevant.

 

[davmat787]

But do we really want to keep out the Canadians? :hmm:

Bellingham WA Costco members sure want to keep the Canadians on their side of the border.

http://www.npr.org/2012/08/13/158681573/canadians-overrun-bellingham-wash-costco

 

[PokerGuy]

A good first step might be to stop waving a carrot from our side of the border. Throw employers in jail and bill them for the social costs of illegal immigration.

I agree with that, but for the poor and desperate, even coming here and being here illegally with no job is a step up from where they're coming from. Also, if you're going to hold employers to account for hiring illegals, you have to give them a solid way to verify if someone is eligible or not. Today there's a hodge-podge of ways you can check, but none of them foolproof to my knowledge.

 

[TheSlamma]

Bellingham WA Costco members sure want to keep the Canadians on their side of the border.

http://www.npr.org/2012/08/13/158681573/canadians-overrun-bellingham-wash-costco

I have lived in Detroit MI and Seattle WA, both states always had Canadians come across the border for shopping for decades. After taking trips to Toronto and Vancouver I don't blame them, holy cow things cost way too much up there.

Remember the old magazines and comics where it was $1.00 USD and $1.29 CAD, that 30% markup still seems in place.

 

[SMOGZINN]

That makes no sense. If there is no border and no risk, wouldn't everyone and their grandmother just stream into the country? Legal or not legal at that point makes no difference, they just stream in. That's a terrible idea. Instead, you need to have effective control of who can / can not come in, and THEN you can look at your immigration policies to see what works best for the benefit of the USA and allow people in as appropriate. No border means you have no control, and the actual policies are essentially irrelevant.

So your argument is that everyone and their grandmother currently wants to come to America but are not doing so because they are afraid of our current border security?

 

[K1052]

A good first step might be to stop waving a carrot from our side of the border. Throw employers in jail and bill them for the social costs of illegal immigration.

The answer that basically everyone will admit behind closed doors but that nobody wants to come to pass. Enjoying the fruits of workers that are paid below market wages who have no legal recourse is the American Way.

 

[chucky2]

1.) Institute National ID, including online verification system to check National ID authenticity (registration done via state DMV or local police station for free)

2.) Lock down border with most reliable means necessary for areas to be covered. Troops can be pulled from other spots in the world save for Afghanistan and South Korea and put on our border.

3.) Pass Constitutional amendment that as long as one of your biological parents are a US Citizen in good standing, you are a US Citizen. No more being born here to two non-US Citizens makes you a US Citizen.

4.) Once all three have been done (and not a second before), non-voting Amnesty 2.0 instituted for any illegals within the US. They are now permanent green card holders for the remainder of their lives, save for breaking any serious laws.

5.) Given #1 (and #4), heavy fines (based on % of gross reported earnings) for first occurrence, local county general population jail time for owner/Board of Directors second occurrence - no exceptions. Your company hires illegals, you pay personally. This will keep the powers that be in charge of these companies personally responsible for it not happening...they want to be coy they didn't know, that's nice, they can do that in jail after their cavity search.

6.) Illegals found in country after Amnesty 2.0 are shipped to an African country that wants (EDIT) freely acquired paid (/EDIT) labor. If the country that they're from doesn't like that, they can go get them in Africa.

 

[K1052]

6.) Illegals found in country after Amnesty 2.0 are shipped to an African country that wants free labor. If the country that they're from doesn't like that, they can go get them in Africa.

Your other insane ideas aside you're actually suggesting that the US essentially establish a new slave class and export them to a non-native country explicitly for economic exploitation?

 

[Genx87]

This thread topic always brings out the crazies that want to erect walls manned by soldiers to keep people out. Never thinking down the road at what a tyrannical govt could do with those walls to people trying to leave.

 

[Jaepheth]

One World Government.
No borders = no illegal aliens

 

[chucky2]

Your other insane ideas aside you're actually suggesting that the US essentially establish a new slave class and export them to a non-native country explicitly for economic exploitation?

Establish a slave class? WTF are you talking about? I'm talking about taking people who are here illegally and taking them (for free) to a country that actually wants them. You can't expect us to return them to their native country, right? They'll just end up back here, further f*cking us. I'm saying our policy should be about making sure we don't have repeat problems, and providing a free trip to a country that wants them (and that they'll have a fairly hard time getting back here from) sounds like a good solution.

Do you have an alternate solution that a.) isn't awarding the caught illegal by letting him/her remain here b.) doesn't involve locking them up for some real period of time costing us $ and resources c.) isn't sending them back to native country so they'll just try again? If so I'm fine with hearing your alternate solution, as you can see I'm a very fair minded individual.

 

[chucky2]

This thread topic always brings out the crazies that want to erect walls manned by soldiers to keep people out. Never thinking down the road at what a tyrannical govt could do with those walls to people trying to leave.

Where would this tyrannical government get the manpower to cooperate with keeping their Citizens in?

 

[soundforbjt]

Establish a slave class? WTF are you talking about? I'm talking about taking people who are here illegally and taking them (for free) to a country that actually wants them. You can't expect us to return them to their native country, right? They'll just end up back here, further f*cking us. I'm saying our policy should be about making sure we don't have repeat problems, and providing a free trip to a country that wants them (and that they'll have a fairly hard time getting back here from) sounds like a good solution.

Do you have an alternate solution that a.) isn't awarding the caught illegal by letting him/her remain here b.) doesn't involve locking them up for some real period of time costing us $ and resources c.) isn't sending them back to native country so they'll just try again? If so I'm fine with hearing your alternate solution, as you can see I'm a very fair minded individual.

So, you're saying your part 2 won't work?

 

[chucky2]

So, you're saying your part 2 won't work?

Nothing will work 100%. Putting Terminator 2's on the border won't work 100%. You have to have a way to handle fallout in any system, and that would seem to me to be a great way to handle fallout.

 

[Newell Steamer]

A good first step might be to stop waving a carrot from our side of the border. Throw employers in jail and bill them for the social costs of illegal immigration.

A-fucking-men.

 

[SMOGZINN]

Where would this tyrannical government get the manpower to cooperate with keeping their Citizens in?

Same place they always do, from people like you who can be convinced that it is nessacary to protect our freedom/economy/whiteness.

 

[xBiffx]

A good first step might be to stop waving a carrot from our side of the border. Throw employers in jail and bill them for the social costs of illegal immigration.

Do you find you solve most problems by trying to heard cats? Or, let me put it another way, what is the point of going through the trouble of trying to mop up the water when you haven't fixed the leak?

 

[Genx87]

Where would this tyrannical government get the manpower to cooperate with keeping their Citizens in?

Where does any tyrannical govt get their manpower?