exdeath
Lifer
- Jan 29, 2004
- 13,679
- 10
- 81
Originally posted by: malG
Originally posted by: Vic
Originally posted by: malG
Originally posted by: bobsmith1492
Originally posted by: malG
Only $20 an hour? That's pathetic, our local garbo (garbage man) makes more than that!
You guys are soooo underpaid
So... what is the incentive to train yourself to be a computer consultant rather than a garbageman if they make the same amount? Artificial wage-leveling reduces incentive to obtain higher-level education and work skills.
I don't know where you come from but in Australia a junior computer consultant would probably earn >$40 an hour. A senior computer consultant/analyst/programmer can probably earn >$60 an hour. Hence there is incentive to train yourself for better jobs.
Except that $40 AUD converts to $32 USD. Which would still sound nice, except that the cost of living is sky-high in most of Australia by US standards. Meaning that, even adjusted for the exchange rate, everything still costs more.
Maybe your socialist government should start teaching basic economics along with all those other "generous" things it does?
Yes, cost of living is expensive in major cities like Sydney or NYC but isn't that like most major cities?
I live in Perth, Western Australia where the cost of living is very moderate.
Ever heard of the expression "there is no such thing as a free lunch" ?
Somewhere, there is someone in Australia who is trying to put in extra hours to save up to move their family into their first new house. All is good and well until that person finds out that because he made slightly more from all those weeks of overtime, his taxes went up, so he actually took home LESS despite working 10 hours more per week. Even though he only earns $30-40k he is being penalized for being one of the 'evil rich'.
And the kids making $18 an hour flipping burgers only think they are sticking it to Bill Gates....
There will be a time where you are working your ass off to save a few extra bucks for a new house or a new car. When you get that paycheck that has more hours and more gross pay, but you actually take home less, you will realize that you've just become one of the evil rich people you despise, and only then will you understand why your ideas are wrong.
Originally posted by: Vic
It does not escape notice that you have posted no links to back up this claim. And why haven't you? Because it's utter bullsh!t. The "working poor" in America make an average of $40k/yr. USD (which let me explain, because you have already proven to be ignorant of exchange rates, is 267% higher than the minimum wage). Which BTW only about 1% of America's workforce make the minimum wage, of which most those are under the age of 25.
I love the "it's the opposite in Australia" line. So everyone there makes above-average incomes, eh?
Fsckin' hilarious.
$40k/yr is "working poor"? That's an effing dream job for everyone I know. Hell, my latest programming job wants to start me at $32,500, and that's after talking them up quite a bit. It is widely accepted fact that the upper 1% of just about any country account for the largest slice of the pie. Bill Gates alone skews the curve. Add in hundreds of other multi-billionaires and you see that it takes a lot of people making minimum wage to average it all out. That's how it works. Come up with some of your own facts and figures to prove him wrong. That's a lot more useful.
zinfamous
No Lifer
- Jul 12, 2006
- 111,889
- 31,410
- 146
Originally posted by: Chaotic42
Probably because Israel is an ally in a very resource-rich but hostile area. We really need someone to come along and push for the development of fuel-cell technology and fusion power. Then we can pull out of the Middle East and let them be.
Melatonin must be kicking in.
couldn't agree more. too bad that those who elect to give so much aid to Isreal, in hopes of protecting their own personal interests in the process, have no desire to allow the development and implimentation of such technology.
Look idiot, here's your link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient
There's a clear disproportionate amount of poor people in US, there's also the highest number of billionaires.
Now f*** off
Originally posted by: malG
Look idiot, here's your link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient
There's a clear disproportionate amount of poor people in US, there's also the highest number of billionaires.
Now f*** off
Hum... How about a ban?
Queasy
Moderator<br>Console Gaming
- Aug 24, 2001
- 31,796
- 2
- 0
Originally posted by: voodoodrul
Originally posted by: Vic
It does not escape notice that you have posted no links to back up this claim. And why haven't you? Because it's utter bullsh!t. The "working poor" in America make an average of $40k/yr. USD (which let me explain, because you have already proven to be ignorant of exchange rates, is 267% higher than the minimum wage). Which BTW only about 1% of America's workforce make the minimum wage, of which most those are under the age of 25.
I love the "it's the opposite in Australia" line. So everyone there makes above-average incomes, eh?
Fsckin' hilarious.
$40k/yr is "working poor"? That's an effing dream job for everyone I know. Hell, my latest programming job wants to start me at $32,500, and that's after talking them up quite a bit. It is widely accepted fact that the upper 1% of just about any country account for the largest slice of the pie. Bill Gates alone skews the curve. Add in hundreds of other multi-billionaires and you see that it takes a lot of people making minimum wage to average it all out. That's how it works. Come up with some of your own facts and figures to prove him wrong. That's a lot more useful.
You live in Montana. $32,500 in Montana is probably about equivalent to $40k and up in other places.
Originally posted by: malG
Look idiot, here's your link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient
There's a clear disproportionate amount of poor people in US, there's also the highest number of billionaires.
Now f*** off
From your link:
Originally posted by: malG
Look idiot, here's your link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient
There's a clear disproportionate amount of poor people in US, there's also the highest number of billionaires.
Now f*** off
I already explained this to you some 10 pages ago, and invited you to discuss the political economy implications of different wealth distributions. Instead, I guess for lack of knowledge, you prefer to randomly insult people.
I reiterate my invitation to discuss the issue, if your economics knowledge is good enough. I'll be happy to help you understanding what obviously you still do not know.
Queasy
Moderator<br>Console Gaming
- Aug 24, 2001
- 31,796
- 2
- 0
Originally posted by: malG
Look idiot, here's your link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient
There's a clear disproportionate amount of poor people in US, there's also the highest number of billionaires.
Now f*** off
That sure is a lot of math to essentially point out wealth-envy.
You realize this is bullshit right? Taxes are a sliding scale and always a fractional percentage of what you make. Sure, there are different brackets, but almost never can you work enough extra hours to see fewer net dollars in the check. Either way, if you hit a max of 50% taxation on the few dollars you earned in the overtime you work on your $200,000+/year job, you still get at least 50% of that money net. Taxation doesn't snap between brackets until you net less money..
Besides, the problem with the rich is that they, under the guise of "generosity", give away large sums of money to charity, which is only a tax writeoff, followed by large kickbacks from the charity itself and it's businesses. Bill Gates doesn't hand out cash because he really wants to. It's purely business.
$40k is not working poor. That's 33% more than I make, which is about $15 an hour if I work 40 hours a week. Minimum wage is $5.15...
Originally posted by: Queasy
Originally posted by: voodoodrul
Originally posted by: Vic
It does not escape notice that you have posted no links to back up this claim. And why haven't you? Because it's utter bullsh!t. The "working poor" in America make an average of $40k/yr. USD (which let me explain, because you have already proven to be ignorant of exchange rates, is 267% higher than the minimum wage). Which BTW only about 1% of America's workforce make the minimum wage, of which most those are under the age of 25.
I love the "it's the opposite in Australia" line. So everyone there makes above-average incomes, eh?
Fsckin' hilarious.
$40k/yr is "working poor"? That's an effing dream job for everyone I know. Hell, my latest programming job wants to start me at $32,500, and that's after talking them up quite a bit. It is widely accepted fact that the upper 1% of just about any country account for the largest slice of the pie. Bill Gates alone skews the curve. Add in hundreds of other multi-billionaires and you see that it takes a lot of people making minimum wage to average it all out. That's how it works. Come up with some of your own facts and figures to prove him wrong. That's a lot more useful.
You live in Montana. $32,500 in Montana is probably about equivalent to $40k and up in other places.
Average house prices would disagree. Cost of living here is high, even on a national scale:
Missoula Median House Prices
The report also made clear the income disparity between homeowners and renters; it pointed out that the median income for Missoula County's homeowners was $54,710 - more than double that of renters, which was $21,570.
While the region's per-capita income has been rising 2 percent a year, to more than $30,000 at last count, the number of households living below the federal poverty level has also been increasing. As it stands, some 15 percent of households in Missoula County live below that threshold.
And this in a town where 38% of the population has at least a bachelor's degree.
While that might be true of some, it's very hard to cover everyone with that statement. I would say the majority do it because they feel it's right. Others because of the insane guilt factor wealth in the US seems to bring.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
- 50,422
- 14,337
- 136
Originally posted by: voodoodrul
Originally posted by: Vic
It does not escape notice that you have posted no links to back up this claim. And why haven't you? Because it's utter bullsh!t. The "working poor" in America make an average of $40k/yr. USD (which let me explain, because you have already proven to be ignorant of exchange rates, is 267% higher than the minimum wage). Which BTW only about 1% of America's workforce make the minimum wage, of which most those are under the age of 25.
I love the "it's the opposite in Australia" line. So everyone there makes above-average incomes, eh?
Fsckin' hilarious.
$40k/yr is "working poor"? That's an effing dream job for everyone I know. Hell, my latest programming job wants to start me at $32,500, and that's after talking them up quite a bit. It is widely accepted fact that the upper 1% of just about any country account for the largest slice of the pie. Bill Gates alone skews the curve. Add in hundreds of other multi-billionaires and you see that it takes a lot of people making minimum wage to average it all out. That's how it works. Come up with some of your own facts and figures to prove him wrong. That's a lot more useful.
According to the census bureau Text, the median household income in the US was $46,326 (if you're unaware BTW, using the median takes out the weighted average effect of the Bill Gates-ers). $40k is only an "effing dream job" if you're in your 20's.
According to Forbes, there are 160 "multi-billionaires" in the US, including families.
According to the UN, Australia has Gini index of .352, while the US Gini is .408 Text. While the Autralian number appears better, both countries actually rank about middlin' from the global perspective.
Are those facts and figures enough for you?
exdeath
Lifer
- Jan 29, 2004
- 13,679
- 10
- 81
Don't you dare tell me thats bullshit, my fiance and I have the check stubs to prove it. We both took home LESS than we were used to after working more to put away for a down on a house. The difference was in the taxes, which would later bite us in the ass again at the end of the year. We had to sit down and mathematically manipulate the system so that we could work enough to make the extra money we wanted, but not an hour more than neccessary, in order to keep the tax down. Despite working more hours, I found myself leaving early on Friday so I didn't work TOO much. Way to stiffle productivity and make someone pay for their success. It's harder for people to work and buy things for themselves when you force them to pay for somebody elses ineptitude.
And for someone who has a problem with the military, etc, wouldn't you rather that Bill Gates send his money directly to a REAL CHARITY that has a reputation for helping people instead of letting the government take it and spend it on wars and welfare for illegals or limos for politicians? Whats the problem if the money goes from the wealthy directly to the needy without the government getting its piece of the pie first?
The U.S. Census Bureau shows household incomes in the county can be grouped into three major brackets: households earning $60,000 to $74,999, households earning $25,000 to $29,999 and those earning less than $10,000. Interestingly, the MOR report found that these peaks correspond with three major employment groupings: professionals, service sector employees and retirees/students.
Queasy
Moderator<br>Console Gaming
- Aug 24, 2001
- 31,796
- 2
- 0
Originally posted by: voodoodrul
Originally posted by: Queasy
Originally posted by: voodoodrul
Originally posted by: Vic
It does not escape notice that you have posted no links to back up this claim. And why haven't you? Because it's utter bullsh!t. The "working poor" in America make an average of $40k/yr. USD (which let me explain, because you have already proven to be ignorant of exchange rates, is 267% higher than the minimum wage). Which BTW only about 1% of America's workforce make the minimum wage, of which most those are under the age of 25.
I love the "it's the opposite in Australia" line. So everyone there makes above-average incomes, eh?
Fsckin' hilarious.
$40k/yr is "working poor"? That's an effing dream job for everyone I know. Hell, my latest programming job wants to start me at $32,500, and that's after talking them up quite a bit. It is widely accepted fact that the upper 1% of just about any country account for the largest slice of the pie. Bill Gates alone skews the curve. Add in hundreds of other multi-billionaires and you see that it takes a lot of people making minimum wage to average it all out. That's how it works. Come up with some of your own facts and figures to prove him wrong. That's a lot more useful.
You live in Montana. $32,500 in Montana is probably about equivalent to $40k and up in other places.
Average house prices would disagree. Cost of living here is high, even on a national scale:
Missoula Median House Prices
The report also made clear the income disparity between homeowners and renters; it pointed out that the median income for Missoula County's homeowners was $54,710 - more than double that of renters, which was $21,570.
While the region's per-capita income has been rising 2 percent a year, to more than $30,000 at last count, the number of households living below the federal poverty level has also been increasing. As it stands, some 15 percent of households in Missoula County live below that threshold.
And this in a town where 38% of the population has at least a bachelor's degree.
I'm talking salary-wise. Not cost-of-living wise. Just went to a site to do a salary comparison for a Programmer I and compared it to Atlanta. Median salary in Missoula for a Programmer I is $40,000. In Atlanta, it is $52,000.
You're how old? Around 25 from what you posted earlier I believe. Know how much I made at 25 living in Atlanta? $35k. Worked hard and was bumped up to $55k within two years and I'm making more than that now.
Wealth in this country is not a zero-sum game. Just because Bill Gates and others make billions of dollars doesn't mean you are stuck making less than $40,000 your entire life.
Toastedlightly
Diamond Member
- Aug 7, 2004
- 7,214
- 6
- 81
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
- 50,422
- 14,337
- 136
There's a wide disparity, both income and cost of living, between western and eastern Montana. The sad fact is that voodoodrul lives in an area where the rich have flocked to and bought up properties, creating significant income disparities. I love western Montana for its beauty, but it's a sad reality that the natives there are mostly poor servants to wealthy that visit their ranches 6 months out of the year.
I don't buy it without figures. Besides, even if you peak and make extra money for a month or two, at the end of the year, that extra taxation is leveled out. You are taxed on your final yearly income, not the predicted income from those short peaks. You should get almost every bit of that extra tax back. Either way, I don't care. The point is there is a huge difference between you working overtime and the taxation of the rich. You aren't dodging taxes with massive writeoffs for your new business developments or your "charitable contributions".
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