This is from when you mistakenly posted in General Hardware
Well, if you let them get mass carriers then you waited way to long to attack him.
If he's going carriers...
- don't let him expand at all (he'll have very little units to protect expansions with)
- consider mixing hydras and zerglings when attacking (you should have had enough time for some ability upgrades)
- defilers are your best friend
If he already has carriers,
- dark swarm your hydras (carriers can't hurt units covered with dark swarm)
- plague the carriers, it'll help run down the health while you're attacking with hydras
- counter attack with zerglings (upgraded zerglings at that stage should waste his base in no time, you should have enough hydras to stay at home base, or wherever)
Watch out for storm!!! Because they're all bunched up under the dark swarm, they're turn into storm bait. Make sure that you keep then out of your way with lurkers and such. Sunkens if you're at your base.
BTW, dnetmhz, this is for the RTS game Starcraft.
Well, if you let them get mass carriers then you waited way to long to attack him.
If he's going carriers...
- don't let him expand at all (he'll have very little units to protect expansions with)
- consider mixing hydras and zerglings when attacking (you should have had enough time for some ability upgrades)
- defilers are your best friend
If he already has carriers,
- dark swarm your hydras (carriers can't hurt units covered with dark swarm)
- plague the carriers, it'll help run down the health while you're attacking with hydras
- counter attack with zerglings (upgraded zerglings at that stage should waste his base in no time, you should have enough hydras to stay at home base, or wherever)
Watch out for storm!!! Because they're all bunched up under the dark swarm, they're turn into storm bait. Make sure that you keep then out of your way with lurkers and such. Sunkens if you're at your base.
BTW, dnetmhz, this is for the RTS game Starcraft.
Originally posted by: Spoooon
Then it doesn't concern you now does it?
Maybe it would concern me if I knew what "IT" was..
He needs dark archons to convert them if I remember correctly. hit those things with that queen ability that kills units and turns them into little wiener units.
If he is massing carriers, then they are probably playing a limitless map. no need to expand because he has unlimited crystals and gas at one base.
Ok, my first impression was to say "are you serious cuz you've got that totally backwards." After thinking about how hard of a time I had as zerg, I think I can help. I used to hear that zerg > protoss but couldn't understand why for the longest time.
Here is why: zerg early game is much much better than protoss. Hydras >> zealots or goons. If you can get to the protoss base with your hydras before he has psi storm, it is all over (well, unless he has a good amount of cannons and/or high ground advantage). Well, if he gets out a dark templar maybe... but I always float an overlord near the protoss base at the very beginning of the game to watch him. This rush is the first test of survival for protoss. If a protoss can survive then he has a chance to win.
Now, you know hydras can win the game for you. But don't think for a second hydras are better on a 1-1 basis. On a 1-1 basis a zealot will slaughter your hydra. The power of the zerg comes largely from numbers. To beat a protoss you must always have more of everything: more bases, more hatcheries (than they have gateways), more money, more units. If you're not always at least 1 expansion ahead of protoss you are dead.
For your first mass hydra attack on protoss, you have about 3 groups and some change in hydras, and maybe a bit of lings. This requires you to have 3 hatcheries. Most beginner will only use their existing hatchery when really, a prerequisite is you have at least 2 no matter what strategy you are going. For a massive attack vs protoss you're going to need 3 hatcheries.
I suggest putting your second hatchery down either right before, or right after your spawning pool. Which means you have about 10-12 drones. Get gas soon too. Once the spawning pool is finished and you feel like you can stop a zealot rush, it's time for another hatchery. That makes 3 hatcheries, and your next move is to make a hydra den. Make sure you have enough drones (about 2 drones or so per patch of mineral, more does not hurt). There is absolutely no need to upgrade your hatchery to lair. That is not essential to our goal of massing hydras. Once the den is up, get the speed upgrade which will allow you to outrun zealots. After that, get the range upgrade. In the meantime, make hydras out of practically every larvae. Make sure you have enough drones. If you have spare money you can upgrade your hatchery.
Once you look up at your supply and you see about 60 odd supply, and your pleasantly glowing at the numbers of your hydra army, it's time to attack. I get lazy most of the and just gather outside his base, then bum rush everything in. If he just happens to be expanding/just expanded, he is toast. If he doesn't have templar he is toast. Even if he has templar, he might only have 1 psi storm. With only 1 psi storm he's still probably toast, and even worse if he misplaces the storm. If he doesn't have at least 4 or more cannons he is toast. If he has a dark templar you've got your overlord nearby. Really, the only way protoss can survive is if he has been preparing the entire time to be rushed by hydras. If he is going carriers he is so dead it won't even be funny.
If protoss does survive this, well, you better expand and keep him from expanding. Zerg has to be aggressive vs protoss.
dfi
Here is why: zerg early game is much much better than protoss. Hydras >> zealots or goons. If you can get to the protoss base with your hydras before he has psi storm, it is all over (well, unless he has a good amount of cannons and/or high ground advantage). Well, if he gets out a dark templar maybe... but I always float an overlord near the protoss base at the very beginning of the game to watch him. This rush is the first test of survival for protoss. If a protoss can survive then he has a chance to win.
Now, you know hydras can win the game for you. But don't think for a second hydras are better on a 1-1 basis. On a 1-1 basis a zealot will slaughter your hydra. The power of the zerg comes largely from numbers. To beat a protoss you must always have more of everything: more bases, more hatcheries (than they have gateways), more money, more units. If you're not always at least 1 expansion ahead of protoss you are dead.
For your first mass hydra attack on protoss, you have about 3 groups and some change in hydras, and maybe a bit of lings. This requires you to have 3 hatcheries. Most beginner will only use their existing hatchery when really, a prerequisite is you have at least 2 no matter what strategy you are going. For a massive attack vs protoss you're going to need 3 hatcheries.
I suggest putting your second hatchery down either right before, or right after your spawning pool. Which means you have about 10-12 drones. Get gas soon too. Once the spawning pool is finished and you feel like you can stop a zealot rush, it's time for another hatchery. That makes 3 hatcheries, and your next move is to make a hydra den. Make sure you have enough drones (about 2 drones or so per patch of mineral, more does not hurt). There is absolutely no need to upgrade your hatchery to lair. That is not essential to our goal of massing hydras. Once the den is up, get the speed upgrade which will allow you to outrun zealots. After that, get the range upgrade. In the meantime, make hydras out of practically every larvae. Make sure you have enough drones. If you have spare money you can upgrade your hatchery.
Once you look up at your supply and you see about 60 odd supply, and your pleasantly glowing at the numbers of your hydra army, it's time to attack. I get lazy most of the and just gather outside his base, then bum rush everything in. If he just happens to be expanding/just expanded, he is toast. If he doesn't have templar he is toast. Even if he has templar, he might only have 1 psi storm. With only 1 psi storm he's still probably toast, and even worse if he misplaces the storm. If he doesn't have at least 4 or more cannons he is toast. If he has a dark templar you've got your overlord nearby. Really, the only way protoss can survive is if he has been preparing the entire time to be rushed by hydras. If he is going carriers he is so dead it won't even be funny.
If protoss does survive this, well, you better expand and keep him from expanding. Zerg has to be aggressive vs protoss.
dfi
Crud my last post was long.
Ok, I'm guessing you're still wondering how zerg beats carriers. Carriers are very allergic to scourges. Because interceptors take time to come out, and then more time to attack, a cloud of scourges can make contact very easily. Please, do not fly scourges into cannons.
dfi
Ok, I'm guessing you're still wondering how zerg beats carriers. Carriers are very allergic to scourges. Because interceptors take time to come out, and then more time to attack, a cloud of scourges can make contact very easily. Please, do not fly scourges into cannons.
dfi
I love SC and SC:BW, but it really sux lately playing cause it seems like EVERYONE map hacks. last 20 games i've played, the opponent made EXACTLY the right moves to counter my strategy. it's as if they knew EXACTLY what i was doing.
i guess i could DL my own hacks, but that's annoying. i used to be able to beat these punks (and still can sometimes) even WITH their hacks, but it is definitely becoming harder.
i guess i could DL my own hacks, but that's annoying. i used to be able to beat these punks (and still can sometimes) even WITH their hacks, but it is definitely becoming harder.
Originally posted by: PlatinumGold
I love SC and SC:BW, but it really sux lately playing cause it seems like EVERYONE map hacks. last 20 games i've played, the opponent made EXACTLY the right moves to counter my strategy. it's as if they knew EXACTLY what i was doing.
i guess i could DL my own hacks, but that's annoying. i used to be able to beat these punks (and still can sometimes) even WITH their hacks, but it is definitely becoming harder.
Really? I encounter suspicious players maybe once every 20 games. Maybe. I really don't play that many hackers, on west or east. Or maybe I just give them too much credit? Regardless, it doesn't matter if they hack if they lose. =p
dfi
I totally disagree. Expanding is still crucial on money maps. You can only have 1 drones, SCVs, probes mining a mineral patch at the same. Even money maps are limited in number patches available per base.
Expansions would bring you lot more money, even though the patches themselves are limitless. And gas geyers can be limited per base.
As for scourge, good luck micromanaging them to a fleet of 12+ carriers. Usually they're bunched together and you won't be able to target the carriers underneath. Even though 3 scourge is enough to kill 1 carrier, you can send in 8 to one and they'll all kamikaze against that one carrier because it doesn't instantly, but rather 1ish second later.
Scourge aren't a bad idea, but they shouldn't be your first line defence. They should just be support units.
when is the last time you played SC??
the money maps now allow for more than 40 drones to mine from one batch of crystals.
i've tried multiple bases and it doesnt' speed up crystal gathering AT ALL.
Ya, as wobble mentioned you should never ever just have 1 unit that you use. If he has carriers and built dozens of cannons, that means you have a chance to get at least 2 more expansions than him. When his carriers are out they are to be greeted by muta, devourer, and scourge, with the very crucial, corsair stopping, armor upgrade.
dfi
dfi
Not all money maps are like that. Take BGH for example, it's still very easy to go carriers on that map.
LordJezo, what map are you playing on?
BGH/Challenger/some custom map with infinite resources.
Bet him on Challanger once.. don't know how.
How are you guys talking about a ultralisks and devourers and such in a 1v1 game? Maybe because its BGH....
It should never reach the 4th rush. Like I said, hit the pylon and he can't make any more zealots. Dont just hit the plyon while a zealot is attack them though. Run and around and micro. Zerglings are faster then zealots.
It should never reach the 4th rush. Like I said, hit the pylon and he can't make any more zealots. Dont just hit the plyon while a zealot is attack them though. Run and around and micro. Zerglings are faster then zealots.
With BGH and Challenger, you definately need to expand.
If you're playing a custom map like "fastest" or a "gamei" map, you may or many not need to expand, depending on the variant.
fastest, zero clutter, etc, they are money maps. bgh really isn't a money map. it's kind of halfway money map.
Oh, you're playing on a money map. That changes everything.
First question, do you get 15 hatcheries? If not then it's time to. You may find that doesn't seem like enough; build more hatcheries. I don't like money maps, but it seems that the way to win is not only to build the right units, but to build them at a much faster rate than your opponent.
If the guy has 4 starports and it's a largely land based map, I would start making massive amounts of cracklings, hydras and mutas or scourge. Strive always to be near the 200 supply mark, and always apply pressure. If you just sent in 100 units, you should be making nearly half that by the time that 100 is dead. If a bum rush is not working out you'll have to start using dark swarm to protect from carrier and cannons. Put dark swarm over his cannon, then bum rush your 10 groups of ground troops in.
dfi
First question, do you get 15 hatcheries? If not then it's time to. You may find that doesn't seem like enough; build more hatcheries. I don't like money maps, but it seems that the way to win is not only to build the right units, but to build them at a much faster rate than your opponent.
If the guy has 4 starports and it's a largely land based map, I would start making massive amounts of cracklings, hydras and mutas or scourge. Strive always to be near the 200 supply mark, and always apply pressure. If you just sent in 100 units, you should be making nearly half that by the time that 100 is dead. If a bum rush is not working out you'll have to start using dark swarm to protect from carrier and cannons. Put dark swarm over his cannon, then bum rush your 10 groups of ground troops in.
dfi
If he only has 4 starports and you have 15 hatcheries, you should be able to waste him regardless
But I agree with what dfi said. Use dark swarm and just push in. Sure he'll storm the choke and waste a whole bunch of units, but you're zerg! Your units are much more expendable! Crackings will make minced meat out of his base. Just keep pumping out units and sending them to his base. Overwhelming him would be your best bet.
Now if he has reavers, it'll take a bit more micromanaging. But it'll be a good fight
Zerg is awesome vs prot! You must really be bad if you didn't know that.
Try hyrdas plus dark swarm
Try hyrdas plus dark swarm
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