History thread: The Brits had 2 strange breaks durring the WW2

[adlep]

Good discussion.

But, given the excellent German engineering, if they really wanted to cross the channel, they would cross it without much of the trouble.

Going back to Dunkirk, the Brits have managed to evacuate 380,000 people within 3 days, under a constant pressure from the surrounding forces. The Nazis stopped attacking, but still you can imagine how anxious all of the Allied soldiers were to get across...
My point is that if the Brits managed to pull all of this mass of soldiers across with little or no planning, with few months of planning - Germans would manage to cross the channel, provided that they would be focused on the task.

The Germans would have had to recognise the significance of the radar stations to have had reason to capture them. Their failure to realize the function of the radio towers led the Luftwaffe to cease bombing those sites after a brief assault on what they apparently thought were maritime navigational aids.

True dat,
However, the radar stations would be knocked off by a sole fact of being under the German control. If the Nazis would of landed in England and occupied ~20 miles into GB, many radar stations would automatically go offline - creating a havoc in British defense and making the job that much easier for the Luftwaffe all of the sudden.

"Hey Helmut - what is zes big steel structure here.
- I don't know Hans - I don't have ze idea, but lets blow it with ze 60 pounds of dynamite just because..."

 

[CallMeJoe]

Originally posted by: adlep
...But, given the excellent German engineering, if they really wanted to cross the channel, they would cross it without much of the trouble.

Going back to Dunkirk, the Brits have managed to evacuate 380,000 people within 3 days, under a constant pressure from the surrounding forces. The Nazis stopped attacking, but still you can imagine how anxious all of the Allied soldiers were to get across...
My point is that if the Brits managed to pull all of this mass of soldiers across with little or no planning, with few months of planning - Germans would manage to cross the channel, provided that they would be focused on the task...

Expert seamen plying familiar waters doing most of the pickups at night, when German interdiction was largely ineffective and depositing them on a friendly shore. No particular requirement for precision or any great need for organization as regards landing sites; rather different than a large scale amphibious assault.

I think you also overestimate German capabilities with a casual comment that they would somehow "engineer" themselves across the channel. Bear in mind that during Operation Overlord a sudden summer squall wreaked havoc on the AEF supply chain when one of the mulberries was destroyed. I doubt the British would have left much if anything in the way of functional port facilities for the Wehrmacht to exploit. Land all the crack troops you want; if you can't supply them, they die.

 

[CallMeJoe]

Originally posted by: adlep
...But, given the excellent German engineering, if they really wanted to cross the channel, they would cross it without much of the trouble.

Going back to Dunkirk, the Brits have managed to evacuate 380,000 people within 3 days, under a constant pressure from the surrounding forces. The Nazis stopped attacking, but still you can imagine how anxious all of the Allied soldiers were to get across...
My point is that if the Brits managed to pull all of this mass of soldiers across with little or no planning, with few months of planning - Germans would manage to cross the channel, provided that they would be focused on the task...

Expert seamen plying familiar waters doing most of the pickups at night, when German interdiction was largely ineffective and depositing them on a friendly shore. No particular requirement for precision or any great need for organization as regards landing sites; rather different than a large scale amphibious assault.

I think you also overestimate German capabilities with a casual comment that they would somehow "engineer" themselves across the channel. Bear in mind that during Operation Overlord a sudden summer squall wreaked havoc on the AEF supply chain when one of the mulberries was destroyed. I doubt the British would have left much if anything in the way of functional port facilities for the Wehrmacht to exploit. Land all the crack troops you want; if you can't supply them, they die.

 

[adlep]

Originally posted by: CallMeJoe

Originally posted by: adlep
...But, given the excellent German engineering, if they really wanted to cross the channel, they would cross it without much of the trouble.

Going back to Dunkirk, the Brits have managed to evacuate 380,000 people within 3 days, under a constant pressure from the surrounding forces. The Nazis stopped attacking, but still you can imagine how anxious all of the Allied soldiers were to get across...
My point is that if the Brits managed to pull all of this mass of soldiers across with little or no planning, with few months of planning - Germans would manage to cross the channel, provided that they would be focused on the task...

Expert seamen plying familiar waters doing most of the pickups at night, when German interdiction was largely ineffective and depositing them on a friendly shore. No particular requirement for precision or any great need for organization as regards landing sites; rather different than a large scale amphibious assault.

I think you also overestimate German capabilities with a casual comment that they would somehow "engineer" themselves across the channel. Bear in mind that during Operation Overlord a sudden summer squall wreaked havoc on the AEF supply chain when one of the mulberries was destroyed. I doubt the British would have left much if anything in the way of functional port facilities for the Wehrmacht to exploit. Land all the crack troops you want; if you can't supply them, they die.

If the Dunkirk Allied Forces were destroyed, then the German task of launching a successful operation across the channel would be a simple operation. No significant forces would be necessary to conquer the leftover Home Guard.
Brits would be scared, with stupid tanks, and very little will to fight. Germans would be able to take over Britain with very little forces and very fast.
Edit:
This what the Germans would be up against (from Wiki):

Nevertheless, they would have been expected to fight well-trained and equipped troops, despite having only negligible training and only weapons such as pitchforks and shotguns (a solid ammunition for shotguns was developed for this purpose) or firearms that belonged in museums. Patrols were carried out on foot, by bicycle, even on horseback, and often without uniforms, although all volunteers wore an armband that said "LDV". There were also river patrols using the private craft of members.[27] Many officers from the First World War used their Webley Mk VI .455 revolvers. There were also numerous private attempts to produce armoured vehicles by adding steel plates to cars or lorries, often armed with machine guns.[28] Some even had access to armoured cars, though these were makes no longer in service with the regular army.[29]

Last but not least, England is no Norway. With a mild climate, and well developed network of roads and infrastructure - it would be an easy prey for the Invading Germans.

 

[CallMeJoe]

The Brits, I suppose, would have been entirely unable to call home any of the hundreds of thousands of troops they had distributed throughout the Empire had they not succeeded in the Dunkirk evacuation...


edit: I guess if someone posted it in Wiki, it must be true!