[hexus.net]AMD claims it will power another gaming device

[tential]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...9SIA5AD1S71978
$39

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231739
$30

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819113286
$110

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813130657
$50

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811119269
$55

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814131545 (and 2 games)
$150

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...9SIA0AT26X2129
$45

$480, i personally dont need to buy an O.S. i have several legal licenses of Windows i can use on any pc i want. but how much could the PS4 OS costs? 10 bucks its already too much for that crap, they already charges you from every game you gona ever buy and multiplayer. I rather to live of free Windows TechNet evals.
It can be done cheapper too, the 760k is still better option.

And we are talking about the hardware.

Oh, so you're going to give your legal copies of Windows out to EVERY person who wants to purchase one?

I didn't know developing the OS for PS4/XboxOne was free. Wow, that's really cool. Any other things you want to tell me about console development that I didn't know?

How do I play your console? Do I mind control it? I don't see any way to control this thing?

Also why is the case so god darn large? Where do I put this? It doesn't fit under my TV that's for sure. Also, how do I purchase an unavailable case?

Also, I thought the PS4 came out at $400? So why am I paying almost $500? I'm not even getting a kinect bar for that extra $100....

that was harsh man, lighten up maybe under the right circumstances the costs will even out. :/

He kind of brought it upon himself....

 

[Shivansps]

you are missing the point, im not trying to sell a console, or do you think that Sony goes to newegg to buy the parts or what?

What's going on in this thread? Are people still upset that the consoles are under powered?

And you can't build a PC to match the consoles unless you are going to pay bulk prices (thus reducing cost).

Someone listed the Alienware Alpha, for $500 beans that's a good competitor to these consoles. Small form factor, faster GPU/CPU, OS, even includes a controller. Only $100 more than the PS4 and $150 than the current priced cut Xbone.

Gonna have to go to an OEM if you want to compete on price. DYI won't win that fight.

That was my point too, buying pieces should be way expensive, the funny thing is that is not.

 

[AtenRa]

What's going on in this thread? Are people still upset that the consoles are under powered?

And you can't build a PC to match the consoles unless you are going to pay bulk prices (thus reducing cost).

Someone listed the Alienware Alpha, for $500 beans that's a good competitor to these consoles. Small form factor, faster GPU/CPU, OS, even includes a controller. Only $100 more than the PS4 and $150 than the current priced cut Xbone.

Gonna have to go to an OEM if you want to compete on price. DYI won't win that fight.

Obviously you cannot make a DYI PC to compete in price and performance against PS4/XBone.
But,
You dont get the same hardware, you pay more but you are getting more. And in the long run the Console will cost higher than the PC due to higher cost of games.
Also, Alienware Alpha is not fully customizable, DYI PCs are.

 

[railven]

That was my point too, buying pieces should be way expensive, the funny thing is that is not.

Well because you're buying pieces individually at prices that manufacturers make profits.

Which is why you can't really build a PC that will compete with a console on your own unless you're willing to accept the loss (which Sony/MSFT initially do) to cover the cost.

They're buying parts in the millions thus getting reduced pricing. You're buy one part at a hell of a mark up because everyone along the chain needs to get paid.

 

[AnandThenMan]

Someone listed the Alienware Alpha, for $500 beans that's a good competitor to these consoles. Small form factor, faster GPU/CPU, OS, even includes a controller. Only $100 more than the PS4 and $150 than the current priced cut Xbone.

$100 is HUGE, massive. There is a tipping point for consumers with this type of device. $400 is pushing it, over $500 and sales will drop off a lot.

3: $130 is nothing when you factor in you may not spend a single dollar for Games if you will play all those free in Steam or anywhere else.

$130 is a big difference. As for the free games, they are so good it's amazing anyone spends 1 cent for games on the PC side!

 

[railven]

Obviously you cannot make a DYI PC to compete in price and performance against PS4/XBone.
But,
You dont get the same hardware, you pay more but you are getting more. And in the long run the Console will cost higher than the PC due to higher cost of games.
Also, Alienware Alpha is not fully customizable, DYI PCs are.

What does customizing have to do with the comparative? The pros are in favor of a PC and always will be. The biggest pro for consoles (though it is definitely declining) is plug and play/user-friendly.

The Alienware Alpha is more than enough to compete with these consoles and it includes the big pros of using a PC.

 

[AnandThenMan]

The Alienware Alpha is more than enough to compete with these consoles and it includes the big pros of using a PC.

Then Sony should have just sold the Alpha with a PS4 sticker slapped on it, instead they wasted their time making a custom machine.

 

[railven]

$100 is HUGE, massive. There is a tipping point for consumers with this type of device. $400 is pushing it, over $500 and sales will drop off a lot.

What are you talking about? The PS3 launched @$600 and sold strong.
The Xbox360 launched with a $500 unit and sold strong. EDIT: COrrection, I was thinking CDN price. Xbox360 had USD $400.

The market will support these prices, it has done so and will do so. Xbone sold over 950K units in @ $500. It sold 1.2Million @$270-350+up to 5 games.

THe only issue with the Alpha is it is a niche. A PC gamer won't spend that, they want upgradeable, and a Consoler would rather buy a console.

 

[railven]

Then Sony should have just sold the Alpha with a PS4 sticker slapped on it, instead they wasted their time making a custom machine.

Man you make some terrible arguments. If Sony could get their hands on the parts inside the Alpha, you think they wouldn't?

If the Alpha is selling for $500 and comes loaded, Dell must be making a profit. No? Or are they selling them at a loss?

 

[RampantAndroid]

That makes no sence, if i buy 10 pieces of hardware, im paying for hardware cost plus profits of the 10 hardware pieces to probably 10 different companys that gets profits ONLY from hardware, if the price its even removely close it looks already very bad for both Sony and Microsoft.

And you think Microsoft and Sony aren't paying a bunch of other companies?

Someone to make the speaker (cheap, but who knows who the supplier is.)
Samsung HD
Nuvoton audio interface chip
AMD for CPU/GPU
Hynix for the RAM (most RAM you buy is rebranded Hynix ram anyway - so MS is paying them more directly.)
Hynix again for 8GB of onboard flash (the OS sits here)
Realtek for the ethernet chip
TI/ON Semiconductor/others for random ICs and voltage regulators.
Whoever manufatures the PCB and then runs the pick & place machines/oven to put the parts on it
Whoever assembles the whole thing.

MS doesn't make the whole thing. They have supply contracts with probably in excess of 50 companies to supply and manufacture it all. They're sourcing directly from the suppliers, getting discounts on parts in bulk but more importantly, a lot of the cost is in the custom design of the system and paying the engineers who made the system & software. Video cards you buy all follow the design AMD/NV has laid out. The only company making their own designs for video cards is ASUS, and they do it rarely (creating custom two GPU cards.)

Point is, you cannot compare pricing of PCs to that of consoles.

$480, i personally dont need to buy an O.S. i have several legal licenses of Windows i can use on any pc i want. but how much could the PS4 OS costs? 10 bucks its already too much for that crap, they already charges you from every game you gona ever buy and multiplayer. I rather to live of free Windows TechNet evals.
It can be done cheapper too, the 760k is still better option.

And we are talking about the hardware.

So in reality you can't even get a PC equivalent to a console for $480. Exactly what I already knew. The "PS4 OS" costs however much it cost Sony to make it up to this exact point, and will continue to cost them to update. In the software industry, you pay an engineer $100,000 they actually cost the company paying them (be it Sony or MS) twice that - getting them computers to write and compile code on, hardware to test with, electricity, benefits and so forth.

The software running on the Xbox One and PS4 are far from free. You very clearly have zero understanding of hardware and software development.

 

[Shivansps]

The only think you cant really do is add a Windows license but all of that OS talk does not make any sence. Because they cant be really compared, and they have diferent profit strategies, in Windows is a $100 license, in SOny is a $50 subscription for using multiplayer and a profits from every game and SDK. You are paying for Sony OS over time, literally.

Well because you're buying pieces individually at prices that manufacturers make profits.

Which is why you can't really build a PC that will compete with a console on your own unless you're willing to accept the loss (which Sony/MSFT initially do) to cover the cost.

They're buying parts in the millions thus getting reduced pricing. You're buy one part at a hell of a mark up because everyone along the chain needs to get paid.

I know that, but my point it was it can be done getting similar or better hardware for nearly the same price, it can be done as much as $500, thats justs 100 on top, thats not a lot, and it can be less if im willing to go for a 760k, still better than x6 jaguar.

 

[AnandThenMan]

Once again we've arrived at the conclusion that Sony and MS don't know how to build and sell a console. Oh and this 3rd and currently unknown gaming device maker (the thread title, remember that?) is ALSO sourcing AMD graphics. They don't know anything about making hardware either.

 

[AtenRa]

$130 is a big difference. As for the free games, they are so good it's amazing anyone spends 1 cent for games on the PC side!

Top 20 games on RAPTR September 2014,
Number one is Free To Play and there are 7 more Free Games in the top 20.

You should really have to change your perception on free Games lately

Edit: DOTA 2 is Number one on Steam with many more Free To Play games in the top 20

http://store.steampowered.com/stats/

 

[RampantAndroid]

What does customizing have to do with the comparative? The pros are in favor of a PC and always will be. The biggest pro for consoles (though it is definitely declining) is plug and play/user-friendly.

The Alienware Alpha is more than enough to compete with these consoles and it includes the big pros of using a PC.

I think the other pro should be easier development of games...but hell if they pass that on to consumers.

 

[railven]

Once again we've arrived at the conclusion that Sony and MS don't know how to build and sell a console.

That seems to be your conclusion. You seem to take it way too personal that some people (a great majority, if you follow console gaming) feel the new consoles are under powered.

MSFT/SONY chased Nintendo to make a unit reach profitable as fast as possible.

If you were to argue the Wii or Wii U were also not under powered, you are beyond reason.

EDIT:

I think the other pro should be easier development of games...but hell if they pass that on to consumers.

Most of Sony's backlash from dev rel was the difficulty of programming on the PS3. Bit them in the ass HARD. But end of the gen PS3 became lead platform for most games even holding a larger exclusive catalog than the XBox 360. Just took some elbow grease.

This gen MSFT has no real secrets of their sleeve. All their pros from last year basically vanished and their digging the whole by letting their exclusives get PC ports. I have zero interest in (most) Xbone exclusives now.

 

[RampantAndroid]

Once again we've arrived at the conclusion that Sony and MS don't know how to build and sell a console.

And where do you get that conclusion? Both consoles work fine...they play games...they're selling better than the x360/PS3 did in the same timeframe.

 

[tential]

That seems to be your conclusion. You seem to take it way too personal that some people (a great majority, if you follow console gaming) feel the new consoles are under powered.

MSFT/SONY chased Nintendo to make a unit reach profitable as fast as possible.

If you were to argue the Wii or Wii U were also not under powered, you are beyond reason.

I would argue that the Wii U isn't underpowered though. Given the types of games it is trying to run how could it be?

It's not trying to run BF4 at 60 FPS 1080p. It's trying to run Mario Kart 8.

The Wii U has enough power for the design of the games they intend to make. Xbone/PS4 are trying to make games with far more graphical complexity.

 

[AnandThenMan]

...if you follow console gaming) feel the new consoles are under powered.

For the money they are not, they are the best you can get.

 

[railven]

I would argue that the Wii U isn't underpowered though. Given the types of games it is trying to run how could it be?

It's not trying to run BF4 at 60 FPS 1080p. It's trying to run Mario Kart 8.

The Wii U has enough power for the design of the games they intend to make. Xbone/PS4 are trying to make games with far more graphical complexity.

Dev Rel pretty much killed the Wii U. We can sit here and argue chicken/egg, but 3rd party abandoned the Wii U.

Of course "under powered" is subjective in what one aims the hardware to target. If the Wii U is following to target the Wii audience, no it is definitely not under powered, but when devs say they won't port to the Wii U citing hardware as an issue - well.

I think Mario Kart 8 looks beautiful. I'm always amazed at the detail they stuck into that title. Shame the Wii U is practically dead.

 

[railven]

For the money they are not, they are the best you can get.

Yeah, no. Perhaps if you add more modifiers to your statement.

I can just toss a <$200 GPU into my work PC and I got a system faster than the new consoles. Way cheaper

 

[AnandThenMan]

You should really have to change your perception on free Games lately

So not only should Sony increase the price of their console (and even lose money on the hardware) they should not make any money selling games. Never mind that, consoles should not even exist only PCs playing free games, why does anyone even buy a console anyway.

 

[AtenRa]

For the money they are not, they are the best you can get.

I will have to agree with this one. For a new system, at the price, they provide the best graphics today.

 

[AtenRa]

So not only should Sony increase the price of their console (and even lose money on the hardware) they should not make any money selling games. Never mind that, consoles should not even exist only PCs playing free games, why does anyone even buy a console anyway.

Come on, i didnt mean that.

I only meant that you can build a new PC and you may never pay extra to purchase a game if you like all those Free PC games.
With Consoles you will have to spend $50-60 at a time for each game you want to play.

And again, PC gaming is not for everyone. Consoles have their own audience

 

[AnandThenMan]

And again, PC gaming is not for everyone. Consoles have their own audience

Yes, which isn't me. I don't own a console and don't want one. But for people that are not part of the "PC master race" they serve the market perfectly. I can't build a machine that matches the PS4 in all or even some metrics, I just can't. If I could I would do it and sell them, they would be a huge seller actually.

 

[MisterLilBig]

I think everyone didn't put a real price on the console gaming side of things.
So, I will try to make a more realistic case.
One user, single/multiplayer game player, one game(BF4?), over the course of 5 years.

Xbox One = $400
Xbox Live Gold = $60 per Year = $300
Game = $60
Total = $760

PS4 = $400
PS Plus = $50 per Year =$250
Game = $60
Total = $710

And the PC I quickly built here...

PC = $736, + Xbox One Play and Charge Controller bundle = $75, Total = $811


Now, of course this can be heavily modified, and such, I will explain some of the reasons for my choices.

Dual cores should die already.
8GB Ram should be a minimum.
That ODD is there for feature parity, otherwise a cheaper one would be used.
The HDD is "future proofing" at 2TB, most games will be downloaded.
Keyboard because its needed, that one, to support "couch use", not gaming.
X1 controller cause I think its better than the 360 one.
HDMI cable, because some might not have one.
Windows OS cause it makes sense to me.
The R9 285 because of its features and latest GCN 1.2, support for next gen games.
And for $12 more you can get a 860k instead, was out of stock.

There is a benefit to consoles, but in the end, a pc will be better. Install SteamOS, cut $100 from Windows, cut $45 from the ODD, cut $25 from that keyboard. Add a $20 mouse and KB bundle. Get the 860K for $12 more. New total = $673.

PC = $673
One game = $60
Last Total = $733


Xbox One = $760
PS4 = $710
Steam PC = $733
Windows 8.1 64bit PC = $871 (With a $60 game.)

Over time, consoles look even worse. Even my data is wrong, of course, to the consoles benefit, in 5 years, how many games do people buy? But then, why just take into account 5 years? It should be more like 7-8 years.


Anyways, any new info about that 3rd gaming device stuff?