HERE'S A TIP! --> Stop tipping waiters and keep the money for yourself!

[tcsenter]

So, IOW, you're a cheap ass who wants his cake and eat it too? The restaurant business is very competitive and margins are slim. No other business has more start-ups and closures than restaurants.

Since the management isn't paying the waiters much more than $2.50/hr in most cases, that translates directly into lower food prices. So, if you don't want to tip the waiter, then you shouldn't also benefit from the lower food prices that paying low wages allows.

Its hard to say how much food prices would need to be raised in order to pay the wait staff the $7 - $10 per hour they would expect to make with tips, but let's just arbitrarily put that number at 100% mark-up. So, when your next bill comes to $12.00, you should give the restaurant $24.00. Fair is fair, where do you think the restaurant is going to get the money to pay waiters higher wages if not from you paying higher food prices?

 

[yellowplastic]

<< a 3 step process?!?!?!?!

i might as well just carry a calculator with me all the time now >>



If you want to think of it that way, tying your shoes is a 9-step process, but once you do it a couple of times you get the hang of it.

Do you keep a cheat sheet that tells you how to tie your shoes?

 

[PeeluckyDuckee]

tipping that we usually consider outrageous is the norm in cities like Las Vegas. $20-$35 tips on a $100 meal is the norm. $60 tip for $200 meals, etc. My uncle lives and works in vegas, in the service industry, and tips back quite generously even though he is not rich. He understands how things work. For normal folks like me, a $60US tip ($100Cdn!!) on a $200US meal is outrageous. Its different everywhere you go. What standard?

There is no standard. There should be no standard. Its your money. Tip as you wish. Don't tell me how I should be spending my money. Period.

 

[MeanMeosh]

<< Oh come on!

My main point is this: Tips are not tips anymore, they're mandatory extra payments. It should not be the case that any waiter or bus boy expects to get a tip every time! You guys are playing into the accepted paradigm of forced-tipping.

Here's 2 directions society could take:
1. Call tips by what they really are. Let's start saying that "I gave the waiter a 15% madatory meal taxation."
or...
2. Accept the fact that the word "tip" doesn't mean you give it all the time for any quality of service. The word "gratuity" is defined as a "favor or gift." Do you want to give your waiter a gift for every damn meal you eat, even when they mess up your order, seat you slowly and their establishment is dirty? No. If you go into a place and it is spotless, the waiters are extra-friendly, they get your order correct and go out of their way in general to provide you a quality service, then tip away! (using the 3-point scale of course!).

Still find it so absurd? >>



yes.... cause i tip well for good service instead of 1 to 3 crappy dollars for a 50 dollar meal. just cause they seat you slowly and their establishment is dirty (none of which is the waiter's fault), if the food's good and the waiter is courteous, i'm not going to be a cheap bastard and stiff them. show me a waiter's handbook that say that waiters have to be friendly in the first place or that a good restaurant has to be spotless. some of the best mexican places i have been to have been in the middle of the hood, where they cant afford fancy amenities like hands-free soap dispensers.

Edit: if the restaurant is so crowded as to make them seat you slowly, you should know enough to call in advance for reservations. if i'm eating out on a schedule or with a big party, i always call ahead.

Double Edit: i leave tips from 0 to 5 percent if the staff is rude, but if they're genial enough, i leave 8 to 10 percent or so. if they smile and are courteous and nice, i leave em 15 percent, or more if they're really nice.

 

[Ns1]

seriously though, i think the tipping idea is absurd

but i work for tips, so i understand how it works ^_^

 

[luv2chill]

Well he brings up an interesting point. Having been to Europe (where the notion of tipping is very different, even among individual countries), I can see where he's coming from. The problem is that restaurant owners are the ones enforcing a 15% minimum tip by paying their waitstaff that much less. Before tips, waiters and waitresses can earn like $2 or $3 per hour. Obvioulsy below minimum wage, but employers are allowed to include tips into that. So you, the customer are paying part of their wages!

I do see a problem with that. TIP is an acronym that stands for "To Insure Promptitude". I definitely believe in tipping even mediocre service. I have never been a waiter, and would never want to. I have to hand it to people who can put up with that much work and putting up with pissy customers all day. Also, as MeanMeosh so nicely put it, I don't like to eat spittle.

But it would be a lot nicer if it was how it is in many other countries. Restaurant owners pay their staff their whole wage (isn't that how it SHOULD be?) and tips are extra... incentive to do a good job. That's the whole motivation behind the notion of leaving a tip. It's supposed to be EXTRA.

So yeah, because the system is so screwed up in this country I still leave at LEAST 15%, even if the service is not that great. If the service is really bad, I usually let the server and/or the manager know (sometimes get food comped that way), but I leave a tip regardless. Hint... if you think by leaving no tip the server will "get the picture" that you got bad service--think again. Usually they just think you're a cheap bastard. Telling them the service sucked is a lot more effective, although I know it's confrontational and most people will do anything to avoid confrontation.

So anyway... do I wish tips were more closely aligned with their original intent? Absolutely. Will I stop tipping in protest? No way... it won't do anything except deprive waitstaff of their proper wage. If you want to change it you need to start with restaurant owners. Good luck with that!

l2c

 

[Epsil0n00]

yeah, I've heard the "what if you were a waiter" argument before... It doesn't phase me.

You are totally correct. If I was a waiter, or working for tips in any way, I would totally hate people like me. However, this is because I would be misguided. The whole situation has gotten so turned around from the original problem. The problem is that jobs that tip don't pay enough so waiters rely on getting income from the customers. This income should come from their employer! A tip is EXTRA! If you get one, great, that _should_ show that you're doing a good job! However, if you don't get a tip then that should be a reflection of the quality of service you provided, not a reflection of the customer.

Okay, heres a poingnant example: You are all saying that when the service is REALLY good then you tip extra. Fine. But when the tip amount is lower (or non-existant) you assume that that means the customer is a cheap bastard.

HIGH TIPS must equal good service
LOW TIPS must equal cheap bastard

What about--> HIGH TIPS=EXCELLENT SERVICE
LOW TIPS=NOT SO EXCELLENT SERVICE

The main point here is that tipping should be directly tied to quality of service, period. What now?

 

[DrMoreau]

Not to say that I'll stop tipping, but I understand your insight into obligatory social standards.

Here's another point, why aren't we obligated to tip the person at the McD's counter or drive-true window? They're food service workers just like a waiter or waitress. How does putting your food in a bag rather than bringing it to a table make you undeserveing of a tip?

 

[Gnurb]

What exactly are you trying to accomplish with this 'anti-tipping revolution'? Is it some sort of statement, or are you just trying to save some money? I

'm 90% sure that you are actually a waiter/pizza driver trying to be ironic...but maybe i'm wrong.

 

[Epsil0n00]

<< what about pizza delivery guys.... how much do you tip them? >>



I don't get delivery. I always order out. Why, you ask? Cause you don't have to tip when ordering out. duh.

Plus, have you ever wondered why it is that you aren't expected to tip for take-out orders? I have. The business is still doing you a service, so why don't you give them the standard 15-20%? I'll tell you why--> our social customs don't mandate tipping on take-out orders, so you all go along with what ever the masses do...

 

[poopaskoopa]

And who decides the cut off point for good service and bad service, you? If you feel so strongly about it, you shouldn't feel uncomfortable telling your next server/waiter straight up what you expect from the person or there will be pennies on the table.

 

[yakko]

I agree with most of what you said. I sure as hell don't tip a percentage because the people at my favorite restaurant would get screwed because the food is cheap. I usually eat there for about $8 and I will be damned if I am giving $2 which is 25% while the people at one of the expensive places gets more because I can't eat there for less than $25 yet the service is not as good.

I also don't tip just because you did your job but because you did your job well. The better you do your job the more I tip. I have worked as a server and the job is not that hard and because of the way people automatically tip I did what I consider a poor job but still got tipped well. Stupid sheep.

 

[PeeluckyDuckee]

DrMoreau - McD does not allow their employees to accept tips even when offered.

 

[amdskip]

I think you don't have too much support for your side of view

 

[Epsil0n00]

<< Here's another point, why aren't we obligated to tip the person at the McD's counter or drive-true window? They're food service workers just like a waiter or waitress. How does putting your food in a bag rather than bringing it to a table make you undeserveing of a tip? >>


My point exactly about the pizza take out.



<< I'm 90% sure that you are actually a waiter/pizza driver trying to be ironic...but maybe i'm wrong. >>


Yep, wrong. I work at an IT Helpdesk. We hardly ever get tips, and it certainly isn't expected, so when we do we know that we did a good job and that the tip is a way of communicating that. Once, I helped a guy setup his computer, but didn't go out of my way at all to do so... he busted out his checkbook and asked me what the going rate was. I could tell that his tip had nothing to do with my performance, but only that he didn't want to seem rude. I told him that it wasn't necessary and walked away. True story, I swear to god!

 

[DrMoreau]

<< DrMoreau - McD does not allow their employees to accept tips even when offered. >>



yeah I know, I worked at Wendy's years ago as a teenager and it was the same way: employees aren't allowed to accept tips. I also wan't allowed to accept tips when I worked as a bagboy at a grocery store and carried an old ladies groceries to her car.

My question is why? If we did such a good job and a customer felt compelled to tip out of gratitude, why are certain jobs not allowed to accept them while other types of jobs depend upon them as part of their wages.

All this goes to prove the point further that the custom of tipping has completely lost it's original meaning. Epsil0n00's social commentary has a lot of validity to it. Doesn't mean I will stop tipping, mind you, but it is a valid insight nontheless.

 

[Epsil0n00]

<< I think you don't have too much support for your side of view >>


Hmmm... really?


<< Epsil0n00's social commentary has a lot of validity to it. >>

 

[poopaskoopa]

<< I work at an IT Helpdesk. We hardly ever get tips, and it certainly isn't expected, so when we do we know that we did a good job and that the tip is a way of communicating that. Once, I helped a guy setup his computer, but didn't go out of my way at all to do so... he busted out his checkbook and asked me what the going rate was. I could tell that his tip had nothing to do with my performance, but only that he didn't want to seem rude. I told him that it wasn't necessary and walked away. True story, I swear to god! >>


Did you draw from this experience to come to the conclusion that waiters should not expect/receive tips?

 

[Epsil0n00]

<< Did you draw from this experience to come to the conclusion that waiters should not expect/receive tips? >>


Nope. I had already developed my new tipping policy prior to this experience... that's why I refused his tip.

 

[Bluga]

<< HELLO?!?! WTF!? THERE SHOULD BE _NO_ ACCEPTED AMOUNT! >>



Agreed. If they spit on your food, than that's their problem. That only shows they don't have any dignity in their work.

 

[777php]

While I don't totally agree with Epsil0n00, I don't think that waiters/waitresses should ever demand a tip.

I was in LA this weekend and went to Miyagi's on Sunset, I bought 7 shots for some of my friends at the bar. The bartender handed me all 7 stacked on top of each other, before he gave it to me I left the money on the bar then I grabbed the glasses. I completely forgot about the tip, I usually tip the bartender a couple of bucks, and as I was walking away the bartender said "Hey, a bartender pours you $40 worth of drinks and you don't tip him?". I acknowledged that I forgot to tip him and felt bad, but at the same time I was a little upset. I said my bad and set the drinks down and ended up giving him a $5 tip as that was the smallest bill I had.

Now I believe that people should tip but I don't think bartenders/waiters/waitresses should ever demand a tip. Thinking back I was a little pissed that he, in a way demanded a tip.

 

[poopaskoopa]

<< If they spit on your food, than that's their problem. >>


I agree with you on moral grounds, but that's really my problem, as I'll be the one eating it. Just give them a few dollars yo...

 

[ChrisIsBored]

Coming from someone who has worked as a waiter at one point in my 21 years of existance... i'm starting to see more and more than tipping is getting to be a pain in the ass.

I've always tipped very well wherever I go, 20-30%, if it's an inexpensive meal i've even gone up to half the price of the meal between myself and my g/f.

Now... like I said, i'm 21 but for some reason look like i'm freaking 16 or 17... well.. because of that i've noticed i'm always getting crappy service compared to others around me. Not getting drinks refilled, not being checked on... it's ridiculous sometimes... Just this past weekend we went to this nice place where i wound up spending $ 93 on our meal... for 2 people at this steakhouse downtown. My waiter sucked ass. I got better service from someone else's waiter who was nice enough to being me a to-go box, my bill, and get everything wrapped up for me. I was generous enough to leave a 5% tip though.

Needless to say, i've left several receipts with messages stating how I felt about the waiters service... nothing too mean, just saying their service was less than satisfactory.

 

[FrontlineWarrior]

<< I happen to enjoy tipping, there's a certain amount of glee involved in leaving someone a $20 for a $20 meal.

The way I see it is a $20 tip would likely make my night if I were working that job.

I don't eat often at places where tipping would be appropriate, but when I do I make a habit of leaving a decent tip.

Viper GTS >>



OMG... SUCKER!

 

[EpsiIon]

This guy is not ME! Don't mix us up! heh