Help me decide which university to go to ...

[hergehen]

Hello,

here's my problem, right now I'm a junior at some university, which is not very good (open enrollment and so on) ...

I got accepted to a very nice university.

But, tution to that university will be $24k instead of $4k that I pay now per semester ... of course I will have to take out a loan ... that's going to leave me with at least of additional $80k in debt ... instead of about $12 in additional debt (I already have big debt)

However, the name of that university will play an important role.

BUT, since it is higher level, I do not think I will be able to get my GPA higher, which would have been possible in my current university.


so it all comes down to: (good name - not so good GPA - big debt + better education) VS. (better GPA + not so big debt - bad name - worse education)

So, what should I do ?

Thanks for any opinions.

 

[royaldank]

Go to the cheaper school and make the most of it. Schools are all pretty much get back what you put in.

"Why is that professor?"

"Sorry student, I can't tell you. Only teachers at Harvard or an expensive IVY league school are allowed to answer such a question."

 

[AgentEL]

$24K a semester? :Q Which school is this?

 

[Aharami]

i say go with the cheaper school. and get some experience under your belt. jobs really care about what you really know and not where u went for school.

 

[AgentEL]

It also depends what area you are studying as well. For example, I would pay a large tuition for a CS degree at MIT, but I wouldn't pay the same for a CS degree at Yale.

 

[Siddhartha]

What are you planning on doing after undergraduate school?

A high gpa, high test, MCAT, GMAT, etc.scores, and good recommendation letters will buy you more in getting accepted by most graduate and professional schools than what undergraduate school you attended.

But the company I work for usually recruits and hires from certain schools: for example Ivory league schools.

 

[DT4K]

Is there a reason you can't tell us the names of the schools?
You are being pretty vague.

Big name schools are not necessarily any more difficult than any other school. So I don't think it's automatic that you would have a lower GPA. They say the only hard thing about going to Harvard is getting in.

You say you are currently a junior. Does this mean you would only be spending one year at this new school? Many schools won't give you a degree with 3 years of transfer credits and only 1 year of credits at their school. Many of them have a limit on the number of transfer credits they will accept.

 

[Gibson486]

what makes you think that a a more reknowned school will be harder?

 

[Ameesh]

what schools are they and what major are you?

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Go to the better school by all means. It will pay off in the end. A good GPA at a crappy school doesn't mean anything.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: Shanti
Is there a reason you can't tell us the names of the schools?
You are being pretty vague.

Big name schools are not necessarily any more difficult than any other school. So I don't think it's automatic that you would have a lower GPA. They say the only hard thing about going to Harvard is getting in.

Hahahahhahahahhahahahahahaha

 

Yeah, I agree with Shanti: Why be so secretive? It might help us better evaluate your situation if you specified what schools.

In any case, working with all you've offered us, I would say go with the cheaper school, since this is an undergraduate school if I'm not mistaken. The money isn't worth it just for an undergraduate level. If it were for MS/MA or J.D., PhD or anything of that nature, I would have said definitely the expensive school, since it would really pay off.

However, it's undergrad. All it takes is to perform in the top 10% (I suppose you're closer in that percentage), and you can get into any schools after your BSc/BA degree or get good jobs.

P.S.: Others are also right in questioning your presumption that going to a [more] renowned school means more difficult coursework. It is usually a false presumption. More resources? Yes. It helps in your performance if you utilise the resources offered.

 

[mdbound]

IMHO, most Ivy league type schools try to keep their students in, ergo, they usually grade a bit easier then the usual. My friend at CalTech said that NOBODY ever got below a B-/C+, even if they totally failed every test, etc. They want to keep their students in (more money, more prestige, etc.).

Also, name recognition means a lot, regardless of the quality of education. Saying you graduated from XXX State University, vs. MIT means a lot, especially for your first job or first graduate type program. Later it may not make any difference, but initially it helps A LOT. I know i've rejected people just based on their school. Lame yes, but dude, if you have too many applicants, you might as well ASSUME that the ones that went to a better school are better individuals (not true, obviously, but a good assumption when it goes to hiring). This is how all major firms operate. The unfortunate reality of the world.

MD.

 

[LordJezo]

Rutgers 4 Life!

 

[hergehen]

Sorry that I did not name schools, the one that I go now to is Cleveland State University, and the expensive one is Case Western Reserve Univresity

actually, I might be mistaken about $24k a semester ... maybe it's a year ? http://www.cwru.edu/finadmin/controller/bursar/tuition.htm

well, I don't have such good GPA ... it's 3.162 right now, but at CSU I would be able until graduation get 3.5 or so ... and I know that CWRU is hard b/c my cousin goes there (freshman) and my sister(med school) ...

My major is Computer Science (and CWRU supposedly has very good reputation in this field )

And after school I'm planning on getting a Ph.D. or Masters ...

And about a junior year ... this current semester that I'm finishing at CSU will get me into the junior year, so I'm behind by one semester than anyone else ... and at CWRU they accept until certain # of credits (well they accepted me anyway, so should not worry about that)

What really bothers me is that I don't want to work for 10 years to pay off my university tution. And I do not believe in career building.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: luvly
Yeah, I agree with Shanti: Why be so secretive? It might help us better evaluate your situation if you specified what schools.

In any case, working with all you've offered us, I would say go with the cheaper school, since this is an undergraduate school if I'm not mistaken. The money isn't worth it just for an undergraduate level. If it were for MS/MA or J.D., PhD or anything of that nature, I would have said definitely the expensive school, since it would really pay off.

However, it's undergrad. All it takes is to perform in the top 10% (I suppose you're closer in that percentage), and you can get into any schools after your BSc/BA degree or get good jobs.

P.S.: Others are also right in questioning your presumption that going to a [more] renowned school means more difficult coursework. It is usually a false presumption. More resources? Yes. It helps in your performance if you utilise the resources offered.

Good luck getting into a good grad school with a degree from some junior college.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: mdbound
IMHO, most Ivy league type schools try to keep their students in, ergo, they usually grade a bit easier then the usual. My friend at CalTech said that NOBODY ever got below a B-/C+, even if they totally failed every test, etc. They want to keep their students in (more money, more prestige, etc.).

Also, name recognition means a lot, regardless of the quality of education. Saying you graduated from XXX State University, vs. MIT means a lot, especially for your first job or first graduate type program. Later it may not make any difference, but initially it helps A LOT. I know i've rejected people just based on their school. Lame yes, but dude, if you have too many applicants, you might as well ASSUME that the ones that went to a better school are better individuals (not true, obviously, but a good assumption when it goes to hiring). This is how all major firms operate. The unfortunate reality of the world.

MD.

They are ivy league... which means they are hard. The students are all smart for one thing. They don't try to keep their students. They can get new ones easily.

 

[DT4K]

No, they are not necessarily harder just because they are ivy league schools. Harder to get into, yes. Harder coursework, not always.

It is definitely possible to get into good grad schools with a degree from any university. They will place far more emphasis on GPA, GRE or other grad exams, and professor recommendations than on what school you graduated from.

A state university is NOT a junior college.

hergehen,
since you said you are planning on graduate work, I'd suggest you stay at the cheaper school, work your ass off to get the best grades you possibly can, do everything you can to make connections with professors who can give you recommendation letters, and study as much as possible for your GRE's or whatever exams you will need to take. Then go to the best grad school you get accepted by.

Once you are done with your graduate degree, nobody will care where you did your undergraduate work. If you think your grades will drop by going to CWR, then I think this would hurt your chances at grad school admission far more than having your undergrad degree be from a lower prestige school.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: Shanti
No, they are not necessarily harder just because they are ivy league schools. Harder to get into, yes. Harder coursework, not always.

It is definitely possible to get into good grad schools with a degree from any university. They will place far more emphasis on GPA, GRE or other grad exams, and professor recommendations than on what school you graduated from.

A state university is NOT a junior college.

hergehen,
since you said you are planning on graduate work, I'd suggest you stay at the cheaper school, work your ass off to get the best grades you possibly can, do everything you can to make connections with professors who can give you recommendation letters, and study as much as possible for your GRE's or whatever exams you will need to take. Then go to the best grad school you get accepted by.

Once you are done with your graduate degree, nobody will care where you did your undergraduate work. If you think your grades will drop by going to CWR, then I think this would hurt your chances at grad school admission far more than having your undergrad degree be from a lower prestige school.

The only people who say that are the ones who go to crappy schools. How do you suppose a school that has on the average MUCH SMARTER students can be at the same level of difficulty as a school that has the dummies?

As for grad school... Pretend you are Harvard. Would you rather admit a grad school candidate who went to Cleveland State or one who went to Duke?

 

[hergehen]

Actually, the thing is, the most probable grad school that I will go to IS Case Western, so by going there as undergrad, it may be give me more chances to get into their grad school ?

 

[DT4K]

Originally posted by: WinkOsmosis

Originally posted by: Shanti
No, they are not necessarily harder just because they are ivy league schools. Harder to get into, yes. Harder coursework, not always.

It is definitely possible to get into good grad schools with a degree from any university. They will place far more emphasis on GPA, GRE or other grad exams, and professor recommendations than on what school you graduated from.

A state university is NOT a junior college.

hergehen,
since you said you are planning on graduate work, I'd suggest you stay at the cheaper school, work your ass off to get the best grades you possibly can, do everything you can to make connections with professors who can give you recommendation letters, and study as much as possible for your GRE's or whatever exams you will need to take. Then go to the best grad school you get accepted by.

Once you are done with your graduate degree, nobody will care where you did your undergraduate work. If you think your grades will drop by going to CWR, then I think this would hurt your chances at grad school admission far more than having your undergrad degree be from a lower prestige school.

The only people who say that are the ones who go to crappy schools. How do you suppose a school that has on the average MUCH SMARTER students can be at the same level of difficulty as a school that has the dummies?

As for grad school... Pretend you are Harvard. Would you rather admit a grad school candidate who went to Cleveland State or one who went to Duke?

Many high profile, elite schools have a major problem with grade inflation. They do this to keep their average GPA statistics and retention rates high. This helps maintain their status and reputation for academic excellence. As other's have stated, some of these schools never give grades lower than C's, no matter how poorly someone does. So in many cases, it is actually easier to maintain a high GPA at some of the "elite" schools.

All else being equal, you are right, they would pick the person who went to Duke. But if the Duke student has a 3.1 GPA while the Cleveland State student has a 4.0, the choice is clear.

Originally posted by: hergehen
Actually, the thing is, the most probable grad school that I will go to IS Case Western, so by going there as undergrad, it may be give me more chances to get into their grad school ?

If their grad school gives preference to their own undergrads, then yes, that might be a good reason to go there for undergrad. You need to find out if that is indeed the case.

 

"Good luck getting into a good grad school with a degree from some junior college."

WinkOsmosis (aka Jellomancer ), if you noted, I said if one was in the top 10%, it didn't matter because he stood a high chance of getting admission like those who went to Ivy League schools, particularly those with average GPAs.

Do you have data that suggests otherwise?

"They are ivy league... which means they are hard. The students are all smart for one thing. They don't try to keep their students. They can get new ones easily."

No, it doesn't! My sibling went to both Ivy League and regular school, and she testified that the Ivy League school was more fun and much easier. There were also better resources. It makes sense that at the very least they'll be the same because they are studying the same subject. You don't see Ivy League schools using a textbook meant for a PhD candidate for undergraduate students. In addition, in many Ivy League undergrad schools, it's TAs (grads) that do the teaching, not the guy with the PhD.

Here's opinion from students in the top 10 law schools at the time: Top Ten Evaluated. Although it's about law school, I think fairly reflects the general sentiment of even undergrad students of Ivy League schools. I am sure there are some that are more difficult than the other, but so are regular schools.

"actually, I might be mistaken about $24k a semester ... maybe it's a year ? http://www.cwru.edu/finadmin/controller/bursar/tuition.htm"

It probably means $24K per year. Usually, tuition posted reflects a year's worth, not per semester. If it means per year, then wouldn't that mean that there isn't much difference with your current school? In fact, it would seem your current school is more expensive if $24K is for two semesters.

 

[hergehen]

luvly

No, my school is still cheaper - $4k a semester = $8k a year ... if it's not even $3k a semester - do not really remember ... one of the cheapest schools in Ohio

 

Oh, sorry, Hergehen! Oops! That is a huge sum difference. For some reason, I thought I read you say somewhere that the difference between the two would be $8K per semester. Now, I see that I had the $80K mixed up. Thanks for the correction.

If you are looking forward to going to Case Western, then two things:

1) Take the offer now. You could offset it by working toward a scholarship in the event that you pursue their grad program. The only question is, would maintaining a good GPA be more difficult as you stated? I don't know about Case Western, so I can't answer. However, if you are convinced that it is likely going to be more difficult and drop your GPA, then go with option 2. (I honestly don't find that difference worth it for undergrad. Check this out, btw, to see what some students are saying about professors in that department: Case Western. Don't put too much weight!)

2) Decline it. Work hard to improve or at least keep your GPA as it is now. Then come back and apply when you're ready for grad program.

One more thing, WinkOsmosis: What makes Ivy League different is that you're competing against students that have been deemed just as smart, if not smarter. (That's another subject, since I know in high school people do cheat and make a high GPA to qualify for Ivy League schools.) It makes the grading system fierce if it isn't an objective subject, such as Mathematics, or if it is graded on the curve. Regular schools also grade on the curve, but you have a better chance if you're competing against average people.

To offset this though, some Ivy League schools do have a grading rule that is soft on students (e.g., Stanford), so no failing; whilst others do not. The students have given too much of their money to be harsh on them. Money speaks! (There was even a time some Ivy League schools just gave Pass/Fail.) It is also not to compromise the reputation of the school. In contrast, regular schools have nothing to lose but much to gain by failing as many students.

 

[CanOWorms]

If I were you I'd do some research on my own since most people will say something that will make themselves feel better.

Personally, I would go to Case Western. Cleveland State University has absolutely no national recognitioin, which is something Case Western has. It's a good school with a good reputation.

However, you can be at CSU and as long as you graduate with an excellent GPA, you're well off, too. However if you graduate with a decent/poor GPA, you're better off at Case Western since the name recognition will help you.

I know people that went to schools like University of Alabama in Birmingham and now they're at prestigious medical schools. Their undergrad school sucked, but they did incredibly well, had many awards, etc. However, the vast majority of their new classmates are from the more prestigious schools in the country.