Help me break past this plateau

[thatsright]

Went back to the gym on March 3rd and up until about 2-3 weeks ago was making steady fat loss progress. My problem has always been that the scale is always misleading and I can never go by that, only measurements. Since I started, I lost ~2.25in off my waist and the same off of my gut/belly. I put on some noticeable muscle at the gym.

But in the last week or so, I can physically feel the fat coming back. When I walk around and what not-super disgusting. I have put on about 3-ish lbs. in the last 3 weeks or so as my scale says. In the last 3 weeks my measurements have stayed exactly the same, no shrinking. What’s odd about all of this is, in the beginning I would wake up hungry at night and have problems going back to sleep. So in the last 3 weeks I started eating 8oz of sweet potato (180cals) right before I go to bed and it did stop me getting up hungry. But I’d be surprised if these sweet potatoes are making me fat again.

My gym routine is solid and at the end of each session, I can hardly move because I push to failure almost every set. I go to the gym 4-5x a week and do weights, compound movements only. I do some cardio during the week (mostly hiking on the weekend and occasionally during the week.)

For this post I am ONLY FOCUSING ON MY DIET-not gym routine. So please suggest how to modify my diet to get back on track. Stats: 38 y/o male. 5'10." 209lb. I take vitamin supplements twice a day. Original diet I started with in March had a 2600cal max. The below is an example of my diet. Its a little bit below the max, but still indictive:

The above has a lot of carbs for sure. I’m averaging 200-250 during the week. I want to focus dropping calories first, as if I try to drop carb AND cals at the same time, there won’t be anything left for me to adjust and use to get past the next, inevitable, plateau. I was thinking to drop down to down to 2300cals per day. Good idea? Bad idea? Totally off base? A guy at a local health food store said I might be consuming too much sugar per day? I don’t drink probably as much water as I should during the day. But if this is the case, would it impact me starting to now GAIN weight?

Every weekend I make all of my lunches or the week, yet I have not done so as of yet and eating the below as an emergency measure until I get some good ideas from you guys-no pressure ;-) Please suggest how to stop the reverse back to Fatso town.

 

[z1ggy]

How much do you weigh now?

With out knowing that, I can't say much, but the macro ratios look fine. I might add in though, your protein on that last screen shot is too high. 290 is just over kill. If I remember correctly, you're somewhere in the low to mid 200lb range? more than 1g/lb body weight is over kill IMO.

The only reasons I can think you're stalling out is that you're lying to yourself/us and not hitting up the gym as hard as you had been previously, or your metabolism has slowed down to the point where it's going to be difficult for you to lose more weight.

I'd like to think it's the latter here, so in that case, a brief diet break may help. This would mean you "over eat" for a day or two to help reset your body and put it into an anabolic state briefly. Then you resume the diet and hopefully push yourself over that hump.

I'm still fine tuning diet breaks at this point for myself. I've read and seen various people describing diet breaks/ carb refeeding. I can't really say what is best, you just kind of have to experiment and see what works. Some people do 1day/week minor carb refeeds, and other stay very strict for up to 10-12 weeks, then take an entire week off, then resume dieting.

 

[blackdogdeek]

Just so I understand the context, you were losing weight but then in the last 3 weeks you started gaining weight exactly when you started eating a sweet potato at night?

If so, my advice would be to stop eating the sweet potato for 3 weeks and see what happens. If you wake up hungry, eat more fat during your last meal. To free up more calories for the increase in fat, lessen the protein since you're eating too much of it, in my opinion. According to my calculations, you only need about 190g of protein.

 

[thatsright]

Ziggy:

I am 209-ish right now. Body fat is easily still ~25-30%. You mention it didn’t sound like I was giving the whole picture of my gym routine, so I’ll list it out+ all of your other questions/comments:


Gym:
-Leg day: (today actually). Lunges. 25lb weights for 40ft-4 sets. 20lb weights for 40ft 6 sets. 25lb lb. 1 set. At end, FAIL-can barely walk. When I was sitting on the bench (below) to do my forearms, I could barely keep my legs/knees straight-jelly legs.
Calf presses 450lb x 10 reps, 540, 12 reps, 640lb x 10reps, 540x12reps, 450x10reps. At end, FAIL can’t do any more.
Chest: (My right shoulder was dislocated about a year ago and I was fine until I fell in February. Since then I have to do more reps and modest weights.) Smith presses – 45lb x8 reps 5-8 sets depending on the day.
Biceps-Zottoman curls. Total weight listed for both dumb bells used. 50lb x 5 reps x 1 set. 60lb x 5 reps x 3 sets, 70lb x 3-5 reps as FAIL hits. When that happens, I wait a minute and then try another set. Can usually get about 3 reps in before I can’t do anymore. It’s been a real struggle to get beyond 70lb. on this. FAIL. Cannot do anymore. (Also,now I put 5lb plate, then 2.5lb plate on top of each other and put on the floor and put my heels on the edge during the z-curls. Then push off and stand on my toes. Works out calves (barely) somewhat. But I love to do it as it adds some instability doing the curls and I have to focus, do it a bit harder.)
Forearms. Seated cable pulley. Sit on a bench with pulley on the floor and do raises with forearms sitting on top of legs. 90lb x 8 reps, 100x6 reps x 3 sets, 90lb x 8 FAIL. Can’t do anymore.
Abs & Lower back extensions-SUPERSET at once. Use the triceps (not sure of the exact name) hanging thing and do leg raises where my leg come out at a 90 degree angle from my body. Knees up 12 reps. Then alternate with 12 reps of toes up. 6 sets of each. FAIL. Cannot do anymore. At the same time, do lower back extensions. 25lb ez curl bar x 5 reps. 30lb ez curl bar 5 reps x 2 sets. 35lb ez curl bar x 5 reps x 2 sets. Lower back is is a ‘burning by then. FAIL. Cannot do anymore.
Middle&Upper back: Cable pulleys, stand back with knees at a 25 degree angle. Stand back and use rope to pulldown to crotch. 60lb x 5 reps, 70x 5 reps, 85lb x 5 reps, 100lb x 5 reps x 4 sets. FAIL. Cannot do anymore.
Shoulders, can’t remember the last movement I did.
Lastly I will mention every time I do fail, I wait about a minute and then try one more set and then usually fail. Then I know I’m done.

Other stuff you mention. Yeah, protein is a bit (too high), but it fluctuates. If I don’t go to the gym, its less than 200gm. I weigh 209lb. Also for gym in the past I never really pushed myself to failure. Almost never, ever. But this time is different. I want to make much quicker progress and just sort of doing the minimum and just kind of ‘being there’ but not really trying isn’t going to make me get any of the gains as quck as I can if I push myself.. And when I started all of this, I finally started to take BCAA powder supplements 3 x a day. Right before gym, right after and then in the afternoon.

Question: I have been on the same kind of diet ever since March=9ish weeks now. So I totally agree to give my body a bit of a break to ‘recalibrate’ itself. Have done this in the past when I was going diet/gym wise usually every 8-12 weeks. I don’t pig out and eat 5 pizzas a day, but just eat ‘normal human’ food at work and for dinner. I’m not sure if I just eat 3 days ‘normally’ that would be enough time to reset? I was thinking about 5-7 straight days perhaps eat about 3k calories. Is this too many days? I’ll start the break tomorrow as I’m already half way through the day with my workout diet. OMG I miss bread so much. Bagels…Mmmmm.

Also, from my above gym routine, that shows a lot more of the bigger picture of what I’m doing. I hope you have more questions/comments from the above. Let me know as you have always helped me out in the past (with other multiple novels ;-) )

Blackdoggeek:

Great idea to try to move a good % of my fats to the last meal of the night. The last time I had a nice steak with some good fat in there, did not wake up hungry at all and it was a small steak at that. And to both of you, will start going down on protein which frees up some cals for fat later in the day/before bed. Any other thoughts?

 

[z1ggy]

As far as your routine goes, right now whats #1 is giving maximum effort from start to finish. Like you said, really be pushing yourself... You should be sweating up a storm by the end of the work out and you should leave feeling pretty tired. Maybe try to fit in each body part 2x a week (that's what I do now).

As far as that diet break, I'd do what Blackdog suggests doing first; that is, don't eat that potatoe before bed, and make your last meal a bit larger and see where that lands you. Since you're still pretty high on body fat %, I don't really think a diet break is going to help a ton, at least not 5-7 days worth. At that high of a % of body fat, you should and could be loosing 1lb/week still (since it's only been 9 weeks since you've been dieting).

Before you diet break, I'd do the above with no bed time meal, and if that doesn't work.. Still don't eat the potatoe, but add in some HIIT 2-x3 a week. This can be anything you find online... 15-20mins of high paced HIIT on the elliptical... 15 x50yard sprints as hard as you can... etc.

IF after those 2 things, you find you haven't lost weight still, I would then try upping carbs (lower protein and fat so you don't go over your calorie goal by much) for 3 days. I'm talking getting like... 500-600g carb on each of the 3 days, but lower the fat by like... 1/3 and lower the protein to around 180-190g.

That's just my opinion, others may disagree on that approach, but it's worked for me on my current fat loss program.

 

[blackdogdeek]

How do you measure your servings? I use a food scale and measuring cups. Personally, I'd try to get more of your food from non-shake sources.

Here is a representative daily myfitnesspal entry log:

I have the coffee as soon as I wake up at 0535. I go to the gym from 0630 to 0730. I have the cottage cheese usually around 0800 before I leave for work. I have the breakfast sandwich around 1000 to 1030. I have lunch around 1430 to 1500. I have dinner around 1900 to 2000. I usually go to bed around 2330.

 

[z1ggy]

^^ Only 6 hours of sleep man??? 0_0 how are you operating?

When I'm lifting and doing 2-3 hockey games a week, if I'm not getting 8+ a night, I'm all sorts of messed up the next day.

Although today I did PR on bench and only got about 6hrs of sleep... but I'm yawning as I type this.

 

[blackdogdeek]

^^ Only 6 hours of sleep man??? 0_0 how are you operating?

When I'm lifting and doing 2-3 hockey games a week, if I'm not getting 8+ a night, I'm all sorts of messed up the next day.

Although today I did PR on bench and only got about 6hrs of sleep... but I'm yawning as I type this.

I have coffee as soon as I wake up. I literally brew the coffee and drink it right after I get out of bed. I also usually have another one sometime during the work day.

Last night, however, Star Trek (JJ Abrams' version) was on FX and I wanted to see the part where Kirk is proven right about the attack near Vulcan by the Romulans so I watched that until a little after midnight.

You get used to it.

 

[z1ggy]

Coffee is just a crutch for me. Your body does most of it's muscle repair and recover during the night.

Then again, Zivic is huge and claims he's basically only ever slept 5-6 hours at a time at most. Common advice amongst the fitness community though is to get 7-8 at a min. Serious body builders try for 10 usually.

Haha, I don't have cable any more so those things can't temp me ;P

 

[blackdogdeek]

I would definitely prefer more sleep for the reasons you've stated but you got to do what you got to do.

 

[thatsright]

As far as your routine goes, right now whats #1 is giving maximum effort from start to finish. Like you said, really be pushing yourself... You should be sweating up a storm by the end of the work out and you should leave feeling pretty tired. Maybe try to fit in each body part 2x a week (that's what I do now).

As far as that diet break, I'd do what Blackdog suggests doing first; that is, don't eat that potatoe before bed, and make your last meal a bit larger and see where that lands you. Since you're still pretty high on body fat %, I don't really think a diet break is going to help a ton, at least not 5-7 days worth. At that high of a % of body fat, you should and could be loosing 1lb/week still (since it's only been 9 weeks since you've been dieting).

Before you diet break, I'd do the above with no bed time meal, and if that doesn't work.. Still don't eat the potatoe, but add in some HIIT 2-x3 a week. This can be anything you find online... 15-20mins of high paced HIIT on the elliptical... 15 x50yard sprints as hard as you can... etc.

IF after those 2 things, you find you haven't lost weight still, I would then try upping carbs (lower protein and fat so you don't go over your calorie goal by much) for 3 days. I'm talking getting like... 500-600g carb on each of the 3 days, but lower the fat by like... 1/3 and lower the protein to around 180-190g.

That's just my opinion, others may disagree on that approach, but it's worked for me on my current fat loss program.

Thanks man! I’ve stopped eating the potatoes for over a week now. I'd be really surprised if that’s what ground my fat loss progress to a halt, but ya never know I suppose. How long do you think I should wait to start taking new body measurements? Maybe two weeks? This is the frustrating part as it might take 2+ weeks to actually see #'s go back down again due mainly to slight fluctuations in where the tape measurement goes on my waist/gut; what time of day; did I just drink all that water after breakfast and not a 'dry weight' (which I never do, but still). I only take measurements right after I wake up and go to the bathroom. It’s hard to know if your back on track If I have to wait 3-4 weeks. Then god forbid, if you’re not on the right track and lost a whole month of possible progress. But hey, that’s part of the game I suppose.

As for the gym stuff, I've started to basically double up my routine into a single week. Though it’s hard to squeeze twice of everything all in in under 5 days. I go to gym at a minimum of 4 days, but life makes it a bit harder to go beyond that. On the other hand, how dedicated are you really? On Tuesday morning I'm taking a 'boot camp' class at BSC where I live. Whatever I do, I've gotta sweat more. I realized on Friday after work (and I never except in the AM to the gym) at the gym for one of the super sets I was doing, I could of easily gone higher/longer/harder when doing back extensions as I was just not getting as work out as I could of (I'd say a partial fail). But I was worried about my back as it’s been really tight of late, so I did no more. In any event, after the super set I had to lie down on the floor I was so wiped out.

I've dropped the potato thing and the shakes. For breakfast and some other meals I've gone back to the Greek yogurt/peanut butter meal. Very filling (vs a shake) and tasty and about the same cals. Besides the dropping the potato and a bit less protein, any other diet suggestions?

 

[thatsright]

Any other ideas or comments to help me get going again?

 

[z1ggy]

I'd keep measuring and not wait. I make notes on my sheets during weeks where say, I didn't sleep as well or maybe more of my calories that weekend were from carbs than normal, etc so if a trend reverses or changes slightly, I can see maybe an explanation why.

The key for me at least has been developing a routine I can stick to, and committing to it. That goes for getting to the gym, the lifts I actually do, and the food that I eat. The hardest part for me (and seems like you and I'm guessing a lot of others) is when progress stops, they immediately want to jump to a different program, try new things, etc.

Patience and consistency.

 

[thatsright]

I'd keep measuring and not wait. I make notes on my sheets during weeks where say, I didn't sleep as well or maybe more of my calories that weekend were from carbs than normal, etc so if a trend reverses or changes slightly, I can see maybe an explanation why.

The key for me at least has been developing a routine I can stick to, and committing to it. That goes for getting to the gym, the lifts I actually do, and the food that I eat. The hardest part for me (and seems like you and I'm guessing a lot of others) is when progress stops, they immediately want to jump to a different program, try new things, etc.

Patience and consistency.

[FONT=&quot]UPDATE 5/30: So I completely stopped doing the shakes during the day. Now I have two ‘real meals’ of 16oz. non-fat Greek yogurt/1 tbs of teddy’s natural PB and 4 Splenda. Then I often have the same for dinner about 2-3hrs before I actually fall asleep. Oh, and NO more sweet potatoes. The results of this are twofold: I am not longer as hungry as I was during the day. And that was kind of the worst hunger as it would hit me hard and often during the day=causing me to eat more calories where I didn’t want to. Result 2: My scale is actually telling me I lost about 3lbs in the last 3 weeks or so and I believe it. Those shakes had a lot of sodium/sugar, so maybe that played a part in it. Who cares, I'm starting to lose weight again

However (and you knew the 'but' was coming), I did some measurements and my waist it looks like I dropped 1/4" of an inch of my waist line-very GOOD. BUT on my gut, it looked like I gained 1/4-1/2." But after more measurements, at best I didn’t loose anything, but it actually looks like I GAINED 1/4" of an inch in my tire/gut. :-( However, I know this is something I need to give it perhaps another week? or so for a final call. By then I will be about 4 weeks into adjusting my routine.

After Ziggy suggested to do some HIT, I took a class at my local BSC gym where it was their version of CrossFit lite. For a solid 45-60 minutes just one aerobic/anaerobic movements back to back with no rest. Rows/Bike machine going full out hard speed, then pulling a sled w/ 90lbs of weights towards you, then immediately pushing it across the floor, then slamming huge ropes up and down (not sure of most of what these exercises/movements are called). But HOLY SH!IT!!!! While I knew I was progressing nicely (for the first time) in the weights/lifting since I got back in the gym, after doing this HIT class I realized how 'out of shape’ I am in the aerobic side. Basically, I had no idea how much aerobic stamina I did NOT have. At one point, I had a very mild feeling I was going to puke-haha. Its only $26 per class a class. As the saying goes, do most of what you dis-like the most ;-) I will sign up for another class next week. It’s for the best, even though the day after I took it I was like "WTF, never again." But again, as Ziggy mentioned have to mix in some HIT as I have not done before to just add more variety to (now) shock my body past the plateau.

So far, I’m now a bit positive/encouraged. But me seemingly gaining more inches on my gut....hmmm. Well, I'll give it maybe another week or two to really start getting worried.

Thoughts?[/FONT]

 

[instituteofper]

Break through your fitness plateau and build more muscle with this list of rut-busting methods.

 

[JBT]

Looks like TOO much protein, and not enough fat. I'd edge the protein down a bit and eat a few more G's of fat, maybe get it up around 80G or so. America is the only country to "mess" with fat in our foods. Look where thats gotten us. Also with that much sodium it could be water weight.

 

[z1ggy]

So... on the whole, you've gained weight? Or your belt is fitting more tightly you are saying? Are you actually measuring your waistline and weight every single day, or do you just feel 'bloated'?

Waist increasing is not 100% always bad. It can potentially be increasing muscle mass in the lower back/oblique area. If your weight is holding fairly steady, but the waist line grew a touch, I would not be terribly concerned.

I'm encountering something similar. My waist line shrunk, but my weight stayed relatively the same. I'm not too worried because I made progress, in the form of less inches on the waist, even though total weight didn't move much.

I recently got a Fitbit to track my fitness. I've discovered I'm actually eating too little. I believe my metabolism has slowed a bit and is causing my personal plateau. Perhaps you should investigate this possibility, but only once after you've gotten 2-3 weeks of solid dieting in place, plus solid gym sessions, with 2-3x week HIIT.

 

[SP33Demon]

Cut out the splenda/sucralose. That is where your cravings are coming from, your body expects more calories due to the sweetness but none are registered, similar to the effects of diet soda.
http://www.livestrong.com/article/407898-is-splenda-good-for-a-low-calorie-diet/

If you need something sweet to stay sane, eat something natural with fructose in it, like fruits. Fructose has a lower and gentler response than regular sugar aka sucrose (fructose and glucose) and won't trigger insulin like sucrose's glucose component.

Your workouts are fine, although I'd try to get some more regular bench press in instead of the Smith machine. Smith limits 3D ROM which will hold your strength levels back and can even be dangerous when going heavy. I'd also recommend going to a gym that allows you to squat in a rack and deadlift. In my area, L.A. Fitness has actually been on point aside from the annoying hex plates (round are much better for deads).