(Heise.de) Nvidia Kepler GPUs are not fully compatible with DirectX 11.1

Toggle sidebar Toggle sidebar
S

Silverforce11

Lifer
Feb 19, 2009
10,457
10
76
Doesn't matter, nobody is going to bother with dx11.1, same as dx10.1, MS is being silly with these little updates, first saying its Windows 8 only now backtracking.
 
F

f1sherman

Platinum Member
Apr 5, 2011
2,243
1
0
Well I'd be pretty pissed about it. Having peace of mind includes things like being able to "take Nvidia at face value", and is actually a big reason why I'm pro NV.
 
ShintaiDK

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
20,378
145
106
AnandThenMan said:
Why does Nvidia keep doing this?
Click to expand...

You might find out that the other party aint "fully DX11.1" either...And its thanks to Microsoft.

But both of them still support full DX11.1 functionality via the DX11.1 API.

"The GTX 680 supports DirectX 11.1 with hardware feature level 11_0, including all optional features.This includes a number of features useful for game developers such as:
  • Partial constant buffer updates
  • Logic operations in the Output Merger
  • 16bpp rendering
  • UAV-only rendering
  • Partial clears
  • Large constant buffers
We did not enable four non-gaming features in Hardware in Kepler (for 11_1):
  • Target-Independent Rasterization (2D rendering only)
  • 16xMSAA Rasterization (2D rendering only)
  • Orthogonal Line Rendering Mode
  • UAV in non-pixel-shader stages
So basically, we do support 11.1 features with 11_0 feature level through the DirectX 11.1 API. We do not support feature level 11_1. This is a bit confusing, due to Microsoft naming. So we do support 11.1 from a feature level for gaming related features."
Click to expand...
You can even say that Kepler and CGN is fully DX11.1 compliant on the platform extended Windows 7 DX. Just a shame Win7 didnt get all DX11.1 features. Now go consider that.

And dont throw rocks when you live in a glass house *hint hint*.

One might even think it was MS themselves that planted it. To get focus away from DX11.1 and Windows 7 with the cancelled SP2 and only minor platform DX update.
 
Last edited:
ShintaiDK

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
20,378
145
106
Its not by pure accident that 9 out of 10 DX11.1 functions run on the CPU and not the GPUs.
 
Z

zlatan

Senior member
Mar 15, 2011
580
291
136
BrightCandle said:
A better link that explains a little better: http://www.brightsideofnews.com/new...directx-111-with-kepler-gpus2c-bute280a6.aspx

In a nuttshell for gaming purposes the 600 series of cards have 11.1 feature support but they don't support the other things in DX 11.1 and hence are only technically 11.0 devices.
Click to expand...
DirectX 11.1 is equal to feature_level_11_1.
If they saying that they support directx 11.1 API, but with feature_level_11_0, than I'll say any DirectX 9 card supports DirectX 11.1, but with feature_level_9_1. It's the same thing. I hope you understand why this statement is stupid.

BrightCandle said:
They could in theory run DX 11.1 games that used feature flag checking to determine if features can be used.
Click to expand...
This is not true. If you pass a compiled vertex, hull, domain or geometry shader that use a non-supported instruction to a create-shader function (vertex, hull, domain or geometry) on a hardware that don’t support UAVs at these stages, than the create-shader function will fails. It will also fails if the shader tries to use an UAV slot beyond the set of UAV slots that the hardware supports.
 
Z

zlatan

Senior member
Mar 15, 2011
580
291
136
ShintaiDK said:
Are they? ;)
Click to expand...
Yes. I'm already done some testing: stream output data directly from the domain shader stage. My GCN-based card can do it, but Kepler not.

ShintaiDK said:
Are they Windows 7 DX11.1 compatible or Windows 8 DX11.1?
Click to expand...
Only Windows 8 support DirectX 11.1. The Windows 7 just got the runtime to speed up some functions in IE10.

ShintaiDK said:
Not only is DX11.1 utterly useless, its also a huge mess. Thanks to the currently imploding Microsoft.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/hh404562(v=vs.85).aspx
Click to expand...
It's a very well documented API, and very useful. I'm really like the shader tracing.
 
RussianSensation

RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
19,458
765
126
f1sherman said:
Well I'd be pretty pissed about it. Having peace of mind includes things like being able to "take Nvidia at face value", and is actually a big reason why I'm pro NV.
Click to expand...

Nvidia still didn't publicly own up to the YLOD hardware issues that crippled PS3s. Instead they quietly let Sony take the entire blame, while it was 100% related to the infamous bump-gate scandal that later crippled GeForce 8/9 chips. If we take NV at face value, they need to be transparent about both their failures and successes and yet when the original PS3s failed due to failed solder over time that requires RSX re-balling to fix, NV didn't say a word. I wouldn't hold NV to any kind of ethical standards.

At the same time DX11.1 seems like another useless release much like DX10.1 was. I really could care less about DX11.1 for marketing reasons to sell GPUs, but how NV handled voltage control with its AIBs this generation is yet another example of NV not being transparent about things. NV never told enthusiasts that if you raise Kepler voltage above 1.175V (+ automatic VID adjustment in GPU boost that happens behind the scenes), that GK104 has a very high chance of experiencing electromigration and this overvoltage could strip the silicon, thus killing the chip prematurely. If it wasn't for MSI and EVGA, we would have never found out this information. It's interesting that you say you expect a peace of mind when buying NV but then NV should have stated this major limitation of GK104 silicon from the very beginning to all MSI Lightning and EVGA Classified users as a pamphlet inside the box.

WRT DX11.1, it's not the first time both videocard companies advertise new features that don't work properly. In this case I don't think it will matter for this generation of cards as once true next generation DX11 games arrive in 2014-2015, GTX680/HD7970 are going to be paperweight.
 
Last edited:
Grooveriding

Grooveriding

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2008
9,147
1,329
126
Lack of transparency is nothing new from nvidia.

About Windows 8 and DX11.1, not sure how many else have tried Win 8 yet. I wasn't even going to bother as I am satisfied with 7 but there was a deal to get an upgrade for $15 so I bit.

I used Start8 to eliminate the Metro UI and make it run mostly like 7 does. While for the most part it works, there are certainly issues with it. On my first install activation totally broke after installing the media center upgrade and I couldn't get it to activate again even after calling MS for help. The suggestion was to reinstall.

Ended up reinstalling and got it working fine after that, then turns out it doesn't play nice with Intel's RSTE drivers and got BSODs from that. Then find out when you uninstall the RSTE driver package it breaks Win 8 necessitating a reinstall. Guess the problem could be Intel's drivers rather than Win 8, but just not worth the headache.

Restored my Win 7 image back to my SSD. Win 8 is currently a POS imo.
 
T

Timorous

Golden Member
Oct 27, 2008
1,966
3,850
136
Well I have just checked on an online retailer in the UK to see if they are advertising DX11.1 on the box or in the specification blurb and it does not, it just sticks to DX11.

I guess that would mean they do not support DX11.1 fully because if they did it would be on the boxes in the UK. As it is not they obviously know that if they were questioned on it they would get hit pretty hard with the trading standards laws about correct and accurate advertisement.

I just checked on newegg and it is the same there, they do not advertise it as being DX11.1 on the boxes so obviously it is missing features even if it partially supports DX11.1.
 
Last edited:
S

Spjut

Senior member
Apr 9, 2011
931
160
106
RussianSensation said:
At the same time DX11.1 seems like another useless release much like DX10.1 was.
Click to expand...

Wouldn't say DX10.1 was totally useless, it sees more usage now when DX11 is gaining more ground. DX10 cards can't enable MSAA in Shogun 2 and Black Ops 2, but DX10.1 cards can.
A game known for better performance in DX10.1 is Battleforge.
 
F

Final8ty

Golden Member
Jun 13, 2007
1,172
13
81
[pressroom.nvidia.com]

NVIDIA Launches First GeForce GPUs Based on Next-Generation Kepler Architecture.

GeForce GTX 680 for PC Gamers Is Fastest, Most Efficient GPU Ever Built; GeForce GT 640M for Notebooks Puts the "Ultra" in Ultrabooks

A new streaming multiprocessor block, known as SMX, that delivers twice the performance per watt of previous-generation products
Special board components, including acoustic dampeners, high-efficiency heat pipes and custom fins, that create a quiet gaming experience
NVIDIA GPU Boost technology, which dynamically adjusts GPU speeds to maximize gaming performance
New FXAA and TXAA antialiasing and Adaptive VSync technologies to enrich visual quality without compromising gaming performance
Support for up to four separate displays -- three of them in 3D -- off a single card for a massive 3D gaming experience
Manufactured on TSMC's new 28-nm process, with support for PCI-E Gen 3 and DX11.1
Click to expand...
http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/...releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=865433


we also had to ask specifically whether the GK104 GPU with DirectX 11.1 support. The answer is yes, but NVIDIA's Drew Henry (General Manager for NVIDIA GPU's PC Business Unit), the "Who cares?"
Click to expand...
http://www.microsofttranslator.com/...t/naytonohjaimet/nvidia-geforce-gtx-680-gk104
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

TRENDING THREADS

COMPANY
RESOURCES
FOLLOW
Top Bottom