Health insurance companies predate the weakest consummer

[xj0hnx]

So lets see, you've never needed health care? Never needed a tetanus shot? Never had a staph infection? Never had the measles or whooping cough? Never needed a vaccine in your life?

You really have ZERO CLUE about health care. Most Americans get it from birth. Actually you are probably like most Americans and were born in a hospital. Know why? Because humans really don't do to well having babies. Most women and children before healthcare was wide spread in industrialized worlds would DIE.

Then there was rampant diseases, infections, and tons of stuff you as an American citizen take for granted because of your health care. Because healthcare has brought you into this world, vaccinated you, and allows you to buy over the counter drugs when needed, you can go much longer in life with out "needing health care." Actually, if it wasn't for the fact I play sports and typically get sports related injuries, I would rarely have to see a doctor as well.

Yes, healthcare is needed more as you get older to extend your life. Without modern medicine, we would all be dying at the ripe old age of 40.

Give me a break. Healthcare is NOT a luxury. Luxury is something defined as being able to live without. Well get this bud, without healthcare you DO NOT LIVE. Just as the absence of water, food, or air will kill you, so will the absence of healthcare. It only takes a little longer.


The fact that healthcare is such a major for profit scheme is what is right now bringing down our society. There is no supply and demand structure because, while you may not need it now, EVERYONE needs healthcare at some point in their lives if they want to continue living. Go troll elsewhere.

Health CARE dumbass. This isn't about health CARE, it's about health INSURANCE. This debate will go nowhere until idiots figure out they are not the same thing.

 

[Patranus]

Health CARE dumbass. This isn't about health CARE, it's about health INSURANCE. This debate will go nowhere until idiots figure out they are not the same thing.

And many people buy much more insurance than they actually need and their plans cost more.

Just like car insurance, you can get a plan with a low deductible/high monthly payment or a high deductible/low monthly payment.

People simply do not shop around but then bitch and moan for the government to fix something that doesn't need to be fixed. The only thing that needs to be fixed is the laziness of many Americans who have become reliant on the nanny government to do everything for them.

 

[HumblePie]

Health CARE dumbass. This isn't about health CARE, it's about health INSURANCE. This debate will go nowhere until idiots figure out they are not the same thing.

Sigh, and how do you expect to pay for healthcare when everything is done in an increasing for profit business model? Healthcare costs go up, and so does insurance. The buck is passed to the people who have pony up.

The problem is healthcare and health insurance really shouldn't be this spiraling out of control for profit business. Healthcare is universally needed by every person in this country. Actually it is needed by everyone person on this planet but that is for a different debate. The collusion of the healthcare industry and the insurance industry to shake down and fleece people for exorbitant costs and fees are pissing people off. In fact, it's causing economic strife and hardship on everyone. It needs to be fixed and regulated on a national scale.

Right now, the only barely affordable way for most people to get healthcare is through health insurance. Which ends up putting a middle man into the equation to take a "cut" and further drive up prices of the whole system.

Be it single payer for everyone, insurance for healthcare forced to be non profit, new government run hospitals and clinics for healthcare that are not for profit, or a combination of all three needs to be done.

Free market rules on a system that doesn't adhere to supply and demand rules the same way for necessities for life need to be regulated to prevent greedy corruption.

 

[xj0hnx]

And many people buy much more insurance than they actually need and their plans cost more.

Just like car insurance, you can get a plan with a low deductible/high monthly payment or a high deductible/low monthly payment.

People simply do not shop around but then bitch and moan for the government to fix something that doesn't need to be fixed. The only thing that needs to be fixed is the laziness of many Americans who have become reliant on the nanny government to do everything for them.

That and people want to be able to put as much of their cost on their plans as possible, and then belly ache because the cost go up. I can see if you have scripts, and/or procedures that cost thousands every month, but people charge everything to it, office visits for routine check-ups, sub $100 meds add up quick, what the hell do they expect?

 

[JSt0rm]

bitch and moan for the government to fix something that doesn't need to be fixed.

buhahahahaha

Do you really believe that we need NO reform? I mean fuck all the free healthcare, uhc, co-op insurance plans - you think we need NOTHING done?

 

[xj0hnx]

Sigh, and how do you expect to pay for healthcare when everything is done in an increasing for profit business model? Healthcare costs go up, and so does insurance. The buck is passed to the people who have pony up.

The problem is healthcare and health insurance really shouldn't be this spiraling out of control for profit business. Healthcare is universally needed by every person in this country. Actually it is needed by everyone person on this planet but that is for a different debate. The collusion of the healthcare industry and the insurance industry to shake down and fleece people for exorbitant costs and fees are pissing people off. In fact, it's causing economic strife and hardship on everyone. It needs to be fixed a regulated on a national scale.

Right now, the only barely affordable way for most people to get healthcare is through health insurance. Which ends up putting a middle man into the equation to take a "cut" and further drive up prices of the whole system.

Be it single payer for everyone, insurance for healthcare forced to be non profit, new government run hospitals and clinics for healthcare that are not for profit, or a combination of all three needs to be done.

Free market rules on a system that doesn't adhere to supply and demand rules the same way for necessities for life need to be regulated to prevent greedy corruption.

Nothing is helped by the things I have mentioned already, people charging every penny they can to insurance, and then expecting that prices are going to stay low, it ridiculous. If people had been responsible with health insurance this likely wouldn't even be a debate, but nobody wants to pay for anything, but they'll complain until the cows come home when their own actions cause prices to spiral out of control. If you put fill ups, new tires, and oil changes on your car insurance, that would be sky high too. People survived quite well before insurance was the norm for basic health care payments.

 

[xj0hnx]

buhahahahaha

Do you really believe that we need NO reform? I mean fuck all the free healthcare, uhc, co-op insurance plans - you think we need NOTHING done?

WE definitely need to do something with it because it's all kinds of fucked up, but people don't want to take the responsibility to fix it, they want to continue get the benefits of having insurance without having to pay for it. You just can't expect insurance companies to bear the cost of a nations health care needs across the board and cost to stay low.

 

[sandorski]

/Facepalm x2 4u

So according to you, if I go rob a bank so I can afford lifesaving medical treatment, than robbing banks is extending my lifespan. It's so unfair that robbing banks is illegal because robbing banks extends lifespans.

I know you wish health insurance = health care, but it doesn't. They are different, and that's why this debate is flawed.

Fail. Strawman noted.

 

[xj0hnx]

Fail. Strawman noted.

Sorry, reality says you can just through "strawman" around and make yourself right ...you are not.

 

[sandorski]

Sorry, reality says you can just through "strawman" around and make yourself right ...you are not.

Fail again.

 

[HumblePie]

Nothing is helped by the things I have mentioned already, people charging every penny they can to insurance, and then expecting that prices are going to stay low, it ridiculous. If people had been responsible with health insurance this likely wouldn't even be a debate, but nobody wants to pay for anything, but they'll complain until the cows come home when their own actions cause prices to spiral out of control. If you put fill ups, new tires, and oil changes on your car insurance, that would be sky high too. People survived quite well before insurance was the norm for basic health care payments.

Actually, that is fallacy I'm pointing out in your argument. People did NOT survive. I repeat in all caps....

THEY DID NOT SURVIVE!!!!!11!1!one!11>.>

(for very long)

Okay, my silliness is over. To reiterate, greed by both healthcare and health insurance has driven prices sky high and some usage. Prices could be brought down if doctors didn't always want to throw in the most expensive procedures or the most expensive drugs and treatments. Prices could be brought down if every kid in America growing up didn't think the most "successful" occupations in life were doctors, lawyers, sport starts, actors, singers, CEOs, and politicians. I'm not saying they aren't, but the fact that people clamor to being a doctor just so they can live the high life later instead of doing it to help their follow man is a huge factor to blame. There is a reason there are more plastic surgeons in LA for example than regular doctors. They all want a piece of the pie.

 

[JS80]

Wellpoint made 2.5 BILLION dollars in profit last year.. yep, it is the fault of those doctors!

Elmoron.

7% profit margin what a travesty

 

[Ozoned]

In what universe is it ethical, for Anthem BC/BS to increase the rates for those who buy their insurance privately, while leaving the group rates the same?
I sincerely doubt that I will ever see a politician strong enough to demand fair and ethical rates from the insurance industry, ie individual rates and small group rates close to group rates.

The statistical analysis of risk universe.

Just guessing, but I would think that the biggest consumer of private health insurance would be small business people. Just guessing again, but I would think that in this economy, small business people that are healthy are taking a little risk and dropping coverage so they can eat. Maybe even being forced out because of business closing down.

Go ahead and blame the evil insurance companies if it makes you feel better.

 

[xj0hnx]

Actually, that is fallacy I'm pointing out in your argument. People did NOT survive. I repeat in all caps....

THEY DID NOT SURVIVE!!!!!11!1!one!11>.>

I am going to assume that's sarcasm, at least I hope it was.

(for very long)

Okay, my silliness is over. To reiterate, greed by both healthcare and health insurance has driven prices sky high and some usage. Prices could be brought down if doctors didn't always want to throw in the most expensive procedures or the most expensive drugs and treatments. Prices could be brought down if every kid in America growing up didn't think the most "successful" occupations in life were doctors, lawyers, sport starts, actors, singers, CEOs, and politicians. I'm not saying they aren't, but the fact that people clamor to being a doctor just so they can live the high life later instead of doing it to help their follow man is a huge factor to blame. There is a reason there are more plastic surgeons in LA for example than regular doctors. They all want a piece of the pie.

Doctors don't always want to use the most expensive treatments. I've been in the hospital a few times, and see a doctor every other month, and have never been pushed to any particular route. I've always been explained the options, and left to decide for myself, outside of the nescessary lifesaving procedures. I suspect that more of an exception than a rule, and one that gets thrown around a lot more than it should. How about people not putting every single little thing on the insurance bill, oh, but that would be personal resonsibility, no need for that when we can paint companies as evil greedy scum. Back when insurance was used like it's supposed to be, it didn't cost anything close to what it does now.

And so what if there are a lot of plastic surgeons in Cali that want a piece of the pie? Welcome to America.

 

[xj0hnx]

Fail again.

There is no need to keep talking again, you're illogical conclusion has enough fail for decades.

 

[sandorski]

There is no need to keep talking again, you're illogical conclusion has enough fail for decades.

How does one Afford Healthcare without Insurance?

Most don't, especially with any Life threatening ailment.

 

[xj0hnx]

How does one Afford Healthcare without Insurance?

Most don't, especially with any Life threatening ailment.

Because if insurance went away tomorrow the world's collective lifespan would be shortened dramatically right? However you pay for it health care is what saves lives, health insurance is just one way to pay for it.

Health care ≠ health insurance

 

[sandorski]

Because if insurance went away tomorrow the world's collective lifespan would be shortened dramatically right? However you pay for it health care is what saves lives, health insurance is just one way to pay for it.

Health care ≠ health insurance

...and if you can't Pay? ...you don't get HealthCare.

See how that works?

 

[HumblePie]

Doctors don't always want to use the most expensive treatments. I've been in the hospital a few times, and see a doctor every other month, and have never been pushed to any particular route. I've always been explained the options, and left to decide for myself, outside of the nescessary lifesaving procedures. I suspect that more of an exception than a rule, and one that gets thrown around a lot more than it should. How about people not putting every single little thing on the insurance bill, oh, but that would be personal resonsibility, no need for that when we can paint companies as evil greedy scum. Back when insurance was used like it's supposed to be, it didn't cost anything close to what it does now.

And so what if there are a lot of plastic surgeons in Cali that want a piece of the pie? Welcome to America.

http://www.x-raytechnicianschools.o...ur-doctor-makes-a-killing-on-prescribing-you/

Chances are, unless you are a doctor yourself, you probably are not qualified to decide what is a procedure being done on you for the sole purpose of making extra cash. There in lies the rub. You think you are getting options, but that is not the case.

The reason insurance even came about was because people could not afford healthcare even when it cheaper. Without a need, it would never had come about. The next problem is that many hospitals will not do a damn thing for you, unless you are dying, unless you have insurance. I have a friend who owns his own glass business and makes some fairly big bucks. He doesn't have insurance and once after a motorcycle accident, he told me of how he had to get switched a different hospital that would take cash because he didn't have insurance.

It's the collusion of the industry that is driving up prices higher than usage is what I'm trying to point out. Pure simple greed is a bigger factor here.

 

[xj0hnx]

It's the collusion of the industry that is driving up prices higher than usage is what I'm trying to point out. Pure simple greed is a bigger factor here.

Yea, sure, nothing to do with people charging every single thing from aspirin to surgery to insurance.

 

[HumblePie]

Yea, sure, nothing to do with people charging every single thing from aspirin to surgery to insurance.

I didn't say that, but there are examples around the world and in America where healthcare and/or insurance reform keep costs way down. That doesn't change how people "use" healthcare because it is used regardless.

Oh, and if you wondering where America has socialized healthcare, look no further than the Military and Hawaii. Both have been doing it for a very very very long time without problems of escalating costs.

 

[xj0hnx]

...and if you can't Pay? ...you don't get HealthCare.

See how that works?

Hmmm, I went for years without insurance, was hospitalized twice in that time, and had a stint in between employment when I was paying bills out of pocket, and I still had health care. Amazing, according to you, I should be dead now. Some people with insurance can't pay, some people without insurance can pay, insurance doesn't extend your lifespan, it is simply one of several methods of paying for the services that do. Not having insurance does not mean you are going to die. It might for you, but that is your problem, doesn't make it a universal truth.

 

[xj0hnx]

I
Oh, and if you wondering where America has socialized healthcare, look no further than the Military and Hawaii. Both have been doing it for a very very very long time without problems of escalating costs.

Ever been in the military? lol at using that system for the civilian world.

 

[HumblePie]

Ever been in the military? lol at using that system for the civilian world.

Actually, I grew up a military kid and was in it as well. Care there is just as I've experienced by private industry. You can get good and bad in both as it is up to the individual doctor treating you.

 

[sandorski]

Hmmm, I went for years without insurance, was hospitalized twice in that time, and had a stint in between employment when I was paying bills out of pocket, and I still had health care. Amazing, according to you, I should be dead now. Some people with insurance can't pay, some people without insurance can pay, insurance doesn't extend your lifespan, it is simply one of several methods of paying for the services that do. Not having insurance does not mean you are going to die. It might for you, but that is your problem, doesn't make it a universal truth.

Obviously you had Money to Pay, what happens if you don't?