Health Dept.: Homeless Can’t Eat Deer Meat

[momeNt]

Health department had to do it to preserve its legitimacy. This was nothing more than a government agency exercising its power simply because it can.

 

[Yreka]

I wonder how much fear of litigation comes into play that would prevent some sort of common sense solution.

That seems like quite a bit of meat (thatswhatshesaid), might be worth an inspectors afternoon rather than have it go to waste.

 

[WHAMPOM]

I think the rational is that the deer meat as provided to the shelter has not been inspected like other meat. The moral question is whether or not homeless people are so under valued by society that we can just feed them whatever garbage is donated and they should be happy to have it or if they should be provided food that is guaranteed in its safety.

A hunter eating what he has killed is different because he bears the entire risk of eating it.

YOU are funny if you think meat from the store is any better. Wild game is required to be inspected individually and cutting machines cleaned between each animal. How many recalls of ground meat have we had in the last couple of years.

 

[BoberFett]

I think what this Dept of Health is trying to tell us is that they think Native Americans were beneath even homeless people. Bunch of racists.

 

[Fern]

I think the rational is that the deer meat as provided to the shelter has not been inspected like other meat. The moral question is whether or not homeless people are so under valued by society that we can just feed them whatever garbage is donated and they should be happy to have it or if they should be provided food that is guaranteed in its safety.

A hunter eating what he has killed is different because he bears the entire risk of eating it.

Just to be clear I am not saying deer meat is garbage. I am saying if it arrives without some kind of inspection it has to be assumed to be unsafe.

That may be the reason. I don't know.

But that logic has a serious flaw in it: Donated meat that has been inspected cannot be assumed safe. We would have no idea how the individual treated/stored that inspected meat after they purchased it.

IMO, adequate preparation is more important than inspection.

Fern

 

[DominionSeraph]

Why not leave it up to the individual whether they would rather go hungry or take that risk?

Because of public health, idiot.

The free market trends towards offering contaminated foods: unavailable information, the human inability to properly aggregate small and/or widely dispersed risks, and the bias towards short-term gains means that a corporation offering safe foods cannot compete with one who offers contaminated foods more cheaply while calling them "safe." If you allow unregulated producers into the market they have a massive competitive advantage. But it does not serve consumers for the market to compete over who can best sell the worst food. That's the reason we have these laws in the first place.
Allowing shelters for the poor to source from unregulated providers is the worst possible entry, as they are under economic pressure for quantity and the risk related to quality isn't personal.
But you're a moron, so this is all over your head.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

Venison is very testy when prepared well and very expensive when ordered in a fancy restaurant. I guess they should eat fish sticks and chicken nuggets.

Isn't it funny that in this instance corporate farm raised chicken and cattle meat, etc is considered superior to deer meat. Of which said deer more than likely was able to graze naturally and freely in the wild without the need of hormones or antibiotics, etc which anti- agri-corp proponents feel is unnecessary (pink slime hysteria anyone?). It's like all that rhetoric about corporate raised livestock and its processing which was previously used to discredit this type of food source goes flying out the window in the defense of this federal agency.

 

[BoberFett]

Isn't it funny that in this instance corporate farm raised chicken and cattle meat, etc is considered superior to deer meat. Of which said deer more than likely was able to graze naturally and freely in the wild without the need of hormones or antibiotics, etc which anti- agri-corp proponents feel is unnecessary (pink slime hysteria anyone?). It's like all that rhetoric about corporate raised livestock and its processing which was previously used to discredit this type of food source goes flying out the window in the defense of this federal agency.

Isn't the left just a crazy bag of nuttiness? Say what you want about the right wing, but they usually are pretty consistently nuts.

"Corporations are evil! Monsanto is the devil! Down with corporate farms! By the way, you're only allowed to serve mystery meat products grown in labs and processed in massive factories, free range food processed by the local butcher is too dangerous."

 

[Fern]

Because of public health, idiot.

The free market trends towards offering contaminated foods: unavailable information, the human inability to properly aggregate small and/or widely dispersed risks, and the bias towards short-term gains means that a corporation offering safe foods cannot compete with one who offers contaminated foods more cheaply while calling them "safe." If you allow unregulated producers into the market they have a massive competitive advantage. But it does not serve consumers for the market to compete over who can best sell the worst food. That's the reason we have these laws in the first place.
Allowing shelters for the poor to source from unregulated providers is the worst possible entry, as they are under economic pressure for quantity and the risk related to quality isn't personal.
But you're a moron, so this is all over your head.

There is no "market" here.

Nothing was for sale, there is no "competitive advantage".

It's just a charitable donation, nothing more, nothing less.

Fern

 

[Lanyap]

I guess the donating hunters will have to switch to rabbit and squirrel meat.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

Isn't the left just a crazy bag of nuttiness? Say what you want about the right wing, but they usually are pretty consistently nuts.

"Corporations are evil! Monsanto is the devil! Down with corporate farms! By the way, you're only allowed to serve mystery meat products grown in labs and processed in massive factories, free range food processed by the local butcher is too dangerous for the poor. Who we really care about because we know what is best for them."

FTFY- I just added a pinch more sarcasm. Hope you don't mind.

 

[momeNt]

Because of public health, idiot.

The free market trends towards offering contaminated foods: unavailable information, the human inability to properly aggregate small and/or widely dispersed risks, and the bias towards short-term gains means that a corporation offering safe foods cannot compete with one who offers contaminated foods more cheaply while calling them "safe." If you allow unregulated producers into the market they have a massive competitive advantage. But it does not serve consumers for the market to compete over who can best sell the worst food. That's the reason we have these laws in the first place.
Allowing shelters for the poor to source from unregulated providers is the worst possible entry, as they are under economic pressure for quantity and the risk related to quality isn't personal.
But you're a moron, so this is all over your head.

All false boogeymen.

 

[SparkyJJO]

Because of public health, idiot.

The free market trends towards offering contaminated foods: unavailable information, the human inability to properly aggregate small and/or widely dispersed risks, and the bias towards short-term gains means that a corporation offering safe foods cannot compete with one who offers contaminated foods more cheaply while calling them "safe." If you allow unregulated producers into the market they have a massive competitive advantage. But it does not serve consumers for the market to compete over who can best sell the worst food. That's the reason we have these laws in the first place.
Allowing shelters for the poor to source from unregulated providers is the worst possible entry, as they are under economic pressure for quantity and the risk related to quality isn't personal.
But you're a moron, so this is all over your head.

So full of fail, from someone self-proclaimed to be so smart. The ironing is delicious. But venison is better.

 

[Bitek]

Just to be clear I am not saying deer meat is garbage. I am saying if it arrives without some kind of inspection it has to be assumed to be unsafe.

Exactly. Who knows where it really came from. Today it could have been a responsible hunter, tomorrow it may be road kill. There is certainly enough dead deer on the roads here to feed a small country.

The agency has to think bigger picture than this one shelter. If they are permitted to serv. uninspected meat then you are opening up the whole system to abuse. How long until we have our own scandal of roadkill and horse meat fed to the disadvantaged by some shady gangsters trying to make a buck off people no one cares about?

 

[nextJin]

Exactly. Who knows where it really came from. Today it could have been a responsible hunter, tomorrow it may be road kill. There is certainly enough dead deer on the roads here to feed a small country.

The agency has to think bigger picture than this one shelter. If they are permitted to serv. uninspected meat then you are opening up the whole system to abuse. How long until we have our own scandal of roadkill and horse meat fed to the disadvantaged by some shady gangsters trying to make a buck off people no one cares about?

Question: Who pays for the 14,000 meals if they ha e to buy them on top of what they are already able to buy through donations?

 

[Bitek]

Question: Who pays for the 14,000 meals if they ha e to buy them on top of what they are already able to buy through donations?

You really can't think of ways to game that system?

How about I set up a little nonprofit, Natures Bounty, where I provide food items to homeless shelters. Some food may get directly donated, some will be purchased at low rates out of donated funds. Charities and shelters will have budgets to pay for required items. Don't assume everything only comes in as a direct donation.

NB is a clearing house for donated meat products, either private or from other businesses who have meat they don't want to sell and would rather take charitable donation credits on their taxes.

Since no one is looking, I also suppliment the supply with meat from alternative sources. Maybe downed animals, maybe guys who bring in deer for a token amt. Maybe I give 20 bucks for a deer carcass. It was killed by a bullet and not a Buick right? I'm not worried, into the meat grinder it goes and I'm selling it next week for $1.25/lb.
No one is looking, no one is asking questions, so its easy money and tax advantaged. Plus it get brownie points for aiding the needy. I'm a hero, who would bother me?

 

[ccbadd]

Venison is very testy when prepared well and very expensive when ordered in a fancy restaurant. I guess they should eat fish sticks and chicken nuggets.

No only that, wild meat is usually the healthiest you can get. Compare that will farm raised fish and chickens, with all the antibiotics and steroids and hormones. They threw away the best food you could have given them.

 

[Exterous]

Exactly. Who knows where it really came from. Today it could have been a responsible hunter, tomorrow it may be road kill. There is certainly enough dead deer on the roads here to feed a small country.

The agency has to think bigger picture than this one shelter. If they are permitted to serv. uninspected meat then you are opening up the whole system to abuse. How long until we have our own scandal of roadkill and horse meat fed to the disadvantaged by some shady gangsters trying to make a buck off people no one cares about?

How do you make money off of donating food? :hmm: I guess claim the deduction on your taxes? Seems like a long way to go for some gangster to get an extra $2-3 in April.

But you're right - far better to not serve them any meals and let them go hungry than to serve them food. Realizing someone is starving them out of care and concern will fill up their stomachs far better than food will. Why should there be some sort of happy medium? Its either they starve or they will be abused. No middle ground

 

[Exterous]

You really can't think of ways to game that system?

How about I set up a little nonprofit, Natures Bounty, where I provide food items to homeless shelters. Some food may get directly donated, some will be purchased at low rates out of donated funds. Charities and shelters will have budgets to pay for required items. Don't assume everything only comes in as a direct donation.

NB is a clearing house for donated meat products, either private or from other businesses who have meat they don't want to sell and would rather take charitable donation credits on their taxes.

Since no one is looking, I also suppliment the supply with meat from alternative sources. Maybe downed animals, maybe guys who bring in deer for a token amt. Maybe I give 20 bucks for a deer carcass. It was killed by a bullet and not a Buick right? I'm not worried, into the meat grinder it goes and I'm selling it next week for $1.25/lb.
No one is looking, no one is asking questions, so its easy money and tax advantaged. Plus it get brownie points for aiding the needy. I'm a hero, who would bother me?

I suggest you read up on USDA and FDA guidelines if you think this is a way around food inspections. Companies who make/process/handle foods are handled a tad differently than individuals and being non-profit does not preclude you from their reach

 

[Bitek]

Here is another one.

Bob Hunter has been providing dear meat to the shelter for 20 years. Bob usually has a good hunt, but this year was tough. Everyone will be upset as they count on him. Its a long drive home from the hunt.

Hey, that truck just hit a deer. Its dying in the ditch, so Bob jumps out and shoots it. It must be a gift from God. Into the pickup and Bob saves the holidays.

The winter is also tough, nothing again. Another lonely drive. Wasn't there another dead one he saw on the way up the mountain? Think it got hit this morning. Hey look, I found two. Looks OK. It is winter, prolly frozen regardless. Bob feels ashamed, but he can't let the people down. Maybe its not perfect, but better than going hungry. He'll butcher and package it and who would really know? Just ask God for a better hunt next time.

 

[Incorruptible]

Thank you big government for this morons. Food is provided for the homeless and government has a problem with it, there just a bunch of idiots who need to get out of the way

 

[zsdersw]

I was raised on venison; my dad was a big-time deer hunter (with a bow, rarely with a gun). I found a typical beef t-bone steak tasteless by comparison the first time I had one.

Venison is extremely healthy for you... I can't imagine why we'd want to keep it from people, especially those who need it most.

 

[Bitek]

How do you make money off of donating food? :hmm: I guess claim the deduction on your taxes? Seems like a long way to go for some gangster to get an extra $2-3 in April.

But you're right - far better to not serve them any meals and let them go hungry than to serve them food. Realizing someone is starving them out of care and concern will fill up their stomachs far better than food will. Why should there be some sort of happy medium? Its either they starve or they will be abused. No middle ground

Why are you assuming everything comes in and used as a donation? Salaries, office supplies and building leases all come out of cash budgets.
Cash donations, fund raisers and sale of donated items all go into operating funds. The charity then uses those funds to buy the things they need.

A food shelter by definition needs a constant reliable supply of food. If you create a secondary market where they can acquire meat a cut rate prices, needy shelters will go there.

 

[Exterous]

Why are you assuming everything comes in and used as a donation? Salaries, office supplies and building leases all come out of cash budgets.
Cash donations, fund raisers and sale of donated items all go into operating funds. The charity then uses those funds to buy the things they need.

A food shelter by definition needs a constant reliable supply of food. If you create a secondary market where they can acquire meat a cut rate prices, needy shelters will go there.

Well - the discussion/article is about donated meat and from an individual no less.* Once you start selling them meat you enter into a whole different realm where the FDA and USDA gets involved. Therefore your argument that it would not be inspected falls flat on its face for food sold to them unless they ignore existing laws and requirements

*There are different guidelines for food donated from a heath inspected facility (ie any place that can sell food)

 

[Bitek]

Well - the discussion/article is about donated meat and from an individual no less.* Once you start selling them meat you enter into a whole different realm where the FDA and USDA gets involved. Therefore your argument that it would not be inspected falls flat on its face for food sold to them unless they ignore existing laws and requirements

*There are different guidelines for food donated from a heath inspected facility (ie any place that can sell food)

Its large quantities of meat from a processing plant, sourced from mgmt programs and collections of hunters. Its not one guy bringing in a deer.

Again, think big scale here. If the dept is sanctioning this practice, then they are creating a precedent for all charities and shelters. This is outside the inspection and regulation system and becomes uncontrolled. These guys maybe a trustworthy bunch, but if the practice is allowed, it can/will expand and who knows where it goes. actually nobody knows because nobody is looking then.