HBO's Game of Thrones season 6 discussion thread- airing 4/24/16 (No book spoilers)

[Homerboy]

Free men. They still see anything south of the wall as having to bend the knee to someone.

Ah yeah - good point.

 

[Newbian]

We should wait for the next J.Martin book to get at least some answers

Wouldn't he need at least 3-4 books to catch up to this season?

 

[Artorias]

It's a travesty.

You cant condense 40 episodes worth of material(10 regular seasons) into two 6/7 episode seasons. At every episode there was at least one character assassination(not death), and were making the stupidest decisions because of how rushed everything was.

Please no to Arya the explorer unless GRRM is writing it.

 

[Newbian]

They did it again.

https://nypost.com/2019/05/20/someone-left-a-water-bottle-in-the-game-of-thrones-finale/

Someone left a water bottle in the ‘Game of Thrones’ finale


It’s another “Game of Thrones” gaffe. Just two weeks after a coffee cup left onscreen sparked countless memes, fans spotted not one but two plastic water bottles in Sunday night’s must-watch finale.

 

[Bitek]

Did you read the rest of my post? I explained precisely why Bran's being essentially a non-entity is why he was the perfect choice. He's supposed to be no king at all. He's supposed to be a figurehead while the council rules.

Which is why I consider my previous prediction of Sansa and Tyrion winning correct, from a certain point of view.

Sansa did become Queen (albeit of an independent North) and her former husband effectively shadow king, as Bran is distant, socially isolated, and off warging into Drogon, or the mice in the newly rebuilt brothels to watch what he can't do (thanks for pointing that out to everyone sis..), or just general creeping about.

I think some better writing/editing could have made it where Tyrion once again manipulated his way to victory, and all the BS about "Bran's Story" was just a desperate bid to save his A, and it worked splendidly.


Sadly Jon the Tart did not die. Arya did nothing after she defeated the NK and destroyed the ring of power, but decide to sail West to the Gray Havens.

Man the Dothraki and the Unsullied really got rolled tho. Didn't even get a walkoff into the sunset.
"Lol, thx for all the dying and winning the wars for us, now back across the sea with you and all the other coloreds. Byeeee."

 

[blankslate]

I don't think he does. His story is so incomplete and hacked up he makes sense only as a side character. He was a narrative tool to give backstory to things like the First Men and Jon's lineage. His warging ability was just abandoned at the end. What did his ravens even do at the battle of winterfell?

Also - what was the point of Varys writing those notes about Jon? Nothing I guess. Same with his talking to his new Little Birds. Ok.

Well if you want another possibility as an interpretation to the Bran becomes king story line. Look into a series of videos on the youtube channel

Preston Jacobs titled "The Minds of Wolves and Robins"

It covers the children of the forest their collective consciousness and how they interacted with the Men who invaded Westeros and how they both had to fight the others. And possibly how they might be involved in the 3 eyed raven and thus Bran.

Spoiler

It's quite possible that Bran really doesn't exist anymore except as a one small part of a collective unable to really influence it. And that the collective known to humans as the 3 eye Raven just trots out the Bran Personality when it has to interact with friends, family and council members.

Given that the children of the forest who have a strong link with the weirwood trees and the collective conscience associated were on the losing side of the war with the first men and most of Westeros was taken from them in the far past.

What might happen now that the children of the forest basically have their "guy" as king of Westeros... will they be benevolent or will they use Bran to subtly weaken the kingdom of men?

 

[Starbuck1975]

Made no sense that Winterfell could claim independence while Dorne, the Iron Islands, the Vale, the Stormlands, the Westerlands and the Reach all yielded to Bran.

Also, how is there still a Night’s Watch, and why?

Also, why are they still closing the gate to the Wall given that the Night King blew a huge hole in it?

 

[zinfamous]

Also, why are they still closing the gate to the Wall given that the Night King blew a huge hole in it?

I was wondering about this myself. But there are a couple of explanations:

--The Night King blew up the wall at Eastwatch. If they are leaving from Castle Black at the end there, then no big deal. The wall at Castle Black remained intact. (kinda doesn't explain why Tormund would be hanging out at Castle Black, though. I think he preferred Eastwatch...but if Jon shows up and is suddenly the Leader of the Night's Watch again, it would be at Castle Black--also a bit weird, seeing as how they have a process, he did "abandon his watch"--even though he has a legit excuse--and they do their own thing. so, weird that he immediately assumes power. He deserves it, but still. Or he was just fuck it from the beginning and took the Wildlings north. Who knows. It was a stupid montage that no one deserved)

--what was that jump in time from when Jon killed Dany and was tossed in prison (which we didn't see)? I think we are to surmise that it was "many months" and maybe even a year or more that Jon and Tyrion remained prisoners of the Unsullied and Grey Worm. That black out to pass time...holy crap what a lazy pos that was to just toss the complete lack of care for this series at the audience, lol. Anyway, Let's consider how long it took for the White walkers to come down to Winterfell and then all that time until the point that Jon returns to the wall...would it have been repaired by then? I dunno. Everyone on the wall was pretty much gone until Tormund took them back up there after Winterfell. Probably a year and many months at most, I'm guessing. Still, I assume all the actual builders were dead, so who would have rebuilt it? I guess we aren't supposed to care about these things.

 

[GrumpyMan]

After such a great episode in #5...#6 just fizzled out...I am disappoint...

 

[zinfamous]

And of course this came to mind with the whole scripting of the final moments of the GoT series.

...seriously, assholes?

 

[SKORPI0]

Spoiler

Bye bye Irone Throne, melted by Drogon.

 

[woolfe9998]

Made no sense that Winterfell could claim independence while Dorne, the Iron Islands, the Vale, the Stormlands, the Westerlands and the Reach all yielded to Bran.

Bran allowed it because Bran is Sansa's brother, and she had a legitimate claim since the north used to be an independent kingdom. As to the rest, any of them could have tried opting out, not just the ones you mentioned. I presume they didn't, at least for now, to avert war. Then again, should the story continue, I would assume that could well be an element of it.

Also, how is there still a Night’s Watch, and why?

As a place to exile people.

Also, why are they still closing the gate to the Wall given that the Night King blew a huge hole in it?

Because when people walk out of doors, the orderly thing to do is close them behind them?

 

[WelshBloke]

Also, how is there still a Night’s Watch, and why?

It's the northern border of the civilised world, it makes sense to have a small force there.

 

[dainthomas]

Well, my wife guessed right who would end up with the iron throne.

Indescribably lame.

Spoiler

"I can't be Lord of Winterfell. I can't be Lord of anything."
"I came here to be king. Wtf y'all waiting for?"

Then cut to boring-ass council meeting talking about budgets and crap. Worst. Ending. Evar. And I've seen Lost.

I wanted tyrant Queen Dany. Oh well.

 

[woolfe9998]

Bran lacks humanity. Well, literally. Cold indifference isn't a good quality for a leader. **cough cough**

I don't think this makes sense, but I understood the idea to remove the nature of born leaders--we crush Dany's wheel, but we are also left with Little Finger's ladder. They still have a system that will be infinitely corruptible and it probably wouldn't be long before some devious asshole gets the Lords of the realm primarily on their side and bribes their way into a new Kingship.

Sure, there's always some asshole, even in an already well established democracy. *cough *cough* But an ending is just arcing the narrative in a future direction, not guaranteeing an outcome forever.

...obviously that can't happen until Bran is gone. Which is weird. What is the point of a ruler that knows everything all the time? How do you reasonably judge their decisions? ...is Bran basically immortal now? Is that kinda the point? With that, I kinda get it. You can't really take his position if he sees you coming, and can probably make a wise decision on selecting new councils and, in this way, lack of humanity means he has no interest in power. He doesn't want the role but he knows he is the only person for the role. He isn't going to be consumed by power because outside of Drogon, I guess, he's the most powerful thing in Westeros. It looks like he plans to find that dragon and bring it back to King's landing or at least establish a proper detente.

You're supporting my interpretation here. If Bran is too powerful to be deposed, but has no interest in actually ruling, you've got perpetual rule by council, which is what I think the show runners intended us to see. I don't think Samwell's suggestion of democracy was just thrown in for no reason, or to show how noble Samwell is.

Anyway, I don't really mind how things ended with where people went, but it was about 3 necessary episodes of material crammed into this episode. Jon taking care of Dany, increased drama with Tyrion in prison, other messes being cleaned up, should have been one episode. Dealing with succession and the new leadership model, another episode. Even a few rebellious lords here and there threatening their power, a bit more threat from the unsullied and the dothraki (both of whom seem to have respawned again?). Bran and Drogon, a bit more development of that whole 3 eyed raven thing, maybe the White Walkers and Children of the Forest, and of course Jon and his wildlings.

Instead, we got a 1980s montage of stealing the jock's Ferrari, chopping off the engine, sticking it on your shitty boat, and winning the island's annual yacht race in a span of 15 minutes.

I said I liked the finale. Didn't say I loved it. I didn't love season 8. It had some great moments, but overall it's problems were more of omission than anything else. There's little doubt the reason season 8 wasn't up to par with the rest of the series was because they didn't allot enough episodes to finish the full arc in a proper fashion.

More about the new leadership model would have been a good idea. I don't think many of the viewers understood that is what was intended. Clues were there, like Bran leaving the council meeting after about 2 minutes and the rest of them carrying on the affairs of state, but it wasn't enough. People are still mired in the question of why such a strange person is king and they're pretty pissed off about it.

 

[dainthomas]

Free men. They still see anything south of the wall as having to bend the knee to someone.

Fookin kneelers can keep their gift!

 

[purbeast0]

--what was that jump in time from when Jon killed Dany and was tossed in prison (which we didn't see)? I think we are to surmise that it was "many months" and maybe even a year or more that Jon and Tyrion remained prisoners of the Unsullied and Grey Worm.

When Tyrion spoke at the "meeting" as a prisoner, he said something along the lines of "over the past few weeks I've had a lot of time to think" and then goes into the stupid speech about how a king just needs a story.

And how does it make any sense that a traitorous prisoner decides who the king is lol?

So much "wrong" with this finale, but it was still entertaining, just not in the way I was hoping.

 

[Homerboy]

I was wondering about this myself. But there are a couple of explanations:

--The Night King blew up the wall at Eastwatch. If they are leaving from Castle Black at the end there, then no big deal. The wall at Castle Black remained intact. (kinda doesn't explain why Tormund would be hanging out at Castle Black, though. I think he preferred Eastwatch...but if Jon shows up and is suddenly the Leader of the Night's Watch again, it would be at Castle Black--also a bit weird, seeing as how they have a process, he did "abandon his watch"--even though he has a legit excuse--and they do their own thing. so, weird that he immediately assumes power. He deserves it, but still. Or he was just fuck it from the beginning and took the Wildlings north. Who knows. It was a stupid montage that no one deserved)

--what was that jump in time from when Jon killed Dany and was tossed in prison (which we didn't see)? I think we are to surmise that it was "many months" and maybe even a year or more that Jon and Tyrion remained prisoners of the Unsullied and Grey Worm. That black out to pass time...holy crap what a lazy pos that was to just toss the complete lack of care for this series at the audience, lol. Anyway, Let's consider how long it took for the White walkers to come down to Winterfell and then all that time until the point that Jon returns to the wall...would it have been repaired by then? I dunno. Everyone on the wall was pretty much gone until Tormund took them back up there after Winterfell. Probably a year and many months at most, I'm guessing. Still, I assume all the actual builders were dead, so who would have rebuilt it? I guess we aren't supposed to care about these things.

They say something like "3 weeks"
And Tormound, when he left, said he was headed to Castle Black. Though I could be wrong on that.

 

[zinfamous]

When Tyrion spoke at the "meeting" as a prisoner, he said something along the lines of "over the past few weeks I've had a lot of time to think" and then goes into the stupid speech about how a king just needs a story.

And how does it make any sense that a traitorous prisoner decides who the king is lol?

So much "wrong" with this finale, but it was still entertaining, just not in the way I was hoping.

well I was going with Jon's beard depth, as well as Tyrion's to try and gauge the time.

Tyrion getting to decide anything at that point is....really strange. But I think the reality is that he was brought there as negotiation and was no longer a prisoner (at that moment--unknown to Tyrion and unknown to the audience. Yes, we were supposed to expect his execution at that point). The Lords of the realm were also expecting Jon in exchange. ....but that in itself is a bit odd. The unsullied literally have the True King of the Realm in captivity, and the lords aren't really doing fuck-all about it. Hey, maybe if we had an episode or two devoted to all those dudes flexing their power and coming to some sort of compromise regarding the shit storm from Dany's sacking of KL to the death of Dany?

Oh right, we got a montage, tho. Be satisfied, everybody.

 

[Homerboy]

Bran allowed it because Bran is Sansa's brother, and she had a legitimate claim since the north used to be an independent kingdom. As to the rest, any of them could have tried opting out, not just the ones you mentioned. I presume they didn't, at least for now, to avert war. Then again, should the story continue, I would assume that could well be an element of it.

You mean like the Kingdom of Dorne or the Iron Islands who have their own princes and princesses in place? The entire point of Dorne was they never knelt to the Targaryans (or Bobby B) and were always independent. Pretty much the same with the Iron Islands.

NOTHING MADE SENSE

 

[dainthomas]

You mean like the Kingdom of Dorne or the Iron Islands who have their own princes and princesses in place? The entire point of Dorne was they never knelt to the Targaryans (or Bobby B) and were always independent. Pretty much the same with the Iron Islands.

NOTHING MADE SENSE

The look on Yara's face was like "wait, that was an option?!?"

 

[Homerboy]

well I was going with Jon's beard depth, as well as Tyrion's to try and gauge the time.

Tyrion getting to decide anything at that point is....really strange. But I think the reality is that he was brought there as negotiation and was no longer a prisoner (at that moment--unknown to Tyrion and unknown to the audience. Yes, we were supposed to expect his execution at that point). The Lords of the realm were also expecting Jon in exchange. ....but that in itself is a bit odd. The unsullied literally have the True King of the Realm in captivity, and the lords aren't really doing fuck-all about it. Hey, maybe if we had an episode or two devoted to all those dudes flexing their power and coming to some sort of compromise regarding the shit storm from Dany's sacking of KL to the death of Dany?

Oh right, we got a montage, tho. Be satisfied, everybody.

Right. Like Grey Worm and the remnants of Dany's crew are holding Jon captive. And the rest of the Lords are like "hey, assholes, that is our rightful king. Give him back" (though Gendry has just as good of a claim to be honest) And there was serious flexing of muscle and more scuffles and Jon used his standard line "I don't want it" and had to convince Sansa and the rest of Lords to stop fighting. He was willing to recuse himself and head north. ANd they needed to find a new King to crown etc

 

[woolfe9998]

You mean like the Kingdom of Dorne or the Iron Islands who have their own princes and princesses in place? The entire point of Dorne was they never knelt to the Targaryans (or Bobby B) and were always independent. Pretty much the same with the Iron Islands.

NOTHING MADE SENSE

Who says they aren't going to make a bid for independence? Seems like a logical thing to happen in the future. They weren't going to have that happen in the finale episode because it leaves a dangling thread - WAR - right at the end of the series. That would have been a much bigger problem than not knowing the fate of the last 75 Dothraki and people are complaining to high heaven about that.

 

[zinfamous]

The look on Yara's face was like "wait, that was an option?!?"

Even so, none of that made sense. Theon frees her, she announces that she is heading back to stake her claim in the Iron Islands. She shows up here at the council, much time later...proclaiming some sort of allegiance to Dany and her army....for what reason? LoL--she could have actually returned with her own fleet and you know, actually fought Uron, right? If nearly every other army can re-spawn for reasons, why couldn't Yara? Too unrealistic?

Oh right, but she had to go and restructure the Ironborn to longer be pirates and claim their own independence...but oh wait her dead queen is now dead and she's suddenly willing to go to war to defend a dead queen's...plans? wtf?

 

[Homerboy]

Who says they aren't going to make a bid for independence? Seems like a logical thing to happen in the future. They weren't going to have that happen in the finale episode because it leaves a dangling thread - WAR - right at the end of the series. That would have been a much bigger problem than not knowing the fate of the last 75 Dothraki and people are complaining to high heaven about that.

So it sounds like then, outside of the threat of the NK, it's pretty much business as usual in Westeros and there's still going to be battles between kingdoms and families as they strive to reach more power and independence. No wheel broken. No resolution or solution.