HardOCP editors declare "shimmer" issue meaningless

[ElFenix]

so shimmering is a moire pattern? ok now i get it

the geforce 4 series had the best image quality i don't know why we've gone downhill since.

 

[sifulee]

Originally posted by: Rollo

You are also misinterpreting my post BTW- I wasn't trying to say mip boundary shimmer doesn't exist, only that many of us never even notice it.

It's very easy to see why people are misinterpreting your point of view. Just look at the title of this thread. "HardOCP editors declare "shimmer" issue meaningless"

I read through the entire post over at , and they never said "declared" that the shimmer issue is meaningless. :roll:

 

[gtx4u]

Originally posted by: Rollo
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=973953&page=3

I have been running NVIDIA cards in my own personal box for a while now and I have never seen what people are talking about. I have talked to Brent about this as well and have downloaded videos of it, that did nothing to impress me.
So given that our evaluations reflect our gaming expeirence, obviously it is not impacting Brent's gaming.

Brent???

Kyle's opinion.

It's not impacting my gaming experience, I'll keep a closer eye on it though to see if there are any 'bad' spots in a game, but so far nothing has really struck out at me, it's hard to notice such things when you are actually playing the game.

Bren't opinion.

I've said many times that I, like most people, have never noticed this "issue" it was nice to see respected web journalists basically saying what I've said all along about this.

Wait wait wait, so ur saying that People paid hundreds of dollars for a product that malfunctions?

 

[gtx4u]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: Lonyo
Just because you and 2 website editors say it's a non-issue for the majority doesn't mean it's a non-issue.

I am not saying it's not an issue to anyone, on any game.

I am saying that for many of us, it's not even noticeable in the games we play.

I posted the thread because the quoted website editors agree with my position, and every story has two sides.

As you seem to be one of the people who notice it and don't like it in the games you play, I can appreciate your position and desire for resolution.

As a person who never notices it in the games I play, and one of many who doesn't, I hope you will afford me the same courtesy.

No ur wrong, who are u to say "FOR MANY OF US" u DON'T represent the people or any 1 but ur self and ur holy god like love for nVidia for some reason.

I certainly am not the 1 of "MANY of US" that u speak of, and I think this problem is very real because If I wanted to kill the shimmering on my 6800 gt SLI setup by switching to high quality mode my damn minimum FPS drops from 36 to 26 this is a huge performance hit whether I like it or not and the % that distribute the best framrate is dropped too.

This is a PROBLEM is just that nVidia aren't getting enough competition for price/performance when compared to ATI, that's why they treat their customers like nothing and not even trying to fix the problem that has been existed so long.

 

[Jeff7181]

The shimmering is pretty obvious in World of Warcraft, especially when you're walking along stone paths.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TheSnowman

Originally posted by: cevilgenius
If you ask me, you people are making a big deal out of a relatively small problem. They can make better, and if you want them to talk to the companies. Still, it don't see how shimmering makes it any less of a game, if you want a good graphics go make a picture and stare at it...

Norm

The thing is we had better filtering back on the Gforce4ti and it has been going down hill since then. When paying more and more for faster and faster grpahics cards it seems reasonable to me to expect to at least get something at least keeps up with quality of what has long been avalable.

Doesn't the R520 have non-shimmering AF?

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: gtx4u

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: Lonyo
Just because you and 2 website editors say it's a non-issue for the majority doesn't mean it's a non-issue.

I am not saying it's not an issue to anyone, on any game.

I am saying that for many of us, it's not even noticeable in the games we play.

I posted the thread because the quoted website editors agree with my position, and every story has two sides.

As you seem to be one of the people who notice it and don't like it in the games you play, I can appreciate your position and desire for resolution.

As a person who never notices it in the games I play, and one of many who doesn't, I hope you will afford me the same courtesy.

No ur wrong, who are u to say "FOR MANY OF US" u DON'T represent the people or any 1 but ur self and ur holy god like love for nVidia for some reason.

I certainly am not the 1 of "MANY of US" that u speak of, and I think this problem is very real because If I wanted to kill the shimmering on my 6800 gt SLI setup by switching to high quality mode my damn minimum FPS drops from 36 to 26 this is a huge performance hit whether I like it or not and the % that distribute the best framrate is dropped too.

This is a PROBLEM is just that nVidia aren't getting enough competition for price/performance when compared to ATI, that's why they treat their customers like nothing and not even trying to fix the problem that has been existed so long.

Quoted with emphasis for truth. :thumbsup:

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: xtknight
Doesn't the R520 have non-shimmering AF?

It has non-angle dependent AF. I'm not sure whether it shimmers or not. I'm pretty sure that on high quality it would look great .

I haven't noticed any shimmering on my X800XL/X850XT PE cards. Although truth be told I didn't notice any on my 6600GT I had for a bit, either. Still, one of the first things I do when I get a new card is crank the driver settings to maximum quality and the AA/AF to application preference.

 

[imported_Rampage]

I guess since Brent and Kyle pretty much have more knowledge and authority than anyone here.. this kinda settles the issue.

Glad this one can finally be put behind us!
Next topic.

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: southpawuni
I guess since Brent and Kyle pretty much have more knowledge and authority than anyone here.. this kinda settles the issue.

Glad this one can finally be put behind us!
Next topic.

The whole point of message boards is to be objective and analyze the data for ourselves. Just because a bunch of opinionated attention-seeking "journalists" can make proclamations doesn't make it dogma. Everyone here knows how much controversy Kyle, Tom and pretty much every big online PC hardware journalist not named Anand likes to generate for themselves.

With this knowledge, it seems facile and ignorant to accept what guys like Brent and Kyle say without questioning it, especially if our own experience proves otherwise.

Besides, you're a well known Nvidia troll, so with that said get back in your cage unless you want to contribute something meaningful to this thread . Some of us actually notice this problem on our Nvidia cards and are annoyed by it :disgust:

 

[imported_Rampage]

Originally posted by: jiffylube1024

Originally posted by: southpawuni
I guess since Brent and Kyle pretty much have more knowledge and authority than anyone here.. this kinda settles the issue.

Glad this one can finally be put behind us!
Next topic.

The whole point of message boards is to be objective and analyze the data for ourselves. Just because a bunch of opinionated attention-seeking "journalists" can make proclamations doesn't make it dogma. Everyone here knows how much controversy Kyle, Tom and pretty much every big online PC hardware journalist not named Anand likes to generate for themselves.

With this knowledge, it seems facile and ignorant to accept what guys like Brent and Kyle say without questioning it, especially if our own experience proves otherwise.

Besides, you're a well known Nvidia troll, so with that said get back in your cage unless you want to contribute something meaningful to this thread . Some of us actually notice this problem on our Nvidia cards and are annoyed by it :disgust:

You're a well known troll. Not a single rig that you list in your sig uses a Nvidia card..

HMMMM I wonder which way you lean and what your goal is here??
To fix an issue or just to propagate it and attempt to tear down Nvidia?

I have never noticed this problem in Quake4 or Battlefield 2.. can you elaborate what I'm supposed to be seeing that makes this Nvidia card a total failure? :disgust:

According to HardOCP (whose opinion that I value over yours by far), its a non-issue.
So ya.. that kinda decides it for most of us besides the ones who also probably took a screenshot of FX cards in lightening fast games and picked apart the IQ as if anyone could ever notice.

I guess if you guys like portraits and photographs with no visual flaws then you are in the wrong business playing video games?

So from a REAL Nvidia owner/user who games on Nvidia.. I agree with the authority of Brent Justice and Kyle Bennett as you sit up there in Canada with (according to your sig) your 4 ATI cards..

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: southpawuni

You're a well known troll. Not a single rig that you list in your sig uses a Nvidia card..

OMG BIAS!!!!!!!!!!111

Because all of the rigs I list in my sig must reflect all I have in my house, right? Forgetting the four other systems I have built in my basement awaiting to be delivered, the 6600GT I owned, the 7800GT I have tested the last couple of days, and the other 7800GT that is in the mail on its way to my house?

I have never noticed this problem in Quake4 or Battlefield 2.. can you elaborate what I'm supposed to be seeing that makes this Nvidia card a total failure? :disgust:

Dude, chill out - absolutely nobody said any card was a total failure - you're jumping to conclusions here. All we are saying is that shimmering is real and it's annoying. You wave your hand and say that all of our opinions are meaningless. Then why even talk about it?

According to HardOCP (whose opinion that I value over yours by far), its a non-issue.
So ya.. that kinda decides it for most of us besides the ones who also probably took a screenshot of FX cards in lightening fast games and picked apart the IQ as if anyone could ever notice.

Whose opinion do you trust more - HardOCP or yourself? If HardOCP says it's a non-issue for them, then that's great. They get one of these . Everybody is different. Some like LCD, some like CRT. To each their own.

I guess if you guys like portraits and photographs with no visual flaws then you are in the wrong business playing video games?

?

So from a REAL Nvidia owner/user who games on Nvidia.. I agree with the authority of Brent Justice and Kyle Bennett as you sit up there in Canada with (according to your sig) your 4 ATI cards..

Why is everything so black and white for you? You probe someone's rigs and you think you can tell something about a person or the fact that they've got an inherent bias? I personally would probably go for 2X GF4 Ti4200's over 2X 8500's for my non-gamer family, but the 8500's were cheaper at the time, and they were pretty much the best option for a cheap card to buy used with DVI and dual display capabilities.

 

[dug777]

Originally posted by: jiffylube1024

Originally posted by: southpawuni
I guess since Brent and Kyle pretty much have more knowledge and authority than anyone here.. this kinda settles the issue.

Glad this one can finally be put behind us!
Next topic.

The whole point of message boards is to be objective and analyze the data for ourselves. Just because a bunch of opinionated attention-seeking "journalists" can make proclamations doesn't make it dogma. Everyone here knows how much controversy Kyle, Tom and pretty much every big online PC hardware journalist not named Anand likes to generate for themselves.

With this knowledge, it seems facile and ignorant to accept what guys like Brent and Kyle say without questioning it, especially if our own experience proves otherwise.

Besides, you're a well known Nvidia troll, so with that said get back in your cage unless you want to contribute something meaningful to this thread . Some of us actually notice this problem on our Nvidia cards and are annoyed by it :disgust:

you said it mate

Personally i notice it on my 6600GT, and it annoys me

 

[jiffylube1024]

Thanks for the props dug!

Don't tell me that re: the shimmering on the 6600GT! My 7800GT is arriving soon, and I don't want it to look all wavey!

 

[CPlusPlusGeek]

Originally posted by: munky

Originally posted by: CPlusPlusGeek
Any argument an ATi fan can make against shimmering is non-seq because ATi has it too.

You forgot one little detail: it's not nearly as bad as the Nv shimmering on "Quality" :laugh: settings.

Thats not true according to an x1800 XL owned we know

 

[dug777]

Originally posted by: CPlusPlusGeek

Originally posted by: munky

Originally posted by: CPlusPlusGeek
Any argument an ATi fan can make against shimmering is non-seq because ATi has it too.

You forgot one little detail: it's not nearly as bad as the Nv shimmering on "Quality" :laugh: settings.

Thats not true according to an x1800 XL owned we know

well i can tell that i never noticed the problem with my 9800 pro, and it jumped out at me with my 6600GT straight off in farcry...

 

[Megatomic]

Originally posted by: southpawuni
I guess since Brent and Kyle pretty much have more knowledge and authority than anyone here.. this kinda settles the issue.

Glad this one can finally be put behind us!
Next topic.

Puh-leeeeze! If this is truly how you think then you are to be discounted with no credit whatsoever. :|

 

[BFG10K]

guess since Brent and Kyle pretty much have more knowledge and authority than anyone here.. this kinda settles the issue.
Glad this one can finally be put behind us!

This is a joke, right? Or are you just trolling?

so shimmering is a moire pattern?

It can be but it doesn't necessarily have to be.

 

[M0RPH]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

guess since Brent and Kyle pretty much have more knowledge and authority than anyone here.. this kinda settles the issue.
Glad this one can finally be put behind us!

This is a joke, right? Or are you just trolling?

I certainly hope that was a joke.

 

[5150Joker]

I don't think he was joking. It's best to disregard anything southpawuni has to say in regards to this topic. /ignore

 

[BFG10K]

Some people seem to enjoy the idea of voluntarily giving up their ability to think for themselves.

 

[imported_Rampage]

Originally posted by: jiffylube1024

Originally posted by: southpawuni

You're a well known troll. Not a single rig that you list in your sig uses a Nvidia card..

OMG BIAS!!!!!!!!!!111

Because all of the rigs I list in my sig must reflect all I have in my house, right? Forgetting the four other systems I have built in my basement awaiting to be delivered, the 6600GT I owned, the 7800GT I have tested the last couple of days, and the other 7800GT that is in the mail on its way to my house?

I have never noticed this problem in Quake4 or Battlefield 2.. can you elaborate what I'm supposed to be seeing that makes this Nvidia card a total failure? :disgust:

Dude, chill out - absolutely nobody said any card was a total failure - you're jumping to conclusions here. All we are saying is that shimmering is real and it's annoying. You wave your hand and say that all of our opinions are meaningless. Then why even talk about it?

According to HardOCP (whose opinion that I value over yours by far), its a non-issue.
So ya.. that kinda decides it for most of us besides the ones who also probably took a screenshot of FX cards in lightening fast games and picked apart the IQ as if anyone could ever notice.

Whose opinion do you trust more - HardOCP or yourself? If HardOCP says it's a non-issue for them, then that's great. They get one of these . Everybody is different. Some like LCD, some like CRT. To each their own.

I guess if you guys like portraits and photographs with no visual flaws then you are in the wrong business playing video games?

?

So from a REAL Nvidia owner/user who games on Nvidia.. I agree with the authority of Brent Justice and Kyle Bennett as you sit up there in Canada with (according to your sig) your 4 ATI cards..

Why is everything so black and white for you? You probe someone's rigs and you think you can tell something about a person or the fact that they've got an inherent bias? I personally would probably go for 2X GF4 Ti4200's over 2X 8500's for my non-gamer family, but the 8500's were cheaper at the time, and they were pretty much the best option for a cheap card to buy used with DVI and dual display capabilities.

Point is that I have never noticed the "issue", and HardOCP declares it a non-issue.
I wouldnt expect you to take my opinion over Anand or OCPs... so why would I take your opinions over those sites? :disgust:

Its a video card. It works great, it has SLI, runs cool, quiet, is single slot and has a great price tag..
if shimmering is this big of a deal to you then go buy an ATI.. they make great cards...

Problem solved?

You buy one after this "shimmering" issue is well known and you go "AAAAHHHH ME SHIMMERING SUXZORZ!"
Easiest solution: dont buy nvidia? :disgust:

 

[imported_Rampage]

Originally posted by: BFG10K
Some people seem to enjoy the idea of voluntarily giving up their ability to think for themselves.

No its called, when I dont see the issue myself in my 100FPS games do I listen to a dingleberry or do I listen to Kyle Bennett and Brent Justice at HardOCP? :disgust:

 

[SynthDude2001]

Originally posted by: southpawuni

Originally posted by: BFG10K
Some people seem to enjoy the idea of voluntarily giving up their ability to think for themselves.

No its called, when I dont see the issue myself in my 100FPS games do I listen to a dingleberry or do I listen to Kyle Bennett and Brent Justice at HardOCP? :disgust:

So just because it's not an issue for you, that means it's therefore not an issue for anyone (even though multiple people have posted otherwise)?

 

[Corporate Thug]

Originally posted by: southpawuni

Originally posted by: BFG10K
Some people seem to enjoy the idea of voluntarily giving up their ability to think for themselves.

No its called, when I dont see the issue myself in my 100FPS games do I listen to a dingleberry or do I listen to Kyle Bennett and Brent Justice at HardOCP? :disgust:

the point is just because Kyle doesnt see it doesnt mean it aint there

if you dont see it, great. nothing to worry about then