Halloween costume outrage...

[purbeast0]

You are getting touchy about it.

Simply, I think given his character he was portraying, he could have skipped the face paint I believe.

not getting touchy at all, i just find it amusing when people play the racist card when it's not racist, then start backtracking about what they've said, then dodge questions they can't answer.

 

[classy]

What's not to understand? If a person dresses up as Frankenstein, they paint themselves green. Dracula, white facepaint. The devil, red facepaint. Why not black or brown for Urkel?

There is a history of blackface.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

This reminds me of the episode of South Park with the N-word. We just don't get it. I agree with others in this thread that painting one's face black as part of a costume isn't inherently racist, but I'm coming at it from the perspective of a white person who has literally never had to deal with racism. That's not the same perspective classy has. I don't get it, but that doesn't make his point of view wrong, nor does it mean he has to justify his feelings on the matter to us. We're not coming from the same background; we just won't get it.

That said, if I saw someone white wearing the Urkel costume, I would not jump to "Urkel," I would just assume they were going as a generic awkward dork. Using blackface would immediately solidify it for me, although it might also make me slightly uncomfortable depending on how they did the black makeup. Similarly, if I saw a black person dressed in Lincoln attire, I would jump to "black Lincoln" rather than just Lincoln. When you're dealing with historical characters that we know the race of, it's hard not to think about the difference in skin color. Maybe that's subtle racism, I don't know. That's just my own experience.

 

[classy]

not getting touchy at all, i just find it amusing when people play the racist card when it's not racist, then start backtracking about what they've said, then dodge questions they can't answer.

Dodging? You just don't like my answers or my stance. Not that I give a fvck. I have an opinion just like you do. I may not like your stance, but to each his own.

 

[DesiPower]

wow this thread has totally derailed and not quickly getting out of hand... mods please lock.

 

[AMDZen]

Black people are the only one's who are racist by calling this racist, or a white person wearing black makeup as part of his Urkle costume. Classy has a long history of being racist, and thats why he thinks it is racist in the first place.

 

[KeithTalent]

This reminds me of the episode of South Park with the N-word. We just don't get it. I agree with others in this thread that painting one's face black as part of a costume isn't inherently racist, but I'm coming at it from the perspective of a white person who has literally never had to deal with racism. That's not the same perspective classy has. I don't get it, but that doesn't make his point of view wrong, nor does it mean he has to justify his feelings on the matter to us. We're not coming from the same background; we just won't get it.

That said, if I saw someone white wearing the Urkel costume, I would not jump to "Urkel," I would just assume they were going as a generic awkward dork. Using blackface would immediately solidify it for me, although it might also make me slightly uncomfortable depending on how they did the black makeup. Similarly, if I saw a black person dressed in Lincoln attire, I would jump to "black Lincoln" rather than just Lincoln. When you're dealing with historical characters that we know the race of, it's hard not to think about the difference in skin color. Maybe that's subtle racism, I don't know. That's just my own experience.

:thumbsup: As always, AP says what I'm thinking far more eloquently and intelligently than I ever could.

KT

 

[purbeast0]

Dodging? You just don't like my answers or my stance. Not that I give a fvck. I have an opinion just like you do. I may not like your stance, but to each his own.

yes, dodging. you haven't answered my questions about the famous actors portraying other races and using paint to color their skin.

 

[DougK62]

I didn't say that. But if you tell me someone white is dressing like a fairly reconizable TV character, I kinda don't understand the face painting. I don't see a picture of the guy, but I think he could have skipped the face paint, just my opinion.

You paint your skin because it makes the costume better - it's not a hard concept. Face paint does not make someone racist. It's just paint. If a guy dressed as Urkel is not racist without face paint, he doesn't magically turn racist with face paint on. That's not how it works. You're doing an injustice by claiming racism so eagerly when it's not warranted. I suggest reading "The boy who cried wolf".

 

[classy]

Using blackface would immediately solidify it for me, although it might also make me slightly uncomfortable depending on how they did the black makeup.

That is a key point. He said the guy used dark shoe polish. Urkel ain't that dark.

 

[AMDZen]

You paint your skin because it makes the costume better - it's not a hard concept. Face paint does not make someone racist. It's just paint. If a guy dressed as Urkel is not racist without face paint, he doesn't magically turn racist with face paint on. That's not how it works. You're doing an injustice by claiming racism so eagerly when it's not warranted. I suggest reading "The boy who cried wolf".

You guys just gotta stop arguing with him. He has proven that he is the one who is racist by thinking it's racist in the first place.

 

[pelov]

That is a key point. He said the guy used dark shoe polish. Urkel ain't that dark.

What are you trying to say, you racist?

 

[classy]

yes, dodging. you haven't answered my questions about the famous actors portraying other races and using paint to color their skin.

Dodging? I enjoyed them. Downey was awesome in Tropic Thunder. But you just don't wanna listen. Seeing a play or skit on TV, you know they are doing for the most part for laughs. But I can see how someone doing it like this, it could be an issue.

 

[purbeast0]

This reminds me of the episode of South Park with the N-word. We just don't get it. I agree with others in this thread that painting one's face black as part of a costume isn't inherently racist, but I'm coming at it from the perspective of a white person who has literally never had to deal with racism. That's not the same perspective classy has. I don't get it, but that doesn't make his point of view wrong, nor does it mean he has to justify his feelings on the matter to us. We're not coming from the same background; we just won't get it.

That said, if I saw someone white wearing the Urkel costume, I would not jump to "Urkel," I would just assume they were going as a generic awkward dork. Using blackface would immediately solidify it for me, although it might also make me slightly uncomfortable depending on how they did the black makeup. Similarly, if I saw a black person dressed in Lincoln attire, I would jump to "black Lincoln" rather than just Lincoln. When you're dealing with historical characters that we know the race of, it's hard not to think about the difference in skin color. Maybe that's subtle racism, I don't know. That's just my own experience.

as a white person who HAS dealt with racism quite a bit growing up, being in multiple interracial relationships, i don't think there is anything racist about it, since it isn't trying to be degrading of any means.

i personally think the people who pull the racist card quickly over things that aren't racist are the ones who are the real racists. they want to make something an issue that isn't even an issue. maybe racist isn't the right word here, but they want to start drama/get attention when there shouldn't even be an issue.

i mean it's fucking halloween. need to keep everything in perspective. it's not like this guy is dressing as urkel at the million man march.

 

[purbeast0]

Dodging? I enjoyed them. Downey was awesome in Tropic Thunder. But you just don't wanna listen. Seeing a play or skit on TV, you know they are doing for the most part for laughs. But I can see how someone doing it like this, it could be an issue.

oh so dressing up for halloween can't be for fun but acting on tv can?

yea ok.

you are right, we do have different opinions. yours is just a double standard while mine isn't.

 

[AMDZen]

as a white person who HAS dealt with racism quite a bit growing up, being in multiple interracial relationships, i don't think there is anything racist about it, since it isn't trying to be degrading of any means.

i personally think the people who pull the racist card quickly over things that aren't racist are the ones who are the real racists. they want to make something an issue that isn't even an issue. maybe racist isn't the right word here, but they want to start drama/get attention when there shouldn't even be an issue.

i mean it's fucking halloween. need to keep everything in perspective. it's not like this guy is dressing as urkel at the million man march.

Bingo.

All you have to do is go back on similar threads where Classy has had similar arguments to see this.

 

[classy]

You guys just gotta stop arguing with him. He has proven that he is the one who is racist by thinking it's racist in the first place.

Really? Blackface has a not to fond history.

Only a complete and utter dumbass could not possibly understand how delicate something like this could be. I don't know what the guy looked like or how it was done. But I am not ignorant of the possbile message here.

 

[classy]

Bingo.

All you have to do is go back on similar threads where Classy has had similar arguments to see this.

Aww you mean where I wouldn't go along with the cross burning sessions. Yea AMD, in those instances and here now, along those lines, you can kiss my ass.

 

[pelov]

i personally think the people who pull the racist card quickly over things that aren't racist are the ones who are the real racists.

It isn't racist if you don't perceive it as racist. It also isn't racist unless you were intentionally doing it to convey some sort of racism.

If a man from Africa came here and saw a bunch of white guys in black face he'd probably laugh and take pictures with them. If a black dude from the bronx saw a bunch of white guys with black face he'd call them cracka ass crackas. Mind you, this hypothetical scenario is completely devoid of the cracka ass crackas' intentions but it goes to show just how much context matters in these scenarios.

Another short story -

I had a black professor -- very smart dude -- who was smoking outside and a few high school kids, mixed hispanic, black, and white, were hanging out right beside him. He was out of their view so they hadn't noticed he was listening to them. They were calling each other niggas, and certainly not the racist way but rather a pretty friendly way (friendly awesome dude?). Then the black and hispanic kid left and the two white kids were still there. As they drifted a bit farther to the side they noticed my professor. Now completely alone and in the presence of an adult, they felt compelled to say something. They discussed it amongst themselves and one of the kids approached my professor and apologized.

It wasn't racist until the kid apologized.

 

[AMDZen]

It isn't racist if you don't perceive it as racist. It also isn't racist unless you were intentionally doing it to convey some sort of racism.

If a man from Africa came here and saw a bunch of white guys in black face he'd probably laugh and take pictures with them. If a black dude from the bronx saw a bunch of white guys with black face he'd call them cracka ass crackas. Mind you, this hypothetical scenario is completely devoid of the cracka ass crackas' intentions but it goes to show just how much context matters in these scenarios.

If it was a random Tuesday in February, yes. If it was Halloween day, they can go fuck themselves then because they obviously don't know what the holiday means and what its for.

 

[Broheim]

Heard about this on radio yesterday... what has this country come down to...

Let us Pray the Pimp's Prayer. Lord, please pray for the soul of this bitch and guide my pimp hand and make it strong Lord, so that she might learn a ho's place.

now get the fuck back out on the street... ho

 

[AMDZen]

Its funny that its racist but isn't sexist.

Bitches can be pimps too. Whenever I see a story about a whore house getting shut down, its always ran by a "Madam" who was once a whore herself.

Personally, I want to know where the female pimp outfits are. 😛

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Dodging? You just don't like my answers or my stance. Not that I give a fvck. I have an opinion just like you do. I may not like your stance, but to each his own.

Would I be a bad person if I wanted to dress up as a mediocre QB for Halloween? I have a Vick jersey I can use.

 

[AMDZen]

Would I be a bad person if I wanted to dress up as a mediocre QB for Halloween? I have a Vick jersey I can use.

Apparently only if you paint your face. That's where the line has been drawn, apparently.

It would be pretty funny if you went as "Zombie Vick" and had a dead dog carcass you carried around with you and fed off of.

As long as its not a real carcass of course.

 

[Aikouka]

I saw Cloud Atlas over the weekend, and it had Hugo Weaving made up to be a large, German woman and also an Asian (Korean) male. So, was the movie sexist and racist? No. It was simply trying to be "more authentic." The make-up/costume doesn't make it racist, but the actions that can be portrayed while in the costume can make it racist.

Consider this, racism requires intent. However, most people don't know whether there was any intent, and they tend to just assume.