Half of all white heroin users started by initially using prescription drugs

[FelixDeCat]

Weed is a gateway drug. We need to put a stop the current trend of decriminalization. Doctor shopping has been illegal for a while and Limbaugh paid the price for it - he lost his natural hearing. Excessive abuse of pain killers stops leads to deafness in some cases.

We also need to keep a close eye on pain managment clinics that over-prescribe medication for profit and not suggest alternatives like surgery or therapy.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Depends on who you are, and what they give you. There's low, medium, high doses just like anything else, and multiple kinds of opioid PK's.

I had 2 wisdom teeth out during christmas 2015, I needed PK's for a few days, hurt pretty bad. I steer clear of Percocet due to side effects that mess with me, and asked for Vicodin instead because it works well.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Weed is a gateway drug.

Yea, this has been the status quo mantra from many for far too long. Mindless chanting.

The gateway drugs in our society are alcohol and tobacco. People are more likely to raid their parents liquor cabinet before stumbling across MJ in their youth. "MJ is a gateway drug" is used as a diversion to keep people feeling justified for drinking or smoking. Meanwhile hundreds of thousands die in our country from those every year.

https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_statistics/fact_sheets/fast_facts/

https://www.niaaa.nih.gov/alcohol-health/overview-alcohol-consumption/alcohol-facts-and-statistics

 

[Darwin333]

True as well. I believe it was a combination of them though and not just one reason.

While I agree, there is a direct correlation with the recent sharp rise of heroin overdoses and the reduced access to pharmaceutical opiates. There were even a bunch of sheriffs and medical professionals that predicted this when the war on "pill mills" was taking place. Unfortunately, along with pushing people off of relatively safe pharmaceuticals and onto an incredibly unsafe drug that's impossible to know the potency from one batch to another, it also made it incredibly difficult for truly sick people to get the medication they really need. Imho, I'd rather have people abusing the vastly safer pharmaceuticals and not punishing very sick people but that's just me.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

While I agree, there is a direct correlation with the recent sharp rise of heroin overdoses and the reduced access to pharmaceutical opiates. There were even a bunch of sheriffs and medical professionals that predicted this when the war on "pill mills" was taking place. Unfortunately, along with pushing people off of relatively safe pharmaceuticals and onto an incredibly unsafe drug that's impossible to know the potency from one batch to another, it also made it incredibly difficult for truly sick people to get the medication they really need. Imho, I'd rather have people abusing the vastly safer pharmaceuticals and not punishing very sick people but that's just me.

Your impression of how safe pharmaceuticals are is phenomenally flawed. It might not kill you outright, but it might poke holes in your brain over a decade to the point where you cannot function normally in society.

This isn't an either-or thing, the bandaid should be ripped off for the betterment of our society.

 

[IronWing]

Weed is a gateway drug. We need to put a stop the current trend of decriminalization.

You're a silly goose.

 

[Darwin333]

Weed is a gateway drug.

It has been well proven that alcohol is the first drug that most kids try making IT the gateway drug, not weed...

Alcohol is also responsible for a ridiculously larger number of deaths, injuries, medical conditions and societal problems than weed.

 

[HomerJS]

It has been well proven that alcohol is the first drug that most kids try making IT the gateway drug, not weed...

Alcohol is also responsible for a ridiculously larger number of deaths, injuries, medical conditions and societal problems than weed.

Let's not let facts get in the way of an ideological rant

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Weed is a gateway drug. We need to put a stop the current trend of decriminalization. Doctor shopping has been illegal for a while and Limbaugh paid the price for it - he lost his natural hearing. Excessive abuse of pain killers stops leads to deafness in some cases.

We also need to keep a close eye on pain managment clinics that over-prescribe medication for profit and not suggest alternatives like surgery or therapy.

I think Rushes hearing loss was due to wearing head phones for his entire career. Not a Rush bash but I've heard and read that happens to radio guys frequently.
Maybe @JSt0rm can chime in. He has audio experience.

As far as Doctor shopping goes Pharmacists need to police this better and arguably need to have stronger consequences if they violate. Two years ago I saw a CVS Pharmacist refuse to fill (I assume) a pain prescription. There was an older Woman waiting for it and her "ride" was a suspicious looking young guy wearing a hoodie and sun glasses at dusk. He kept impatiently milling around and honestly the older Woman may not have been 100% mentally competent. The Pharmacist said I'm not going to fill this, you were given a 3 day supply two days ago and I see a lot of ER room visits and too many different Doctors. I don't think they are all aware of how many have been filled (or something very similar to this)

 

[Darwin333]

Your impression of how safe pharmaceuticals are is phenomenally flawed. It might not kill you outright, but it might poke holes in your brain over a decade to the point where you cannot function normally in society.

This isn't an either-or thing, the bandaid should be ripped off for the betterment of our society.

Well we have absolute proof that a very large portion of people that were hooked on pharmaceutical drugs have switched to heroin when they could no longer obtain the pills. I never said they were safe, I said they were SAFER than heroin which again is simply a fact. I also said that it isn't right to punish sick people because of junkies but that is my opinion.

Another fact is that we simply are not going to win the war on drugs, we lost it a very long time ago. So I'm not sure what you mean by "bandaid should be ripped off" but I assume you mean that we should completely end the abuse of opiate drugs which includes heroin. Never. Going. To. Happen. We should be focusing on treatment instead of incarceration which could actually reduce the number of addicts.

 

[piasabird]

I dont even like to take asprin.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

I think Rushes hearing loss was due to wearing head phones for his entire career. Not a Rush bash but I've heard and read that happens to radio guys frequently.
Maybe @JSt0rm can chime in. He has audio experience.

As far as Doctor shopping goes Pharmacists need to police this better and arguably need to have stronger consequences if they violate. Two years ago I saw a CVS Pharmacist refuse to fill (I assume) a pain prescription. There was an older Woman waiting for it and her "ride" was a suspicious looking young guy wearing a hoodie and sun glasses at dusk. He kept impatiently milling around and honestly the older Woman may not have been 100% mentally competent. The Pharmacist said I'm not going to fill this, you were given a 3 day supply two days ago and I see a lot of ER room visits and too many different Doctors. I don't think they are all aware of how many have been filled (or something very similar to this)

Not long after I graduated I was attacked by someone for not filing a forged prescription. Man that didn't turn out well for the other guy

There's a lot of pressure from Corporate to fill fill fill but we generally resist. One thing some states have done is create a database that can be accessed to see if anyone has been abusing privileges and it's a major aid at many levels.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Well we have absolute proof that a very large portion of people that were hooked on pharmaceutical drugs have switched to heroin when they could no longer obtain the pills. I never said they were safe, I said they were SAFER than heroin which again is simply a fact. I also said that it isn't right to punish sick people because of junkies but that is my opinion.

Another fact is that we simply are not going to win the war on drugs, we lost it a very long time ago. So I'm not sure what you mean by "bandaid should be ripped off" but I assume you mean that we should completely end the abuse of opiate drugs which includes heroin. Never. Going. To. Happen. We should be focusing on treatment instead of incarceration which could actually reduce the number of addicts.

Agreed completely on incarceration, and what I meant by 'ripping off the bandaid' was that people should be restricted from both heroin *and* pharmaceuticals (of this type). We're already doing the former, need to do the latter as well. I'm not talking cold turkey here mind you, there should be a concerted effort to work with people addicted to pain meds to get them off. Hell, we put more effort into isolating the Zika virus than we've done to isolating an actual epidemic within the US.

 

[Leyawiin]

I can't stand the way opiod painkillers make me feel. My neurologist gave me hydrocodone for chronic migraines. Took them a few times and all they did was make me feel loopy and made me constipated (seriously). I flushed them and told him I'd just get by with aspirin and imitrex. He seemed surprised and told me that there were patients that just begged him for Norco.

Just not an addictive person I guess. Don't like booze, cigs or weed. I'll just take my physiology straight, thanks.

 

[Darwin333]

Agreed completely on incarceration, and what I meant by 'ripping off the bandaid' was that people should be restricted from both heroin *and* pharmaceuticals (of this type). We're already doing the former, need to do the latter as well. I'm not talking cold turkey here mind you, there should be a concerted effort to work with people addicted to pain meds to get them off. Hell, we put more effort into isolating the Zika virus than we've done to isolating an actual epidemic within the US.

I am in complete agreement with the above. Another consequence to the serious restriction of pharmaceutical pain killers pushing a ton of people to heroin is that at least if they were still on the pharmaceuticals it would be easier to identify a lot of the people addicted to try and get them help and treatment. IMHO, all drugs should be decriminalized and this should be viewed as a medical problem instead of law enforcement problem. The untold billions we would save could be put into various different treatment programs as well as harm reduction programs. It's ironic that for a lot of people more harm has been done to their lives from the enforcement of drug laws than the drugs ever did and those who truly need help often can't get it. Throwing them in jail and giving them a felony rap sheet doesn't help anyone at all and we have literally decades of evidence that it does not prevent people from using and/or becoming addicted to drugs in the first place.

 

[JSt0rm]

I think Rushes hearing loss was due to wearing head phones for his entire career. Not a Rush bash but I've heard and read that happens to radio guys frequently.
Maybe @JSt0rm can chime in. He has audio experience.

As far as Doctor shopping goes Pharmacists need to police this better and arguably need to have stronger consequences if they violate. Two years ago I saw a CVS Pharmacist refuse to fill (I assume) a pain prescription. There was an older Woman waiting for it and her "ride" was a suspicious looking young guy wearing a hoodie and sun glasses at dusk. He kept impatiently milling around and honestly the older Woman may not have been 100% mentally competent. The Pharmacist said I'm not going to fill this, you were given a 3 day supply two days ago and I see a lot of ER room visits and too many different Doctors. I don't think they are all aware of how many have been filled (or something very similar to this)

That would depend on how loud he listens. He is in a pretty quiet environment so I would expect his levels to be lower. When I am on the mix stage and doing fixes in headphones it is way too loud. I have to have my headphones above the volume of the stage (fucking loud). Luckily Im not on the stage too often.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

I am in complete agreement with the above. Another consequence to the serious restriction of pharmaceutical pain killers pushing a ton of people to heroin is that at least if they were still on the pharmaceuticals it would be easier to identify a lot of the people addicted to try and get them help and treatment. IMHO, all drugs should be decriminalized and this should be viewed as a medical problem instead of law enforcement problem. The untold billions we would save could be put into various different treatment programs as well as harm reduction programs. It's ironic that for a lot of people more harm has been done to their lives from the enforcement of drug laws than the drugs ever did and those who truly need help often can't get it. Throwing them in jail and giving them a felony rap sheet doesn't help anyone at all and we have literally decades of evidence that it does not prevent people from using and/or becoming addicted to drugs in the first place.

Agreed on all points, unfortunately there's some very large bankrolls keeping the status quo. You wouldn't need nearly as many prisons, police officers, or border protection agents if drugs were decriminalized, which is exactly why they won't be anytime soon.

 

[JSt0rm]

I can't stand the way opiod painkillers make me feel. My neurologist gave me hydrocodone for chronic migraines. Took them a few times and all they did was make me feel loopy and made me constipated (seriously). I flushed them and told him I'd just get by with aspirin and imitrex. He seemed surprised and told me that there were patients that just begged him for Norco.

Just not an addictive person I guess. Don't like booze, cigs or weed. I'll just take my physiology straight, thanks.

Please dont flush your medications. You should take them to a place to properly dispose of them.

 

[IronWing]

That would depend on how loud he listens.

If I were as insanely awesome as Rush, I'd have my headphones set to infinity and beyond just to hear the echos of my words.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Please dont flush your medications. You should take them to a place to properly dispose of them.

Per the FDA, flushing is acceptable, or simply throwing it in the garbage (flushing considered 'better' for narcotics prone to abuse).

https://www.fda.gov/ForConsumers/ConsumerUpdates/ucm101653.htm

 

[Darwin333]

Agreed on all points, unfortunately there's some very large bankrolls keeping the status quo. You wouldn't need nearly as many prisons, police officers, or border protection agents if drugs were decriminalized, which is exactly why they won't be anytime soon.

Don't forget things like asset seizure, court fines, probation fines and fees as well as the people working in them, drug testing facilities, etc... So while I firmly believe that my idea is an insurmountably better solution I also agree that it is very unlikely to happen anytime in the foreseeable future.

 

[bluestreak1776]

In my opinion the drug makers should be held responsible. I remember in the 90s the drug manufacturers were adamant that the new pain pills were non habit forming

Fanatical Meat is correct!

"Purdue debuted the narcotic OxyContin in 1996. The powerful painkiller gained momentum through heavy marketing approaches and topped sales revenues at $31 billion..."

https://cronkitenews.azpbs.org/hookedrx/pharmaceutical-industry-az-opioid-epidemic/

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[JSt0rm]

Per the FDA, flushing is acceptable, or simply throwing it in the garbage (flushing considered 'better' for narcotics prone to abuse).

https://www.fda.gov/ForConsumers/ConsumerUpdates/ucm101653.htm

That may be because its better to flush then have them in the hands of crazed druggies but meds in our water supply are a big problem.

http://www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/features/drugs-in-our-drinking-water#1

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Weed is a gateway drug. We need to put a stop the current trend of decriminalization. Doctor shopping has been illegal for a while and Limbaugh paid the price for it - he lost his natural hearing. Excessive abuse of pain killers stops leads to deafness in some cases.

We also need to keep a close eye on pain managment clinics that over-prescribe medication for profit and not suggest alternatives like surgery or therapy.

it should literally hurt to be this stupid

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

That may be because its better to flush then have them in the hands of crazed druggies but meds in our water supply are a big problem.

http://www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/features/drugs-in-our-drinking-water#1

I agree completely, which confuses me as to why the FDA recommends flushing them. It's like flushing heavy metals so crackheads don't get ahold of copper and sell it for more drugs, or something. I would never think that flushing anything other than human waste and tissue paper would be a good thing.