Guild Wars 2. How is it?

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GaiaHunter

Diamond Member
Jul 13, 2008
3,732
432
126
There's playing to enjoy, looking at scenery and reading all the story.

Then there's playing the most time efficient way, skip all the story lines, use generic strategies, use money.

Tim Buckley of CAD Comic posted a pretty big rant about GW2, and I do agree with it. It was hyped as a revolutionary game, that it was going to do SO many things differently and such. They didn't really deliver, it's a VERY solid MMO though but it's not what they said it'd be or what a lot of people were hoping for.

I don't regret the money I put down for it (specially since I only paid $48 :p) but it feels a lot like many other MMO's. The amazing visuals + epic storylines (granted a lot of the VA could use quite a bit more emotion) are enough to make it an enjoyable experience for me.

His big rant consisted of saying he doesn't like the fact your weapons unlock the skills too quickly and that GW2 isn't WoW.

There are many aspects that I enjoy about GW2, but the feeling you get that the world is alive (NPCs doing their stuff, gigantic cities) and the fact you are cooperating with tons of other people in the open world is something that really is revolutionary.

And there is no holy trinity!

Just to be curious what did they promise the game to be that isn't?
 

Coffinmaker

Member
Sep 15, 2010
101
0
71
Ok, here's my take on this game. Mind you I am only level 13 and have only ventured in the Black Citadel and Plains of Ashford so don't take my opinion as all encompassing. I think many minor things save a couple major ones have made this game unlike any other MMO. I am only going off of what I've experienced so far.

1st Major: The quest system, working with others without having to party up. This is a major change from traditional MMOs where you have been forced to find a party or see a guy you know doing the same thing as you but doesn't want to work with you by partying up. Everyone works together as long as they're in that area whether you or them like it or not.

2nd Major: The developers made this amazing world and want you focus on their masterpeice by exploring it rather than rushing from point A to point B. This has taken the addictiveness out of the genre by allowing one to logon for 20-30 minutes at a time and still accomplish something and gaining a good amount of xp.

Now for the minor revolutions:
1. The holy trinity is gone, everyone can rez. No more being as picky and choosy about who's in your party when you need one for a dungeon run. (This may be a major one)
2. Things are going on all over the place, the world is so active and you feel like you're in a busy environment, they took Rift's principals and added on to it multiple times over.
3. Almost anything you do gives you exp. I can't think of an MMO in recent memory where crafting gave you exp!
4. There is a slight puzzle aspect to the vistas with trying to navigate your way up to them which I thought was a pretty neat idea.

I'm sure there's lots more out there but I either can't think of any right now because it's late or I haven't gotten to them yet in the game.

One of my only gripes with this game is that my equipment busts too damn quick!

I am thoroughly enjoying this game with my Charr warrior and continue to play and enjoy the story for many many more days to come. Just my 2 cents.
 

Anubis

No Lifer
Aug 31, 2001
78,712
427
126
tbqhwy.com
How in the hell are people 80 already with the best gear? I feel like I've spent too much time playing at level 37. I really doubt anyone that rushes to 80 in a few days is not going to be satisfied with anything that is a large commercial title.

3 day head start + 16 hours a day. there is at least 1 member in my guild who is 80, he actually may have been the first 80 on the server i play on, not sure how he did it but there are ways to game the system into getting more XP per hour then you should be able to, by kinda sorta exploiting some things, which have been fixed i beleive. waiting to craft untill 60+ can gain you 10 levels in a matter of hours, same with saving exploring till later, because of how the XP scales its better to just wait on it
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
It doesnt sound like the game will be one that "lasts" along time.
Not something to play for years and years in its current state.

Same thing is said about GW1. And it had almost no PvE endgame. Yet over a million + played for many years, even after wow shot up to 11+ million. (Max level 20, by lv 14 you can have the best statted gear. It was just ugly)

Its pvp endgame is always strong, and you have to get 500 organized PvP wins to move to the pvp rank "Rabbit".

Also a lot of the negative level 80 posts are people who rushed as fast as they could and expected WoW type endgame (which it isn't), never realizing what GW1 endgame was like.

Sure they probably have plans for more PvE "raid" stuff (similar to GW1), and rumor is they already are almost finished on an expansion. But if people require a WoW like endgame, this is not the game for them.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
it is amazing.



question: how do you think GW1 became less solo-friendly? If anything, the advent of Heroes with NF made it a big online solo fest with the occasional desire to maybe team up with someone. It is, I think, the biggest solo-oriented MMO out there. Also--when I was sitll playing rather regularly (about 3 years ago), ecto farming was still viable, but I moved on to things like feather farming which were more consistent and efficient.

GW1 never ever "removed farming" All they ever did was tweak skills here and there, making certain builds no longer viable for certain farms...only to find those same farms easily replaced by another build on another class. Most people adapted :\

I hated the companions you could hire to follow you in GW1.

I despised the Heroes you could control/train. Really the day they implemented those, I never looked at GW1 again. No more grouping, and it was stupid being able to do an 8man team all by one self.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
There's playing to enjoy, looking at scenery and reading all the story.

Then there's playing the most time efficient way, skip all the story lines, use generic strategies, use money.

Tim Buckley of CAD Comic posted a pretty big rant about GW2, and I do agree with it. It was hyped as a revolutionary game, that it was going to do SO many things differently and such. They didn't really deliver, it's a VERY solid MMO though but it's not what they said it'd be or what a lot of people were hoping for.

I don't regret the money I put down for it (specially since I only paid $48 :p) but it feels a lot like many other MMO's. The amazing visuals + epic storylines (granted a lot of the VA could use quite a bit more emotion) are enough to make it an enjoyable experience for me.

They did deliver actually. It just isn't "enough" to a lot of peoples crazy high expectations. So many changes that have more or less shown what an MMO is capable of.

-Instant mail, no mailbox (Simple, but really important)
-Cross Server Guilds
-Dyes, that can color any armor any color after finding said color dye.
-Events that (A) Change the world for a time and (B) is active and can push some of the stories forward (kinda like Rift's Rifts)
-Active combat in which requires no actual tank or healer, just strategy and ability to dodge things that happen. (aka no trinity)
-A difficult crafting system, that also requires discoverys, and gives good xp
-Xp for everything (And leveling is a x/y slope of 1 instead of level 79-80 taking 4x as long as level 11-12)
-Random chests guarded by Big bosses in the playing world
-Limited skills at once, yet can combo through use of weapons (Actually never liked WoWs ability to have 100 skills on your screen to click/use at any time)
-The story is kinda like ToR, as it is unique to each character you make basically, and kinda interesting watch it unfold.

To reach some peoples expectations (those that rush and want more, more more! at every MMOs max level) a game would require close to 5-6 year development time with 2x the budget EA used on ToR with skilled programmers, along with 2-3 patches already ready for release with an Expansion already in the works. (Basically it means the developers would have to put all their eggs into a basket of a game taht has not proven to be successful, but game-wise and financial wise) Even then, I bet the end game content wouldnt be huge on release. No MMO had huge content on release.

I love WoW, I always have. Yet this game feels so different and fun. And with no subscription, I can play this like anyother game and not needing to be on 4-5 hours a day 5 days a week. (gasp!)
 
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diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
One of my only gripes with this game is that my equipment busts too damn quick!

Each time you die, and by die I mean not "rally" back up after falling. 1 piece takes damage.

Once every piece of gear takes damage. The next death = a piece breaks. Once you have a peice of gear in eevry slot, it takes 6-7 deaths before you need to actually repair.

I now have personal experience with this as I completed the AC dungeon, only died 23 times :D. (For those that don't know the dungeons can be so hard)
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
3 day head start + 16 hours a day. there is at least 1 member in my guild who is 80, he actually may have been the first 80 on the server i play on, not sure how he did it but there are ways to game the system into getting more XP per hour then you should be able to, by kinda sorta exploiting some things, which have been fixed i beleive. waiting to craft untill 60+ can gain you 10 levels in a matter of hours, same with saving exploring till later, because of how the XP scales its better to just wait on it

Some people set macros so that their character did an auto attack right in a nevent spawn point that spawned fairly often, and would leave game running 24hrs as they did RL stuff.

Anet banned all of them. They also are now banning if your name is offensive (do not break their naming rules.)

They banned a huge protion for names, yet decided to only give a 72 hour suspension as it was a first offense. But they did announce breaking it now will = a ban. (No dirty words, No sexual words, No copyright names, No (lol, rofl, etc.) in a name.)

Average leveling speed is also 1 lv an hour. SO those 80s that hit 80 in the head start? literally played nonstop and/or exploited a weakness in the game that has been fixed and the plaeyrs rectified.
 

imaheadcase

Diamond Member
May 9, 2005
3,850
7
76
Its worth the money. It has zero replay value though. The WvW is tiresome after about 30min.

The problem is that its, just to dam easy. Everything gives exp, i played a little less than a hour before work at level 45 and gained a level for example. Lots of level 80s already in game because of this. Its not really challenging.

My MMO days of old that took about 6-8 hours of grinding and quests. lol

It is fun though, and graphics are top notch for a mmo.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
Its worth the money. It has zero replay value though. The WvW is tiresome after about 30min.

The problem is that its, just to dam easy. Everything gives exp, i played a little less than a hour before work at level 45 and gained a level for example. Lots of level 80s already in game because of this. Its not really challenging.

My MMO days of old that took about 6-8 hours of grinding and quests. lol

It is fun though, and graphics are top notch for a mmo.

(A) - The alt characters are fun as you get a feel of how different each profession is and each one can have a different story. Plus the PvP is a blast and can take a while to get anywhere achieveable. So it only has 0 replay value if you require a gear "carrot on the stick" from max level raiding.

(B) - Easy? When has an MMO not been easy to level? I have never once seen an MMO in which leveling wasn't easy. To claim the game is easy, I hope you beat each dungeon on exploration mode (especially AC :eek:) and have attained enough wins in PvP for one of the nice titles.
 

darkewaffle

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2005
8,152
1
81
It's ok. I'm enjoying it to an extent, you can definitely progress without much lump time but on that same note I often feel like I'm not actually doing anything, especially with a quest system the pretty much abandons all attempts at story or situation. It's not really 'grabbing' me; it's extremely easy for me to log and I already think the levelling is tiresome at 35ish; though I do need to get round to trying a dungeon and PVP at least.

Zones are pretty but indistinct at the same time; every place I've levelled so far just kind of runs together as "the snowy mountains" or "the grassy plains/hills". Combat is spammy (partly my fault, I'm having trouble adjusting to having an auto-attack again lol) and essentially requires weapon switching (friend of mine loves it, I think it's an abysmal idea).

"Area" [only] questing and events are a step backwards imo, maybe I was spoiled by SWTOR's emphasis on presentation but without even a pretense of story/motivation to any of it, it feels like a straight up grindfest with the ability to 'grind' exploration or 'grind' crafting thrown in; the game it feels most similar to for me is Eden Eternal.

Ultimately I just don't feel particularly thrilled by the actual playing of the core (imo) game, the combat. I'll stick with it until I get a better feel for PVP and Dungeons to see if they do anything for me though; as I do definitely notice a lot of my abilities (Guardian here) seem worthless in non-party scenarios so I might feel more engaged then.
 

gladiatorua

Member
Nov 21, 2011
145
0
0
It has zero replay value though.
It does. Story-wise about 10-20% is the same for every character. Everything else is branched by choices you make. There are three or more distinct paths 15-70 location-wise.
Its not really challenging.
Leveling and progression is not supposed to be challenging. Content is. And there are 8 dungeons. To my knowledge, all of them have story mode, which is supposed to be easy and for everyone, and there is an explorable mode that has three branches. A perfect run should take about an hour. Tens of hours of content. Most runs are imperfect so they can take up to 4 hours with multiple tries, people leaving etc.
And downscaling makes return to missed content or stuff you want to repeat, enjoyable.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
It does. Story-wise about 10-20% is the same for every character. Everything else is branched by choices you make. There are three or more distinct paths 15-70 location-wise.Leveling and progression is not supposed to be challenging. Content is. And there are 8 dungeons. To my knowledge, all of them have story mode, which is supposed to be easy and for everyone, and there is an explorable mode that has three branches. A perfect run should take about an hour. Tens of hours of content. Most runs are imperfect so they can take up to 4 hours with multiple tries, people leaving etc.
And downscaling makes return to missed content or stuff you want to repeat, enjoyable.


Haha yea dungeons... even the first dungeon (lv 30) AC was very difficult on story mode. (Wonder what it is like on explorer mode)
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
It's ok. I'm enjoying it to an extent, you can definitely progress without much lump time but on that same note I often feel like I'm not actually doing anything, especially with a quest system the pretty much abandons all attempts at story or situation. It's not really 'grabbing' me; it's extremely easy for me to log and I already think the levelling is tiresome at 35ish; though I do need to get round to trying a dungeon and PVP at least.

Zones are pretty but indistinct at the same time; every place I've levelled so far just kind of runs together as "the snowy mountains" or "the grassy plains/hills". Combat is spammy (partly my fault, I'm having trouble adjusting to having an auto-attack again lol) and essentially requires weapon switching (friend of mine loves it, I think it's an abysmal idea).

"Area" [only] questing and events are a step backwards imo, maybe I was spoiled by SWTOR's emphasis on presentation but without even a pretense of story/motivation to any of it, it feels like a straight up grindfest with the ability to 'grind' exploration or 'grind' crafting thrown in; the game it feels most similar to for me is Eden Eternal.

Ultimately I just don't feel particularly thrilled by the actual playing of the core (imo) game, the combat. I'll stick with it until I get a better feel for PVP and Dungeons to see if they do anything for me though; as I do definitely notice a lot of my abilities (Guardian here) seem worthless in non-party scenarios so I might feel more engaged then.


If the combat isn't fun for you it is one of the few possibilities where:

(A) The holy trinity was your comfort zone, and it isn't enjoyable leaving that zone as everything in combat was more or less predictable, and only 1 person had to worry about the groups survival and not each individual person. (Did my first dungeon and I came to realize how difficult it is to NOT die w/o the holy trinity)

(B) Do not like the more "live action kite feel" from Diablo 3, and would rather have a stand still attack and only move if needed combat (Much like what WoW has become)

(C) You do not fully grasp the combos that can be done with weapon switching and/or chosing skills that compliment each other and the weapon skills to form insane combos.

I personally love the combat, I would be lying if I said I didnt miss the holy trinity in my dungeon run, but overall the PvE in a dungeon felt like a PvP battle and was still fun.
 

Arkadrel

Diamond Member
Oct 19, 2010
3,681
2
0
Why do die hard fantatics of GW2 have to put words into peoples mouths,
and explain "their" problems to them?

"Its not the game, its you, your problem."

I got the same told to me in another thread, by another GW2 fanantic.
Now here is another GW2 fan, doing the same thing to another person.

The reason I mention this, is because *he* mentions why he doesnt like the combat in GW2.
(yet you ignore his reasons, and start playing the blame game instead, blameing him for not likeing the game)


Hes a player that plays the game, why cant his reasons be valid? why do you feel the need to explain away his reasons?
with almost insult like logic? blameing him for not likeing the game?

I will say this, guildwars 2 is crazy hyped.
Perphaps even more than Diablo III was.
 
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CountZero

Golden Member
Jul 10, 2001
1,796
36
86
I will say this, guildwars 2 is crazy hyped.
Perphaps even more than Diablo III was.

There is no way GW2 is more hyped than D3.

D3 was hyped from the second it was mentioned that it was happening.

GW2 was more of a slow burn up until the last couple months where it became the next MMO FotM. The benefit to GW2 compared to most MMOs that have been the FotM is that you can buy it now and pick it up and put it down whenever as it gets more patches in the future. You basically can't get burned as an early adopter by 'wasting' that first free month as it were.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
Why do die hard fantatics of GW2 have to put words into peoples mouths,
and explain "their" problems to them?

"Its not the game, its you, your problem."

I got the same told to me in another thread, by another GW2 fanantic.
Now here is another GW2 fan, doing the same thing to another person.

The reason I mention this, is because *he* mentions why he doesnt like the combat in GW2.
(yet you ignore his reasons, and start playing the blame game instead, blameing him for not likeing the game)


Hes a player that plays the game, why cant his reasons be valid? why do you feel the need to explain away his reasons?
with almost insult like logic? blameing him for not likeing the game?

I will say this, guildwars 2 is crazy hyped.
Perphaps even more than Diablo III was.

It was hyped, though idk if as hyped as D3 as that had almost a decade to stir in peoples minds.

I never put words in his mouth. I am guessing as to why he didn't like the combat. You do not dislike something for no reason. He never gave a reason he didn't like the combat, he just stated he didn't like it which to him is a core piece of gameplay and not something he enjoys(which is understandable).

The options I gave were 3 primary reasons I could see someone not liking how combat has changed.

A) Its too different
B) It is more about the group looking out for the group and not just some individuals looking out for the group. (aka healers / leaders calling out what to do)
C) It was not explored to see all the possibilities so it seems like too many useless skills or too complicated.

"Its not the game, its you, your problem."

This is actually a true statement though. Just because someone doesn't find a game fun, doesn't mean it is the games fault. Its the problem of the person because they do not enjoy that type of game. This goes for any game out there. I dislike FPS games. So, is it the game genres fault that I don't like it? Or is it my problem because I just find no joy in simplified point and shoot and hiding PVP games?

And again, no words in his mouth. It was just a gauge to see WHY he didn't like the combat. Because i am interested in why people don't like / do like certain games. Hence the long thread we had about a month back on the MMO-poll where we debated on stuff and you were very partial to the FF 11 MMO type of game.
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,978
31,531
146
I hated the companions you could hire to follow you in GW1.

I despised the Heroes you could control/train. Really the day they implemented those, I never looked at GW1 again. No more grouping, and it was stupid being able to do an 8man team all by one self.

as a chronic AFKer, I didn't mind it so much :\ Though, allowing entire teams of 8 heroes, instead of the initial 4, where you would still need a player to group with, was certainly too far (as fun as it is to kind of sit back and watch your OP heroes melt down mobs in HM explorables...it's pretty much what you're left with after completing most of the game, and you have little else to do but farm for achievements...you realize that the game has jumped the shark)

Still, you couldn't successfully use Heroes in the HM dungeons, particularly in Cantha or EoTN.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,978
31,531
146
Same thing is said about GW1. And it had almost no PvE endgame. Yet over a million + played for many years, even after wow shot up to 11+ million. (Max level 20, by lv 14 you can have the best statted gear. It was just ugly)

Its pvp endgame is always strong, and you have to get 500 organized PvP wins to move to the pvp rank "Rabbit".

Also a lot of the negative level 80 posts are people who rushed as fast as they could and expected WoW type endgame (which it isn't), never realizing what GW1 endgame was like.

Sure they probably have plans for more PvE "raid" stuff (similar to GW1), and rumor is they already are almost finished on an expansion. But if people require a WoW like endgame, this is not the game for them.

--Rushes to max level in 3 day-old game.
--Complains that endgame is too limited, in this level 80 zone, empty of all other players....in 3-day old game

:|
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,978
31,531
146
It's ok. I'm enjoying it to an extent, you can definitely progress without much lump time but on that same note I often feel like I'm not actually doing anything, especially with a quest system the pretty much abandons all attempts at story or situation. It's not really 'grabbing' me; it's extremely easy for me to log and I already think the levelling is tiresome at 35ish; though I do need to get round to trying a dungeon and PVP at least.

Zones are pretty but indistinct at the same time; every place I've levelled so far just kind of runs together as "the snowy mountains" or "the grassy plains/hills". Combat is spammy (partly my fault, I'm having trouble adjusting to having an auto-attack again lol) and essentially requires weapon switching (friend of mine loves it, I think it's an abysmal idea).

"Area" [only] questing and events are a step backwards imo, maybe I was spoiled by SWTOR's emphasis on presentation but without even a pretense of story/motivation to any of it, it feels like a straight up grindfest with the ability to 'grind' exploration or 'grind' crafting thrown in; the game it feels most similar to for me is Eden Eternal.

Ultimately I just don't feel particularly thrilled by the actual playing of the core (imo) game, the combat. I'll stick with it until I get a better feel for PVP and Dungeons to see if they do anything for me though; as I do definitely notice a lot of my abilities (Guardian here) seem worthless in non-party scenarios so I might feel more engaged then.

You can turn off autoattack. I have to do that in many cases.

For those that are very "meh" on the questing/dynamic event aspects: Have you hung around to actually work through some of the event chains? early enough in Kessex--the bandit fort, the centaurs vs Seraph throughout central and western Kessex? The thing that really works, is you have to "stick around." Listen to the NPCs, complete one, and then follow where it takes you to the next event. It really does offer some wide-ranged "world changing" if you follow them through

Of course, they do repeat and the problem is, that people will farm them for various reasons, never allowing the centaur to win certain posts, to see the new events that spawn requiring groups to run through all the outposts to reclaim them. The blank slate of a place like Kessex is centaurs controlling all of the various outposts throughout the northwest and central region--you actually have ot retake them one at a time, wait for seraph to rally, assault the bridge as centaurs try to repair it, then assault the main centaur camp, anger the bosses that spawn, then take them out. It's rare that people see this now, as it's a populated areas (especially with the XP farmers exploiting the bridge event). I do agree that it's a real criticism of the system, but essentially unavoidable. Still tons better than go collect beets! (yes, you can also do this in GW2, but you can complete that NPC's various needs in many other ways, like killing centaurs through the events) and return them to NPC


My main criticism with the combat, and I think it's a big one, is that difficulty and strategy from "1 meter to the next" is horribly unscaled. meaning, mobs tend to be painfully difficult in comparison to most of the bosses. Mob fights are about crowd control, support, and careful dodging. These are the majority of fights, of course, and really utilize the various class's skills and methods of play. Boss's, on the other hand--particularly int he explorables, are essentially zerg rushes. beat down on boss, until it croaks. These explorable spawning bosses have various functions--separate stages, habits, whatever, but I have yet to see one of these through 60 levels that can't be beaten by simple mob violence. As pontifex and others have said, the player mobs get so huge swarming the bosses, that you rarely have any idea where you are, if you are mele range, and what exactly you are doing in terms of contribution.

Now, dungeons are a different story. same issue--mobs tend to be much, much harder than bosses, but you are limited to a 5-man team, so it does require much more thinking to survive and complete these instances. 5 of us tackled CM (the second dungeon, with a rather short, and relatively "easy" (lol) story mode) explorable mode--the 2nd time you go through this dungeon, the map opens into an entirely new area, with very different bosses, very different mobs, and vastly increased difficulty. AC (the first dungeon), was simply too punishing to enjoy, and I think most simply don't like doing it more than once. CM explorable, offers more variety and strategy, the bosses are still sort of trap and hammer them down, but they have individual traits (based on their class) that teams can exploit depending on their make up.

The beauty of all of this is that not only are they ways to complete dungeons and their bosses dynamic depending on your team--which will never rely on "the tank" pulling angry mob into corner while two brainless DPS whittle them down, repeat, repeat, etc--but the dungeons are dynamic--they change, and it's not a simple change.

We had 2 level 80s and 3 level 55+ in that group (this was level 45 dungeon) and if you think it was "easy" for the level 80s....jsut ask them how often they died.

with explorable mode, we got 30 tokens in one run to be used on advanced gear, with another potential set of level 70 "endgame" gear. 30 tokens gets you a piece of gear that can be used at level 45, while you will need 150 minimum of these same tokens to get you the level 70 stuff. And these tokens are good for this dungeon, and the vendor that sells loot based on the dungeon. There are currently 8 such vendors with their own unique armor and weapon sets, requiring dungeon tokens

So basically--those that complain there is no endgame PvE or endgame content in GW2 right now, have simply chosen to stop playing.

There is, in my experience, more than what is currently available in ToR, especially considering that PvP in GW2 puts what you have in ToR to utter shame.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
You can turn off autoattack. I have to do that in many cases.

For those that are very "meh" on the questing/dynamic event aspects: Have you hung around to actually work through some of the event chains? early enough in Kessex--the bandit fort, the centaurs vs Seraph throughout central and western Kessex? The thing that really works, is you have to "stick around." Listen to the NPCs, complete one, and then follow where it takes you to the next event. It really does offer some wide-ranged "world changing" if you follow them through

Of course, they do repeat and the problem is, that people will farm them for various reasons, never allowing the centaur to win certain posts, to see the new events that spawn requiring groups to run through all the outposts to reclaim them. The blank slate of a place like Kessex is centaurs controlling all of the various outposts throughout the northwest and central region--you actually have ot retake them one at a time, wait for seraph to rally, assault the bridge as centaurs try to repair it, then assault the main centaur camp, anger the bosses that spawn, then take them out. It's rare that people see this now, as it's a populated areas (especially with the XP farmers exploiting the bridge event). I do agree that it's a real criticism of the system, but essentially unavoidable. Still tons better than go collect beets! (yes, you can also do this in GW2, but you can complete that NPC's various needs in many other ways, like killing centaurs through the events) and return them to NPC


My main criticism with the combat, and I think it's a big one, is that difficulty and strategy from "1 meter to the next" is horribly unscaled. meaning, mobs tend to be painfully difficult in comparison to most of the bosses. Mob fights are about crowd control, support, and careful dodging. These are the majority of fights, of course, and really utilize the various class's skills and methods of play. Boss's, on the other hand--particularly int he explorables, are essentially zerg rushes. beat down on boss, until it croaks. These explorable spawning bosses have various functions--separate stages, habits, whatever, but I have yet to see one of these through 60 levels that can't be beaten by simple mob violence. As pontifex and others have said, the player mobs get so huge swarming the bosses, that you rarely have any idea where you are, if you are mele range, and what exactly you are doing in terms of contribution.

Now, dungeons are a different story. same issue--mobs tend to be much, much harder than bosses, but you are limited to a 5-man team, so it does require much more thinking to survive and complete these instances. 5 of us tackled CM (the second dungeon, with a rather short, and relatively "easy" (lol) story mode) explorable mode--the 2nd time you go through this dungeon, the map opens into an entirely new area, with very different bosses, very different mobs, and vastly increased difficulty. AC (the first dungeon), was simply too punishing to enjoy, and I think most simply don't like doing it more than once. CM explorable, offers more variety and strategy, the bosses are still sort of trap and hammer them down, but they have individual traits (based on their class) that teams can exploit depending on their make up.

The beauty of all of this is that not only are they ways to complete dungeons and their bosses dynamic depending on your team--which will never rely on "the tank" pulling angry mob into corner while two brainless DPS whittle them down, repeat, repeat, etc--but the dungeons are dynamic--they change, and it's not a simple change.

We had 2 level 80s and 3 level 55+ in that group (this was level 45 dungeon) and if you think it was "easy" for the level 80s....jsut ask them how often they died.

with explorable mode, we got 30 tokens in one run to be used on advanced gear, with another potential set of level 70 "endgame" gear. 30 tokens gets you a piece of gear that can be used at level 45, while you will need 150 minimum of these same tokens to get you the level 70 stuff. And these tokens are good for this dungeon, and the vendor that sells loot based on the dungeon. There are currently 8 such vendors with their own unique armor and weapon sets, requiring dungeon tokens

So basically--those that complain there is no endgame PvE or endgame content in GW2 right now, have simply chosen to stop playing.

There is, in my experience, more than what is currently available in ToR, especially considering that PvP in GW2 puts what you have in ToR to utter shame.

The "Lovers" fight in AC (lv 30 dungeon)

That fight, almost broke my soul. 2 bosses at once, that AoE and do 40-50% your hp in one hit. Until I devised a strategy to overcome them, then it was just execution and keep moving so aoe dont hurt you.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,978
31,531
146
Why do die hard fantatics of GW2 have to put words into peoples mouths,
and explain "their" problems to them?

"Its not the game, its you, your problem."

I got the same told to me in another thread, by another GW2 fanantic.
Now here is another GW2 fan, doing the same thing to another person.

The reason I mention this, is because *he* mentions why he doesnt like the combat in GW2.
(yet you ignore his reasons, and start playing the blame game instead, blameing him for not likeing the game)


Hes a player that plays the game, why cant his reasons be valid? why do you feel the need to explain away his reasons?
with almost insult like logic? blameing him for not likeing the game?

I will say this, guildwars 2 is crazy hyped.
Perphaps even more than Diablo III was.


I don't get it--you haven't played the game and rely only on criticisms based on people who already hate the game?

so, why do diehard haters of a game simply seek to reinforce their dislike of something they clearly have no interest in?


I've repeatedly commented, at length on the many criticisms I have of the game. I'm not putting words in people's mouth--I'm specifically showing where some of these criticisms are valid, and where some of them are completely and obviously baseless. (lack of endgame content = someone who stopped playing. period)


Anyone's hate can be valid, and I've tried to address the various criticisms. It's not the type of play you like? simple, perfectly reasonable!

There is no endgame? Uh, really? compared to what other 1 week-old game? Hell, there's already far more content than a nearly 1 year-old game (ToR), and as you explore, you clearly notice the inactive waypoints (hello, LA) that are already geared for expanded content.


as far as the weapon-switching mechanic, I find it really depends on the class, and the time it takes to "get" how it works. For me, it takes a minimum of 15 levels to simply get comfortable with these classes, and it really takes level 20+, when you have some investment in the trait system, for a class to blossom into a particular role. Again, I have the same complaints--but realized that, for me, it just takes time to "get it."

Overhyped more than D3? o_O Now I know you're just trolling. :D


really, have you compared the backlash to the release of D3 and it's many faults (this crap made national media! :D) to the, uh, "backlash" with GW2? seriously? A handful of lonely level 80s in GW2 complaining about lack of players at the end of the game = confirmed over-hyping?

OK.... :hmm:
 
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cronos

Diamond Member
Nov 7, 2001
9,380
26
101
If the combat isn't fun for you it is one of the few possibilities where:

(A) The holy trinity was your comfort zone, and it isn't enjoyable leaving that zone as everything in combat was more or less predictable, and only 1 person had to worry about the groups survival and not each individual person. (Did my first dungeon and I came to realize how difficult it is to NOT die w/o the holy trinity)

(B) Do not like the more "live action kite feel" from Diablo 3, and would rather have a stand still attack and only move if needed combat (Much like what WoW has become)

(C) You do not fully grasp the combos that can be done with weapon switching and/or chosing skills that compliment each other and the weapon skills to form insane combos.

I personally love the combat, I would be lying if I said I didnt miss the holy trinity in my dungeon run, but overall the PvE in a dungeon felt like a PvP battle and was still fun.

I am personally intrigued by the non-existence of holy trinity and weapon-based skill set, but if I ended up not getting GW2 it's because of point B above. All of the descriptions I've read regarding combat in this game seems like playing a typical arcade fight game to me. I believe I've read that I have to actively move around and can dodge spells/arrows/etc. and I have to time my moves correctly to get the effect that I want.

This just doesn't appeal to me. If I wanted to play Mortal Kombat or Soul Calibur I'll play Mortal Kombat or Soul Calibur, not an MMORPG. I got burned on similar thing with Age of Conan and its supposedly fresh combat mechanic. It was advertized pretty much exactly like that. I tried the game, and the combat mechanic alone killed that game for me before everything else did.

Even in the official website they describe combat as: "Combat in Guild Wars 2 is flexible, fast-paced, and dynamic. You’ll achieve victory through timing, dodging, and quick thinking, not immobile number-crunching." Ugh.

So, fans, please tell me I misunderstood this combat thing.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
I am personally intrigued by the non-existence of holy trinity and weapon-based skill set, but if I ended up not getting GW2 it's because of point B above. All of the descriptions I've read regarding combat in this game seems like playing a typical arcade fight game to me. I believe I've read that I have to actively move around and can dodge spells/arrows/etc. and I have to time my moves correctly to get the effect that I want.

This just doesn't appeal to me. If I wanted to play Mortal Kombat or Soul Calibur I'll play Mortal Kombat or Soul Calibur, not an MMORPG. I got burned on similar thing with Age of Conan and its supposedly fresh combat mechanic. It was advertized pretty much exactly like that. I tried the game, and the combat mechanic alone killed that game for me before everything else did.

Even in the official website they describe combat as: "Combat in Guild Wars 2 is flexible, fast-paced, and dynamic. You’ll achieve victory through timing, dodging, and quick thinking, not immobile number-crunching." Ugh.

So, fans, please tell me I misunderstood this combat thing.

You did but you didn't.

Yes you dodge abilities. However it is limited as a "resource" as it takes tim to regenerate the ability to dodge. Also some attacks are so fast that unless you decide to dodge for fun, and an attack happens right then, you will be hit. However it is these attacks that don't do a lot of damage.

Many Boss fights have Red circles where AoE is about to happen, so you press dodge to "roll" out of it, and if the attack starts to happen as you roll, you 'evade' the attack. They also have a power up swing (kinda like a 3s charge up attack on other MMOs) where just moving isn't fast enough to not be hit by it, however the dodge roll is.

But yes the combat is more active, I think you explained it better than I would have thought to. It is kinda like if WoW playstyle (attack style) mixed with a fighter games active dodge setup. Though it is limited and you have to be intelligent on when to use it or just take the hit.

With that said. Odds are you will die during "group" combat. That is normal, normally a person should come over, right click you and start reviving you. Once revived your back in the game.

And I understand. I think teh active combat thing will turn some people off, but it was their attempt to make the holy trinity removed.
 
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diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
I don't get it--you haven't played the game and rely only on criticisms based on people who already hate the game?

so, why do diehard haters of a game simply seek to reinforce their dislike of something they clearly have no interest in?


I've repeatedly commented, at length on the many criticisms I have of the game. I'm not putting words in people's mouth--I'm specifically showing where some of these criticisms are valid, and where some of them are completely and obviously baseless. (lack of endgame content = someone who stopped playing. period)


Anyone's hate can be valid, and I've tried to address the various criticisms. It's not the type of play you like? simple, perfectly reasonable!

There is no endgame? Uh, really? compared to what other 1 week-old game? Hell, there's already far more content than a nearly 1 year-old game (ToR), and as you explore, you clearly notice the inactive waypoints (hello, LA) that are already geared for expanded content.


as far as the weapon-switching mechanic, I find it really depends on the class, and the time it takes to "get" how it works. For me, it takes a minimum of 15 levels to simply get comfortable with these classes, and it really takes level 20+, when you have some investment in the trait system, for a class to blossom into a particular role. Again, I have the same complaints--but realized that, for me, it just takes time to "get it."

Overhyped more than D3? o_O Now I know you're just trolling. :D


really, have you compared the backlash to the release of D3 and it's many faults (this crap made national media! :D) to the, uh, "backlash" with GW2? seriously? A handful of lonely level 80s in GW2 complaining about lack of players at the end of the game = confirmed over-hyping?

OK.... :hmm:

Also Kaln, before I removed him from the guild. Or he left. Whatever story you wish to believe. LOVED how the armor looked. (lv 80 who played almost every single hour during headstart)

After an avid WoW and ToR player, the gear actually looked new/fresh and cool. Unlike how WoW after 7 years some sets look similar to Vanilla Tier sets now.