gtx570 or 6970?

[skipsneeky2]

Here i go bringing a old thread back to life,considering the last post was almost 3 months ago,how would the results pan out these days between the 6970 and gtx570.

Do to a handful of circumstances and last minute decisions i eventually settled on a core i5 2500k8gb ddr3 ram and a gtx560 non ti 2gb thats basically oced to slighter lower then gtx560 ti specs and performance.

Purchased this card as a cheaper alternative to the gtx570 with plans of replacing it with a 7950 when it came out but due to its higher then expected msrp i should have sticked with the gtx570.

The card i got has a locked voltage of 1.037v and 925 core,1050 memory is as high as the card will overclock and i do desire a little more kick.

Considering 3 months have passed and if you ignored enabling msaa with ultra settings and disabled motion blur as technically no single card is capable of good performance anyways with these options enabled,which of the two would be the better option?

 

[aaksheytalwar]

If you want to play at 1080p then nothing less than a gta 580 or radeon 7950 will allow 4x msaa with an average of at least 50 fps

Without any form of aa both 570 and 6950 at 1080p will give 50+ fps but your CPU might hold you back from a smooth hiccup free gameplay.

 

[Dark Shroud]

The 6970 is the stronger of the two and if you like eye candy the extra memory will come in handy. But you'll need to buy soon.

HD 6900 cards in general are getting bought up by Bitcoin miners and they're probably going to be EOL soon.

 

[Jacky60]

Most benchmarks put 6970 slightly ahead of 570 and more behind 580 and the extra ram helps a lot. 6970 if its a straight choice.

 

[Termie]

Honestly, neither of these choices warrants an upgrade from your GPU. Is your motherboard SLI-capable? Doubling up on your 560 would provide gains in BF3 leaps and bounds ahead of the 570 or 6970. You can probably hit around 45fps at all high with your card. The 570 and 6970 would get you to about 50-55.

I understand your frustration, though. AMD disappointed a lot of people waiting to buy with the 7950, which for all intents and purposes costs the same as the 7970 and performs too closely to a 580.

 

[skipsneeky2]

Honestly, neither of these choices warrants an upgrade from your GPU. Is your motherboard SLI-capable? Doubling up on your 560 would provide gains in BF3 leaps and bounds ahead of the 570 or 6970. You can probably hit around 45fps at all high with your card. The 570 and 6970 would get you to about 50-55.

I understand your frustration, though. AMD disappointed a lot of people waiting to buy with the 7950, which for all intents and purposes costs the same as the 7970 and performs too closely to a 580.

Between my psu,my choice of motherboard and my smaller case,sli would be basically impossible without spending more then what the 6970 or the gtx570 would cost by itself.

I had my gtx560 at 945,2250 for a short time before it was unstable and it kicked some ass with near 448 ti core specs but since i got a locked voltage of 1.037v i had to drop it way down to 925,2100 be stable,that included game settings .
When i started this thread i was mostly gaming at 1600x1200 but now my native resolution is 1920x1080 and my current card constantly dips into the lower 40's and plenty of times it can dip into the mid 30's in BF3 and in BC2 i went from 8x msaa which is beautiful and gives me a major advantage to 1x msaa which looks ass ugly and isn't even as playable making me lose my advantage usually at long distance as 8msaa just is very sharp so i miss it dearly.

I do feel the extra kick the gtx570 or 6970 will give me is worth it as the card of choice will be overclocked as well but which overclocks better and has better performance at stock in BF3 without msaa with ultra settings as all the reviews really are a mixed bag.

 

[Childs]

If you are still going to purchase a card, consider the following:

GTX 480 $250

With free shipping and no tax, you cant get a better deal on a new card.

 

[skipsneeky2]

This is the only chart i swear in existence that has 1920x1080 performance without msaa and its in this forum thread.....http://www.overclock.net/t/1161283/580-or-6970-for-bf3 .

Post #2 and its a hardware canucks chart that seems to follow Hard ocps review of recommending a gtx570 for the best ultra experience of course with disabling msaa as about 90% of the reviews of hardware have msaa enabled like people actually enjoy 41fps average on a gtx570 with it enabled like come on.

The 6970 does have the advantage of extra memory but seems a couple reviews put it below the gtx570 but with a moderately safe oc how would the 6970 scale?

 

[BallaTheFeared]

6970's typically don't really OC well. 570s on the other hand can OC well, most will do around 900MHz. Reference designs have poor vrms though, so exceeding 900MHz is a wash on them even if the gpu itself is capable.

Depending on your games of choice it can go either way or be tied, Nvidia has an advantage in BF3 while AMD does better in games like Crysis 1. Also the 570 is considerably faster when it comes to tessellation, which is something to keep in mind as DX11 becomes more mature.

 

[RussianSensation]

HD6900 series tanks with MSAA in BF3.
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2011/11/10/battlefield-3-technical-analysis/6

IF you are already considering a ~$300 HD6970, If I was you, I'd get an EVGA GTX480 for $250 + $30 Extended Warranty so that you are eligible for a 90-day Step-Up.

I know it sounds 'insane' to recommend such a card with such high power consumption and relatively loud noise levels but hear me out.

1) It has more VRAM than GTX570 or 560 Ti 448, so it'll be sufficient for 1080P in BF3.

2) GTX480s overclock better than most GTX570s and you are more or less guaranteed GTX580 level of performance. HD6970 will not touch GTX580 in BF3 at 1080P with MSAA considering it takes HD7950 to do that (see link below).

3) EVGA allows 90 day-step up if you spend $30 to upgrade -KR* <$300 SKU card. If NV manages to get out GTX670Ti within the next 3 months ~ $300-350, you'll be able to step-up for $50 to a much quieter card, faster card.

Considering GTX580 easily trades blows with a $450 HD7950 in BF3, if this is the game you care about the most, then you are getting a bargain on that GTX480 right now.

Given that NV's Fermi architecture performs better with deferred MSAA game engines, it's reasonable to believe that GTX670Ti based on Kepler would do even better and should have no problems at all beating HD7950 in BF3.

Alternatively, you can do the same with a quieter $270 GTX560 Ti 448, but it costs you $20 more.

It makes no sense to buy HD6970 based on its current price for BF3, considering GTX560 Ti 448 and GTX480 give better performance in BF and give you 90-day step-up.

 

[skipsneeky2]

HD6900 series tanks with MSAA in BF3.
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2011/11/10/battlefield-3-technical-analysis/6

IF you are already considering a ~$300 HD6970, If I was you, I'd get an EVGA GTX480 for $250 + $30 Extended Warranty so that you are eligible for a 90-day Step-Up.

I know it sounds 'insane' to recommend such a card with such high power consumption and relatively loud noise levels but hear me out.

1) It has more VRAM than GTX570 or 560 Ti 448, so it'll be sufficient for 1080P in BF3.

2) GTX480s overclock better than most GTX570s and you are more or less guaranteed GTX580 level of performance. HD6970 will not touch GTX580 in BF3 at 1080P with MSAA considering it takes HD7950 to do that (see link below).

3) EVGA allows 90 day-step up if you spend $30 to upgrade -KR* <$300 SKU card. If NV manages to get out GTX670Ti within the next 3 months ~ $300-350, you'll be able to step-up for $50 to a much quieter card, faster card.

Considering GTX580 easily trades blows with a $450 HD7950 in BF3, if this is the game you care about the most, then you are getting a bargain on that GTX480 right now.

Given that NV's Fermi architecture performs better with deferred MSAA game engines, it's reasonable to believe that GTX670Ti based on Kepler would do even better and should have no problems at all beating HD7950 in BF3.

Alternatively, you can do the same with a quieter $270 GTX560 Ti 448, but it costs you $20 more.

It makes no sense to buy HD6970 based on its current price for BF3, considering GTX560 Ti 448 and GTX480 give better performance in BF and give you 90-day step-up.

Excellent article link you posted,thank you.:thumbsup:

Couple other reviews have pushed me to either the 560ti 448 or the gtx570 as also your link and while the gtx480 looks like a tasty option,i think the gtx570 is as good of a card as i will go due to my power supply being not the worlds best being a 600 watt thermaltake tr2 with 56amp on dual 12v.

Some googling has suggested a stock gtx570 can hit 800 core,2000 memory on stock voltage and that article hints without no msaa a gtx570 could pull about 46 min and close to 60fps average with max post aa which would be sweet.:thumbsup:

Think at this point a 7970 would be the first card anyone should think of if they want even 2x msaa in BF3 let alone 4x msaa with decent performance but without msaa looks like a gtx570 should suffice.:thumbsup:

Picking up the card next week and unless i have more to spend its either a gtx570 or 7970 and thanks again for the help everyone.

 

[Crap Daddy]

I'm playing ULTRA preset, 4MSAA, Vsync on, max FOV and get above 45 on B2K and around 50 in older maps with a GTX570 at 800 core. Resolution is 1680x1050 22"

 

[RussianSensation]

Picking up the card next week and unless i have more to spend its either a gtx570 or 7970 and thanks again for the help everyone.

I still think if you are going to buy a GTX570 for $280-300 at this point, you should strongly consider an EVGA version. It seems a little bit wasteful to drop that much $ on a generation which is more or less 2-years-old. You really should have purchased a GTX570 1 year ago when it came out since its prices have barely dropped. Obviously, it's difficult to always predict pricing trends, etc. Also, no one really expected 28nm GPUs to be 'so slow' at stock speeds. It's really sad that 15 months later GTX570 and GTX580 have barely dropped $50. The same has to be said for HD6950 and HD6970.

I think we'll have much faster performance soon at $300-350. Basically what I am saying is prices now are artificially high due to lack of competition. How can 12 months pass and HD6950 2GB still costs the same or more than it did in February of 2011? 15 months later and GTX570 still sells for barely less than MSRP. So if you are going to dump $300 into a last generation card, especially with only 1280mb of RAM, I presume you have been saving for a while since you didn't buy HD6950 / 6970 or GTX570 for $250-300 for 12 months...As such having a 3 months "insurance" to step-up to what surely has to be to be a much faster $300-350 card from NVidia seems like a good bet this time.

I might be in the minority on our boards, but in my view the current pricing structure makes no sense in terms of historical market forces. It's like a stock that's been overhyped. Long-term fundamentals will ensure that the stock price returns to its fair value once investors reevaluate all pertinent information, including expected growth and how the company is doing vs. the competition. Right now, if you look at the current market pricing structure of GPUs, performance has not or barely increased at $150, $200, $250, $300, $350 or $450 price levels. That's not fundamentally sound and which is why I believe the market will eventually return to fundamentals: either prices have to fall in-line with the historical GPU technology curve of "more performance for a similar price," or increased competitiveness in the marketplace will ensure that prices fall for a similar level of performance.

Right now, the market is stagnant. HD7900 series selling out likely signals shortage of 28nm parts. Lack of mid-range 28nm offerings isn't going to start a fire-sale on old 40nm parts. In summary, if you want an NV card for some reason, get the EVGA step-up "insurance." Otherwise, I think HD7870 might be the card you want, especially if it overclocks 40% like Tahiti.

 

[wand3r3r]

I'd wait till March 6th if you can when the 7870 should be released. It actually might not do anything to the current pricing judging by the fact that they just bumped the cards up a price bracket and keep the last generation side by side with the next generation. Just a thought though..

 

[3DVagabond]

I still think if you are going to buy a GTX570 for $280-300 at this point, you should strongly consider an EVGA version. It seems a little bit wasteful to drop that much $ on a generation which is more or less 2-years-old. You really should have purchased a GTX570 1 year ago when it came out since its prices have barely dropped. Obviously, it's difficult to always predict pricing trends, etc. Also, no one really expected 28nm GPUs to be 'so slow' at stock speeds. It's really sad that 15 months later GTX570 and GTX580 have barely dropped $50. The same has to be said for HD6950 and HD6970.

I think we'll have much faster performance soon at $300-350. Basically what I am saying is prices now are artificially high due to lack of competition. How can 12 months pass and HD6950 2GB still costs the same or more than it did in February of 2011? 15 months later and GTX570 still sells for barely less than MSRP. So if you are going to dump $300 into a last generation card, especially with only 1280mb of RAM, I presume you have been saving for a while since you didn't buy HD6950 / 6970 or GTX570 for $250-300 for 12 months...As such having a 3 months "insurance" to step-up to what surely has to be to be a much faster $300-350 card from NVidia seems like a good bet this time.

I might be in the minority on our boards, but in my view the current pricing structure makes no sense in terms of historical market forces. It's like a stock that's been overhyped. Long-term fundamentals will ensure that the stock price returns to its fair value once investors reevaluate all pertinent information, including expected growth and how the company is doing vs. the competition. Right now, if you look at the current market pricing structure of GPUs, performance has not or barely increased at $150, $200, $250, $300, $350 or $450 price levels. That's not fundamentally sound and which is why I believe the market will eventually return to fundamentals: either prices have to fall in-line with the historical GPU technology curve of "more performance for a similar price," or increased competitiveness in the marketplace will ensure that prices fall for a similar level of performance.

Right now, the market is stagnant. HD7900 series selling out likely signals shortage of 28nm parts. Lack of mid-range 28nm offerings isn't going to start a fire-sale on old 40nm parts. In summary, if you want an NV card for some reason, get the EVGA step-up "insurance." Otherwise, I think HD7870 might be the card you want, especially if it overclocks 40% like Tahiti.

I'm not sure when we'll ever see AMD and nVidia compete hard on price like they did with the 4000 and 200 series. The 5870 pricing was low because AMD was expecting tough competition a lot sooner from nVidia than what eventually came about. They thought that what eventually came out as the GTX-580 a year later was due any day. I think they learned a hard lesson.

In the end a duopoly isn't really much better than a monopoly.

As far as performance not increasing, that's not totally accurate. The 7970 is markedly faster than the 580. Especially when you O/C the two cards. When it was released they were the same price. The 580 has come down in price since then. Although, I'm sure that somewhere along the way there was some stupid low sale price that someone will pull out where they paid $379 for one, or something.

 

[RussianSensation]

As far as performance not increasing, that's not totally accurate. The 7970 is markedly faster than the 580.

Ya, I did specify @ $150-450 price levels. Basically at $280-300 that the skipsneeky2 is looking to spend, he is getting more or less 15 months old performance and power consumption at next generation pricing. If someone asked you in December 2010 (when GTX570 launched) how fast of a videocard you thought you'd be able to buy for $300 in 15 months, would you have said GTX570?

The market has to correct itself. We are either right at the end of the cycle where a "new" 28nm card will completely make a $300 40nm card obsolete or prices have to fall significantly on 40nm tech so that 40nm inventory is cleared if 28nm parts are barely better. That applies for all HD6950/6970/GTX570/580.

By now the price of GTX580 should have fallen well below $400. However, it seems to be a 2-way street. If consumers are still buying $300 GTX570 and $450 GTX580s, why would the manufacturers lower prices? Unfortunately it seems most consumers either don't care or aren't paying attention to the product life-cycle. Otherwise, how can a consumer justify prices for what more or less are 15-months old parts? Logically it hardly makes sense to buy a $300 GTX570 or $450 GTX580 at this time (aside from having the option to step-up to a 28nm part). Of course if NV releases a GTX670Ti for $450 as a "replacement for GTX570" and GTX680 for $649, then we might be entering a period of much higher prices...

 

[skipsneeky2]

I still think if you are going to buy a GTX570 for $280-300 at this point, you should strongly consider an EVGA version. It seems a little bit wasteful to drop that much $ on a generation which is more or less 2-years-old. You really should have purchased a GTX570 1 year ago when it came out since its prices have barely dropped. Obviously, it's difficult to always predict pricing trends, etc. Also, no one really expected 28nm GPUs to be 'so slow' at stock speeds. It's really sad that 15 months later GTX570 and GTX580 have barely dropped $50. The same has to be said for HD6950 and HD6970.

I think we'll have much faster performance soon at $300-350. Basically what I am saying is prices now are artificially high due to lack of competition. How can 12 months pass and HD6950 2GB still costs the same or more than it did in February of 2011? 15 months later and GTX570 still sells for barely less than MSRP. So if you are going to dump $300 into a last generation card, especially with only 1280mb of RAM, I presume you have been saving for a while since you didn't buy HD6950 / 6970 or GTX570 for $250-300 for 12 months...As such having a 3 months "insurance" to step-up to what surely has to be to be a much faster $300-350 card from NVidia seems like a good bet this time.

I might be in the minority on our boards, but in my view the current pricing structure makes no sense in terms of historical market forces. It's like a stock that's been overhyped. Long-term fundamentals will ensure that the stock price returns to its fair value once investors reevaluate all pertinent information, including expected growth and how the company is doing vs. the competition. Right now, if you look at the current market pricing structure of GPUs, performance has not or barely increased at $150, $200, $250, $300, $350 or $450 price levels. That's not fundamentally sound and which is why I believe the market will eventually return to fundamentals: either prices have to fall in-line with the historical GPU technology curve of "more performance for a similar price," or increased competitiveness in the marketplace will ensure that prices fall for a similar level of performance.

Right now, the market is stagnant. HD7900 series selling out likely signals shortage of 28nm parts. Lack of mid-range 28nm offerings isn't going to start a fire-sale on old 40nm parts. In summary, if you want an NV card for some reason, get the EVGA step-up "insurance." Otherwise, I think HD7870 might be the card you want, especially if it overclocks 40% like Tahiti.

Always have bought Evga,hell i had a gtx570 and it was very good but i went for a cheaper gpu being my current gtx560 anticipating the 7950 would be at least $350 then i would jump onboard that as a gtx580 alternative and sell my current gpu but prices are higher then i expected for the 7950.

I do feel the gtx570 is priced currently ok as its the only gpu with its performance in that segment besides the 6970 but the 7870 could change that but till i see reviews and see them retailing on newegg,the gtx570 is still ok but the gtx580 is insane right now and needs a price drop immediately to at least $400.

Only radeon card i would be interested in purchasing would be the 7970 simply for enabling 2x msaa at 1080p in BF3 which is stunning at times and the gtx570 already is a proven boss when msaa isn't enabled and from reviews it looks to offer what i need but if a review for the 7870 comes out in a few days i might sit back and wait which isn't something i usually do for a amd product after bulldozer showed its ugly head after how many delays and rumors?

 

[Crap Daddy]

The 7870 will be in the 6950 range so you can forget it. Your only bet is to fork out 550$ for a 7970 or wait for Nvidia's performance card GK104 which is rumored to be between the 7950 and the 7970 for a better price (up to 400$?)

 

[Termie]

Unfortunately, I'm with Russian on this. We are at the worst time I can remember in terms of what your video card money buys. I think the 7870 will offer less performance per dollar than the 6970, at least compared to the lowest price the 6970 has been. Prices have gone up in preparation for video card reviewers to somehow blindly say you're getting so much value with the new cards.

Skip - seriously, keep your card. You are going to feel very bad about spending $150 net for the performance boost you're going to get.

 

[formulav8]

I personally would NOT even consider MSAA in my purchase. Its a big fat goose IMO. I see very little benefits for what it offers. Way to much of a performance downer on any video card for what it offers. So, IMO, look for the best bang for the buck without giving to much consideration to overhyped msaa.

 

[skipsneeky2]

Unfortunately, I'm with Russian on this. We are at the worst time I can remember in terms of what your video card money buys. I think the 7870 will offer less performance per dollar than the 6970, at least compared to the lowest price the 6970 has been. Prices have gone up in preparation for video card reviewers to somehow blindly say you're getting so much value with the new cards.

Skip - seriously, keep your card. You are going to feel very bad about spending $150 net for the performance boost you're going to get.

Yeah i was looking up more info on the 7870,at $300 it doesn't look like something worthy of waiting for and spec wise if anything it will be slightly faster then a gtx570 if not on par out the gate.

My gf is purchasing this gpu for me as a early birthday gift this week,looking over everything i will see if she will cave in to a 7950 as i did originally intend to use this gtx560 as a hold me over then sell it when the 7950 came out.