GTX 295

[Mr. Lennon]

We'll the buy.com GTX 280 deal bombed, but I still want to get rid of this 4870 1gb. I was looking at the 285's when I started thinking...fuck it, I want the best.

When I bought the X850XT PE it was $500 and that damn thing lasted me for 3 years. I'm tired of buying middle of the line shit and having to upgrade all the time.

So here are my questions to you guys:

Has micro stuttering been eliminated?

Are there still a lot of problems with mulit gpu's in general?

Am I stupid for spending $500 on a card right now?

 

[SlowSpyder]

Why not crossfire another 4870 since you already have one?

 

[Mr. Lennon]

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
Why not crossfire another 4870 since you already have one?

I want to go back to the green side for various reasons.

The second PCIE slot doesn't work on my xfire mobo : /

 

[SSChevy2001]

Here's the info your looking for. Micro stuttering is still there.
http://translate.google.com/tr...&tl=en&history_state0=

 

[palladium]

It might be worth it if you have a 30" monitor to game on ( you'll need multi GPU setups to play at 25x16 with all maxes out).

 

[Hauk]

Microstutter is blown out of proportion, usually from fanboys on the other side trying to find fault. And that applies to both sides. I'd be more concerned about future driver support.

Adding another 4870 1GB would make the most sense. What's happening with the 2nd PCI-E slot?

 

[djnsmith7]

Will your power supply handle a 295? You need a 700+ for that card. If a 295 is what you want, I say go with it. Sure, adding another 4870 would also be a good way to go...If it's an Asus board, it might make sense to RMA it, in case you run into other problems in the future. I've had pretty good luck with them & RMA's. I wouldn't want to ignore the problem, I'd want to get it fixed.

I don't think you're stupid at all for wanting to upgrade your video card setup. It's your money, you earned it & you can spend it however you like. Don't worry about what non-family members think about how you spend your money.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282
We'll the buy.com GTX 280 deal bombed, but I still want to get rid of this 4870 1gb. I was looking at the 285's when I started thinking...fuck it, I want the best.

When I bought the X850XT PE it was $500 and that damn thing lasted me for 3 years. I'm tired of buying middle of the line shit and having to upgrade all the time.

So here are my questions to you guys:

Has micro stuttering been eliminated?

Are there still a lot of problems with mulit gpu's in general?

Am I stupid for spending $500 on a card right now?

depends

have you had a multi-GPU setup before?
.. MS is still evident in all multi-GPU systems but it can be minimized and does not bother most users [evidently]

what is the rest of your rig like?
- and your LCD resolution .. what games do you play?

do you expect it to last 3 years?

 

[OCGuy]

Do it.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

To answer some of the questions in this thread....

I'm using this for a PSU

I'm running at 1920 res

I have a abit ix38 quadgt. The PCIE slot will work, but it crashes, and most of the time won't display video on start up. I heard the company was shutting down, so receiving a RMA in a timely fashion would probably not happen. So I'm sticking with single slot solutions.

Rest of the rig:

Q6600 @ 3.0ghz

4gb of 8500 OCZ reaper

Also, I have had experience with SLI awhile back. I had two 6800GTs SLI'd at one point. Ended up selling them for the X850XT PE because I couldn't justify the price lol. I don't remember experiencing the micro stuttering, but boy were there a lot of bugs.

 

[MyLeftNut]

An Abit IX48? Didn't even know they released that in time before they started to shut down. I thought the IX38 was their last.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

Originally posted by: MyLeftNut
An Abit IX48? Didn't even know they released that in time before they started to shut down. I thought the IX38 was their last.

Woops, put a 4 instead of 3.

 

[MegaWorks]

4870X2 is a better barging than the GTX295, cmon $399 for this card!

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: MegaWorks
4870X2 is a better barging than the GTX295, cmon $399 for this card!

It's "a better bargain" because:

1. Driver limitations make it less user friendly:
AnandTech warns us about ATi drivers for about the 4th time

In spite of the potential advantages offered by the Radeon 4870 X2, we have qualms about recommending it based on our experiences since October with the introduction of Core i7 and X58 and the multitude of software titles that were released. Driver support just isn't what it needs to be to really get behind an AMD single card dual-GPU solution right now.

2. The 4870X2 doesn't offer the performance of the GTX295:
Comparing NVIDIA to AMD, it's clear that NVIDIA has recaptured the halo product at least in the majority of tests we ran in this snapshot of performance.

3. The 4870X2 has no good stereo 3d options.

4. The 4870X2 offers no hardware accelerated physics.

5. ATi's Open CL solution has been pretty much going nowhere from what I can tell, but CUDA has gained a lot of momentum. For most of us, that means the opportunity for much faster transcoding of video.

The AMD part is priced where it might sell. it's the high end solution for people willing to trade $100 for it's limitations.

 

[SlowSpyder]

The 4870x2 is certainly better bang for the buck as it is generally right there with the GTX295. But it said you'd like to go back to the green side (I assume you had problems with your 4870?). If that's the case then get the GTX295, I'm sure you'll like it. If you've been happy with your experience with the 4870 then I'd just get a 4870x2 since it's cheaper by a good amount and the two cards trade blows.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
The 4870x2 is certainly better bang for the buck as it is generally right there with the GTX295. But it said you'd like to go back to the green side (I assume you had problems with your 4870?). If that's the case then get the GTX295, I'm sure you'll like it. If you've been happy with your experience with the 4870 then I'd just get a 4870x2 since it's cheaper by a good amount and the two cards trade blows.

"Right there" at what?

Being not as fast or not having the features that can change the level of immersion in games?

 

[SlowSpyder]

It's "a better bargain" because:

1. Driver limitations make it less user friendly:
AnandTech warns us about ATi drivers for about the 4th time
In spite of the potential advantages offered by the Radeon 4870 X2, we have qualms about recommending it based on our experiences since October with the introduction of Core i7 and X58 and the multitude of software titles that were released. Driver support just isn't what it needs to be to really get behind an AMD single card dual-GPU solution right now.

The OP isn't using an x58... isn't that where the problems are that AT is talking about? It's not hard to find articles discussing driver problems with both companies if you search. AMD isn't the only current graphics maker that has any bugs in their drivers. Wasn't Nvidia actually named in a lawsuit over driver problems in Vista?

2. The 4870X2 doesn't offer the performance of the GTX295:
Comparing NVIDIA to AMD, it's clear that NVIDIA has recaptured the halo product at least in the majority of tests we ran in this snapshot of performance.

I'd say overall the GTX295 is a hair faster. But I don't think it's nearly $100 faster. And the benches I saw show the 4870x2 generally faster with AA, perticulary 8x. The GTX295 sure did clean up at 1280x1024 1xAA/1xAF though. But I would imagine it's a toss up at resolutions and setting people will actually use this level of card at. What you get left with is two cards that are very, very near each other in performance, but one costs $100 more.

3. The 4870X2 has no good stereo 3d options.

I'm not sure I'd call Nvidia's 3d 'good' either. Seeing as the OP would have to buy $200 glasses (I assume, he didn't mention he had these), ditch his 24" monitor for a 22" monitor (even if the gaming in 3d makes up for it, you're still stuck with a smaler, lower res monitor for everything else you do like internet, movies, etc. And if you go dual monitor with the 22" and 24" then while you'll have the 24" for everything else you don't get to sell it to off set the costs of the new 22"... trade offs I guess) and don't essentially you get half the frame rate using the 3d? Certainly it's not a bad option if that's something that really interests you, but I know for me I'm not even mildly interested until the cost of entry comes down.

4. The 4870X2 offers no hardware accelerated physics.

Nvidia offers no DX10.1 support. Both cards have some unique features. I think it's pretty one sided of you to point out just what Nvidia offers without pointing out any of the unique features that AMD provides.

5. ATi's Open CL solution has been pretty much going nowhere from what I can tell, but CUDA has gained a lot of momentum. For most of us, that means the opportunity for much faster transcoding of video.

I have no experience with this and am not too informed on it so I can't really comment.

The AMD part is priced where it might sell. it's the high end solution for people willing to trade $100 for it's limitations.

Yea, you get 95% of the performance overall for less then 80% of the price of the GTX295.

 

[MegaWorks]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: MegaWorks
4870X2 is a better barging than the GTX295, cmon $399 for this card!

It's "a better bargain" because:

1. Driver limitations make it less user friendly:
AnandTech warns us about ATi drivers for about the 4th time

In spite of the potential advantages offered by the Radeon 4870 X2, we have qualms about recommending it based on our experiences since October with the introduction of Core i7 and X58 and the multitude of software titles that were released. Driver support just isn't what it needs to be to really get behind an AMD single card dual-GPU solution right now.

By releasing the new 9.1 drivers with a lot of improvement on many titles, to me that's a good effort for a single card "duel-GPU" solution.

2. The 4870X2 doesn't offer the performance of the GTX295:
Comparing NVIDIA to AMD, it's clear that NVIDIA has recaptured the halo product at least in the majority of tests we ran in this snapshot of performance.

ComputerBase review clearly shows that the 4870X2 is quite competitive with the new 9.1x drivers. For a $100 less, I'm sorry but it's a better deal.

3. The 4870X2 has no good stereo 3d options.

stereo 3d is not free nRollo, isn't an extra $200!

4. The 4870X2 offers no hardware accelerated physics.

Not enough games to justify the extra $100 for physX.

5. ATi's Open CL solution has been pretty much going nowhere from what I can tell, but CUDA has gained a lot of momentum. For most of us, that means the opportunity for much faster transcoding of video.

The AMD part is priced where it might sell. it's the high end solution for people willing to trade $100 for it's limitations.

Yes I agree CUDA is better, only if you want to use this feature specifically. But I think the op wants to make his decision on gaming performance.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
The 4870x2 is certainly better bang for the buck as it is generally right there with the GTX295. But it said you'd like to go back to the green side (I assume you had problems with your 4870?). If that's the case then get the GTX295, I'm sure you'll like it. If you've been happy with your experience with the 4870 then I'd just get a 4870x2 since it's cheaper by a good amount and the two cards trade blows.

"Right there" at what?

Being not as fast or not having the features that can change the level of immersion in games?

"Right there" as in I'm willing to bet if you average out average FPS between the two they're very, very close to one another. "Right there" with one another. I'm sorry for you that the GTX295 wasn't the Nvidia homerun that the fanboys and focusgroup members wanted it to be. It's a great option, but it's just not head and shoulders above the 4870x2.

What are these features that 'change the level of immersion in games'? Physx? Yea, you get that for free with Nvidia cards. Sweet, more particles! Sweet, blowing banners! Physx has all the potential in the world, no doubt. But what I've seen of it so far is not what I'd call something that 'change the level of immersion in games.' 3D? Yea, the option is there. But assuming someone isn't going to drop the money on the glasses and a new monitor then that means nothing to them.

 

[SlowSpyder]

4870x2 for $369.99 (free shipping) after rebate.

Good deal for sure. The cheapest GTX295 is $469.99 after rebate. It is my opinion that the GTX295 is not worth that much more then the 4870x2.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder

"Right there" as in I'm willing to bet if you average out average FPS between the two they're very, very close to one another. "Right there" with one another. I'm sorry for you that the GTX295 wasn't the Nvidia homerun that the fanboys and focusgroup members wanted it to be. It's a great option, but it's just not head and shoulders above the 4870x2.

It only has to be in first place to get the halo effect

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
What are these features that 'change the level of immersion in games'? Physx? Yea, you get that for free with Nvidia cards. Sweet, more particles! Sweet, blowing banners! Physx has all the potential in the world, no doubt. But what I've seen of it so far is not what I'd call something that 'change the level of immersion in games.' 3D? Yea, the option is there. But assuming someone isn't going to drop the money on the glasses and a new monitor then that means nothing to them.

The point is the option isn't there on the 4870X2- just the same gaming we've always had.

PhysX is a lot more than particles and banners. It's more realsistic, less static environments. I suppose some are still impressed with the games of yesteryear where everything is an impervious 2d picture of the gaming world.

Some of us want interactive environments with 3 dimensions.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
4870x2 for $369.99 (free shipping) after rebate.

Good deal for sure. The cheapest GTX295 is $469.99 after rebate. It is my opinion that the GTX295 is not worth that much more then the 4870x2.

+1

The GTX 295 is the faster part but as others have mentioned it's not really that much faster. If the difference were $20-30 it would make the decision a lot harder but at $100 it's not much of a contest IMO.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Elfear

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
4870x2 for $369.99 (free shipping) after rebate.

Good deal for sure. The cheapest GTX295 is $469.99 after rebate. It is my opinion that the GTX295 is not worth that much more then the 4870x2.

+1

The GTX 295 is the faster part but as others have mentioned it's not really that much faster. If the difference were $20-30 it would make the decision a lot harder but at $100 it's not much of a contest IMO.

Of course you're an X2 user who has likely never played with PhysX or 3D vision, so do you really want to lock people out of that given a. many physx games will launch this year, and a lot of the big devs have signed up to use it b. the difference in 3d immersion with 3D Vision is HUGE?

Not to mention, all of AnandTechs complaints with the X2 drivers are with X58:

Though we tend to see problems a lot more frequently than end users, we do see a lot more issues with AMD drivers than NVIDIA.

There are two old sayings that come to mind:

"You get what you pay for."

"There's no such thing as a free lunch."

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder

"Right there" as in I'm willing to bet if you average out average FPS between the two they're very, very close to one another. "Right there" with one another. I'm sorry for you that the GTX295 wasn't the Nvidia homerun that the fanboys and focusgroup members wanted it to be. It's a great option, but it's just not head and shoulders above the 4870x2.

It only has to be in forst place to get the halo effect

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
What are these features that 'change the level of immersion in games'? Physx? Yea, you get that for free with Nvidia cards. Sweet, more particles! Sweet, blowing banners! Physx has all the potential in the world, no doubt. But what I've seen of it so far is not what I'd call something that 'change the level of immersion in games.' 3D? Yea, the option is there. But assuming someone isn't going to drop the money on the glasses and a new monitor then that means nothing to them.

The point is the option isn't there on the 4870X2- just the same gaming we've always had.

PhysX is a lot more than particles and banners. It's more realsistic, less static environments. I suppose some are still impressed with the games of yesteryear where everything is an impervious 2d picture of the gaming world.

Some of us want interactive environments with 3 dimensions.

3D is not a deal breaker for most of us yet
- not everyone is impressed with dropping to 16x10 resolution, limiting options and wasting $600 for a novelty that is in its infancy

--PhysX, i guess if you like to watch glass shatter more realistically as you computer comes to a crawl, you might feel you need it now

And you have never played with an X2; it has DX10.1 also .. in Clear Sky you have a grayed-out box for GTX option


... and you are also clearly wrong about some of us getting a "free lunch"
- do want an example of someone who does?

Yes, you DO get what you pay for; X2 is an awesome card for $370; the GTX is also an excellent choice - for ~$100 more

 

[SlowSpyder]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Elfear

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
4870x2 for $369.99 (free shipping) after rebate.

Good deal for sure. The cheapest GTX295 is $469.99 after rebate. It is my opinion that the GTX295 is not worth that much more then the 4870x2.

+1

The GTX 295 is the faster part but as others have mentioned it's not really that much faster. If the difference were $20-30 it would make the decision a lot harder but at $100 it's not much of a contest IMO.

Of course you're an X2 user who has likely never played with PhysX or 3D vision, so do you really want to lock people out of that given a. many physx games will launch this year, and a lot of the big devs have signed up to use it b. the difference in 3d immersion with 3D Vision is HUGE?

Not to mention, all of AnandTechs complaints with the X2 drivers are with X58:

Though we tend to see problems a lot more frequently than end users, we do see a lot more issues with AMD drivers than NVIDIA.

There are two old sayings that come to mind:

"You get what you pay for."

"There's no such thing as a free lunch."

The OP is using an x38. Here is the bottom line. Both cards have some unique features. Every potential buyer of one of these cards will have to decide for themselves if those unique features are worth consideration and take their pros and cons into consideration. 3D sounds pretty cool. It's also not cheap, and has some down falls as far as monitor choice. The GTX295 is sometimes faster then the 4870x2, sometimes slower. I'll be willing to bet more often then not it's going to be a little faster, though not always. But it's always more expensive too... by $100 right now. It's up to any potential buyer of these cards to decide what that $100 gets you, if it's worth it or not. I'm not in the market for either of these cards. But if I was, I'd get the 4870x2 no questions ask and pocket that $100 or put it to use for games or other hardware.