GTX 1080 custom (non-Founders Edition) cards

[RussianSensation]

So with a custom card they were able to achieve 2012MHz max?

Even FE cards have hit 2.1GHz. I wonder if it's going to be an ASIC/chip lottery game with these aftermarket cards to hit higher clocks?

The max was 2063mhz in one review and 2088mhz in another for the Strix OC. Since its retail MSRP is $639, runs cooler and quieter than the FE and has dual HDMI 2.0b for Oculus, it's still a far superior card than the FE. Voltage is locked at 1.25V on the Strix.

One way to look at it is HD7950/7970 and Maxwell cards were too conservatively clocked. Since not everyone overclocks, NV pushing clocks close to the max leaves just 11-14% overclocking headroom.

Sure, a $530 980Ti OC beats a $380-400 1070 OC by 10%, it will use 350W of power vs. likely 185-190W. 980Ti is still a bad value because even for $400 used, most of them don't have transferable warranty. I would personally take a card 10% slower for $400 brand new because if the used 980Ti dies, that's $400 into the toilet. Knowing what kind of customers buy AIB 980Ti, no way that card was babied either. It was probably max overclocked and overvolted from Day 1. Not saying this means a used 980Ti is going to fail but the chance is likely higher than a new $400 1070.

Let's also remember when 980 launched, we saw benchmarks of 780Ti Classified @ 1200-1250mhz beat or tie 980 @ 1500mhz. Then over the generation, 780Ti started losing to the 970. Will that happen with 980Ti vs. 1070? We don't know but if both cost $400, and one is new and used half the power, why would I even take those chances?! The 1070 also has the option to use HB SLI bridges for smoother SLI, has more free VRAM, 4K/8K video acceleration, FastSync, way better VR support, way better support for multi-monitors if developers utilize SMP, and guaranteed driver focus form NV.

What makes 980Ti less favorable isn't the 1080 but an immenent launch of $380-420 1070 cards.

980Ti looks even worse for someone who wants to go 4K. The HB SLI bridges could ensure that 1070 SLI is smoother in frame times at 4K even with 10% slower raw FPS. 980Ti @ 1525mhz would use 350W and add another 350W 980Ti. Together 1070 SLI OC would use barely more power than a single 980Ti. This makes 1070 SLI more accessible for people with 550-650W PSUs.

Either way, I think some NV users live in reality distortion field. There is a reason used after-market 290/290X cards sell for way less than a new 390/390X -- the latter cards have warranty.

What happens if even a single AIB adds GDDR5X to a 1070? What happens if even a single AIB 1070 can hit 2.1-2.2Ghz reliably?

Another major point to consider is that there won't even be a large enough market for used 980Ti cards to satisfy all the PC gamers looking to build a new PC/upgrade theirs. Sooner or later $20-30 rebates and AAA game bundles will mean $350 1070 cards. I mean many people on this forum warned 980Ti owners to sell their cards in late April/early May while there was still time. These cards are only going to drop more in value because for most people even at $380 a used 980Ti is a worse guy than an AIB 1070.

As far as $599-699 1080 goes, it's the worst value out of both of these cards. It's impossible to ignore that for $760, 1070 SLI should burry a $600-700 1080 at 4K. 1070 SLI will provide Big Pascal performance NOW for not much more $ than a 1080.

 

[tential]

Ya people are looking at benches now thinking "ya my 980ti will hold up!" so did 780ti owners...

 

[l2ez4m]

So basically anyone buying those big whales (780ti/980ti/most certainly 1080ti) coming on the second bifurcated release wave are dumping half of their hard earned money ~ $300 less than a year in owning it. As it was the case with 780ti beaten by 970, now 980ti - 1070.
That is Matrix level of reality distortion on Nvidia side and unparalleled level of asset depreciation clientside.

 

[sam_816]

So basically anyone buying those big whales (780ti/980ti/most certainly 1080ti) coming on the second bifurcated release wave are dumping half of their hard earned money ~ $300 less than a year in owning it. As it was the case with 780ti beaten by 970, now 980ti - 1070.
That is Matrix level of reality distortion on Nvidia side and unparalleled level of asset depreciation clientside.

Pretty much it..

NVIDIA has ppl dancing to their tunes. This year FE stunt raised concerns n voices but next time lesser ppl will speak up& then it will be a trend.

PC master race is basically slaves with more disposable income.(not to offend anyone but just how I see it). Everyone knows that ti version is inevitable but nobody stands up n says 'Screw u nvidia we want x80ti enough with these stop gap price grabs'

Microsoft tried to push ppl with original Xbox one 'features' & ppl threw them from the top position but nothing like that with PC gamers. X70/x80 will sell like hot cakes and by dec-Jan ppl will be ready to ditch'em and spend on new vega/x80ti.

 

[Dice144]

The way I look at it is... I invest over 30% of my take home pay. A 300~600 video card is still much cheaper than most of my friends toys.

 

[sam_816]

The way I look at it is... I invest over 30% of my take home pay. A 300~600 video card is still much cheaper than most of my friends toys.

My honest opinion (&request) to ppl is that if u have extra disposable income buy other tech n toys. Let multiple companies grow and help the economy. But stop the buck when these companies start manipulation of the consumer.

Don't promote such practices which will eventually hurt the industry.

 

[railven]

My honest opinion (&request) to ppl is that if u have extra disposable income buy other tech n toys. Let multiple companies grow and help the economy. But stop the buck when these companies start manipulation of the consumer.

Don't promote such practices which will eventually hurt the industry.

Odd suggestion.

Well then, what would you suggest someone to buy?

EDIT:

Pretty much this:

The way I look at it is... I invest over 30% of my take home pay. A 300~600 video card is still much cheaper than most of my friends toys.

I got a friend who blows lavishly on clothing. Drops almost $100 on colognes every other month. Yeah, some how I don't think he's ruining the fashion industry. Haha. (GF just dropped $90 on perfumes, you wanna talk about crimes, go bark at them!)

 

[sam_816]

Odd suggestion.

Well then, what would you suggest someone to buy?

EDIT:

Pretty much this:



I got a friend who blows lavishly on clothing. Drops almost $100 on colognes every other month. Yeah, some how I don't think he's ruining the fashion industry. Haha. (GF just dropped $90 on perfumes, you wanna talk about crimes, go bark at them!)

BARK? I mentioned 'request'& u don't have common courtesy/manners about how to reply to someone? I will BARK at them if they're buying from same brand, same aroma/style of tshirt/color of dress and everytime the newer version is slightly different but cost similar to last one.

But don't stress ur brain too much over this. I am not addressing the likes of you.

To everyone else who value their hard earned money, who don't look for excuses to dispose off disposable cash on toys, ppl from countries where taxes are already breaking the wallets, please think about it.

Wouldn't u like to have a x80ti instead of x80?(may be in a couple of months down the line)

Do u guys never wonder that NVIDIA is taking advantage of ppl by releasing 25-30% better cards & creating a panic situation where ppl sell their last Gen cards before their values tank?

Do you guys think really thnk this x80-titan-x80ti is doing good for the industry as a whole?

 

[exar333]

4K
DAI = 35 FPS
The Division = 41 FPS
Far Cry Primal = 42 FPS
Assassin's Creed Syndicate = 42 FPS
The Witcher 3 = 49 FPS (no HairWorks)
Metro Last Light = 46 FPS
Rise of the Tomb Raider = 46 FPS
Shadow of Mordor = 61 FPS
Fallout 4 = 37 FPS
Hitman = 42 FPS
GTA V = 40 FPS
http://m.sweclockers.com/test/22153-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1070/5

Even with 0 GameWorks features and 0xAA, 1080 OC cannot hit 60 FPS in modern AAA games at 4K.
https://youtu.be/XdN9DxR-JVQ

25% extra over 980Ti OC/1070 OC is a drop in the bucket for 4K gaming when what's needed is 50-80% more performance. That's why for 4K gaming 1070 SLI is still better. A single 1080 is a pointless videocard. Overkill for 1080p 60Hz, pointless for 1440p 60Hz, not fast enough for 1440p 144-165Hz or 4K 60 FPS average. The exact definition of a No Mans Land videocard -- exactly what I said when the Original Titan came out (too fast for low end resolutions, not fast enough for next gen games or 4K). Since 1070 also costs much less, it'll be far easier to sell as there will be a bigger market for it. Once 2017 cards hit the scene, 1080's resale value will drop big. Just like today there is hardly anything better than a $200 970, making it an easy sell, but try selling a used 980/980Ti for close to their MSRP around launch?

1080 is a repeat of 980--only purpose are paper benchmarks to say it's the fastest. In practical terms, it's not going to provide a much better gaming experience where it counts. It's exactly why many 980Ti users were disappointed by it. It's another waste of $ videocard against 1070/980Ti and 1070 SLI.

I guess I see it a little differently. For those 'in between' resolutions like 3440x1440 or VR (which are both maybe 20-25% more demanding vs. 1440P) you can get ~1070 performance at 1440P on a 21:9 ultrawide or VR display. If you already plunked down for those, an extra $200 is worth it to keep relative performance with the extra pixels.

For 4K, I would agree that SLI is required for hitting max framerates, but the 980ti was 'doable' if you turned down some eye candy. I think this gets us even closer...

SLI/CF just isn't for me, so the extra 20% is meaningful. Agree on the resell prices, but that's not a huge issue. Will plan to re-sell a month or two ahead of the 1080Ti release and swap up.

 

[imaheadcase]

If you are complaining about price or power draw being a issue, you are not the target audience. Seems people forget that people buy these cards don't care if its %10 gain or draw %20 more power, they want the pure performance over other cards. Simple as that really.

I don't care about the money or power draw for example. If %10 more performance is a extra $200 i'm fine with that.

 

[RussianSensation]

If you are complaining about price or power draw being a issue, you are not the target audience. Seems people forget that people buy these cards don't care if its %10 gain or draw %20 more power, they want the pure performance over other cards. Simple as that really.

I don't care about the money or power draw for example. If %10 more performance is a extra $200 i'm fine with that.

So why are you upgrading from a 780Ti then? If you didn't care about $, you'd do 780Ti -> 980 -> 980Ti/Titan X -> 1080.

Your response is flawed since everyone is affected. Even the gamers who buy $100-200 GPUs are now getting crap that in the past used to cost $50-100. Because $249 560Ti is now a $599-699 1080, that automatically means every single card that used to be below GTX560Ti level card is also going up in price. That means 1050/1050Ti/1060/1060Ti are all going up in price 50-100% vs. historical prices. NV is just cleverly hiding these facts by renaming cards using marketing names (aka 660Ti is now a 1070, 680 is now a 1080 but 680 itself was really just a true 660Ti in the first place. Clever).

Do u guys never wonder that NVIDIA is taking advantage of ppl by releasing 25-30% better cards & creating a panic situation where ppl sell their last Gen cards before their values tank?

Do you guys think really thnk this x80-titan-x80ti is doing good for the industry as a whole?

Of course they are. You think they split a generation into 2 parts because they are bored? They know exactly what they are doing. What's happening right now is a nice parallel to the high-end audiophile market. Guess who else decided to join on the fun? It's simple economics at play. Once NV pulled off the Kepler generation, it's not realistic anything will change. That's because high-end gamers now have no choices period.

Option 1: Buy in on the 1st half of a new generation (that means "flagship" next mid-range cards). Get thrown under the bus a year after when real flagships come out.

Option 2: Buy in on the 2nd half of a new generation (that means true flagship priced at flagship prices -- but these prices keep going up too!). Get thrown under the bus a year after when the next gen mid-range card comes out offering similar performance for nearly half the price.

Between these 2 options, because we know the generations are split into 2 or even 3 parts (get ready for a possible repeat of 680->780->780Ti as we might not even get the true fully unlocked 1080Ti right off the bat), it's now impossible to maintain the resale value of your card forcing you to upgrade far more often than ever.

The only way this will stop is once current gen consoles hold back PC development so much that even a $249 card will run every 2018-2021 AAA game at 1080p 120-140 FPS and 1440p at 60 FPS. But then PS5/XB2 will come out and the cycle will start again.

My personal way out of this nonsense has been mining. Haven't paid for a single GPU upgrade since 2008 but even I know this perk will run out sooner or later. That's why I am going to try to max out this free bonus feature over the next 1-2 years. Will probably buy 7-12 more mining cards over June-July. Should be enough to get me through to 2020 without paying for GPUs.

 

[jabroni619]

So why are you upgrading from a 780Ti then? If you didn't care about $, you'd do 780Ti -> 980 -> 980Ti/Titan X -> 1080.

Your response is flawed since everyone is affected. Even the gamers who buy $100-200 GPUs are now getting crap that in the past used to cost $50-100. Because $249 560Ti is now a $599-699 1080.

I haven't found any benchmarks or reviews of a 560Ti being the fastest GPU you can buy at any point during it's life. Can you post some links?

 

[MagickMan]

Ya people are looking at benches now thinking "ya my 980ti will hold up!" so did 780ti owners...

The 780Ti did hold up, until the 980Ti came out. The 980Ti will "hold up" until the 1080Ti comes out. See how that works?

 

[Raising]

The only thing leaning me towards getting two 1070s from two 980tis is the power consumption, this summer gonna be hot.

Getting 460€ offers for each 980ti.. not sure if deal or not.

 

[RussianSensation]

I haven't found any benchmarks or reviews of a 560Ti being the fastest GPU you can buy at any point during it's life. Can you post some links?

Nice attempt at obfuscating my comment. 560/560Ti is like releasing 1060/1060Ti first and holding back GTX570/580 for another year (whether intentionally or to maximize profits is irrelevant). You keep not understanding GPU history even though you already said you gamed since the original Doom. Everything is crystal clear when one analyzes pre-Kepler generations and Kepler and thereafter and also compares NV's gross margins. What NV has effectively done is split the generation into 2 distinct halves with 2 flagships. They only other time in recent memory prior to Kepler where they had to do this was 7800GTX 256MB --> 7900GTX and so did ATI because both firms ran into serious node issues (X1850XT --> X1900/1950XTX).

If you don't get this still, a generation lasts ~ 2 years. It makes no difference if BMW launches 5 series then 7 series or first 7 series, then 5 series. Next generation 5 series will smoke last generation 7 series In all key areas but it's not magically called 7 series.

All NV has done is release x04 series (that's 5 series BMW first) and called it 7 series (x80) purely based on marketing.

If you STILL don't get this, at no point in the history of NV, did a next generation flagship EVER only my beat the last generation's flagship by 25-30%. Hence the only generations that fail this test are Kepler (680 vs. 580), Maxwell (980 vs. 780Ti), and Pascal (1080 vs. 980Ti/Titan X). These 3 latest generations are the new marketing norm.

If you STILL don't get this, then for every previous generations, the next generation's mid-range card has ALWAYS outperformed last generation's flagship:

Flagship <--> Next gen mid-range

GeForce 2 Ultra < GeForce 3 Ti 200
GeForce 3 Ti 500 < GeForce 4 Ti 4200
GeForce 4600/4800 < GeForce 5600/5700U
GeForce 5800U/5950U < 6600GT
GeForce 6800U/Ultra Extreme < 7900/7950GT
GeForce 7800/7900GTX < 8800GT/S
GeForce 8800GTX/Ultra < GTS250/GTX260
GeForce 9 was a fake GeForce 8 generation
GeForce GTX 285 < GTX 460 1GB/GTX560/560Ti

This is where it gets tricky.

GeForce 4 and 5 are the same generation, but instead of calling 570/580 GTX475/485, NV faked it and made a new generation out of then air.

GTX580 < 670/680 (upper mid-range Kepler)
GTX780Ti / OG Titan < 970/980 (upper mid-range Maxwell)
GTX980Ti/Titan X < 1070/1080 (upper mid-range Pascal)

$249 GTX560Ti -> $499 GTX680 -> $549 GTX 980 -> $599/699 GTX1080. NV's gross margins went form sub-30% to almost 60%.

Any questions?

 

[RussianSensation]

The only thing leaning me towards getting two 1070s from two 980tis is the power consumption, this summer gonna be hot.

Getting 460€ offers for each 980ti.. not sure if deal or not.

How much is a semi-decent 1080 over there? Say EVGA ACX 3.0 SC?

 

[Raising]

How much is a semi-decent 1080 over there? Say EVGA ACX 3.0 SC?

So far the 1080FE is 800&#8364;..

 

[jabroni619]

Nice attempt at obfuscating my comment. 560/560Ti is like releasing 1060/1060Ti first and holding back GTX570/580 for another year (whether intentionally or to maximize profits is irrelevant).

Any questions?

Yes, the same question I had for you before. Please link me a review showing the 560Ti being the fastest card you can buy.

Your reasoning makes no sense. 570/580 were released in 2010. AMD's Radeon HD5870 was released in 2009. If nVidia had released the 560Ti then waited a year to release the 570/580 it STILL would never have been the fastest card you can buy. It in fact, would not have been anywhere remotely close. The 1080 IS the fastest card you can by, and by quite a margin.

You keep talking to me like you have it all figured but come out on the losing end of the discussion. Sounds like PCSS (Post Count Seniority Syndrome)

 

[stockwiz]

nobody has to game at 4K resolution and upgrade their cards every generation. I game at 1080P and plan to skip this generation and perhaps the next. There's the law of diminishing returns when it comes to resolution gains versus viewing distance. Besides I'd rather game on my 60 inch LCD with full home theater floorstanding speakers than in front of a computer monitor with small crappy speakers.

Nvidia charges what they do because PC enthusiasts keep paying... if people stopped paying they would charge less. They will charge what they can get away with charging.

 

[tential]

nobody has to game at 4K resolution and upgrade their cards every generation. I game at 1080P and plan to skip this generation and perhaps the next. There's the law of diminishing returns when it comes to resolution gains versus viewing distance. Besides I'd rather game on my 60 inch LCD with full home theater floorstanding speakers than in front of a computer monitor with small crappy speakers.

Nvidia charges what they do because PC enthusiasts keep paying... if people stopped paying they would charge less. They will charge what they can get away with charging.

So would I on my 80 inch projector screen. But I'd never do it at 1080p resolution. I use downsampling to make the image actually pleasurable to view. 1080p was good enough for me until VSR was introduced. Once I saw VSR on my screen, I never went back.

4K is 100% worth it on larger screens. It's actually necessary if you are using a home theater setup and sitting at the correct seating distance....

 

[railven]

BARK? I mentioned 'request'& u don't have common courtesy/manners about how to reply to someone? I will BARK at them if they're buying from same brand, same aroma/style of tshirt/color of dress and everytime the newer version is slightly different but cost similar to last one.

The idiom is bark up the wrong tree, which I'm sure you are aware of. You are asking the wrong group of people to NOT buy expensive toys. Forums such as these tend to have a mix user base. The ones in this buying bracket will not listen to someone asking them not to buy something. The ones asking someone not to buy something are most likely not in that buying group (note: I don't know you, nor do I care to, but this is just a generalization. If you are of that buying group, you probably already know the mentality of that buyer to begin with.)

But don't stress ur brain too much over this. I am not addressing the likes of you.

Then who are you addressing? If not the buyers of this price bracket/tier?

To everyone else who value their hard earned money, who don't look for excuses to dispose off disposable cash on toys, ppl from countries where taxes are already breaking the wallets, please think about it.

This just gets more amusing. Now because people buy in this bracket, they don't appreciate their hard earned money? Next you'll tell us not to buy certain processors because the performance gain is too little by your metric thus not worth it.

Wouldn't u like to have a x80ti instead of x80?(may be in a couple of months down the line)

Do u guys never wonder that NVIDIA is taking advantage of ppl by releasing 25-30% better cards & creating a panic situation where ppl sell their last Gen cards before their values tank?

Do you guys think really thnk this x80-titan-x80ti is doing good for the industry as a whole?

Nvidia is a company, no one's personal friend. As long as they offer something we can afford, chances are we'll buy it. For those whom can't or choose not to, there are other performance levels at other prices also AMD as an alternative. They can sure use the support right about now.




Someone else said something along the lines of "how rich people spend their money makes no sense to me." I replied, "it's not suppose to." "rich" being subjective, and "value" being subjective it changes from miser to YOLO. If this forum is going to turn into a lecture hall on what not to buy because x-people can't afford it in y-country, this place is going down the hole.

 

[showb1z]

If we can't take pricing into account what the hell are we even discussing around here?
Some people on this forum would still run out the door to buy 2 1080's at $1000. Great for them, doesn't mean it's not a worse product at that price.

 

[railven]

If we can't take pricing into account what the hell are we even discussing around here?
Some people on this forum would still run out the door to buy 2 1080's at $1000. Great for them, doesn't mean it's not a worse product at that price.

Talk about price all you want. There is nothing wrong with that. But people got to stop acting like those who buy these products are doing something wrong.

The insults thrown around are getting out of hand (and no I'm not saying sam insulted anyone, his plea was rather civil). I personally don't post in an enthusiast forum to get called out because I have plenty of cash to burn on my hobby.

 

[Timmah!]

Just checked the probably biggest hardware e-shop in my and neighbouring country, the one i usually buy this kind of stuff from, whether they added any custom 1080s...it was just FEs until now...obviously everything in state "receiving preorders" for now...

anyway, as expected, bar one card (MSI Armor, still 770 EUROs compared to 789 for FE), all of them are pretty much above 800 EUROs (ranging from 804 for Gainward Phoenix to 848 for Seahawk... i wonder if these prices drop once they become on stock, but i am not holding my breath. Nvidia really helped here with its FE price...

 

[Headfoot]

Yes, the same question I had for you before. Please link me a review showing the 560Ti being the fastest card you can buy.

Your reasoning makes no sense. 570/580 were released in 2010. AMD's Radeon HD5870 was released in 2009. If nVidia had released the 560Ti then waited a year to release the 570/580 it STILL would never have been the fastest card you can buy. It in fact, would not have been anywhere remotely close. The 1080 IS the fastest card you can by, and by quite a margin.

You keep talking to me like you have it all figured but come out on the losing end of the discussion. Sounds like PCSS (Post Count Seniority Syndrome)

You're not getting it. The 560 Ti wasn't the fastest chip at launch. You asking for him to "prove it" only proves his point more. People didn't buy the 560 Ti thinking it was the fastest chip in the Fermi family BECAUSE IT WASN'T. People bought the 560 Ti because it was a great value. Likewise, the 1080 is not the fastest chip in the Pascal family. GP100 confirmed, 100% exists. There are rumors they are making a GP102 even, which should be even faster than GP100 for gaming purposes. But they bifurcated the launch for a variety of reasons, so the 1080 is faster than last gen on a significantly larger node. Of course the midrange card is faster than the last high end card on a major die shrink. That has been the case literally since the beginning of GPU ASIC design.

The difference this time is with the bifurcated launch, you pay $600 for the 560 Ti chip of the Pascal family and in return you get a new 16nm chip a year (or more) before they release the high end. Basically, they could have delayed the entire family in order to release high end chips economically at the same time as midrange chips, or they could release the midrange chips early as they will be economical for consumers before the high end. And then charge a premium (vs. if it was release contemporaneously with high end) since it is still technically faster than the last gen stuff.

It's fine if people want to spend their money on the midrange chip to get more performance earlier. I'm considering it myself. But like any other frugal consumer, I feel a lot worse about a purchase when I know I'm paying a premium that goes straight to profit that I never used to have to pay.