Government is still making payments to relatives of civil war vets

Theb

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
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and of course all wars since then.

The Iraq wars and Afghanistan

So far, the wars in Iraq, Afghanistan and the first Persian Gulf conflict in the early 1990s are costing about $12 billion a year to compensate those who have left military service or family members of those who have died.

Those post-service compensation costs have totaled more than $50 billion since 2003, not including expenses of medical care and other benefits provided to veterans, and are poised to grow for many years to come.

The new veterans are filing for disabilities at historic rates, with about 45 percent of those from Iraq and Afghanistan seeking compensation for injuries. Many are seeking compensation for a variety of ailments at once.

Experts see a variety of factors driving that surge, including a bad economy that's led more jobless veterans to seek the financial benefits they've earned, troops who survive wounds of war and more awareness about head trauma and mental health.

—Vietnam War

It's been 40 years since the U.S. ended its involvement in the Vietnam War, and yet payments for the conflict are still rising.

Now above $22 billion annually, Vietnam compensation costs are roughly twice the size of the FBI's annual budget. And while many disabled Vietnam vets have been compensated for post-traumatic stress disorder, hearing loss or general wounds, other ailments are positioning the war to have large costs even after veterans die.

Based on an uncertain link to the defoliant Agent Orange that was used in Vietnam, federal officials approved diabetes a decade ago as an ailment that qualifies for cash compensation — and it is now the most compensated ailment for Vietnam vets.

The VA also recently included heart disease among the Vietnam medical issues that qualify, and the agency is seeing thousands of new claims for that issue. Simpson said he has a lot of concerns about the government agreeing to automatically compensate for those diseases.

"That has been terribly abused," Simpson said.

Since heart disease is common among older Americans and is the nation's leading cause of death, the future deaths of thousands of Vietnam veterans could be linked to their service and their benefits passed along to survivors.

A congressional analysis estimated the cost of fighting the war was $738 billion in 2011 dollars, and the post-war benefits for veterans and families have separately cost some $270 billion since 1970, according to AP calculations.

—World War I, World War II and the Korean War

World War I, which ended 94 years ago, continues to cost taxpayers about $20 million every year. World War II? $5 billion.

Compensation for WWII veterans and families didn't peak until 1991 — 46 years after the war ended — and annual costs since then have only declined by about 25 percent. Korean War costs appear to be leveling off at about $2.8 billion per year.

Of the 2,289 survivors drawing cash linked to WWI, about one-third are spouses and dozens of them are over 100 years in age.

Some of the other recipients are curious: Forty-seven of the spouses are under the age of 80, meaning they weren't born until years after the war ended. Many of those women were in their 20s and 30s when their aging spouses died in the 1960s and 1970s, and they've been drawing the monthly payments since.

—Civil War and Spanish-American War

There are 10 living recipients of benefits tied to the 1898 Spanish-American War at a total cost of about $50,000 per year. The Civil War payments are going to two children of veterans — one in North Carolina and one in Tennessee— each for $876 per year.

Surviving spouses can qualify for lifetime benefits when troops from current wars have a service-linked death. Children under the age of 18 can also qualify, and those benefits are extended for a lifetime if the person is permanently incapable of self-support due to a disability before the age of 18.

Cliffs:

Compensation for WWII vets peaked in 1991.
Compensation for Vietnam vets hasn't peaked yet.
About 45% of Iraq and Afghanistan vets are seeking compensation.

http://www.masslive.com/news/index.ssf/2013/03/ap_costs_of_us_wars_linger_for.html

I hope everyone enjoyed the wars. We're going to be paying for them forever.
 

nextJin

Golden Member
Apr 16, 2009
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Of course, and the costs for these are going to be even greater because of battlefield trauma care.

If I had died in Iraq my wife would have gotten 400k, but if I were to be disabled my lifetime costs would have been exceptionally higher.

These costs aren't even that great, if you want to see ridiculous numbers look at other future liabilities those are unimaginable.
 

PokerGuy

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
13,650
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That's a tough nut to crack because on the one hand it's an enormous amount of money, but on the other hand you want to make sure the veterans who serve their country end up getting what they deserve in terms of care and benefits.
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
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Shameful. Vets need money after the fact but those people getting money from 19th century wars come on.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
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Shameful. Vets need money after the fact but those people getting money from 19th century wars come on.

Anytime the gov't is giving away money, there's going to be abuse, even among a group as honorable (generally speaking, as there are exceptions) as veterans.
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
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Shameful. Vets need money after the fact but those people getting money from 19th century wars come on.

If the rule states that the child of a KIA war vet gets X dollars for their life, you have to give the child of the KIA war vet x dollars for their life.
 

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,143
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Shameful. Vets need money after the fact but those people getting money from 19th century wars come on.

if that is what's promised they get it. those that are getting paid are still alive.

so err. fuck you.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
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If the rule states that the child of a KIA war vet gets X dollars for their life, you have to give the child of the KIA war vet x dollars for their life.

Are there still children alive of soldiers KIA in the Civil War or Spanish-American War? I'd find that hard to believe.

Anyway, I agree that our nation should honor its commitments to veterans and their families, but the rules are a whole lot more complicated and vague than that.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
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The children of Civil War vets are not still alive.

The article says there are:

The Civil War payments are going to two children of veterans — one in North Carolina and one in Tennessee— each for $876 per year.

I find it hard to believe.

In any case, the grand total of payments for the Civil War and Spanish-American War is about $70K by my calculations. That's so infinitesimally small I cannot manage to feign any concern.

Otherwise, the real numbers here all derive from what has been of one our largest problems for quite some time: Out-of-control health care costs.

Fern
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
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Oct 30, 2000
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The article says there are:



I find it hard to believe.

In any case, the grand total of payments for the Civil War and Spanish-American War is about $70K by my calculations. That's so infinitesimally small I cannot manage to feign any concern.

Otherwise, the real numbers here all derive from what has been of one our largest problems for quite some time: Out-of-control health care costs.

Fern

this is accurate.

Vets came home and in their 70-80s were having children.

One that was 18 during the Civil War would be born around 1845. If he had a child in 1920; that child would be in their 90s. Long life spans can be hereditary.

Yes, in this example and most up to WWII is an abuse of the system.
Adult children should not be receiving benefits.
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
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this is accurate.

Vets came home and in their 70-80s were having children.

One that was 18 during the Civil War would be born around 1845. If he had a child in 1920; that child would be in their 90s. Long life spans can be hereditary.

Yes, in this example and most up to WWII is an abuse of the system.
Adult children should not be receiving benefits.


I think the modern rules say the child only gets payments until age 26 if going to school, and 18 if not. Not positive, though. If I am correct, this is a problem that will go away all by itself given enough time.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
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I'm going through the release from active duty process now, and it's amazing how hard they push you to try for disability. Maybe it's just to ensure that those who are truly injured are found, but the system seems really easy to abuse.
 

nextJin

Golden Member
Apr 16, 2009
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I'm going through the release from active duty process now, and it's amazing how hard they push you to try for disability. Maybe it's just to ensure that those who are truly injured are found, but the system seems really easy to abuse.

Really?

I have not heard of this before what branch?
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
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Oct 30, 2000
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I was given a quickie exam and told to go to the VA hospital in Hew Hampton for further followup.

I found out there my records were completely FUBAR.
I tried to the DAV involved and it was even a bigger mess; where they trying to resolve the issue and/or getting me to file at 30% because of my knee?
 

Lithium381

Lifer
May 12, 2001
12,452
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I don't see a problem with taking care of our vets in terms of direct medical care...
paying spouses? mmmmmmm, depends.
paying children? no
 

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,143
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I don't see a problem with taking care of our vets in terms of direct medical care...
paying spouses? mmmmmmm, depends.
paying children? no

i agree with paying children IF under 18.

after that they are adults/
 

Leymenaide

Senior member
Feb 16, 2010
752
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i agree with paying children IF under 18.

after that they are adults/

Should we not provide help though a 2-4year degree or trade school.
Loseing Mom or Dad can be a huge financial loss for the average child.
 

KB

Diamond Member
Nov 8, 1999
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I think the point here isn't that we shouldn't be compensating veterans and their children, we should be. The point is that we shouldn't be fighting so many wars.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
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I think the point here isn't that we shouldn't be compensating veterans and their children, we should be. The point is that we shouldn't be fighting so many wars.

You'd be surprised at how much compensation is paid for disability completely unrelated to injuries from war. Yes, being at war does increase the disability rolls, but compensation costs would still be in the billions if we hadn't gone into Iraq or Afghanistan.
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
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Anytime the gov't is giving away money, there's going to be abuse, even among a group as honorable (generally speaking, as there are exceptions) as veterans.

They are honorable men, but the problem is, they are going to stand in line for free govt money just like anyone else.

I worked as DoD contractor for quite a few years and in my experience, most disabled vets are middle aged men with middle age ailments that are no where near makes them disabled.