Good news in Michigan: Abortion amendment must appear on ballot

[Exterous]

Michigan currently has a law on the books passed in 1931 banning abortion in most cases which had languished for decades due to Roe v Wade. With Roe v Wade being overturned Michigan has become a constant back and forth legal battleground as various stays, enforcements, prohibitions etc have been handed out.

A group called Reproductive Freedom for All sponsored a ballot proposal to modify the state constitution to guarantee the right to abortion. Over the summer it became the most signed ballot effort in Michigan history gathering ~800,000 signatures, far more than the 425,000 required to be put on the ballot.

Republicans tried to get the initiative tossed on a technicality. Some of the spacing was off resulting in "gibberish" [Their words not mine]. They provided examples of this gibberish including "FACTSOFTHECASE" and "INCLUDINGBUTNOTLIMITEDTOMISCARRIAGE"

Unfortunately the State Board of Canvassers was split among party lines - apparently buying the argument that

"The text of the amendment is filled with run-on words that are incomprehensible, making an already confusing amendment impossible to understand,” the group’s spokesperson, Christen Pollo, said in a statement, adding, “There’s no fixing this confusing gibberish.”

This nonsensical argument placed the initiative before the Michigan Supreme Court despite the huge amount of support from state residents. Thankfully the court, rather notably given the current climate, with a 5-2 vote decided the amendment must appear on the ballot.

From Chief Justice Bridget McCormack:

"The challengers have not produced a single signer who claims to have been confused by the limited-spacing sections in the full text portion of the proposal. Yet two members of the Board of State Canvassers would prevent the people of Michigan from voting on the proposal because they believe that the decreased spacing makes the text no longer '[t]he full text.' That is, even though there is no dispute that every word appears and appears legibly and in the correct order, and there is no evidence that anyone was confused about the text, two members of the Board of State Canvassers with the power to do so would keep the petition from the voters for what they purport to be a technical violation of the statute," she wrote.

"They would disenfranchise millions of Michiganders not because they believe the many thousands of Michiganders who signed the proposal were confused by it, but because they think they have identified a technicality that allows them to do so, a game of gotcha gone very bad. What a sad marker of the times."

Somewhat amusingly Bernstein, who is blind, had an added criticism for one of the 2 judges that voted in favor of preventing the ballot initiative from being voted on

"Justice Zahra notes that, as a wordsmith and a member of this court, he finds it 'an unremarkable proposition that spaces between words matter.' As a blind person who is also a wordsmith and a member of this court, I find it unremarkable to note that the lack of visual spacing has never mattered much to me," Bernstein wrote.

Of course its now up to Michigan voters as to whether this passes or not but at least that BS is out of the way. Given Michigan's status as a battleground state I have a tiny glimmer of hope that this will cause more voters to show up so this gets passed (and they vote for Democrats while they're there).

Michigan Supreme Court: Abortion amendment must appear on ballot

The court ruled the issue with the amount of space in between words in the proposed amendment are not a fatal flaw, sending the issue to voters.

www.freep.com

Foes: Abortion initiative is ‘gibberish,’ should be kept off Michigan ballot - Bridge Michigan

A initiative to add abortion rights to the Michigan Constitution has 43 ‘serious errors’ related to spacing, opponents claim. Organizers say they are confident the measure meets legal requirements.

www.bridgemi.com

 

[trenchfoot]

Talk about having the tyranny of the minority getting whipped back into their cages. This may be premature, but it sure looks like another case of Kansas Blowback in the making in a state that's ripe for it and hopefully a flood of similar backfires to follow.

I guess the extremist wing of the GOP is going to have to find a fix for this real quick. Along with Biden stoking the fires about how the Repubs are busy dismantling the democracy this nation's foundation is built on, having our rights being taken away by a bunch of corrupted judges that Trump installed just completes the picture of what the Repubs want our nation to devolve into.

 

[K1052]

It will likely drive turnout which is why the GOP made shit up trying to keep it off the ballot even if that meant simply not discharging their duties. In 2020 the canvassing board was a subject of GOP intrigue and came under pressure not to certify Biden's win. The republican who did so was forced from his position.

It is hard not to see a fundamental breakdown coming at some point where Republicans running vital electoral functions just ignore the law and do whatever they want daring somebody to stop them.

 

[hal2kilo]

Michigan currently has a law on the books passed in 1931 banning abortion in most cases which had languished for decades due to Roe v Wade. With Roe v Wade being overturned Michigan has become a constant back and forth legal battleground as various stays, enforcements, prohibitions etc have been handed out.

A group called Reproductive Freedom for All sponsored a ballot proposal to modify the state constitution to guarantee the right to abortion. Over the summer it became the most signed ballot effort in Michigan history gathering ~800,000 signatures, far more than the 425,000 required to be put on the ballot.

Republicans tried to get the initiative tossed on a technicality. Some of the spacing was off resulting in "gibberish" [Their words not mine]. They provided examples of this gibberish including "FACTSOFTHECASE" and "INCLUDINGBUTNOTLIMITEDTOMISCARRIAGE"

Unfortunately the State Board of Canvassers was split among party lines - apparently buying the argument that

This nonsensical argument placed the initiative before the Michigan Supreme Court despite the huge amount of support from state residents. Thankfully the court, rather notably given the current climate, with a 5-2 vote decided the amendment must appear on the ballot.

From Chief Justice Bridget McCormack:


Somewhat amusingly Bernstein, who is blind, had an added criticism for one of the 2 judges that voted in favor of preventing the ballot initiative from being voted on


Of course its now up to Michigan voters as to whether this passes or not but at least that BS is out of the way. Given Michigan's status as a battleground state I have a tiny glimmer of hope that this will cause more voters to show up so this gets passed (and they vote for Democrats while they're there).

Michigan Supreme Court: Abortion amendment must appear on ballot

The court ruled the issue with the amount of space in between words in the proposed amendment are not a fatal flaw, sending the issue to voters.

www.freep.com

Foes: Abortion initiative is ‘gibberish,’ should be kept off Michigan ballot - Bridge Michigan

A initiative to add abortion rights to the Michigan Constitution has 43 ‘serious errors’ related to spacing, opponents claim. Organizers say they are confident the measure meets legal requirements.

www.bridgemi.com

Let the Kansas wave roll right over it all.

 

[HomerJS]

Michigan currently has a law on the books passed in 1931 banning abortion in most cases which had languished for decades due to Roe v Wade. With Roe v Wade being overturned Michigan has become a constant back and forth legal battleground as various stays, enforcements, prohibitions etc have been handed out.

A group called Reproductive Freedom for All sponsored a ballot proposal to modify the state constitution to guarantee the right to abortion. Over the summer it became the most signed ballot effort in Michigan history gathering ~800,000 signatures, far more than the 425,000 required to be put on the ballot.

Republicans tried to get the initiative tossed on a technicality. Some of the spacing was off resulting in "gibberish" [Their words not mine]. They provided examples of this gibberish including "FACTSOFTHECASE" and "INCLUDINGBUTNOTLIMITEDTOMISCARRIAGE"

Unfortunately the State Board of Canvassers was split among party lines - apparently buying the argument that

This nonsensical argument placed the initiative before the Michigan Supreme Court despite the huge amount of support from state residents. Thankfully the court, rather notably given the current climate, with a 5-2 vote decided the amendment must appear on the ballot.

From Chief Justice Bridget McCormack:


Somewhat amusingly Bernstein, who is blind, had an added criticism for one of the 2 judges that voted in favor of preventing the ballot initiative from being voted on


Of course its now up to Michigan voters as to whether this passes or not but at least that BS is out of the way. Given Michigan's status as a battleground state I have a tiny glimmer of hope that this will cause more voters to show up so this gets passed (and they vote for Democrats while they're there).

Michigan Supreme Court: Abortion amendment must appear on ballot

The court ruled the issue with the amount of space in between words in the proposed amendment are not a fatal flaw, sending the issue to voters.

www.freep.com

Foes: Abortion initiative is ‘gibberish,’ should be kept off Michigan ballot - Bridge Michigan

A initiative to add abortion rights to the Michigan Constitution has 43 ‘serious errors’ related to spacing, opponents claim. Organizers say they are confident the measure meets legal requirements.

www.bridgemi.com

Wow. This ruling shit all over the members who wanted to keep it off the ballot by lying using spacing as an excuse.

All these pious assholes are starting to pay the piper. Hopefully this continues

 

[Lezunto]

This should help Dems in Michigan. But Sanders and Manchin are up to their old divisive nonsense again.

We need to face the truth that the voting coalition Obama supporters carefully constructed is no more. It's Pure Selfishness and Ego now.

 

[hal2kilo]

This should help Dems in Michigan. But Sanders and Manchin are up to their old divisive nonsense again.

We need to face the truth that the voting coalition Obama supporters carefully constructed is no more. It's Pure Selfishness and Ego now.

Links? Wut?

 

[pcgeek11]

It should be on the ballot in every state. As each state should vote a current law that follows the views of the majority of the current population.

Automatic trigger laws that were passed years ago should all be tossed.

 

[vi edit]

It should be on the ballot in every state.

Agreed. Put it up to a state vote, let every voter give their stance via the ballot box, and put this nonsense behind us.

 

[Lezunto]

Links? Wut?

I thought you guys were watching the happenings in Congress closely.

In order to pass the Inflation Reduction Bill, Schumer had to agree with Manchin's proposal to ease permits to build oil pipelines. They Dems had to hold their nose on what Sinema wanted as well. But Dems seemed united on the bill.

But now there's disagreement over stop gap financing to keep the federal government funded. Depending on who's writing the story, different folks are to blame.

Biden 'committed' to permitting deal with Manchin

White House press secretary Karine Jean-Pierre said President Joe Biden would support permitting reform legislation opposed by many Democrats and

www.eenews.net

Sanders threatens ‘no’ vote on government funding over Manchin ‘side deal’ on energy permits

If the stopgap funding bill is not passed by Sept. 30, a federal government shutdown could be on the horizon.

vtdigger.org

 

[MrSquished]

It should be on the ballot in every state. As each state should vote a current law that follows the views of the majority of the current population.

Automatic trigger laws that were passed years ago should all be tossed.

It shouldn't be up to the states at all. It's a fundamental right of women over their bodies.

But that would be a start at least.

 

[brycejones]

It should be on the ballot in every state. As each state should vote a current law that follows the views of the majority of the current population.

Automatic trigger laws that were passed years ago should all be tossed.

Body autonomy is a basic human right. I appreciate your stance that trigger laws aren’t valid but the real issue here is the denial of a basic human right to women.

 

[vi edit]

Body autonomy is a basic human right. I appreciate your stance that trigger laws aren’t valid but the real issue here is the denial of a basic human right to women.

I don't disagree, but I also just want voters in red states to smear their authoritarian and overreaching republican representatives noses in it.

 

[pcgeek11]

It shouldn't be up to the states at all. It's a fundamental right of women over their bodies.

But that would be a start at least.

Body autonomy is a basic human right. I appreciate your stance that trigger laws aren’t valid but the real issue here is the denial of a basic human right to women.

That is one train of thought on the subject.

I agree up to a point, as do many others that after 15 -16 weeks abortion should only be considered for saving the life of the mother or severe defects in the fetus (baby). I say let the people have their voice as it should be.

 

[brycejones]

That is one train of thought on the subject.

I agree up to a point, as do many others that after 15 -16 weeks abortion should only be considered for saving the life of the mother or severe defects in the fetus (baby). I say let the people have their voice as it should be.

The problem I have with those regulations is that is placing additional burdens on medical professionals and women at a time of great stress. Women do not have large numbers of abortions at very late stages of pregnancy because they’ve decided they don’t wa t to be pregnant anymore. Things have gone very wrong for a woman to have an abortion after she has already been picking out names and shopping for baby clothes. We need to trust women and respect their agency.

 

[Zorba]

That is one train of thought on the subject.

I agree up to a point, as do many others that after 15 -16 weeks abortion should only be considered for saving the life of the mother or severe defects in the fetus (baby). I say let the people have their voice as it should be.

Provide some evidence that any real number of abortions happen past 16 weeks except for medical reasons. But 16 weeks basically everyone knows you are pregnant and an abortion is much harder than at 8 weeks.

 

[pcgeek11]

Provide some evidence that any real number of abortions happen past 16 weeks except for medical reasons. But 16 weeks basically everyone knows you are pregnant and an abortion is much harder than at 8 weeks.

Well to be honest about it, I don't need to provide evidence of any number of abortions happening past 16 weeks except for medical reasons. That wasn't a point or an argument placed by myself. I only stated my belief on what the law should be in a general sense.

If you want to hammer out exactly what you would like to see as a law in your state and provide the data to back it up feel free to do so.

 

[brycejones]

Well to be honest about it, I don't need to provide evidence of any number of abortions happening past 16 weeks except for medical reasons. That wasn't a point or an argument placed by myself. I only stated my belief on what the law should be in a general sense.

If you want to hammer out exactly what you would like to see as a law in your state and provide the data to back it up feel free to do so.

Except in a very specific sense you want to eliminate the agency of women.

 

[Zorba]

Well to be honest about it, I don't need to provide evidence of any number of abortions happening past 16 weeks except for medical reasons. That wasn't a point or an argument placed by myself. I only stated my belief on what the law should be in a general sense.

If you want to hammer out exactly what you would like to see as a law in your state and provide the data to back it up feel free to do so.

I am saying what you say you want, is the way it already is and has been since Roe. No law required.

 

[Fenixgoon]

That is one train of thought on the subject.

I agree up to a point, as do many others that after 15 -16 weeks abortion should only be considered for saving the life of the mother or severe defects in the fetus (baby). I say let the people have their voice as it should be.

Wouldn't the ultimate expression of "let the people have their voice" be to let women choose whether to have an abortion or not?
Everything else is a restriction on that "voice".

And what you believe is only relevant if you need an abortion. Then you can put your belief into action.
Otherwise, don't project your beliefs onto someone else's life.

 

[iRONic]

How hard is it for him to understand this?!?!? JFC…

 

[pcgeek11]

Except in a very specific sense you want to eliminate the agency of women.

I said what I think the law should be. You disagree. I'm OK with that.

The states should have their citizens vote to uphold the majority beliefs for Their State.

The range varies from free abortion at will up till birth and no abortions at all and every shade of gray in between. One size doesn't fit all.

 

[pcgeek11]

I am saying what you say you want, is the way it already is and has been since Roe. No law required.

OK... But Roe no longer applies as the Supreme Court Ruling, so each state must decide for their own what their citizens want.

 

[K1052]

The range varies from free abortion at will up till birth and no abortions at all and every shade of gray in between. One size doesn't fit all.

Should it be within the power of the state to mandate women carry non-viable pregnancies to term or pregnancies that risk the life of the mother?

A lot of red state bans claim to not do this but functionally they do because the legal language is intentionally vague so doctors won't act.

 

[pcgeek11]

Wouldn't the ultimate expression of "let the people have their voice" be to let women choose whether to have an abortion or not?
Everything else is a restriction on that "voice".

And what you believe is only relevant if you need an abortion. Then you can put your belief into action.
Otherwise, don't project your beliefs onto someone else's life.

After about 16 weeks I think it is killing a possible viable human. A woman shouldn't have a voice to kill a viable fetus without cause, even if the odds are only 50/50. If she so decides to abort before the 16 weeks point then that is fine.

Many here have claimed that late term abortions are very rare and are mostly due to medical reasons. If that is in fact true then it wouldn't be an issue to outlaw abortions after 16 weeks except for medical reasons. So who's voice is being restricted?