GeForce Titan coming end of February

[Janooo]

Ah yes,the good ol rumor mill...NV fans will lap this one up lol
http://x-surface.tumblr.com/

I would not be surprised if you were the guy.

 

[Crap Daddy]

We've had similar if not better gains in the past without the massive price hike so why the justification from Crap Daddy (unless Titan will be a very limited run of cards)?

It's not a justification it's just how they are doing business, healthy business I might add. Nobody forces you too buy but I'm sure the cards will be sold out because you don't flood the market with 1k cards. You'll see later this year, much later since AMD is delaying its new series of cards, the 780 at a competitive price and performance against the top AMD card.

 

[sontin]

You are saying GPUs shouldn't get faster at the same price or cheaper? Prices should keep increasing for faster GPUs every generation? GTX680 is not worthy its $499 price today. Just because some sheep are buying it doesn't make it reasonably priced. GTX580 was going for $450 at the end of its life and all of us were aware that it was overpriced. Using GTX680/690's pricing to justify Titan's price makes no sense unless you think NV should adopt Apple's school of product pricing.

Write a letter to AMD. They tried to rip off their fan base 12 months ago.
Had they introduced the 7970 at $369 like Cypress and Cayman we had much lower prices.

 

[notty22]

Write a letter to AMD. They tried to rip off their fan base 12 months ago.
Had they introduced the 7970 at $369 like Cypress and Cayman we had much lower prices.

It's easier to present strawman arguments, and play on Apple hatred. He's picking up steam on that front.

 

[RussianSensation]

Write a letter to AMD. They tried to rip off their fan base 12 months ago.
Had they introduced the 7970 at $369 like Cypress and Cayman we had much lower prices.

HD7970 $360
GTX680 4GB $550

Most 680s are still selling for $440-460.

So no it doesn't look like if HD7970 launched at $369, NV would have magically launched GTX680 at $369-399.

Also, HD7970 has come down in price from $549 to $360-370. How do you not get this? You keep ignoring that most tech gets cheaper over time clinging to launch MSRPs a year ago. You also just contradicted yourself. HD7970 OC delivered 79% more performance over HD6970 and you called it "AMD trying to rip off their fan base 12 months ago". Yet, based on the Titan's pricing and even if it's performance lands at 80% faster than the 680, that's way MORE of a rip-off. Further, the Titan is landing today when a level of performance of 1Ghz HD7970/680 costs $380, not $550. That makes GTX680 overpriced, GTX690 overpriced and thus the price of $900 is overpriced too even if it matches the 690 because you are using NV's overpriced product prices to begin with as your justification. That's not logical.

It's easier to present strawman arguments, and play on Apple hatred. He's picking up steam on that front.

Always amusing the same people ignore mathematics/economics and how the GPU technology market works to justify why they'd throw hundreds of dollars more for their preferred brand. You might want to check my posts when HD7970 launched regarding what my views were on its price. Also, last time I checked, a $900 Titan is probably going to be a dud wrt to bitcoin mining. So comparing that to HD7970 misses one of the greatest $$ making features the 7970 had. Carry on justifying why it's dandy that NV decided to raise the price of a flagship GPU from $500-650 levels of 280/480/580/680. I suppose you think Maxwell GTX890 is fine at $1,500?

 

[sontin]

HD7970 $360
GTX680 4GB $550

Most 680s are still selling for $440-460.

So no it doesn't look like if HD7970 launched at $369, NV would have magically launched GTX680 at $369-399.

And you know that? AMD failed with this generation: High prices, underperforming cards, driver bugs. nVidia got all the mind share. That is the reason why they can ask for these prices.

Also, HD7970 has come down in price from $549 to $360-370. How do you not get this? You keep ignoring that most tech gets cheaper over time clinging to launch MSRPs a year ago.

Sure it come down. Because it was overpriced after nVidia launched the GTX670. The only way to stay competitive was to lower the price.
And since them nVidia did only little adjustments of their lineup. What we see now should be there from the beginning.

Talking about HD7970 priced at $549 more than 12 months ago is meaningless in relation to the pricing of the Titan. The Titan is landing today when HD7970 costs $360, not $550. That makes GTX680 overpriced, GTX690 overpriced and thus the price of $900 is overpriced too even if it matches the 690.

TITAN will be nearly 2x faster than the GTX580 and cost 90% more. It's right in line with AMD's price increase. The difference between TITAN and GTX680 will be exact the same like it was with the GTX580 and GTX560TI: 50% faster and twice the price.

 

[Grooveriding]

Haha, loving it. The good old busted up fanboy logic. I don't like this company, their cards are the fastest, they're too expensive!!

Now it's this company is great, their cards are the fastest, the price is the fault of that mean bad company who charged too much when their card was the fastest.

Throw in a dash of those good crazy performance expectations too. lol. Like the 'GTX 680 will be 60% faster than 580, never mind that it is a tiny die, it'll also cost $300'

Worthless drivel.

 

[notty22]

 

[Black Octagon]

I sometimes think Anandtech should win an award for having attracted some of the most voracious graphics card fanboys on the web...

 

[thilanliyan]

And you know that? AMD failed with this generation: High prices, underperforming cards, driver bugs. nVidia got all the mind share. That is the reason why they can ask for these prices.

Actually AMD doesn't have underperforming cards...they mostly perform better than the nV cards at the respective price points. nVidia actually has all three.

And the 7970 price came down because of the GTX670? So the 7970 competes with the GTX670 and not the GTX680? Point me to those reviews please...the 7970 competes with (and beats) the GTX680.

I still laugh when people blame AMD for the prices this gen...nVidia has been charging top dollar for their top end cards for ages (I know...I paid $600 for a GTS640 once upon a time)...god forbid if AMD charges more for a card that is faster than the competition (GTX580 at the time of the 7970 release)...lol. You should complain to nVidia that GTX680 prices have stayed high, when faster 7970s can be had for less, rather than venting your frustration on THESE forums...remember, this is AMDShillTech right?...your complaints are falling on deaf ears.

 

[Rvenger]

And you know that? AMD failed with this generation: High prices, underperforming cards, driver bugs. nVidia got all the mind share. That is the reason why they can ask for these prices.

Funny thing is you would still be saying this even if NV went out of business. I had a good laugh, thanks Sontin.


EDIT: The reason why AMD failed is with marketing. That is all, and obviously its not too late for them to make a come back either, look at all the developer relations they had recently. How many PhysX titles are set for this year again? Oh yeah, Hawken. I never heard of that title until I updated my Nvidia drivers.


EDIT 2: Sorry all if I derailed the topic.. my response was a waste of time and effort on my behalf. All I am doing is fueling a fire that needs put out.

 

[DooKey]

I sometimes think Anandtech should win an award for having attracted some of the most voracious graphics card fanboys on the web...

^^^^^^^
This

 

[sontin]

Actually AMD doesn't have underperforming cards...they mostly perform better than the nV cards at the respective price points. nVidia actually has all three.

We talking here about the first half of 2012 and 28nm products. A GTX680 was faster and cheaper, a GTX670 was faster and cheaper than the competition.

And the 7970 price came down because of the GTX670? So the 7970 competes with the GTX670 and not the GTX680? Point me to those reviews please...the 7970 competes with (and beats) the GTX680.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/NVIDIA/GeForce_GTX_670/
http://www.computerbase.de/artikel/grafikkarten/2012/test-nvidia-geforce-gtx-670/4/

And that is only the reference design. Right from the start there were customs design like the gigabyte windforce for the same MSRP:
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/graphics/2012/11/12/gigabyte-geforce-gtx-670-2gb-review/9

I still laugh when people blame AMD for the prices this gen...nVidia has been charging top dollar for their top end cards for ages (I know...I paid $600 for a GTS640 once upon a time)...god forbid if AMD charges more for a card that is faster than the competition (GTX580 at the time of the 7970 release)...lol. You should complain to nVidia that GTX680 prices have stayed high, when faster 7970s can be had for less, rather than venting your frustration on THESE forums...remember, this is AMDShillTech right?...your complaints are falling on deaf ears.

Yeah, increasing the MSRP 50% over the previous generation and allowing nVidia to double the MSRP over their older gen is not AMD's fault.
The GTX670 fucked up AMD's whole lineup. Without a price drop nobody would had buy a 7870, 7950 or 7970. It was nVidia who forced AMD to lower their prices and yet nVidia is still staying at the same price level while selling more gpus.

But yeah, it's not AMD fault that we pay 100% more for the successor of the GTX560TI. :|

 

[Will Robinson]

Just to clarify there sontin...you claim GTX680 is faster than HD7970 GE right?

 

[Keysplayr]

Just to clarify there sontin...you claim GTX680 is faster than HD7970 GE right?

If not higher fps, then smoother. Better drivers. More features. PhysX, CUDA.
While these things are acid on your tongue, some people actually appreciate and like the extra lengths Nvidia goes to to offer a better product.

 

[Red Hawk]

If not higher fps, then smoother. Better drivers. More features. PhysX, CUDA.
While these things are acid on your tongue, some people actually appreciate and like the extra lengths Nvidia goes to to offer a better product.

Supporting features of dubious utility is a separate point from which card is faster. "Smoother" is more related, and I'll grant that Nvidia seems to have had a better focus on smoothness with its drivers. But since the point has been brought to AMD's attention, their driver team seems quite capable of remedying the issue, with an early beta fix smoothing out Borderlands 2 and Skyrim performance without losing FPS.

 

[Keysplayr]

Supporting features of dubious utility is a separate point from which card is faster. "Smoother" is more related, and I'll grant that Nvidia seems to have had a better focus on smoothness with its drivers. But since the point has been brought to AMD's attention, their driver team seems quite capable of remedying the issue, with an early beta fix smoothing out Borderlands 2 and Skyrim performance without losing FPS.

Yes indeed. Which game was it though where they did in fact lose about 8% of the framerate? And wasn't that the game which corrected most of the latency while Skyrim and BL2 not so much? I thought 3 games were addressed.
At any rate, yes it is good that it only took a GIANT nudge from just about every corner of the interweb to get AMD's attention. And great they are doing what they can.

 

[Red Hawk]

Yes indeed. Which game was it though where they did in fact lose about 8% of the framerate? And wasn't that the game which corrected most of the latency while Skyrim and BL2 not so much? I thought 3 games were addressed.
At any rate, yes it is good that it only took a GIANT nudge from just about every corner of the interweb to get AMD's attention. And great they are doing what they can.

Yes, Guild Wars 2 did lose some FPS with the driver fix; the fix to Skyrim and Borderlands 2 were certainly on the same level as Guild Wars 2 without a performance loss, though. And keep in mind this is a beta driver.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

You're thinking of Guild Wars 2.

Anyways, I think creedence should be paid to what else Nvidia may or may not offer over simple FPS. I mean are we gamers, or are we benchers, or are we image linkers?

I personally consider myself a gamer.

 

[VulgarDisplay]

We talking here about the first half of 2012 and 28nm products. A GTX680 was faster and cheaper, a GTX670 was faster and cheaper than the competition.

If we're talking about the first half of 2012 then keep in mind that the gtx580 was still selling for $500 and was far slower than the 7970. :whiste:

Instead of focusing on the past how about we focus on the here and now where the nvidia cards offer less price/perf.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

If we're talking about the first half of 2012 then keep in mind that the gtx580 was still selling for $500 and was far slower than the 7970. :whiste:

Instead of focusing on the past how about we focus on the here and now where the nvidia cards offer less price/perf.

You could get the 1.5GB 580 for less than $500, unless you mean the 3GB card which was even more overpriced than the 1.5GB card and it's price stuck more than the 1.5GB card.

I seem to recall it being in the low $400s at times, but I never really paid much attention to it since the card itself was overpriced for that generation. Often the 6970 was as good or better at 1600p stock vs stock, and the 580 didn't have a huge amount of OC headroom left over because it shared the same clock threshold as other Fermi based chips and was the highest clocked of the big dies.



Also that's no justification, even if this topic is a bit silly. AMD is going to do whatever AMD feels they can do. That said, using being faster than a previous nodes high end card is not fair grounds imo to justify any pricing structure or we'd all be playing well over $10,000 for mid-range gpu's at this point.

 

[Whitestar127]

And wasn't that the game which corrected most of the latency while Skyrim and BL2 not so much?

Not really. Skyrim is very very smooth now. And I suppose I should thank Techreport, some other sites and partly you too for raising the micro stutter issue. I don't think I would have been playing Skyrim smoothly now if it hadn't been for all that focus.
MS didn't really bother me that much before, but now that I have gotten used to living without it...

Still, if this Titan exists out there, then it'll most likely be my next card (if I can afford it). Not just because it's (probably) fast but because with an NV card I can fully utilize the features in my monitor.

 

[SickBeast]

I've gotta say, $899 is way too much if that is indeed the actual MSRP. I highly doubt it will be as fast as a pair of GTX 680s.

 

[thilanliyan]

We talking here about the first half of 2012 and 28nm products. A GTX680 was faster and cheaper, a GTX670 was faster and cheaper than the competition.

You generalized and said this, not "first half of 2012":
"AMD failed with this generation: High prices, underperforming cards, driver bugs."
At release, yes the prices were higher, and they were adjusted accordingly, but they were first to market by 3-4 months...why wouldn't they price their cards according to what was available at the time (GTX 580)?

As for reviews, again, at release fine, but now the 7970GE is competing (and beating) the GTX680, yet the GTX680 costs more. Where is your outrage at nVidia for keeping prices high?
Who do you blame for nVidia keeping prices high now? I'd genuinely like to know.

But yeah, it's not AMD fault that we pay 100% more for the successor of the GTX560TI. :|

AMD has to price their cards according to the competition at the time of release. Don't forget their older cards (9800, X800, X1800XT, X1900XTX, etc) cost $500+ many years ago. People act like AMD has always been charging $379 for their high end single GPU...they HAVE NOT.

I really don't get the outrage about the prices...they are VIDEO CARDS!! If you think it costs too much, don't buy it and please don't b!tch about it...they are not necessary for you to live. nVidia and AMD are publicly traded companies that have to make profits, not satisfy forum goers...they should price their cards at whatever the market will bear. If nVidia prices their high end cards now on at like $800, so be it...I won't be spending that much on a video card, and I sure as heck will not moan about it on these forums.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

Where are you seeing this?

he's talking about the conversion from a euro pricing which includes typical heavy euro taxes, no way its going to be anywhere near that price in the states