Geek Squad, Firedog Scam Consumer On Hidden Camera

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: ultimatebob
If I would have seen the "OS not found" error, I would have assumed that it was a dead hard drive as well. I certainly would have checked it anyway before replacing the drive, though.

Any decent tech, upon seeing that error message, would have:

1) Checked the physical hard drive connection to make sure it was connected properly

2) Checked the BIOS to make sure the system was booting the correct device

Assuming it's a bad hard drive before doing a basic 60 second diagnostic? Better leave that to the Geek Squad and Firedog guys.

 

[sirplayalot]

Originally posted by: OdiN

Originally posted by: sirplayalot
As a current GeekSquad employee im laughing at this video, because of how true it is! Not because I think geeksquad sucks, i actually think they are a great service for people who dont know what they are doing and they do have the big best buy brand to back their services, but I do see a lot that sometimes even the people I work with dont spend enough time with their customers. It does get pretty frustrating with new PCs/Old or broken PCs/ and customers and the phone all needing attention at the same time but some things are an easy fixed thats not looked into very well. I just setup a system of how I check people in, I ask what they were doing right before it crashed, I check the bios, see if I can boot safe mode, if what I am doing will take longer than 30 min I check them in, at no charge untill I figure it out!

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I dont see how this is funny! Its true! I have seen first hand that the managers of these stores (atleast the 2 I worked at) are great people and they actually know what it feels like to be a consumer. I have seen our service center screw up someones computer or even one of our own agents who do "not so great" service on someones laptop and have it replaced in our store! Remember, the people working at these stores are just people...

 

[mrSHEiK124]

...that screen of blue death

:laugh:

 

[xeemzor]

My confidence in retail computer supported has been lowered even by it's already unreasonably low expectations.

 

[marvdmartian]

Yeah, I shook my head at the screen of blue death as well.... :laugh:

Had a co-worker, a few years ago, that took his son's desktop to GeekSquad, and paid for them to install the norton antivirus he'd just bought for it. I asked him how much they charged, and was astounded that he'd paid so much for someone to basically stick in a cd, install a program, then download the updates for it.......something like $50!! My response was pretty much, "Geez, couldn't you handle that yourself??", to which his mumbled reply was something to the effect that they'd "tuned up" the computer while they had it. Yeah......I'm sure they just went through, and cleared out the internet cache, cookies & temporary internet files (3 minutes), then did a check for any known viruses with the antivirus he'd had them install. :roll:

 

[JEDI]

Originally posted by: Tiamat
lol at the followup from BB and CC. Yeah-fucking-right. You guys know you steal peoples money. Props to Microcenter, but man thats expensive!

what did Microcenter do right?

<not d/l video atm>

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: JEDI

Originally posted by: Tiamat
lol at the followup from BB and CC. Yeah-fucking-right. You guys know you steal peoples money. Props to Microcenter, but man thats expensive!

what did Microcenter do right?

<not d/l video atm>

They fixed the BIOS issue, which was the only problem with the laptop.

 

[Cuda1447]

Originally posted by: marvdmartian
Yeah, I shook my head at the screen of blue death as well.... :laugh:

Had a co-worker, a few years ago, that took his son's desktop to GeekSquad, and paid for them to install the norton antivirus he'd just bought for it. I asked him how much they charged, and was astounded that he'd paid so much for someone to basically stick in a cd, install a program, then download the updates for it.......something like $50!! My response was pretty much, "Geez, couldn't you handle that yourself??", to which his mumbled reply was something to the effect that they'd "tuned up" the computer while they had it. Yeah......I'm sure they just went through, and cleared out the internet cache, cookies & temporary internet files (3 minutes), then did a check for any known viruses with the antivirus he'd had them install. :roll:

They probably also disabled startup programs, I'd say for that he got his moneys worth...

 

[Zugzwang152]

Originally posted by: JEDI

Originally posted by: Tiamat
lol at the followup from BB and CC. Yeah-fucking-right. You guys know you steal peoples money. Props to Microcenter, but man thats expensive!

what did Microcenter do right?

<not d/l video atm>

Fix a BIOS setting. The TV station had their IT tech disable the IDE/SATA channel of a laptop's hard drive so the error "Operating System Not Found" appeared on the screen when turning it on. They then took it to Geek Squad, Fire Dog, and Microcenter.

Geek Squad and Firedog wanted to replace the hard drive and reinstall the OS. Microcenter fixed the problem and returned the laptop in working condition.

 

[Skipholiday]

Good post.
Beware of the crooks~!

 

[alkemyst]

what's even worse is the car and computer places that charge for replacement parts that they claim under your warranty.

There was something about that here a few years ago.

Mechanics do it a lot of times with emissions devices that are covered for life. Most consumers just expect to pay to replace a part in an older car.

 

[gorcorps]

I expected the BB and CC guys to screw the customer over on price but end up fixing it. The fact that they didn't after all of that is pretty bad. But places like this make huge bank on those who don't bother getting to know some basics of the computer.

Reminds me of the time I went with my sis to CC to buy her a laptop. The guy said "now all of these laptops come with a lot of trial software and stuff you don't need on there that may slow down your computer. For an extra $50 (or so) we can get rid of all that stuff for you." My sister looked at me with a "should I do that" look and I just laughed... said I could probably handle it and left.

 

[mcmilljb]

Originally posted by: TechBoyJK

Originally posted by: bigal40
"There's multiple ways to accidentally get into the BIOS and accidentally change somthing"

like accidently hitting F2, changing some stuff, and hitting f10 to save and exit

Yeah, I do it all the time. It sucks bad, really bad. Sometimes I press Shift+Delete while selecting all my files. Crap!

 

[zanejohnson]

wow they are expensive....the never did find say what the problem was, i saw "operating system not found"

so either boot.ini was fuxored, or there wasnt anything on the drive...and one of the techs said it was clicking...and we all know what that means...

so what did they do to fix it....


but yeah they are expensive as helll, to reinstall windows/backup all the users data (OE mail accounts, the dbx files for there OE files/or a pst file if they're running Outlook) all of there my documents stuff, and quickbooks company files if they have them.... it would end up being an hour and a half job.... and i bill at $65 an hour...

the other company i have a partnership with charges 92.50 an hour...and i get 35 percent of of the total + gas money for going to pick up the machine and drop it back off..

 

[alkemyst]

PC tech is a definite need. Because most of us here can do something (and I am willing many that think they can do things really are just flailing at it and would be dangerous in a real production environment) doesn't mean the other 9 out of 10 can.

 

[mcmilljb]

I actually think the video is unfair. They don't show what questions the techs asked, so we don't know what lies that "News 10" said. Thanks News 10, I need to start asking "are you a retarded new channel disabling stuff in the bios?"

Seriously if the tech is going to say "There's multiple ways to accidentally get into the BIOS and accidentally change somthing," I can't believe they have him hired. I can believe accidental changes(if you actually know what the BIOS is), but I can't believe there are multiple ways besides pressing F2 or Del to get into the BIOS to accidentally make changes. Maybe letting your spider monkey press the keys while booting up. So unless the person mentions "Oh I was booting up and changed something in this ugly screen and then it stopped working" or anything leading to the BIOS. The BIOS is not going to be a first thing on my mind. Should it be something to check first? It's possible, but we don't know what lies they told the tech. Honestly, the scary part sounds like the GeekSquad guy is trying to rip them off for a new HD. The Firedog people just didn't even look at it. I bet they just forgot about it.

 

[Exterous]

Originally posted by: ultimatebob

Originally posted by: TechBoyJK

Originally posted by: bigal40
"There's multiple ways to accidentally get into the BIOS and accidentally change somthing"

like accidentally hitting F2, changing some stuff, and hitting f10 to save and exit

Yeah. That "test" was kinda lame. Clueless users don't "accidentally" change the boot order in their BIOS... most of them don't even know what a BIOS is!

If I would have seen the "OS not found" error, I would have assumed that it was a dead hard drive as well. I certainly would have checked it anyway before replacing the drive, though.

As a tech who had a similar job to the ones in the video, I don't think I ever ran across a BIOS problem that a customer caused.

Hey, if I came up with random assed stuff I'll bet I could stump people as well

Props to Microcenter for catching the real problem though!

(Oh, and as a one time firedog bench tech - there is no real training. How good your service depends almost entirely on how lucky you are with your technician)

 

[Exterous]

Originally posted by: mcmilljb
I actually think the video is unfair. They don't show what questions the techs asked,

Yeah, and one of the first things I learned was that you can't always trust the customer's answers. Many new techs are too trusting of customers explanations

 

[daveymark]

Originally posted by: alkemyst
PC tech is a definite need. Because most of us here can do something (and I am willing many that think they can do things really are just flailing at it and would be dangerous in a real production environment) doesn't mean the other 9 out of 10 can.

agreed. it'd be like a car forum wondering why the average person doesn't know how to change their spark plugs....some people just don't know how to do it, and shouldn't be expected to know.

 

[mcmilljb]

Originally posted by: Exterous

Originally posted by: mcmilljb
I actually think the video is unfair. They don't show what questions the techs asked,

Yeah, and one of the first things I learned was that you can't always trust the customer's answers. Many new techs are too trusting of customers explanations

I am saying you have to start some where. All 3 should have caught the problem. If they don't have the time do all the steps immediately and have false information, you aren't going to solve the problem quickly. The diagnostic programs should have said something about no hard drive found, and that's when you should have looked at the BIOS first then checked the connection to the drive. It seems weird that the Geek Squad guy took the drive out... I know a Geek Squad guy that's awesome, and he would not take the drive out unless he was making sure it's connected. It's just sad that they are just trying to find a problem. We know they overharge, but at least give them a real problem to solve with real information. Make it fair, geez.

 

[CZroe]

By not answering truthfully and saying that they were messing around in the BIOS, there's no way it would take 30 seconds to fix because that WOULDN'T be the most likely cause. Being coy is not a good thing for a customer that wants it fixed.

Obviously, if it spontaneously gave that error, then it would most likely be a hardware failure or corruption. One easy way to test is trying it in another system, exactly like they did. If it clicked and locked up on another system with a known-good adapter then I, too, would believe the case to be "closed" and not worth charging the customer more hours to look for an alternate problem that DOESN'T explain the click and freeze. It would be dishonest of me to do that just to run up their bill. Dead hard drives click, lock-up, and cause the BIOS to report "No Operating System Found," but the deal-sealer is that dead drives do it spontaneously. BIOS settings don't spontaneously change themselves.

Their IT guy clearly gets off on asserting himself over them... that 30-second quote just proves it. It would take 30-seconds if you stupidly went straight to the BIOS to see if a customer changed something they just stated they did not change (they would know if they did as they would have directly attributed the inability to boot to the last thing they did). It's the same attitude half the people in this thread are giving off. It's just not logical troubleshooting without the customer admitting that they were in the CMOS/BIOS/"Strange Menu," etc. Hindsight is 20/20, so don't pretend that makes you "smarter."

Granted, I recently had a personal laptop that wouldn't boot right after a forced hibernation (battery died) and deleting the restore data would cause it to hang on the Windows XP logo with the animation pausing and stuttering and never progressing (oddly, pressing the power button repeatedly would make the animation progress one frame per press... weird!). Setting CMOS defaults didn't help. I've had that happen on many dieing hard drives, and it HAD been making a terrible noise for almost a year... the heads sound like they "drop and bounce" as if the accelerometer triggered them to do an emergency head park (spontaneously and often). It was still readable in an adapter and I had another SATA 2.5" HDD of the same capacity (120GB found on clearance for $23.99!). I had intended to migrate to it all along as a precaution due to the "scary noise" exhibited by the original drive, so I cloned it and encountered the same thing problem when booting up. I knew that that was likely in the event of corruption, and I had my CD ready to install XP again. It wasn't until I got a crash when trying to reinstall Windows XP on a brand new drive that I realized something else was the matter. With no option to clear CMOS, I reset defaults again, tested alternate settings, reseated memory, removed un-needed hardware, and held in the power button for 30-seconds with the battery and power disconnected, but nothing worked short of a full CMOS clearing by removing the CMOS battery. Bingo! Something corrupted in the CMOS when it had last hibernated and I simply had to go to more extremes than I should have had to go through (what happened to simple "reset" holes?). I had to use a toothpick to remove the CMOS battery's connector and the connector shroud shattered, so I had to use tweezers to connect the pins themselves.

This is a similar scenario in so many ways, but I followed a proper troubleshooting process.

 

[0roo0roo]

actually if the system can't find the o/s one obvious place to check is the bios just for eliminating source of problems before you take the trouble of ripping the case open. its simply critical thinking. you don't assume anything, especially in a case where its actually easier to simply check. making an assumption to save time might make sense if the procedure in question took massive amounts of effort but bios is hardly much of a chore to check to simply eliminate possibilities. do the easiest things first. they totally failed. at their diagnostic prices they have plenty of time. i truely doubt the tech is being paid 60 bucks an hour or whatever. for 60+ bucks for a diagnostics even if you pay a tech 12bucks an hour instead of min wage or whatever they get you got plenty of time.

as for the store, its funny how it works. the more incompetent the employee the more money they make.
whats to fix?

 

[jpeyton]

Regardless of what explanation was given by the customer at drop-off, for that particular error, the first and second things any decent troubleshooter would do is check the physical hard drive connection, and check the BIOS.

Do the simple things first. Both those checks can be done in a few minutes maximum.

If the physical connection and BIOS are fine, and the problem persists, move on to more advanced tests like full hard drive scans. That can take several hours (depending on the size of the drive).

If the hard drive is in good working condition, and problem still persists, its time to check the motherboard for a dead connector. This is probably the least likely possibility, but worth checking.

That's my checklist, anyways.

 

[fierydemise]

I think I would have caught the error, although it was a poor test. Sure an average person could change something in the bias but the chances of that happening are really low and while the CC and BB techs should have caught the problem the conclusions they came too were not unreasonable without knowing exactly what they were told. There was a better test done by the BBC IIRC, they scraped off part of the contact on a piece of RAM and of the 6 companies tested 4 got it wrong and the 2 that got it right tried to charge $100 for a 256MB piece of RAM.

 

[mcmilljb]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Regardless of what explanation was given by the customer at drop-off, for that particular error, the first and second things any decent troubleshooter would do is check the physical hard drive connection, and check the BIOS.

Do the simple things first. Both those checks can be done in a few minutes maximum.

If the physical connection and BIOS are fine, and the problem persists, move on to more advanced tests like full hard drive scans. That can take several hours (depending on the size of the drive).

If the hard drive is in good working condition, and problem still persists, its time to check the motherboard for a dead connector. This is probably the least likely possibility, but worth checking.

That's my checklist, anyways.

I just watched the video again, and I couldn't see exactly what he did. What I think he did was disable all the boot options for the hard drive. He could have disabled sata/ide, but I have a hard time believing they couldn't see that there are no disks present when the screen comes up! Now if I see a hard drive present and get the error message, what should I think? Hmmm, might be time to run the diagnostics. When I pop the cd in to run the diagnostics, have to check the boot options to make sure the cd boots! Problem discovered and fixed in the BIOS. I think that's what they were going for. Considering MicroCenter didn't do it like that, I assume the techs just saw that it was getting that error message probably just sat it on the queue like all the others thinking it might need some actual work.

*edit*
The scary part is the Geek Squad guy. I think he was just trying to sell a hard drive and an operating system installation. The other sad part is Firedog wanted to get paid, and they didn't even touch it. Had they been honest and did work, they would have fixed it.