#Gamergate, the war on nerds, and the corruption of the left and the free press

[Phanuel]

You're asking for a literal impossibility.

This is exactly like asking for men to stop being rapists (which we pretty much aren't unless counting sex under the influence as rape and then... RAAAAPPPE, rape everywhere!) and stop hanging out with women drinking.

Instead of telling women to take care of themselves and don't put themselves into situations where they are willingly reducing their functionality and inhibitions around members of the opposite sex and then hooking up.

Which of these is a more likely solution to a problem? If you come back with victim blaming you're refusing to let women be adults and be responsible for themselves.

Stop infantizing women in order to castrate men.



Edit; here's a fun one. Would you have ever gotten laid/had a girlfriend/married/had children if you were never allowed to speak to women ever? I'm guessing no.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Edit; here's a fun one. Would you have ever gotten laid/had a girlfriend/married/had children if you were never allowed to speak to women ever? I'm guessing no.

I know I met my wife when I heard her speak in a video game server and I spent the next 45 minutes following her around going "TITS TITS TITS TITS TITS." That's just basic biology.

 

[MrPickins]

You're asking for a literal impossibility.

This is exactly like asking for men to stop being rapists (which we pretty much aren't unless counting sex under the influence as rape and then... RAAAAPPPE, rape everywhere!) and stop hanging out with women drinking.

Instead of telling women to take care of themselves and don't put themselves into situations where they are willingly reducing their functionality and inhibitions around members of the opposite sex and then hooking up.

Which of these is a more likely solution to a problem? If you come back with victim blaming you're refusing to let women be adults and be responsible for themselves.

Stop infantizing women in order to castrate men.



Edit; here's a fun one. Would you have ever gotten laid/had a girlfriend/married/had children if you were never allowed to speak to women ever? I'm guessing no.

I don't even know how to respond to this trainwreck of a post other than to say that it's perfectly possible to talk to a woman without harassing her.

That, and you seem to have serious issues...

 

[CitizenKain]

Male gamer asks a female sounding gamer if she is single, response: "WTF, ASSHOLE, I DON'T WANT TO BE HARASSED, GET THE FUCK OUT OF THIS GAME AND LEAVE ME ALONE!"

Female gamer asking male gamer the same- very difference response.

Look at you inventing a fun little story. You left off the part where the male gamer has asked the women that constantly for the last 5 minutes and has been politely rejected each time.

What is your solution to online harassment against women?

Men are going to actively pursue women due to basic biology.

If a woman wants to limit "harassment" received from the opposite gender, never revealing their sex is a start. Not talking on voice com is a good follow up. Doing both of these will pretty much shield you from 99.999999999% of male attention.

It's rare that I use voice coms.

So as long as they don't talk to anyone in game, they are free to play. Otherwise they deserve and should be expected to be harrased every minute they play. This is acceptable why?

Its not basic biology, its called some people are worthless assholes that shouldn't be allowed to interact with normal humans. I played WoW a long time ago and women were able to interact with people in the guild, and if someone harrassed them, that person was kicked out. If they took it off vent, then they went to GMs in game who solved the problem.

 

[Exophase]

The only way to curb the harassment is to have the entire community stand up and say that it's not ok and that those participating it will be ostracized.

Instead, you advocate the opposite.

Unfortunately you can't really get that by having anonymity without moderation, and studies like this are specifically looking at places with anonymity without moderation. Unless you're hoping for a situation where there's constant shouting where people try to drown out the dregs.

I looked at some of the sample negative comments and it blows my mind that people actually say things like this to strangers. The only place I've seen something like this happen is Youtube, and let's just say I'm not very invested in reading Youtube comments (and needless to say, I don't bother reading stuff on chans)

The study makes the claim that showing anonymity without moderation removes a filter that gives a more honest impression of what people are really like. I don't think this comes even close to telling the whole story. This sort of environment lets the worst people speak the loudest (not because they're allowed to speak more loudly, more than they're allowed to speak and happen to be loud) - that in turn makes a lot of the more reasonable people want to leave for places that are moderated. Which in turn increases the environment's reputation as a shithole. Which attracts more new jerks wanting to outdo the current jerks. So in the end it really does have a bias towards much worse people.

The environment studied isn't the worst possible result of this since people still have a unified interest in just playing the game, but it's still pretty bad, and I'm told there are much better places you can go for Halo 3 alone. To see the worst of it you have to take anonymity without moderation and remove purpose or focus, ala /b.

 

[CitizenKain]

This is exactly like asking for men to stop being rapists (which we pretty much aren't unless counting sex under the influence as rape and then... RAAAAPPPE, rape everywhere!) and stop hanging out with women drinking.

If you have sex with someone who can't give consent, that is pretty much rape. Guess that explains a lot about you there.

 

[Chiropteran]

Look at you inventing a fun little story. You left off the part where the male gamer has asked the women that constantly for the last 5 minutes and has been politely rejected each time.

So you are another one of the chauvinist pigs who think women are too stupid to use a /ignore function?

Women aren't that dumb. They do have brains, and free will. You can't harass someone in a video game that has /ignore functionality unless they are consciously allowing you to do so.

 

[BoberFett]

You are terribly mean to me but I return only love and kisses.

You're mean to everyone.

 

[Exophase]

Why are so many of you so invested in this constant shit slinging? What are you getting out of it?

 

[BoberFett]

I don't even know how to respond to this trainwreck of a post other than to say that it's perfectly possible to talk to a woman without harassing her.

You'd think so, but you'd be wrong.

Just look at the whole Rebecca Watson affair. Asking a woman to coffee is "harassment" to the wrong feminist.

Or the Adria Richards fiasco. Make a relatively innocuous joke to your friend and get internet shamed and ultimately fired because of a feminist.

 

[MrPickins]

You'd think so, but you'd be wrong.

Just look at the whole Rebecca Watson affair. Asking a woman to coffee is "harassment" to the wrong feminist.

Or the Adria Richards fiasco. Make a relatively innocuous joke to your friend and get internet shamed and ultimately fired because of a feminist.

Yes, let's all use extreme examples and call them the norm!

 

[BoberFett]

Yes, let's all use extreme examples and call them the norm!

That seems to be how things are done now. How else do you think the term "rape culture" came to be? Take the outliers and convince people that they're the rule.

Further, what makes you think that they're not the norm? Have you ever read the misandrist tripe that gets posted on popular sites such as Jezebel?

 

[JSt0rm]

You'd think so, but you'd be wrong.

Just look at the whole Rebecca Watson affair. Asking a woman to coffee is "harassment" to the wrong feminist.

Or the Adria Richards fiasco. Make a relatively innocuous joke to your friend and get internet shamed and ultimately fired because of a feminist.

basically if you are ugly and poor stop talking to women. If you are hot, in shape, rich and alpha say what you want.

 

[Nebor]

basically if you are ugly and poor stop talking to women. If you are hot, in shape, rich and alpha say what you want.

 

[Victorian Gray]

 

[JSt0rm]

Its about ethics in gaming journalism.

 

[MrPickins]

That seems to be how things are done now. How else do you think the term "rape culture" came to be? Take the outliers and convince people that they're the rule.

Further, what makes you think that they're not the norm? Have you ever read the misandrist tripe that gets posted on popular sites such as Jezebel?

Umm, my interaction with actual women? You know, offline, in person?

 

[JSt0rm]

Umm, my interaction with actual women? You know, offline, in person?

But we only deal in extremes round these parts.

 

[norseamd]

Everything in this discussion is important but notably he talks about some of the problems of feminism starting at around 15:50 and going on for a few minutes or so.

http://www.c-span.org/video/?324708-1/sir-david-cannadine-undivided-past

 

[BoberFett]

basically if you are ugly and poor stop talking to women. If you are hot, in shape, rich and alpha say what you want.

More or less. You'd think feminists would be against that sort of thing, but being the hypocrites (read: human) they are, it's not surprising they're all about appearances.

 

[BoberFett]

Umm, my interaction with actual women? You know, offline, in person?

Clearly you've never met one of these new feminists. They're as crazy in real life as they are on the internet.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Women aren't that dumb. They do have brains, and free will. You can't harass someone in a video game that has /ignore functionality unless they are consciously allowing you to do so.

Yes you can. In Counter-strike, for example, you can flashbang people on your team, block doorways, stand in front of people trying to use a sniper rifle, team attack (even with friendly fire off, hitting your teammate in the head causes their view to bounce), jump on teammates' heads to limit their mobility and spam radio commands that aren't covered with the ignore function. You used to be able to stick teammates in place with smoke grenades, and you can still use smoke grenades to break physics models on certain maps. Griefing is unfortunately common and without dedicated people administering servers, they can devolve into a shitshow in no time at all. That's just one game, but you can do similar things in all matter of online games. If you think harassment is limited to communication, you don't have much experience gaming online.

 

[blankslate]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-33613781

A new study has found that men who harass women online are actual losers - at least when it comes to video games.

Two researchers analysed how men treated women while playing 163 games of Halo 3.
Men who performed poorly in the games responded by being hostile to female players.
The male winners were mostly pleasant to other players, while the losing men made unsavoury comments to female players.

"Low-status males that have the most to lose due to a hierarchical reconfiguration are responding to the threat female competitors pose," the researchers, from the University of New South Wales and the Miami University in Ohio, write. "High-status males with the least to fear were more positive."

In Halo 3, players are anonymous and only interact with each other by voice a few times during the game. Most Halo players are men.

When performing poorly, players increased negative statements toward women and submissive statements toward the men who were winning.

"As men often rely on aggression to maintain their dominant social status, the increase in hostility towards a woman by lower-status males may be an attempt to disregard a female's performance," the researchers write.

Male players were thrown off by hearing female voices during the game. The researchers think their results suggest that young males should be taught that losing to women is not "socially debilitating".

The results also suggest that video games may be reinforcing gender segregation and potentially promoting sexist behaviours, especially troubling since so many "gamers" are teenagers.

Seems like some people should be playing more and posting less about "Ethics"


.....

 

[MrPickins]

Clearly you've never met one of these new feminists. They're as crazy in real life as they are on the internet.

And they are exceedingly rare, just very vocal.

They don't represent feminism any more than right wing militant groups represent the Republican Party

 

[Blue_Max]

And they are exceedingly rare, just very vocal.

They don't represent feminism any more than right wing militant groups represent the Republican Party

Bullshit. Just look at the demonstrations that pretty much every single university and college gender studies group put on every year. They're required to do this as part of the course, so this type of behaviour is taught, encouraged, rewarded, and penalized for failure to comply.

THIS is everyday feminism. Patriarchy theory, "gender is a construct", "every man will be a rapist and abuser if you don't pound out that 'toxic masculinity'", job gap, wage gap, representation gap, etc. etc. etc. That's all modern 3rd-wave mainstream feminism, not radicals.