(gamegpu.ru) assassins-creed-syndicate-test

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.
Status
Not open for further replies.

.vodka

Golden Member
Dec 5, 2014
1,203
1,537
136
980Ti/TX maxed out at 40FPS, lol. Gotta start making gimpworks, maxwell edition so that there's a reason to buy Pascal, starting now. At least 290X/390X and 780Ti are performing similarly enough and both under the 970, like in other gimpworks games. So there's that.

Either that, or the game needs 5-6 patches like Unity to start performing as it should, plus a few drivers from both camps. Is the game visually appealing enough to justify those cringe inducing framerates from such powerful hardware?


I wonder how this kind of game would run on an engine like Frostbite, especially what's been shown on Battlefront lately, in both visuals and gameplay.

What a mess.
 
Last edited:

RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
19,458
765
126
Hyper 212 Evo = over hyped junk. Get a Phanteks or Noctua cpu cooler...or even an Enermax. Extremely easy to install, and excellent performance with little to no noise.

You missed the most best one - $40 Thermalright True Spirit 140. There is no CPU cooler from any of the brands you mentioned that even comes close for the price, performance and noise levels.
http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/71...irit-140-bw-rev-cpu-cooler-review/index6.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/noctua-nh-d15_5.html#sect0

I agree that Hyper 212 Evo is one of the most overhyped products, along with Arctic Silver 5. Herd/sheep mentality sells these products since they are popular.

Don't say "You guys". Blame yourself. You should ultimately make the decision. And people recommended me the i5 too. I said screw that, the i7 is clearly the best processor for longevity considering how long intel processors last, you definitely should get the extra threads and clockspeed.

It's also what I recommend.

This forum loves to defend the performance of i3s and i5s and ignore i7s. How many times have you read people crap all over the i7 2600K suggesting it was a waste of $100 over 2500K? However, for this particular game, his OC i5 is not the problem. This game is so horribly optimized that it hammers Fury X CF and 980Ti SLI at 1080P UQ. :thumbsdown:

With SC2: Legacy of the Void, Witcher 3, Dying Light, GTA V, FO4, BO3, MGS:V, Rainbox 6 Siege, Just Cause 3, Ori the Blind Forest, Pillars of Eternity, Division Original Sin Enhanced Edition, Mad Max, Rocket League, and some other cool console games (Bloodborne, Rise of the Tomb Raider, Forza Motorsport 6, Uncharted Collection, etc.), AC Syndicate is hopelessly outclassed.

I don't even know why developers keep using PCSS or any other soft shadowing technique when just about every realtime software shadow approximation is bad ...

http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTQzMjQ0NjMyNWt1bjU1ODVvcmFfNF82X2wucG5n

More often than not it just destroys shadow quality like it shows above ...

Thanks for linking that. I linked to that image some months ago saying how unnatural that looks and some PC gamers actually preferred the incorrect PCSS shadows. NV's programmers spend way too much time focusing on algorithms and math and not spending time with photographers and outdoors.

Shadows4.jpg

shadow.jpg

133589.jpg.700

328068.jpg

960.jpg

drone_3.jpg

200244697-001-people-standing-in-queue-casting-shadows-gettyimages.jpg


NV's PCSS implementation is the complete opposite of what happens in real life.

1432446325kun5585ora_4_6_l.png


Soft shadows in the real world are not what NV thinks they are. It does not mean that the character is floating on the ground and the shadow is soft around him, especially closest to the object. Also, as you pointed out, soft shadows doesn't mean that suddenly all of the details of the object casting the shadow become a blurry mess and patches.
 
Last edited:
Feb 19, 2009
10,457
10
76
980Ti/TX maxed out at 40FPS, lol. Gotta start making gimpworks, maxwell edition so that there's a reason to buy Pascal, starting now. At least 290X/390X and 780Ti are performing similarly enough and both under the 970, like in other gimpworks games. So there's that.

Either that, or the game needs 5-6 patches like Unity to start performing as it should, plus a few drivers from both camps. Is the game visually appealing enough to justify those cringe inducing framerates from such powerful hardware?


I wonder how this kind of game would run on an engine like Frostbite, especially what's been shown on Battlefront lately, in both visuals and gameplay.

What a mess.

The game runs great with GW features not maxed out. Gamers are reporting major fps drop running them on Ultra, despite not looking any different. Not unless you analyze screenshots zoomed in.

Here's the most stupid thing about soft-shadows in general.

1. Let's use high resolution shadow maps to get accurately detailed shadows that are crisp & sharp. Right? Looks good.

2. Let's blur the crap out of it with PCSS so now its a blurry mess losing all that fine detail. Let's make it tank performance while we're at it.

Smart? Well yes, if done appropriately, ie. blurring on very distant shadow cast, sharp on closer shadows, without a major performance hit (GTA V's Rockstar implementation).

Well here's a trend, because TXAA absolutely kills image quality with its blurfest, so there's no point having textures and filtering on Ultra since now they game looks like its on low/medium.

More cinematic? Please.
 

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
20,378
145
106
Hilarious considering R9 295X2 is 56% faster at 1440P achieving 64 fps averages vs. 41 fps avg for a 980 under the same settings.

Yup, 980 sounds like it was a great investment. :D

Yep, imagine spending 1000€ or so on a 500W space heater that would eat money via the power bill as fast as a hummer can go through fuel. And then have to deal with all the multi GPU and driver issues.

http://geizhals.at/?fs=295X2&in=

It certainly was a great investment! :D
 

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
20,378
145
106
This is the type of thing I don't understand from the crowd who loves Nvidia. They see a game in which Nvidia is ahead and immediately go "This is why you should buy Nvidia."

Yes, Nvidia has better performance.....

But even a Titan X is struggling in this game at 1080p. EVERY GPU is struggling in this game. So Gameworks arrives, every GPU takes a massive hit, but at least Nvidia is on top?

Because I can't see many people being happy about the amazing performance they're getting when GTX 980Ti's are getting 30-40 FPS at 1080p, those GTX 970 owners must be VERY excited.

You can just lower the settings cant you? Imagine having the option for higher graphics settings...

If a game runs at 200FPS people complain at that too. Its a funny mix between those feeling entitled to ultra settings and those demanding more graphics requirement to push development so we dont end in IGP land.
 

tential

Diamond Member
May 13, 2008
7,348
642
121
You can just lower the settings cant you? Imagine having the option for higher graphics settings...

If a game runs at 200FPS people complain at that too. Its a funny mix between those feeling entitled to ultra settings and those demanding more graphics requirement to push development so we dont end in IGP land.

If you want to argue that the game is well optimized and that you just have to turn down settings, be my guest....
 

SimianR

Senior member
Mar 10, 2011
609
16
81
The GTX980 purchase rewards again. And no wonder the GTX970 is the best selling card far ahead of everything else on steam.

Maybe AMD performance will improve whenever they release a game ready driver.

The 970 is the best selling card because in a one off title that seems to perform like crap across the board it edges out AMD cards but still performs like crap? The 390 is generally ahead of the 970 across the board. Interesting conclusion.
 

Teizo

Golden Member
Oct 28, 2010
1,271
31
91
By the way...MSAA is forked in this game. FXAA is fine and is the best way to go. Not sure, why..but you get the MSAA performance hit but it doesn't work. I get 55-85 fps with Ultra High textures with FXAA, PCSS, and HBAO+ which is more than fine considering this game plays like Splinter Cell. Now, for them to patch the game because graphically it is nice and since game play is like Splinter Cell (in some regards)...it is a nice change of pace for me from BF4.

There are options for PCSS Ultra and HBAO+ Ultra, but the IQ difference is not worth the FPS hit.
 

Teizo

Golden Member
Oct 28, 2010
1,271
31
91
The 970 is the best selling card because in a one off title that seems to perform like crap across the board it edges out AMD cards but still performs like crap? The 390 is generally ahead of the 970 across the board. Interesting conclusion.

Overall, the 970 is better than the 390 factoring in overclocks....which is probably why it has better overall sales. However, the 390 is a good card for sure and for people who prefer Radeon cards then you certainly can't go wrong with it.
 

SimianR

Senior member
Mar 10, 2011
609
16
81
I am just referring to what people actually buy.

Try this:
http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/

Yup - and I was referring to your theory about why they buy it. On Reddit for example, the 970 was the default card in what seemed like every new build in /r/buildapc for quite awhile. At one point someone made a thread saying "why is this default card when the 390 is the better value, etc" with people posting links/benchmarks/deals on the 390. As time went on you started to see the 390 pop up in more and more builds. My point is, yes the 970 is a good card, but a lot of sales at the end of the day come from marketing, word of mouth, etc and that stuff doesn't change over night. And yes - before you say it, AMD still has some work to do on getting those day one drivers out there. Ubisoft doesn't exactly have the best rep for launching well performing, bug free games though. So the situation is really not quite as black and white as it seems.

Overall, the 970 is better than the 390 factoring in overclocks....which is probably why it has better overall sales. However, the 390 is a good card for sure and for people who prefer Radeon cards then you certainly can't go wrong with it.
I'm not really convinced that the average joe is buying the 970 because at max overclocks it's faster than the 390 (probably by quite a small margin as well). I don't think most people assume they'll win the silicon lottery and get a beast of an overclocking card anyway. I'm more convinced that for almost a year when it was still only the AMD 200 series cards that were available (which had the reputation for being hot/loud from reference coolers) they generally went the NVIDIA option without even considering an AMD card. To be honest - I don't think you can really go wrong with either choice - just that it in this case it seems pretty one sided when it shouldn't be.
 
Last edited:

DarkKnightDude

Senior member
Mar 10, 2011
981
44
91
An Assassin's creed game with poor performance? Can't say I'm too surprised.

Unity looks better honestly.
 

master_shake_

Diamond Member
May 22, 2012
6,425
291
121
Assassins's creed games and performance both went to hell after revelations.

quit milking this dead cow and end it already.
 

crisium

Platinum Member
Aug 19, 2001
2,643
615
136
Overall, the 970 is better than the 390 factoring in overclocks....which is probably why it has better overall sales. However, the 390 is a good card for sure and for people who prefer Radeon cards then you certainly can't go wrong with it.

I assume you have a comparison of a max OC 970 vs a 390? Such as here where the 390 is still faster?

The 970 sells more due to a combination of Nvidia branding and power efficiency. Now before anyone has a fanboy heart attack here, the Nvidia branding includes both real tenable features and "opinions" due to advertising.

Performance and price-to-performance does not drive the GPU market as much anymore as in the old days.
 

Teizo

Golden Member
Oct 28, 2010
1,271
31
91
I assume you have a comparison of a max OC 970 vs a 390? Such as here where the 390 is still faster?

The 970 sells more due to a combination of Nvidia branding and power efficiency. Now before anyone has a fanboy heart attack here, the Nvidia branding includes both real tenable features and "opinions" due to advertising.

Performance and price-to-performance does not drive the GPU market as much anymore as in the old days.

Saw that video. JayZ and his sexual innuendo and goofy mannerisms get old. I still subscribe to him though because he is trust worthy and knows what he is doing. That MSI 390 is a good card. I almost bought it originally after watching that video, but going by the [H] review of the 390 according to them the 970 had the slight edge . They are very close in performance, but the power efficiency of the 970 makes it a better buy imho, and especially after the easy to obtain OC of 1500/8000 which brings the 970 to within 10% or so of a 980. But, nothing 'wrong' with the 390 if you prefer Radeon over Nvidia. It will perhaps over time hold it's own a bit better @ 1440p than the 970, but most people who use 1440p monitors are going to use a 390X/980 or higher (of which there the 390X is probably the better choice given the price point of $420 for the MSI Gaming 390X).
 
Last edited:
Feb 19, 2009
10,457
10
76
but going by the [H] review of the 390 according to them the 970 had the slight edge

[H] GPU reviews are useful if you want to know how well AMD GPUs run in mostly GameWorks titles. If that's the titles you play, then Maxwell is superior. Just look at the result for this thread and the recent Fallout 4 with God Rays on Ultra that most sites love to test.
 

Innokentij

Senior member
Jan 14, 2014
237
7
81
Ahh ubisoft, after AC Black flag u just keep pumping out shitty ports, but dont blame the french they dont even make the port, AC black flag was ported by a polish company, duno who made unity or this new one as i havent played it and didnt see end credits where i noticed it last time. To lazy to google something when it comes to ubisoft games since i stay away.
 

Skurge

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2009
5,195
1
71
CF owners must be laughing. SLI isn't working. What the hell did that game ready driver do exactly? This keeps happening, Nvidia keep releasing game ready drivers that don't really do much tbh.
 

sontin

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2011
3,273
149
106
I don't even know why developers keep using PCSS or any other soft shadowing technique when just about every realtime software shadow approximation is bad ...

http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTQzMjQ0NjMyNWt1bjU1ODVvcmFfNF82X2wucG5n

More often than not it just destroys shadow quality like it shows above ...

Yeah, dont care about reality, right?
AMD's shadows in GTX5 are or were just broken. Hard shadows from the source to the furthest point are not realistic.

That's the reason why someone would use PCSS.
 
Last edited:

StrangerGuy

Diamond Member
May 9, 2004
8,443
124
106
980Ti/TX maxed out at 40FPS, lol. Gotta start making gimpworks, maxwell edition so that there's a reason to buy Pascal, starting now. At least 290X/390X and 780Ti are performing similarly enough and both under the 970, like in other gimpworks games. So there's that.

Either that, or the game needs 5-6 patches like Unity to start performing as it should, plus a few drivers from both camps. Is the game visually appealing enough to justify those cringe inducing framerates from such powerful hardware?


I wonder how this kind of game would run on an engine like Frostbite, especially what's been shown on Battlefront lately, in both visuals and gameplay.

What a mess.

Exactly. All the AMD vs NV myopic red herring crap needs to go, when all of us should be enraged by how ridiculously incompetent the general AAA PC gaming industry has become when it comes to optimization.
 

ThatBuzzkiller

Golden Member
Nov 14, 2014
1,120
260
136
Yeah, dont care about reality, right?
AMD's shadows in GTX5 are or were just broken. Hard shadows from the source to the furthest point are not realistic.

That's the reason why someone would use PCSS.

LOL, like PCSS even comes close to reality and the same goes for AMD CHS or the others ... :rolleyes:

If I want near physically correct results, I would stay the hell away from PCSS and embrace a path tracer or other monte carlo ray tracers ...

When it comes to image quality PCSS is EASILY the one of the WORST soft shadowing techniques available ...

There's just simply not enough information to make PCSS work when you only have a single layer shadow map to work with ...
 

sontin

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2011
3,273
149
106
Here is picture from the real world:
Travertin-Platten-Medium-Line-auf-Terrasse-mit-Palme_f6688e2838.jpg


And this is one from Syndicate:
assassins-creed-syndicate-shadow-quality-001-pcss.png


It looks more realistic. But that doesnt mean you must like it.
Ubisoft's shadows are just bad: Either they are low quality and only sharp or they are just blurry.
 
Last edited:

ThatBuzzkiller

Golden Member
Nov 14, 2014
1,120
260
136
Here is picture from the real world:
Travertin-Platten-Medium-Line-auf-Terrasse-mit-Palme_f6688e2838.jpg


And this is one from Syndicate:
assassins-creed-syndicate-shadow-quality-001-pcss.png


It looks more realistic. But that doesnt mean you must like it.
Ubisoft's shadows are just bad: Either they are low quality and only sharp or they are just blurry.

Your comparison between real world and PCSS is irrelevant when we don't even know the lighting conditions from each ...

You just further proved my point about why PCSS lowers shadow quality from your second picture ...

For a scene with strong amounts of direct illumination and occlusion, hard shadows are supposed to take precedence over soft shadows ...

Just where exactly are the shadow casting leaves ?

Face it, single layered soft shadows like PCSS is absolute rubbish when it comes to both quality AND sometimes plausibility ...

You'd have to compute an expensive integral to even get near correct results or use sophisticated volumetric shadow mapping techniques like deep shadow maps or the Intel approximation like AVSM ...
 

sontin

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2011
3,273
149
106
The lighting conditions are pretty similiar - the sun.

And like in the real world picture the shadows are getting blurrier with the distance from the object in Syndicate.

Maybe you should show us a example with proof your point.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.