Game Day Thread: Iowa Caucuses

[thilanliyan]

This is getting off topic. But I find the false equivalency interesting. Especially the "capitalism is always much worse" stance.

I don't agree 100% with the communist version of socialism, but I'm not sure you can blame all those deaths on socialism per se...they also had to do with the psychopaths at the helm.

 

[cytg111]

I mean why is Biden polling poorly here? Is it the GRU Ukraine psy ops campaign starring the GOP and Trump or is it his own doing? If it is his own doing and/or Biden was never the man to take down Trump to begin with it has the nice side prize of the whole Ukraine fairy tale to be wasted effort on Russia and Trumps behalf.

 

[IronWing]

I mean why is Biden polling poorly here? Is it the GRU Ukraine psy ops campaign starring the GOP and Trump or is it his own doing? If it is his own doing and/or Biden was never the man to take down Trump to begin with it has the nice side prize of the whole Ukraine fairy tale to be wasted effort on Russia and Trumps behalf.

Biden doing poorly calls into question the "RIGGED!" and "Iowa is just a bunch of lily conservative white geezers" claims in this thread.

 

[KMFJD]

And how many were killed as a result of the American and British empires? How many people have been starved by American sanctions? How many killed by the polluted air and water of capitalism? I'm quite comfortable that these numbers dwarf the finest work of Mao and Stalin.

Capitalism is just fine and dandy with people dying though, it has no morals

 

[SteveGrabowski]

American politics is weird.

You have a bunch of people who appear to hate the Democratic party trying to vote for some who isn't a member of the Democratic party to be leader of the Democratic party and then getting surprised that the existing members of the Democratic party who have worked for the party for decades aren't massively enthused about this.

What's weird is the Democratic party pretends to be the party of Franklin Delano Roosevelt so when we finally get someone very in line with Roosevelt's plan for the nation the party tries to destroy him. Bill Clinton winning the presidency is the worst thing to ever happen to the Democratic party since it took them right. And then of course the GOP went even harder right thanks too pieces of shit like Limbaugh and Hannity radicalizing their base not long after.

Sanders absolutely would have been a Democrat 80-90 years ago when it was a liberal party.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Sure, the millenials you know, maybe.

But come out of your bubble and smell the wider demographics, please. From that noted right wing rag, Huff Post:

Turns Out White Millennials Are Just As Conservative As Their Parents
Democrats hoping for younger voters to reduce the country’s political and racial divide could be disappointed.

Au contraire, I think it's unforgivably blind to his clear and present danger not to. First things first . . . then, we can work together for true, democratic progress.

A (very possible) Trump re-election would be a tragedy. His current term sure is.

Our house is burning. Now is not the time to consider new lawn ornaments or which flowers to plant.

What's really fun is to compare 2016 (what your article is citing) to 2018.
2016 by age and race:

2018:


Blue shift in literally every single category.

Citations:

https://www.cnn.com/election/2016/results/exit-polls

2018 midterms: EXIT POLLING | CNN

View CNN's 2018 election exit polls for Senate, House and governor races, including information on how different races, genders and age groups voted. For midterm election results, visit cnn.com/election.

www.cnn.com

 

[cytg111]

I don't agree 100% with the communist version of socialism, but I'm not sure you can blame all those deaths on socialism per se...they also had to do with the psychopaths at the helm.

Socialism is just looking out for your brothers and sisters... Any form of government that does not have seperation of powers always turns into a shitshow for the masses, call it what you will.

 

[mect]

Sure, the millenials you know, maybe.

But come out of your bubble and smell the wider demographics, please. From that noted right wing rag, Huff Post:

Turns Out White Millennials Are Just As Conservative As Their Parents
Democrats hoping for younger voters to reduce the country’s political and racial divide could be disappointed.

Au contraire, I think it's unforgivably blind to his clear and present danger not to. First things first . . . then, we can work together for true, democratic progress.

A (very possible) Trump re-election would be a tragedy. His current term sure is.

Our house is burning. Now is not the time to consider new lawn ornaments or which flowers to plant.

Maybe you should do the same. Get out of your bubble. My bubble doesn't have many progressives, period. I live in one of the reddest counties in America. So people around me in general won't vote for any Dem candidate. But I read the news, and many sources of the news. I haven't seen anything indicating Sanders can't win. I prefer to put out the fire in such a way that it won't flare back up even worse than last time.

Also, read your whole headline. There are more people out there than just whites.

70% of millennials say they'd vote for a socialist

And half say they have an unfavorable view of capitalism.

www.axios.com

 

[soulcougher73]

Man, it's early, but it looks like Biden is getting wiped.

Don't worry, he is the "establishment choice". He will get the nomination one way or another

 

[ElFenix]

well guys, we fucked this up pretty bad, can anyone think of anything we could do worse?

iowa democrats: hold my beer

https://twitter.com/x/status/1224747184857288704

 

[SMOGZINN]

I don't agree 100% with the communist version of socialism, but I'm not sure you can blame all those deaths on socialism per se...they also had to do with the psychopaths at the helm.

They might have called themselves communist, but none of the countries were actually communist in practice, and socialism had little to do with the problems those countries have had. They have all been some form of totalitarian dictatorship, and that was their main problem.
Socialism is not the boogyman that the GOP wants you to think. Medicare, Social Security, and public schooling is all varying degrees of socialism. In fact if the government does it, it is by definition a type of socialism. It is not a all or nothing game, it can, and should, peacefully coexist with the American type of Capitalism.

So, while the GOP tells you ghost stories about how the big bad socialism is coming to get you, the real monster is Totalitarianism, which they are inviting in the front door.

 

[uallas5]

Just saying it would be an obvious GRU op.

At this point do you think most people in the GOP would care if it was?

 

[cytg111]

Team Trump is rocking a state of the art razor sharp lethal cambridge analytica team..... meanwhile Dems are trying to get one app with one button to work properly.... magic 8-ball? Outlook not so good.

 

[cytg111]

At this point do you think most people in the GOP would care if it was?

Of course not. In 20 years we will learn that many of them knew about it before hand. I dont think you can make a clear distinction between Russia, Russian Intelligence operations and the GOP + Trump anymore. I think you are utterly fucked if you keep bringing knives to gunfights.

 

[Bitek]

He can set the tone, but the house and senate will be the ones drafting bills for him to sign. You believe if they send him small wins, he'd veto them out of idealism?

The problem would start from the beginning.

Let's keep 2009 as our recent history.
Lots of time and political capital burnt on HC.

What's Bernie's top priorities? He "wrote the damn m4a bill", so there is no realistic way it's not that legislation that gets worked on, and likely first as that's his signature issue.

Nancy is proud of Obamacare, she passed it, maybe she'll try and steer Bernie back to it, but really? That's likely to happen?

That's the Biden path anyway, so why do I need Bernie?

Ds will be lucky to get a majority in the Senate.
60 is not going to happen.

So say we stay on the Bernie path, how many months of committee hearings, protests and death panel bullshit are we going to go through?
It's 20% of the economy, millions of jobs impacted, no way they are doing a TCJA rush job in the middle of the night on this.
And we're getting 60 votes how?

So after all that wasted time, we do what, when does Bernie call an audible and go back to the Biden Ocare plan?

Then there's the inevitable midterm bloodbath. Can Ds keep the house? Or is it 2010 all over again.

Then you can kiss the green new deal stuff goodbye when the Rs take back the house, and well be lucky if anything gets done before that.

 

[Bitek]

well guys, we fucked this up pretty bad, can anyone think of anything we could do worse?

iowa democrats: hold my beer

https://twitter.com/x/status/1224747184857288704

Put out 100%, or don't put out any.

This is stupid AF and guaranteed to cause controversy and pandemonium.

Trump will be gloating in the sotu.. ugh

 

[hal2kilo]

What's weird is the Democratic party pretends to be the party of Franklin Delano Roosevelt so when we finally get someone very in line with Roosevelt's plan for the nation the party tries to destroy him. Bill Clinton winning the presidency is the worst thing to ever happen to the Democratic party since it took them right. And then of course the GOP went even harder right thanks too pieces of shit like Limbaugh and Hannity radicalizing their base not long after.

Sanders absolutely would have been a Democrat 80-90 years ago when it was a liberal party.

Not so much. You seem to forget about the Dixiecrats influence into the early seventies. Roosevelt had his hands full dealing with that faction.

 

[SMOGZINN]

So say we stay on the Bernie path, how many months of committee hearings, protests and death panel bullshit are we going to go through?
It's 20% of the economy, millions of jobs impacted, no way they are doing a TCJA rush job in the middle of the night on this.
And we're getting 60 votes how?

Here is what they should do. If the Dems take the WH and Senate they should borrow Mitch's playbook and tell the Republicans that they are no longer needed and change any rules needed to pass their legislation expeditiously.

 

[thilanliyan]

Dems take the WH and Senate

How likely is that?

 

[SMOGZINN]

How likely is that?

I don't know. I think it is possible that Trumps antics will get Dem voters out in force which could mean that the Dems take both.
It is also possible that the feelings of hopelessness wins and they hardly show up at all, in which case the GOP is free to finish making the US into a White Male Christian Dictatorship.

 

[cytg111]

Here is what they should do. If the Dems take the WH and Senate they should borrow Mitch's playbook and tell the Republicans that they are no longer needed and change any rules needed to pass their legislation expeditiously.

pass legislation that renders the GOP a domestic terrorist organisation?

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

How likely is that?

Just gonna leave these here, link above from 2018 exit polls.


The numbers are NOT in favor of the incumbent.

 

[ultimatebob]

Right now Fox is beating this CF to death with statements like "How can the Democrats fix Healthcare if they can't run a Caucus" and crap like that. This just directly feeds into Trump's narrative of how you can't trust elections. His campaign manager is adding to the discord by tweeting about how the Caucus was "rigged"

I didn't need the help of Fox News to figure out that the Iowa Dems screwed up this caucus. I figured it out on my own, thanks.

 

[woolfe9998]

Looks like turnout was similar to 2016, and much less than in 2008. That is not good.

Early Iowa turnout signs point to lagging Democratic enthusiasm

There's still a lot we don't know about the 2020 Iowa Democratic caucuses, including who won the contest.

www.cnn.com

And more:

In the final two polls before the midterms, Democrats and Democratic-leaning independent voters had an advantage over Republicans and Republican-leaning independents. An average of 65% of the Democratic group said they were extremely or very enthusiastic. This beat the average 58% of the Republican group.
Our last two polls for 2020 show something different. The 7-point Democratic lead on the extremely or very enthusiastic question has turned into a 7-point Republican lead on enthusiasm.

If Iowa is not an anomaly and turnout continues at this pace during the primary, then we're in trouble in November. I honestly don't understand what is wrong with someone who is not highly motivated to vote this year. We have great enthusiasm for the midterms and it's going to be tepid on the POTUS year?

 

[Jaskalas]

Socialism is just looking out for your brothers and sisters...

No, the actual definition of the word Socialism would relate to Government taking over and directly owning / controlling all business in a nation. People would still own private property, but there would be no private business. Republicans have bastardized the term so badly... that modern use of it relates to even having a government at all. Then the morons go further still and just call everyone Communists.

Bernie Sanders and company have taking to calling for "Democratic-Socialism" which is more or less what you describe. But the meaning of the word is shattered.