Furor Erupts Over Atheist Display At State Capitol

[IronWing]

The Freedom From Religion group did something similar in the Wisconsin State Capitol back in the '80s. No one really cared that much.

And if you go carryin' pictures of chairman Mao,
You ain't gonna make it with anyone anyhow.

 

[fskimospy]

People just need to watch the South Park episode about this. With all the PC crap going on, nothing is fun anymore.

About 95% of the time when South Park tries to opine about something they make it into a libertarian morality play where they attack a straw man. Since it's their show, nobody is there to call them out on their bullshit.

Don't get me wrong, I think South Park is hilarious, but I wouldn't look to them for ideas on politics.

 

[frostedflakes]

I think the sign is in bad taste, but it is protected speech, and the guy seriously overreacted IMO. I mean it's just a sign.

 

[dahunan]

Anybody know a gay person?

Karma is a bitch.. religion wants to fuck with our whole society then they are fair game too.

Here comes an unPC comment-question from me

The USA IS a Christian Nation.. "In God We Trust" anyhow.. Can you imagine if it was run by Islam and citizens were up in arms saying Islam was fake and not real and that the government is not allowed to force religion on people...

BLOOD is what it would be^^ the govt would kill people who did that or extremists would

 

[Vic]

The sign is in poor taste and does not in itself represent any kind of holiday celebration, but instead is just being used as an excuse to attack religion. This kind of atheism is a disgrace to all free-thinking rational people, and only serves to strengthen the churches. IF those who posted the sign were really rational atheists, they would have left off the last sentence (as it serves no rational purpose).

 

[Vic]

I think the sign is in bad taste, but it is protected speech, and the guy seriously overreacted IMO. I mean it's just a sign.

The sign is on public property (inside the state capitol building), and therefore is not protected speech.

Militant atheists lose what little credibility they already have when they protest religious displays in public buildings in California the same Christmas week they use the excuse of religious diversity to post an anti-religious display in the state capitol in Illinois.
If it's just a sign, then a Christian ornament on a Christmas tree in a Sonoma county building is just an ornament.
You cannot protest religious symbols on public property as unconstitutional while putting up anti-religious symbols on public property and pretending that is protected. Militant atheists only erode their own cause while making the real rational atheists and scientific agnostics (like myself) look bad.

 

[BeauJangles]

Christians protheletize to save the world for Jesus. This sign was on a par, trying to save the world from religion. Maybe if both sides decided to compete for members based on actions other folk take an interest in emulating, this sort of nonsense wouldn't happen.

But I don't see Atheists backing off with folk out there trying to shovel their religion down other people's throats and especially at the ballot box. Generally speaking, folk that want respect want it one way, coming their way, and blind to what they do that bothers others.

As someone who believes there is no god or anything, I have to say that atheists shouldn't stoop to such lows. As long as religion isn't forced on me, people can believe whatever the fuck they want.

 

[palehorse]

The sign is in poor taste and does not in itself represent any kind of holiday celebration, but instead is just being used as an excuse to attack religion. This kind of atheism is a disgrace to all free-thinking rational people, and only serves to strengthen the churches. IF those who posted the sign were really rational atheists, they would have left off the last sentence (as it serves no rational purpose).

This.

 

[ebaycj]

There are any number of ways to say that "You don't need to believe in god to love your fellow man." The sign was indeed antagonistic, unless you're the kind of person who thinks aborted-fetus Christmas cards with the tagline "Atheists kill babies" would be festive.

"Christians kill babies" would be more accurate.

 

[irishScott]

A lot of people like to go around spreading their version of the "truth" without admitting the validity and merits of other philosophies. These people are usually self-righteous and stupid. Atheists can't disprove religion, and religion can't disprove Atheism. I don't really see why this is such a hard concept for people to accept.

Oh, and theflyingpig was obviously trolling on this one. I don't come in here that often, but it seems he's one of those intelligent trolls who occasionally makes a reasonable argument to remain a valid member in the eyes of the forum.

 

[Genx87]

Boy I bet the people who put that sign up are a real fun crowd to run with. Talk about being the party pooper at the party.

 

[bfdd]

About 95% of the time when South Park tries to opine about something they make it into a libertarian morality play where they attack a straw man. Since it's their show, nobody is there to call them out on their bullshit.

Don't get me wrong, I think South Park is hilarious, but I wouldn't look to them for ideas on politics.

maybe that's the exact thing they're going for to show the ridiculousness of it all

 

[fskimospy]

maybe that's the exact thing they're going for to show the ridiculousness of it all

I find that unlikely, they are self professed libertarians if I remember correctly, so showing why libertarianism is stupid probably isn't what they are going for.

 

[bfdd]

I find that unlikely, they are self professed libertarians if I remember correctly, so showing why libertarianism is stupid probably isn't what they are going for.

we must not be watching the same show then or you're looking for things that don't really exist.

 

[fskimospy]

we must not be watching the same show then or you're looking for things that don't really exist.

No I'm watching the exact same show. There are dozens of episodes that end with libertarian morality plays, if you haven't noticed them you aren't paying attention. Most of them are stupid, gross oversimplifications. Libertarianism generally relies on gross oversimplification however, so maybe this goes unnoticed in the larger background noise.

Next time you watch the show pay closer attention and you'll see what I mean.

 

[Fox5]

Anybody know a gay person?

Karma is a bitch.. religion wants to fuck with our whole society then they are fair game too.

Here comes an unPC comment-question from me

The USA IS a Christian Nation.. "In God We Trust" anyhow.. Can you imagine if it was run by Islam and citizens were up in arms saying Islam was fake and not real and that the government is not allowed to force religion on people...

BLOOD is what it would be^^ the govt would kill people who did that or extremists would

The USA's founding was about as far from Christian as possible.
Many of the founding fathers were deists. From wikipedia:
"Deism (\ˈdi:iz(&#601m\)[1] or (\ˈdē-ˌi-zəm\)[2] is a religious and philosophical belief that a supreme being created the universe, and that this (and religious truth in general) can be determined using reason and observation of the natural world alone, without a need for either faith or organized religion. Deists tend to, but do not necessarily, reject the notion of divine interventions in human affairs, such as by miracles and revelations. These views contrast with a dependence on revelations, miracles, and faith found in many Jewish, Christian, Islamic and other theistic teachings.

Deists typically reject most supernatural events (prophecy, miracles) and tend to assert that God (or "The Supreme Architect") has a plan for the universe that is not altered either by God intervening in the affairs of human life or by suspending the natural laws of the universe. What organized religions see as divine revelation and holy books, most deists see as interpretations made by other humans, rather than as authoritative sources.

Deism became prominent in the 17th and 18th centuries during the Age of Enlightenment, especially in what is now the United Kingdom, France, United States and Ireland, mostly among those raised as Christians who found they could not believe in either a triune God, the divinity of Jesus, miracles, or the inerrancy of scriptures, but who did believe in one god. Initially it did not form any congregations, but in time deism strongly influenced other religious groups, such as Unitarianism and Universalism, which developed from it. It continues to this day in the forms of classical deism and modern deism."

Essentially, they believed in one God, but did barely at that as this God did not interact with humans at all, and wasn't necessarily based in the Christian belief.
Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin even made comments that seemed to question the very existence of God.
And one of the first acts of the nation were to sign the Treaty of Tripoli:
"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Musselmen; and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."
Essentially excluding religion from the affairs of the state in dealings with Muslims.

 

[Jeff7]

That right there is the problem. Because I believe differently than you it makes me a fool? Do you think there is one person in the world who believes exactly as you? Does that make the rest of the world fools except for you?

Like I said, the world would be a much better place if people respected others beliefs. If you feel strongly about something, go vote. Discuss things as non-offensively as possible. You don't help people see your side of things by calling them idiots. Successful Human Interactions 101. People can disagree but do you have to be such a jerk about it?

If I am a firm believer in Elvisology, or Pastafarianism, or the Greek Pantheon of Gods, would you show my beliefs equal respect as Christianity or Judaism?

Anybody know a gay person?

Karma is a bitch.. religion wants to fuck with our whole society then they are fair game too.

Here comes an unPC comment-question from me

The USA IS a Christian Nation.. "In God We Trust" anyhow.. Can you imagine if it was run by Islam and citizens were up in arms saying Islam was fake and not real and that the government is not allowed to force religion on people...

BLOOD is what it would be^^ the govt would kill people who did that or extremists would

"In God We Trust" - added in the 50's in a political ploy to say, "See, God? We're not like them commies! We luvs ya!" You know, cause we need to kiss up to God to make sure he's on our side.

Also, yeah, a Christian nation...because theocracies of any faith have such an excellent track record when it comes to human rights and equality.

 

[Elfear]

If I am a firm believer in Elvisology, or Pastafarianism, or the Greek Pantheon of Gods, would you show my beliefs equal respect as Christianity or Judaism?

Sure. Why would I show you any less respect? One of my friends is pagan and I always treat her with respect. One of my close family members believes in Shamanism and Reiki healing and I love and respect her very much. I may not believe in the same thing they do but that doesn't mean I can't treat them with respect.

I'm not really sure where you were going with that question??

 

[Jeff7]

Sure. Why would I show you any less respect? One of my friends is pagan and I always treat her with respect. One of my close family members believes in Shamanism and Reiki healing and I love and respect her very much. I may not believe in the same thing they do but that doesn't mean I can't treat them with respect.

I'm not really sure where you were going with that question??

For real now? If I were to espouse the wonders of Elvis as the one true God, you'd view that as being just as valid and worthy of respect as if I replaced "Elvis" with "Jesus/Yaweh"?

 

[Ronstang]

I find it funny that we are always seeing atheist posting topics hating religion but you don't see religious people posting trying to convert anyone else to their views.

I'll take the religious people over atheist any day of the week. The atheist seem to have some sort of anger issue.

I have noticed the same thing.

 

[eits]

yeah, i gotta agree with the conservative on this one.

 

[BoberFett]

No I'm watching the exact same show. There are dozens of episodes that end with libertarian morality plays, if you haven't noticed them you aren't paying attention. Most of them are stupid, gross oversimplifications. Libertarianism generally relies on gross oversimplification however, so maybe this goes unnoticed in the larger background noise.

Next time you watch the show pay closer attention and you'll see what I mean.

Awww, poor widdle man, somebody disagrees with him. Call the waaambulance.

 

[WHAMPOM]

http://cbs2chicago.com/politics/capitol.atheist.display.2.1387754.html


A conservative activist and Illinois comptroller candidate was escorted from the Illinois State Capitol building Wednesday when he tried to remove a sign put up by an atheist group.

Who would have guessed?


His Problem is, some Children might run up to the Christmas tree and actually READ the sign... Save the poor little children! It's all about the children! It's classic! They will be converted to atheism if they read the sign! Haha


The sign reads: "At the time of the winter solstice, let reason prevail. There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no heaven or hell. There is only our natural world. Religion is just myth and superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds."


Wow, do you think your capitol would allow you to display such a sign right next to the xmas trees? I feel like moving to Illinois now!

Edit: Happy Holidays everybody!

Sounds OK to me, after all such warnings are required on tobacco products and for the side effects of drugs.

 

[El Guaraguao]

I find it funny that we are always seeing atheist posting topics hating religion but you don't see religious people posting trying to convert anyone else to their views.

I'll take the religious people over atheist any day of the week. The atheist seem to have some sort of anger issue.

My Christian girlfriends family seem to only have one TV station, and thats whatever channel thats like a 24\7 church. On more than one occasion, Ive overheard some angry pastor on that TV station talking about how atheist are fools and how much they love to sin because we don't have any standard for morals, lol. So don't give me that "atheist are always mad" bullshit.

The late, Tupac Shakur once said, "I ain't mad at cha"

Have a nice day.

 

[manowar821]

I found that message far more uplifting than most holiday drivel.

I don't cry like a baby when somebody says "god bless you" to me, but keep on bitching. I'm sure you'll get into your magic-land faster that way.