French mag photographs resistance shooting down DHL plane

[Miramonti]

Personally, if anyone invaded the US, particularly a heathenist force, and started to occupy us, even if they were overthrowing an iminent threat to world peace like GW, I'd join the resistance to eliminate them, their puppet government, and anyone who aided them.

And if the Occupation called me a "terrorist" or a "thug", I think I'd probably laugh.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Firing a AA missle at a commercial aircraft is brave?

Yeah, I hear the ultimate in bravery is raiding the homes of your opposition and detaining the family.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc

Firing a AA missle at a commercial aircraft is brave?

Yeah, I hear the ultimate in bravery is raiding the homes of your opposition and detaining the family.

As opposed to what the prior regime did? Detaining was not quite the word.

If you think a targeting a commercial air liner is an act of bravery, then I'll be happy to kick in for a one way ticket to Jordan, (you're own your own for the dynamite stuffed vest), so you can hang out with those you admire.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Yep . . . the brilliance of how militants think is amazing. Just because I think American policy in Iraq (and the rest of the Middle East) is morally bankrupt doesn't mean I have one iota of positive regard for the previous regime or the various factions fighting against our troops in Iraq. But I will take that ticket to Jordan . . . I've always wanted to visit.

 

[Miramonti]

 

[Gaard]

And to continually accuse people of admiring the Iraqi resistance is worse than ignorant.

Seriously Alchy, do you know what the word means?

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc
Yep . . . the brilliance of how militants think is amazing. Just because I think American policy in Iraq (and the rest of the Middle East) is morally bankrupt doesn't mean I have one iota of positive regard for the previous regime or the various factions fighting against our troops in Iraq. But I will take that ticket to Jordan . . . I've always wanted to visit.

Oh but I'm sure you support the troops right?

Trotting out the attempted downing and showcasing of a civilian airliner, then attempting to morally equate it to raids to weed out those responsible.

How the hell can you call anything morally bankrupt, when you and your ilk are unwilling to even draw a moral line anywhere? Sickening.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: Gaard
And to continually accuse people of admiring the Iraqi resistance is worse than ignorant.

Seriously Alchy, do you know what the word means?

Do you admire people that you call brave?

 

[Gaard]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: Gaard
And to continually accuse people of admiring the Iraqi resistance is worse than ignorant.

Seriously Alchy, do you know what the word means?

Do you admire people that you call brave?

Not necessarily. Some I do, some I don't. Bravery isn't always considerred when speaking of admiration.

Do you admire everyone whom you consider brave?

 

[Miramonti]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc Yep . . . the brilliance of how militants think is amazing. Just because I think American policy in Iraq (and the rest of the Middle East) is morally bankrupt doesn't mean I have one iota of positive regard for the previous regime or the various factions fighting against our troops in Iraq. But I will take that ticket to Jordan . . . I've always wanted to visit.

Oh but I'm sure you support the troops right?

Trotting out the attempted downing and showcasing of a civilian airliner, then attempting to morally equate it to raids to weed out those responsible. How the hell can you call anything morally bankrupt, when you and your ilk are unwilling to even draw a moral line anywhere? Sickening.

You can step down from the "civilian airliner" righteousness. It was most likely contracted by the military, by the occupation.

When you have occupation, you have resistance - any prewar assumptions to the contrary were obviously neglecting history, not to mention some obvious pre-war muslim and arab hostility towards the west.

And while I don't claim to be a history professor, I'm not familiar with a country that was invaded and occupied and all the nationals that didn't resist were defined by history as "brave".

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc Yep . . . the brilliance of how militants think is amazing. Just because I think American policy in Iraq (and the rest of the Middle East) is morally bankrupt doesn't mean I have one iota of positive regard for the previous regime or the various factions fighting against our troops in Iraq. But I will take that ticket to Jordan . . . I've always wanted to visit.

Oh but I'm sure you support the troops right?

Trotting out the attempted downing and showcasing of a civilian airliner, then attempting to morally equate it to raids to weed out those responsible. How the hell can you call anything morally bankrupt, when you and your ilk are unwilling to even draw a moral line anywhere? Sickening.

You can step down from the "civilian airliner" righteousness. It was most likely contracted by the military, by the occupation.

When you have occupation, you have resistance - any prewar assumptions to the contrary were obviously neglecting history.

And while I don't claim to be a history professor, I'm not familiar with a country that was invaded and occupied and all the nationals that didn't resist were defined by history as "brave".

Yup you are right, the military would not bother putting military equipment on its c-5s or c-17s. And we all know that the 25 million iraqis have no need to either send or recieve goods via air from other countries.

 

[Miramonti]

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc Yep . . . the brilliance of how militants think is amazing. Just because I think American policy in Iraq (and the rest of the Middle East) is morally bankrupt doesn't mean I have one iota of positive regard for the previous regime or the various factions fighting against our troops in Iraq. But I will take that ticket to Jordan . . . I've always wanted to visit.

Oh but I'm sure you support the troops right?

Trotting out the attempted downing and showcasing of a civilian airliner, then attempting to morally equate it to raids to weed out those responsible. How the hell can you call anything morally bankrupt, when you and your ilk are unwilling to even draw a moral line anywhere? Sickening.

You can step down from the "civilian airliner" righteousness. It was most likely contracted by the military, by the occupation. When you have occupation, you have resistance - any prewar assumptions to the contrary were obviously neglecting history. And while I don't claim to be a history professor, I'm not familiar with a country that was invaded and occupied and all the nationals that didn't resist were defined by history as "brave".

Yup you are right, the military would not bother putting military equipment on its c-5s or c-17s. And we all know that the 25 million iraqis have no need to either send or recieve goods via air from other countries.

Suppose thats the case (as unlikely as it is),

If I'm not mistaken here (which I'm not), DHL was not there before we got there. You wouldn't suppose pimping out iraq's business to american firms and not arab firms would have anything to do with the occupational hostility do you?

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc Yep . . . the brilliance of how militants think is amazing. Just because I think American policy in Iraq (and the rest of the Middle East) is morally bankrupt doesn't mean I have one iota of positive regard for the previous regime or the various factions fighting against our troops in Iraq. But I will take that ticket to Jordan . . . I've always wanted to visit.

Oh but I'm sure you support the troops right?

Trotting out the attempted downing and showcasing of a civilian airliner, then attempting to morally equate it to raids to weed out those responsible. How the hell can you call anything morally bankrupt, when you and your ilk are unwilling to even draw a moral line anywhere? Sickening.

You can step down from the "civilian airliner" righteousness. It was most likely contracted by the military, by the occupation. When you have occupation, you have resistance - any prewar assumptions to the contrary were obviously neglecting history. And while I don't claim to be a history professor, I'm not familiar with a country that was invaded and occupied and all the nationals that didn't resist were defined by history as "brave".

Yup you are right, the military would not bother putting military equipment on its c-5s or c-17s. And we all know that the 25 million iraqis have no need to either send or recieve goods via air from other countries.

Suppose thats the case (as unlikely as it is),

If I'm not mistaken here (which I'm not), DHL was not there before we got there. You wouldn't suppose pimping out iraq's business to american firms and not arab firms would have anything to do with the occupational hostility do you?

You do of course realize DHL is a German company. So it does appear you are mistaken. You also seem to forget the UN sanctions that have been lifted since we have been there.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: Gaard
And to continually accuse people of admiring the Iraqi resistance is worse than ignorant.

Seriously Alchy, do you know what the word means?

Do you admire people that you call brave?

Can you admire your enemy without supporting them?

Can someone be brave without your approval?

How has the power come to you to make absolutes in such matters?

I detest Bush, does that mean I admire Clinton? How have you made it so?

Are these people brave for shooting at an airliner? I don't think so, but as much as you may not like it, it takes a certain physical bravery to fly an airplane into a building. That does not make the act or the person who did it admirable.


I am quite able to admire the bravery of an enemy while I take their life, without falling down and worshipping them. You are taking a simplistic attitude towards the statement of others, whether on purpose or not, I don't know.

I do know that by defining things as you have you make it either impossible to understand the enemy and the motivations, or do so, and be guilty of the sin of "admiration".

 

[Miramonti]

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc Yep . . . the brilliance of how militants think is amazing. Just because I think American policy in Iraq (and the rest of the Middle East) is morally bankrupt doesn't mean I have one iota of positive regard for the previous regime or the various factions fighting against our troops in Iraq. But I will take that ticket to Jordan . . . I've always wanted to visit.

Oh but I'm sure you support the troops right?

Trotting out the attempted downing and showcasing of a civilian airliner, then attempting to morally equate it to raids to weed out those responsible. How the hell can you call anything morally bankrupt, when you and your ilk are unwilling to even draw a moral line anywhere? Sickening.

You can step down from the "civilian airliner" righteousness. It was most likely contracted by the military, by the occupation. When you have occupation, you have resistance - any prewar assumptions to the contrary were obviously neglecting history. And while I don't claim to be a history professor, I'm not familiar with a country that was invaded and occupied and all the nationals that didn't resist were defined by history as "brave".

Yup you are right, the military would not bother putting military equipment on its c-5s or c-17s. And we all know that the 25 million iraqis have no need to either send or recieve goods via air from other countries.

Suppose thats the case (as unlikely as it is), If I'm not mistaken here (which I'm not), DHL was not there before we got there. You wouldn't suppose pimping out iraq's business to american firms and not arab firms would have anything to do with the occupational hostility do you?

You do of course realize DHL is a German company. So it does appear you are mistaken. You also seem to forget the UN sanctions that have been lifted since we have been there.

You're missing the whole point as usual. Whether its ours, german or any other ally, and whether its carrying items for the military or not, sending so much reconstruction money to non-arab firms increases hostility and makes them an obvious target for the resistance.

 

[miguel]

Originally posted by: jjsole

You're missing the whole point as usual. Whether its ours, german or any other ally, and whether its carrying items for the military or not, sending so much reconstruction money to non-arab firms increases hostility and makes them an obvious target for the resistance.

So are you inferring that terrorists don't attack arab firms? Ever see what happens to "collaborators"?

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc Yep . . . the brilliance of how militants think is amazing. Just because I think American policy in Iraq (and the rest of the Middle East) is morally bankrupt doesn't mean I have one iota of positive regard for the previous regime or the various factions fighting against our troops in Iraq. But I will take that ticket to Jordan . . . I've always wanted to visit.

Oh but I'm sure you support the troops right?

Trotting out the attempted downing and showcasing of a civilian airliner, then attempting to morally equate it to raids to weed out those responsible. How the hell can you call anything morally bankrupt, when you and your ilk are unwilling to even draw a moral line anywhere? Sickening.

You can step down from the "civilian airliner" righteousness. It was most likely contracted by the military, by the occupation. When you have occupation, you have resistance - any prewar assumptions to the contrary were obviously neglecting history. And while I don't claim to be a history professor, I'm not familiar with a country that was invaded and occupied and all the nationals that didn't resist were defined by history as "brave".

Yup you are right, the military would not bother putting military equipment on its c-5s or c-17s. And we all know that the 25 million iraqis have no need to either send or recieve goods via air from other countries.

Suppose thats the case (as unlikely as it is), If I'm not mistaken here (which I'm not), DHL was not there before we got there. You wouldn't suppose pimping out iraq's business to american firms and not arab firms would have anything to do with the occupational hostility do you?

You do of course realize DHL is a German company. So it does appear you are mistaken. You also seem to forget the UN sanctions that have been lifted since we have been there.

You're missing the whole point as usual. Whether its ours, german or any other ally, and whether its carrying items for the military or not, sending so much reconstruction money to non-arab firms increases hostility and makes them an obvious target for the resistance.

Well, we have given the world a chance to put up money for reconstruction and very little has been offered by the world. Now it is our fault that we are left to do the reconstruction on our own.

You forget hoards of iraqi subcontractors that have been hired to do the reconstruction work.

You forget about the daily flights landing at the baghdad airport filled with arab business people coming to iraq to do bussiness in the country.

 

[Gaard]

I think this quote fits in regards to Alchy's unsubstantiated claims of members admiring the Iraqi resistance. Can everyone guess who said it?

<< Me, along with about 240 or so million other americans, prefer to hear facts and evidence, not theories and innuendo.>>

 

[Gaard]

<<Now it is our fault that we are left to do the reconstruction on our own.>>

Of course it is.

 

[Miramonti]

Originally posted by: miguel

Originally posted by: jjsole You're missing the whole point as usual. Whether its ours, german or any other ally, and whether its carrying items for the military or not, sending so much reconstruction money to non-arab firms increases hostility and makes them an obvious target for the resistance.

So are you inferring that terrorists don't attack arab firms? Ever see what happens to "collaborators"?

Because resistance might attack an arab firm for being considered a "collaborator" doesn't suggest that we are right for giving the contracts to allied resources instead of more arab resources. I however don't believe arab firms would be as common of a target because targeting them would be less popular in iraq and the middleeast.

 

[miguel]

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: miguel

Originally posted by: jjsole You're missing the whole point as usual. Whether its ours, german or any other ally, and whether its carrying items for the military or not, sending so much reconstruction money to non-arab firms increases hostility and makes them an obvious target for the resistance.

So are you inferring that terrorists don't attack arab firms? Ever see what happens to "collaborators"?

Because resistance might attack an arab firm for being considered a "collaborator" doesn't suggest that we are right for giving the contracts to allied resources instead of more arab resources. I however don't believe arab firms would be as common of a target because targeting them would be less popular in iraq and the middleeast.

Well, of course it's useless to argue about what would happen. All I can tell you is that terrorists do not seem to discriminate when they attack.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: Gaard
<<Now it is our fault that we are left to do the reconstruction on our own.>>

Of course it is.

It is of course our burden to rebuild the country. But it is not our fault that others want to do business in Iraq now that sancations have been lifted. The complaints of world is not about americans company getting contracts to rebuild Iraq, but it is about that it is not their countries not getting contracts with american dollars to rebuild Iraq.

 

[Miramonti]

Originally posted by: miguel
All I can tell you is that terrorists do not seem to discriminate when they attack.

For being such an expert on the traits of terrorists I don't think you know what a terrorist is. Their goal is to undermine the security and agenda of the foreign occupation, ie resistance.

Defining everyone simply as "terrorist" or a "thug" rings ignorance, especially when most of the resistance are probably iraqi nationals who never previously had affiliations to international terrorism.

If GW were president in the 1860's I think he'd call 1/2 the country terrorists and thugs.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: Gaard
I think this quote fits in regards to Alchy's unsubstantiated claims of members admiring the Iraqi resistance. Can everyone guess who said it?

<< Me, along with about 240 or so million other americans, prefer to hear facts and evidence, not theories and innuendo.>>

Come on Gaard..that's a pretty weak one to pull out of the vault You gotta catch me jumping to conclusions about some news article, not insulting the local AT saddam sympathizers.

 

[miguel]

Originally posted by: jjsole

Originally posted by: miguel
All I can tell you is that terrorists do not seem to discriminate when they attack.

For being such an expert on the traits of terrorists I don't think you know what a terrorist is. Their goal is to undermine the security and agenda of the foreign occupation, ie resistance.

Defining everyone simply as "terrorist" or a "thug" rings ignorance, especially when most of the resistance are probably iraqi nationals who never previously had affiliations to international terrorism.

If GW were president in the 1860's I think he'd call 1/2 the country terrorists and thugs.

jsole,

I don't claim to be an "expert" on terrorists, nor did I call anyone a "thug". The discussion was around the attempted downing of a DHL plane. The description you described of the "resistance" also fits the description of the palestinian terrorists who blow up coffee shops and snipe at babies. Do you consider them "resistance" as well?