Forecast: Six-Speed Automatics To Dominate U.S. Market

[thecritic]

I'm not touching these for a few years...they're probably going to have all kinds of "bugs" when they first launch.

I can't imagine how much they'd cost to rebuild after their 150k (or so) service life...5-spd Hondas are already a bit higher than $3000.

 

[NFS4]

Originally posted by: wanmichael
I'm not touching these for a few years...they're probably going to have all kinds of "bugs" when they first launch.

I can't imagine how much they'd cost to rebuild after their 150k (or so) service life...5-spd Hondas are already a bit higher than $3000.

You're usually pretty safe with Lexus. They continue to the brand with the least problems per vehicle year after year in the US

 

[thecritic]

Not all the of the Toyota Aisin Warners have been great over the years...their U140E is a good example of this, and it was used in the RX300/ES300.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

I could have sworn this thread was about 6-speed transmissions....

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: sdifox
Talking of CVT, anyone drive one of the Audi A4 with CVT? My concern with another gear is how responsive that AT can be with so may different gears to grease, so to speak.

I want their DSG. No torque convertor, no pulleys, just a straight mechanical connection, but with two clutches -- one for gears 1,3,5, the other for gears 2,4,6 -- electronically controlled, with the next gear always preselected.

So, when you're in, say, 2nd, 3rd gear is preselected on the 1-3-5 bank. When you row that stick, the clutch on 1-3-5 bank is electronically engaged while simultaneously the clutch on the 2-4-6 band is electronically disengaged.

It's all done faster than any carbon based biped amongst could ever hope to.

Those fiendishly clever Teutons! :thumbsup:

 

[Fingolfin269]

CVT is really not that annoying once you get used to it. I know that the newer Nissan's with CVT actually have better fuel efficiency than their M/T counterparts.

 

[MikeMike]

hey, EyeMDouche... 07's have been available since early-mid May...

also, 6 speeds are nice, they allow the engine to shift smoother, etc.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: PAB

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: EyeMWing
Leather (Cloth is INFINITELY superior)

Wrong. Leather wears better (wooo, 20 minutes to condition once a year, that's so inconvenient :roll: ) and is infinitely easier to clean. Not only that, but real leather is not cold in the winter like Vinyl is, nor is is unbearable in the summer (my daily has a black leather interior and the seats never have heat problems in the summer).

ZV

However true this may be, I'd like to affirm that in no way does any Detroit automarker use "real" leather.

Almost every car I see after 3 years with GM/Ford/DC "leather" looks like a vinyl dash off a 79 Trans Am. It might be easier to clean, but it's still going to disintigrate.

Never had a lick of trouble from the leather in my old Lincoln. When I traded it in the leather still looked as good as the day it left the showroom. I've yet to see any problem with leather disintegrating unless the car was abused or neglected, American or otherwise, with the exception of the stitching tearing on 20+ year old Porsche 944 seats.

ZV

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
also, 6 speeds are nice, they allow the engine to shift smoother, etc.

The number of available gears has nothing whatsoever to do with how smooth the shifts are. Shift smoothness is simply a matter of valving (on older transmissions) or electronic programming.

ZV

 

[MikeMike]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
also, 6 speeds are nice, they allow the engine to shift smoother, etc.

The number of available gears has nothing whatsoever to do with how smooth the shifts are. Shift smoothness is simply a matter of valving (on older transmissions) or electronic programming.

ZV

the RPM drops however, cause it to be more noticable in cars, and the 8 spd, has the ratios so close that it hardly drops RPMs when shifing, almost making it into a CVT, but still has gears.

 

[m2kewl]

Originally posted by: AgentJean

Originally posted by: ultimatebob
Aren't these 6 speed automatic transmissions going to add about $1,500 to the total price of the car over the price of a four speed? You're going to need to put a LOT of miles on your car for that 4% mileage improvement to pay for itself. Not to mention that these newer transmissions will be more expensive to replace when they break, and they probably will break down more often thanks to all of the extra parts.

Wow, thow in another 1500 bucks and you have the additional cost of a hybird that gets TWICE(2 times) the gas mileage.

Yeah, American car companies are just plain STUPID.
They need to learn from Toyota.

I'll never buy an American(Ford or GM) car.

toyota is delaying their cars by 6 months to address quality...plus 3 of their execs might be going to jail. not something Ford or GM want to emulate.

 

[MikeMike]

Originally posted by: AgentJean

Originally posted by: ultimatebob
Aren't these 6 speed automatic transmissions going to add about $1,500 to the total price of the car over the price of a four speed? You're going to need to put a LOT of miles on your car for that 4% mileage improvement to pay for itself. Not to mention that these newer transmissions will be more expensive to replace when they break, and they probably will break down more often thanks to all of the extra parts.

Wow, thow in another 1500 bucks and you have the additional cost of a hybird that gets TWICE(2 times) the gas mileage.

Yeah, American car companies are just plain STUPID.
They need to learn from Toyota.

I'll never buy an American(Ford or GM) car.

Hybrids now get 2x the gas mileage??? wtf?? wow, can i smoke what you are smoking?

 

[zephyrprime]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Good start but what is sad is this should've at least been standard since the Oil embargo of 1973.

Uhh... maybe because the technology didn't exist then? :roll:
4 speed automatics didn't exist until the '80s. 5 speeds were invented in the '90s, and 6 speeds just a few years ago.

I don't think that's due to lack of technology.

I think there's a slow features arms race between car makers. That's what's relly behind the push for more gears. That and the desire for better fuel economy.

 

[SampSon]

2015, don't rush or anything.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
also, 6 speeds are nice, they allow the engine to shift smoother, etc.

The number of available gears has nothing whatsoever to do with how smooth the shifts are. Shift smoothness is simply a matter of valving (on older transmissions) or electronic programming.

ZV

The RPM drops however, cause it to be more noticable in cars, and the 8 spd, has the ratios so close that it hardly drops RPMs when shifing, almost making it into a CVT, but still has gears.

Nope, still wrong. I can have a 200 RPM gap between gears and if I sidestep the clutch, it's still going to be very firm.

ZV

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: virtualgames0
I still remember driving my company's 1990 Mazda MPV. That thing had 3 gears. First gear had to rev up near redline at 5000RPM. Not to mention it couldn't climb uphill even with its V6 engine.

heh i remember even in 98 toyota sold 3 speed auto corollas on their lowest model. 3 %@# gears.. its just sad.

and yea the dsg thing with double clutch instead of slushbox is nice

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: sdifox
Talking of CVT, anyone drive one of the Audi A4 with CVT? My concern with another gear is how responsive that AT can be with so may different gears to grease, so to speak.

I want their DSG. No torque convertor, no pulleys, just a straight mechanical connection, but with two clutches -- one for gears 1,3,5, the other for gears 2,4,6 -- electronically controlled, with the next gear always preselected.

So, when you're in, say, 2nd, 3rd gear is preselected on the 1-3-5 bank. When you row that stick, the clutch on 1-3-5 bank is electronically engaged while simultaneously the clutch on the 2-4-6 band is electronically disengaged.

It's all done faster than any carbon based biped amongst could ever hope to.

Those fiendishly clever Teutons! :thumbsup:

That is kindda interesting, so drive train in the middle, 2 half gear box flanks it and 2 cluch plates. That sould be hell to service if you burn up the plates Other than that, sounds great, except I haven't see any in Canada yet...

 

[imported_Shivetya]

I'll stick with my CVT, infinite gearing FTW.

Its a Murano, Nissan is going to use CVT across the whole line. I can't imagine going back to a regular Automatic transmission after having a CVT

 

[WolverineGator]

Originally posted by: EyeMWing

Originally posted by: sniperruff
pfft. i don't buy anything with less than 8 gears.

So all your vehicles are commercial trucks?

No, he rides a Wallyword Bicycle. 21 speeds!

 

[imported_Shivetya]

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: andylawcc
urrr.. isn't CVT far more efficient?

...and annoying?

The engine note when driving one is VERY weird IMHO.

Hmmm.... Now I'm interested in hearing this.

Does it basically just only change pitch slightly as you climb in speed? :Q Or is it like, backwards? RPMs start high and decrease as you accelerate?

That'd be really weird. Does it at least keep the engine in it's peak powerband?

I have a 05 Murano (CVT 6cyl 250 horse engine). RPMs remain constant unless you just stomp it. RPMs can kick up upon launch but they settle down real quick and the car just goes. Friends have stated that it felt "electric smooth".

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: EyeMWing

Originally posted by: andylawcc

Originally posted by: EyeMWing
And the LS fails at life, my Focus is better.

hahahahahahahah..... you really know a lot about cars do you.

Funny thing, Lexus won't let you configure an LS without an options package for an additional $7000 above MSRP.

For $54000 more, the Lexus gets you:
Twice the cylinders
A sequential gearbox
Some run of the mill psuedo-luxury suspension (this is WITHOUT the expensive air-suspension option)
Move the drive wheels to the back
Some fancy-ass computer in between the steering wheel and the actual steering
Significantly worse gas mileage
Some fancy interior trim bits
Leather (Cloth is INFINITELY superior)
An extra CD changer slot
Bluetooth (why?)
A power trunk closer (wow, you're ****** lazy if you need that)
A universal garage door opener
Some lights underneath the rocker panel that lights up the ground when you open the door
A COMPASS
A tire pressure monitoring system
An engine immobilizer
LED lights
SatNav
A backup camera
Heated seats (you don't need this with cloth seats)
Alloy wheels 1 inch bigger
Marginal extra rear legroom
ONE VERY SHINY LEXUS BADGE.

If you're going to sell me a $70,000 car, you need a lot more than THAT to make it worth the extra $60k over a $10,000 used economy car - especially since I could add damn near all of those things to the Focus for less than $5000.

A $70,000 car that gets me relatively little compared to a better looking $10,000 car is VERY low on my spending priorities list. If I'm going to be spending $70k on a car, it had damn well better be more than some Japanese economy car they put on the photocopier and enlarged it to 120%, and then stole some bits and pieces out of Germany's reject bin and installed a hashed up 1st gen V8 engine. For just pocket change more than an LS, you can have a damned BMW M5 - and the BMW is a far better driver's car.

You've obviously never been in an LS.

So, what good is 6 speeds if I'm driving 10mph in LA traffic?

 

[Tom]

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: andylawcc
urrr.. isn't CVT far more efficient?

They haven't yet developed a really good CVT.

what's your opinion of the one in the Dodge Caliber ? Designed by Benz I presume.

 

[CVSiN]

automatics suck... /thread..
now 6 speed manuals.. thats the way to go!
I will never buy another automatic as long as I live..

 

[Stunt]

Originally posted by: CVSiN
automatics suck... /thread..
now 6 speed manuals.. thats the way to go!
I will never buy another automatic as long as I live..

I perfer standard too...but in traffic it's such a pain in the ass.

I got to play with my mom's 3.5L triptronic Altima when they were down visiting. That's actually quite fun; rev the sh!t out of it! (0-60 in less than 6secs)

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: Shivetya
I'll stick with my CVT, infinite gearing FTW.

Its a Murano, Nissan is going to use CVT across the whole line. I can't imagine going back to a regular Automatic transmission after having a CVT

Nissan figured out a CVT for powerful engines? good for them, maybe everyone else will follow suit