FIND THE BOTTLENECK

[amol]

Posting on a friend's computer, this guy is LOADED and doesn't mind spending money to upgrade some of his components (which are all fairly new)

CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3200+ Winchester (NO OC) NOT 3500+
Mobo: gigabyte board now, but he's expecting the new Asus SLI Board any moment now
GFX: Just got a BFG PCI-E 6800GT
RAM: 1GB PC3200
HD: Seagate Barracuda 160Gb
PSU: Antec Neopower 480W
Case: Lian-Li PC-V1100
Monitor: Some cheapo 1280x1024 17" LCD, but he's expecting another Dell 20" WS (1680x1050) . . . the backlighting on the other ones have been bothering him

my guess would be that the bottleneck is the 3500+

i dunno if he has enough $$ to upgrade to a 4000+ or fx-55 . . . but any second opinions?

thanks

EDIT: plz note that the new monitor will be native resolution 1680x1050

 

[Mik3y]

that's plenty fine.

 

[Matthias99]

Running at 1280x1024 with a 6800GT, the bottleneck is probably the CPU. Although it should still be really, really fast compared to about 99% of the machines out there.

 

[magomago]

hard drive. Scsi would be heaven for him. Use the seagate for storage....but if he really is loaded...scsi would be ridiculous not to get, because its ALWAYS something people notice.

 

[amol]

Originally posted by: Matthias99
Running at 1280x1024 with a 6800GT, the bottleneck is probably the CPU. Although it should still be really, really fast compared to about 99% of the machines out there.

it will be running at 1680x1050 soon (as soon as the new monitor comes in)

Originally posted by: magomago
hard drive. Scsi would be heaven for him. Use the seagate for storage....but if he really is loaded...scsi would be ridiculous not to get, because its ALWAYS something people notice.

aren't SCSI drives pretty loud and that you need to buy controllers for them

would it really help system and game loading?

 

[Geforcer]

bottleneck for what??? with that system, he should be able to play easily @ 1280*1024 with highest details on just about any game, and probably even higher resolutions, and still get good fps. is the 1gb ram 1 stick or 2 in dual channel?

 

[imported_Phil]

Originally posted by: Amol

aren't SCSI drives pretty loud and that you need to buy controllers for them

would it really help system and game loading?

Yes, they're louder than regular, plain IDE drives.
Yes, you need to buy a controller.

But they are very very fast.
It would most definitely help system & game loading.

Two 74Gb Seagate 15.3krpm U320 disks would be an excellent starting point. Five of those in RAID-5 will be very fast.

 

[amol]

Originally posted by: Geforcer
bottleneck for what??? with that system, he should be able to play easily @ 1280*1024 with highest details on just about any game, and probably even higher resolutions, and still get good fps. is the 1gb ram 1 stick or 2 in dual channel?

but he's selling the 1280x1024 (or giving it to his bro, i dunno yet)

he's getting a 1680x1050 dell

its a 1GB stick

 

[amol]

Originally posted by: Dopefiend

Originally posted by: Amol

aren't SCSI drives pretty loud and that you need to buy controllers for them

would it really help system and game loading?

Yes, they're louder than regular, plain IDE drives.
Yes, you need to buy a controller.

But they are very very fast.
It would most definitely help system & game loading.

Two 74Gb Seagate 15.3krpm U320 disks would be an excellent starting point. Five of those in RAID-5 will be very fast.

hmm, okay, i guess we'll take that into consideration

anyone know HOW LOUD

he doesnt mind noise, just hates VERY LOUD components

EDIT: + what is the reliability factor with SCSI vs SATA?

 

[Geforcer]

Originally posted by: Amol

Originally posted by: Geforcer
bottleneck for what??? with that system, he should be able to play easily @ 1280*1024 with highest details on just about any game, and probably even higher resolutions, and still get good fps. is the 1gb ram 1 stick or 2 in dual channel?

but he's selling the 1280x1024 (or giving it to his bro, i dunno yet)

he's getting a 1680x1050 dell

its a 1GB stick

is he wanting to max out his resolutions in gaming? what exactly are we trying to find the bottleneck to resolve? dual channel memory would help him. but as for the cpu and gpu, they are fine. if he's wanting to play anything as high as the 1680*1050 monitor he's getting, then that changes things. but aside from that, it's not a bad system.

 

[ssvegeta1010]

SCSI for the hard drives if he wants it, and for the CPU, get a good HSF and OC it.

(There is no justification in getting a new CPU)

Also another 1GB stick of RAM for dual channel.

 

[amol]

Originally posted by: Geforcer

Originally posted by: Amol

Originally posted by: Geforcer
bottleneck for what??? with that system, he should be able to play easily @ 1280*1024 with highest details on just about any game, and probably even higher resolutions, and still get good fps. is the 1gb ram 1 stick or 2 in dual channel?

but he's selling the 1280x1024 (or giving it to his bro, i dunno yet)

he's getting a 1680x1050 dell

its a 1GB stick

is he wanting to max out his resolutions in gaming? what exactly are we trying to find the bottleneck to resolve? dual channel memory would help him. but as for the cpu and gpu, they are fine. if he's wanting to play anything as high as the 1680*1050 monitor he's getting, then that changes things. but aside from that, it's not a bad system.

he doesnt care for max AA/max AF, but pretty good/medium settings

 

[imported_Phil]

Originally posted by: Amol

hmm, okay, i guess we'll take that into consideration

anyone know HOW LOUD

Not annoyingly loud. Think of the difference between one of the quieter Maxtors and the quietest Seagate. A slight increase in noise, less so if he mounts them with rubber grommets.
Having said that, I have seen 10+ disk arrays, and they are noisy. Two disks will hardly be noticeable.

he doesnt mind noise, just hates VERY LOUD components

They're definitely not very loud.

EDIT: + what is the reliability factor with SCSI vs SATA?

[/quote]

The reliability of SCSI drives is the main reason that servers use banks of them in various RAID configurations.
I work for a computer manufacturer, and regularly walk past the rack of dead disks waiting to be RMA'd in the morning to get my coffee
There's about four SCSI disks right now, and 35-40 IDE disks.

 

[amol]

oh ok, thanks a lot dopefiend and others

looks like the solution (as of now) would be

1. SCSI drives w/ controller

2. upgrade to 2GB (2x1GB in dual channel)

would it be better to get a SCSI controller w/ a PCI-express X1 interface? would it be faster than just the regular pci interface, since these drives have theoretical speed of 320?

 

[sandorski]

Hard to upgrade a system that pretty much is top of the line. If he really wants an Upgrade, get a SLI mobo and a pair of 6800 Ultras(or whatever), SLI them, and have one of the fastest PCs on the planet. Otherwise, don't bother wasting your money.

 

[amol]

Originally posted by: sandorski
Hard to upgrade a system that pretty much is top of the line. If he really wants an Upgrade, get a SLI mobo and a pair of 6800 Ultras(or whatever), SLI them, and have one of the fastest PCs on the planet. Otherwise, don't bother wasting your money.

hmmm if that's the case . . .

i've been trying to tell him that he already has a good computer (he thinks that he needs an fx-55 with a ton of extra stuff)

he already has an A8N-SLI board on the way and a BFG 6800GT

wouldn't hurt to get another 6800GT (didnt think about that, forgot he has SLI in the mail)

would the 480W Neopower handle it? i think it should . . .

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: Dopefiend

Originally posted by: Amol

hmm, okay, i guess we'll take that into consideration

anyone know HOW LOUD

Not annoyingly loud. Think of the difference between one of the quieter Maxtors and the quietest Seagate. A slight increase in noise, less so if he mounts them with rubber grommets.
Having said that, I have seen 10+ disk arrays, and they are noisy. Two disks will hardly be noticeable.

I have to disagree, at least for 15KRPM drives (although I must admit I have not seen the second-generation 15KRPMs in person). The drives are noticeably louder than a quiet 7200RPM drive -- although they're not that much louder than a fairly loud 7200RPM drive. Vibration can be a big problem (in terms of noise) if they're not mounted well. I don't find them to be particularly annoying, but you can definitely hear them in a quieter system, whereas you really can't hear the quietest 7200RPM ATA/SATA drives inside most cases.

I would not describe them as "VERY LOUD", however (unless you have a whole bunch of them in one place). They're certainly less annoying than little high-pitched GPU/northbridge fans, and you might not even notice them in a noisy case with four or five fans going.

 

[aatf510]

If he has to upgrade his rig with no budget limits:
FX-55 + VapoChill LightSpeed should be able to take the FX-55 anywhere from 3GHz to 3.5GHz
Two 6800U
Two sticks 2-2-2-5 512MB is better than 2 sticks of 1GB
15k SCSI array (if you think it's too much trouble with the SCSI, two raptors 74GB is still way better than plain old seagate 160GB, this part doesn't belong to a high-end system)
PC&C PSU (the Antec might do the job, but if cash isn't a problem then PC&C is a better bet)

 

[amol]

Originally posted by: toattett
If he has to upgrade his rig with no budget limits:
FX-55 + VapoChill LightSpeed should be able to take the FX-55 anywhere from 3GHz to 3.5GHz
Two 6800U
Two sticks 2-2-2-5 512MB is better than 2 sticks of 1GB
15k SCSI array (if you think it's too much trouble with the SCSI, two raptors 74GB is still way better than plain old seagate 160GB, this part doesn't belong to a high-end system)
PC&C PSU (the Antec might do the job, but if cash isn't a problem then PC&C is a better bet)

This guy is a STUDENT, not a CEO of a Fortune 500 Company!!

I would say that he has about $500 . . .

EDIT: your link does not work either

 

[LikeLinus]

Originally posted by: Amol

Originally posted by: toattett
If he has to upgrade his rig with no budget limits:
FX-55 + VapoChill LightSpeed should be able to take the FX-55 anywhere from 3GHz to 3.5GHz
Two 6800U
Two sticks 2-2-2-5 512MB is better than 2 sticks of 1GB
15k SCSI array (if you think it's too much trouble with the SCSI, two raptors 74GB is still way better than plain old seagate 160GB, this part doesn't belong to a high-end system)
PC&C PSU (the Antec might do the job, but if cash isn't a problem then PC&C is a better bet)

This guy is a STUDENT, not a CEO of a Fortune 500 Company!!

I would say that he has about $500 . . .

EDIT: your link does not work either

No point in calling shens...

He's "LOADED" and rich!! But he has $500 to spend and can't afford a 4000+ LOL

You mean he's living off his parents and has almost spent his allowance.

 

[amol]

1. He's 18 and in college, and has been working (after school/ part-time) since he was 15½ . . .

2a. His parents said that they would pay for his college and that he could pay them back when he was older, interest free

2b. However, he got a 2yr scholarship (worth over $80K). His parents gave him some money (about $2K?) . . . vs. ($40K for school)

3. He has more than $500, but he's good with finances and only wants to spend $500.

4. He needs some money to spend in Florida . . . he's flying out on Sunday to watch the Orange Bowl . . . he goes to USC

 

[amol]

omg, i just realized that he has a 3200+ winchester, not a 3500+ . . . editted in first post

 

[Rapsven]

Get a nice 17" LCD, screw the Dell (even though they do brand off very good monitors).

And you should be fine.

Edit:

SCSI is overkill. If you're that edgy for a few seconds in game loading, by all means.

SCSI is usually for enterprise, databases, stuff like that.

Plus VERY expensive.

 

[aatf510]

Originally posted by: Amol

This guy is a STUDENT, not a CEO of a Fortune 500 Company!!

I would say that he has about $500 . . .

EDIT: your link does not work either

Sorry, I thought loaded means a lot of budget. Well, if he is only going to spend $500, he is better off saving it for future upgrades. $500 doesn't really buy you too many high-end components these days.

 

[imported_Phil]

Originally posted by: Matthias99

Originally posted by: Dopefiend

Originally posted by: Amol

hmm, okay, i guess we'll take that into consideration

anyone know HOW LOUD

Not annoyingly loud. Think of the difference between one of the quieter Maxtors and the quietest Seagate. A slight increase in noise, less so if he mounts them with rubber grommets.
Having said that, I have seen 10+ disk arrays, and they are noisy. Two disks will hardly be noticeable.

I have to disagree, at least for 15KRPM drives (although I must admit I have not seen the second-generation 15KRPMs in person). The drives are noticeably louder than a quiet 7200RPM drive -- although they're not that much louder than a fairly loud 7200RPM drive. Vibration can be a big problem (in terms of noise) if they're not mounted well. I don't find them to be particularly annoying, but you can definitely hear them in a quieter system, whereas you really can't hear the quietest 7200RPM ATA/SATA drives inside most cases.

I would not describe them as "VERY LOUD", however (unless you have a whole bunch of them in one place). They're certainly less annoying than little high-pitched GPU/northbridge fans, and you might not even notice them in a noisy case with four or five fans going.

Er, that's pretty much exactly what I said/meant.