Originally posted by: magomago
Originally posted by: RichardE
I never really trust your views on Muslims since you have always been a sympathizer. Though I understand that fact that the average person in the world wants simple things we do, Palestinians want there children to go to school just like the jews do. I think you miss the point of what is the crux of the problem, though you hit the conditions of it. Poverty with a belief of god so strong it controls you life makes them easy to manipulate from the people with $$ that you said you did not interact with. If these people make a effort to tell the masses that the US or Israel or the West was responsible for there issues, I imagine there would be a different type of people you would see.
Sudan though, sadly, has alot of issues that need alot of work and I truly sympathize with those people. The poor people are not the ones we need to address though, the people with a little money who have a taste of power and want more are the ones needed to be dealth with.
Thanks for giving a human face to the poor people of the world, I had this life realization the first time I actually *visited* Palestine and talked to people there finding out that they more or less wanted the same things as me out of life.
On another non political note
Did you happen to visit Darfur (I know its pretty much impossible) as well, do you have any pictures? I have a number of friends who are actively trying to get more aid and change to that country who would probably love them. Glad you got back safe.
Thus, we can agree that Islam is not the cause of it based on your bolded part.
By the way, those with hella $$$$ were usually families whose husband's worked abroad as doctors or lawyers.
I didn't go to Darfur...but I was told it actually isn't that hard. The hard part is getting OUT of Darfur. What I learned over there is that Darfur is greatly exaggerated. Of course I'd be careful from the actual Sudanese and what they think, but I actually got a chance to speak with several UN Workers who work in Darfur helping to provide relief. Even most of Darfur is okay, it is just the select clashes that is REALLLLY bad (I actually didn't pressure them for information because I know they came to visit to relax a little from work which isn't easy). Darfur is, first and foremost, a competition for resources that has been going on for hundreds of years (ie: this isn't anything new). But now that oil has been discovered, the government is more inclined to come in and support a more 'loyal side', especially if its near the oil fields.
I actually have plenty of pictures ~ well over 600...but the airline lost one of my bags. I'm now hoping to God that it gets recovered... I would most definitely post some
And thanks for the care, I appreciate it. Who knows, give ma a few more years and maybe you can believe that Islam is not some 'ebil' religion
Originally posted by: CKent
Sudan, the country embracing the Religion of Peace. Where a female teacher - how dare a woman seek employment??? - should be stoned to death for the tragedy of allowing her students to name a tedday bear "Muhammed". Ah yes, what great people. They belong in a fucking zoo. But anyway.
This is what I'm talking about guys. He doesn't know anything and he goes on his own tirade about women not working. There are plenty of women working EVERYWHERE in Sudan - from bitches who try to overcharge me at a pharmacy, to the family friends who literally lives twice a week at a hospital because she is a doctor, to even old ladies selling hats at a market for 50 cents.
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: clamum
People who blame all evils on Islam, or thing that most Muslims are terrorists... these people really have no fucking clue what they're talking about. Rednecks. Ignorance -> fear -> hate.
You're right, I'm ignoring the daily suicide bombings everywhere in the world except northern Africa and the middle east. Erm, oh wait... that kinda... doesn't hold any water, does it? Put the peace pipe down Cheech, and be a little more realistic.
Well, clearly you were full of shit on your last post...
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Originally posted by: Deadtrees
That's how I feel about Christians. Many Christians are just nice people living their lives but there're these paranoid Christian wackos doing nasty things. It is those people that makes me to devalue general Christians.
For 'God's sake,' I just can't stand those people who can find themselves without a thousands years old fairy tales.
Except the body count of radical christians seems to be significantly less than that of radical islam.
Yeah, I have no love for the religious of any flavor... but I'm having trouble remembering when christians flew planes into muslim skyscrapers and military establishments, killing nearly 3,000 in a single day. But according to the red streaks from the bleeding hearts here, it must have happened.
This is him trying to frame the argument is a certain way - making us accept his implicit assumptions. "Muslim Skyscrapers"?
Originally posted by: Spook
I work with two Pakistani's, and they explained to me that some of the problems in the Northern Provence's stem from the fact that Muslims are too hospitable. In these Northern tribal areas of Pakistan when these families invite someone into their house, they will defend that person tooth and nail, and will die for them if necessary. And this is the trouble with the Taliban fighters hiding out in these northern provinces, Americans or Pakistani officials will go looking for hiding Taliban, and end up killing whole families, because they are under the protection of the family. Makes everyone look bad. It doesn't help that the Pakastani central government doesn't have control of those norther provences either, but I'll save that for another thread. My example is to explain that yes, Muslims are very friendly people, so much so, that it can get themselves into trouble.
Interesting...several Pakistanis have also added to me that many problems in Pakistan are also not really religion related - it is ethnicity-based. Someone may do something stupid, but because he is an X and the others are an Y, it causes both sides to dig in.
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: KingGheedora
I sort of think it's odd that you seem this surprised about all of this. I thought it was common knowledge that terrorists don't represent mainstream Islam.
Mainstream christians go to church on easter & christmas and know who jesus was.
Mainstream muslims go to church 5 times a day and are very happy that almost 3,000 infidels were killed on 9/11. They're a few centuries behind the times is all. In 1, 2, maybe 3 centuries they'll look back on their past the way we look back on slavery and naziism.
Wow...its just getting amusing how he is constructing his own image of Muslims.
There are some other stupid posts here, but I'm glad that many can dis embed religion as the primary cause from these types of events. I do not think for one minute that religion cannot be used to push any personal socio-political agenda; this happens a lot, but there is a big difference between having a religion manipulated to achieve an agenda, and religion purposely pushing for this. with the Media so intent to focus on only Muslims, it draws away from the complex causes of these situations, as well as problems that happen with other religious groups leading us to think that this happens ONLY with Muslims because they ARE Muslims. We should always consider religion in the analysis, but I do believe that it should be analyzed as a commodity that is manipulated as opposed to the driving force.
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