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Finally a GTX 460 @ 900 core review. Beats both a gtx470 and 5870!

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Power consumption might not mean much at first glance. For HTPC, its very important, but well, i dont really care about HTPC, and this thread has nothing to do with HTPC. Anyway, power consumption actually can be important. 750 watts is generally ideal for people who consider dual cards setups, but only want a single card currently. With Fermi like psu consumption, it generally takes a 850 watt. Also, the added power of say a 480 over a 5870 can cost quite a decent bit per year. $20-50 per year based on quite a few variables. So while i dont think its as important as price, heat, raw power, features, and so on, but it definitely isnt something that should be brushed off.
 
blastingcap said:
This isn't entirely accurate because only in SOME games at SOME resolutions does the GTX460 touch a 5870@stock or 470@stock. This is regardless of any problems with shortening lifespan of GPU, temperature, etc
Click to expand...

if your talking about the review, I believe it said the gtx460 when it loses, never loses by more then 10%. ,But the majority of the time it won and stayed cool and quiet, so the lifespan theory is a non issue.
 
Ares1214 said:
Power consumption might not mean much at first glance. For HTPC, its very important, but well, i dont really care about HTPC, and this thread has nothing to do with HTPC. Anyway, power consumption actually can be important. 750 watts is generally ideal for people who consider dual cards setups, but only want a single card currently. With Fermi like psu consumption, it generally takes a 850 watt. Also, the added power of say a 480 over a 5870 can cost quite a decent bit per year. $20-50 per year based on quite a few variables. So while i dont think its as important as price, heat, raw power, features, and so on, but it definitely isnt something that should be brushed off.
Click to expand...

This discussion was allready beaten to death on the first 2 pages,led by Toyota.
 
In Europe, electricity prices are generally very high compared to USA.. so yeah, 2 years at over gtx470 power use will make any $$ savings null. Just grab a gtx470 and leave it at stock and it'll be cheaper in the long run. OC gtx460 is nearing gtx480 in power use.. that's a bit weird.

Looking at http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/radeon-hd5850_3.html#sect0
OC of 5850 from 725mhz to 1ghz (>35% OC) raised power draw a bit, but nothing massive like in the gtx460.. what's going on?
 
happy medium said:
if your talking about the review, I believe it said the gtx460 when it loses, never loses by more then 10%. ,But the majority of the time it won and stayed cool and quiet, so the lifespan theory is a non issue.
Click to expand...

RE: performance, I think people can look at the numbers and decide for themselves. Even if you ignore the potential downsides and look JUST at performance, it's misleading to say that ON AVERAGE, a 33% oc'd GTX460 is as fast as a 5870@stock or 470@stock, over a large number of modern games at realistic resolutions.

RE: voltage, quiet has nothing to do with it, and good cooling may help, but it may not be enough to completely negate the ov'ing. In any case, it will void the warranty. And there is no guarantee that any given GTX460 can oc as well as the sample that the reviewer used. Etc. This is in addition to other potential problems which I previously mentioned in this thread. GTX460 is a good card that hits the sweet spot for a large number of people, but people should be aware of the limits of how hard you should push your card, and that even with 33% oc's they will lose to GTX470@stock and 5870@stock in many games and resolutions, especially higher resolutions.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2468/6 "Those that choose to ignore these recommendations and/or exceed any specification do so at their own peril. This is not meant to insinuate that doing so will necessarily cause immediate, irreparable damage or product failure. Rather, every decision made during the course of overclocking has a real and measureable "consequence." For some, there may be little reason to worry as concern for product life may not be a priority. On the other hand, perhaps precautions will be taken in order to accommodate the higher voltages like the use of water-cooling or phase-change cooling. In any case, the underlying principles are the same - overclocking is never without risk. And just like life, taking calculated risks can sometimes be the right choice."
 
Silverforce11 said:
In Europe, electricity prices are generally very high compared to USA.. so yeah, 2 years at over gtx470 power use will make any $$ savings null. Just grab a gtx470 and leave it at stock and it'll be cheaper in the long run. OC gtx460 is nearing gtx480 in power use.. that's a bit weird.

Looking at http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/radeon-hd5850_3.html#sect0
OC of 5850 from 725mhz to 1ghz (>35% OC) raised power draw a bit, but nothing massive like in the gtx460.. what's going on?
Click to expand...

It was 75 watts more, thats not too much less then 95watts for the gtx460.
Remember power consumtion will vary from review to review with the same card.
 
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happy medium said:
It was 75 watts more, thats not too much less then 95watts for the gtx460.
Remember power consumtion will vary from review to review with the same card.
Click to expand...
yeah but that 5850 at 1010 would easily beat the gtx460 at 900 while using 40 watts less. clearly ATI has the much more efficient architecture.
 
Silverforce11 said:
Looking at http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/radeon-hd5850_3.html#sect0
OC of 5850 from 725mhz to 1ghz (>35% OC) raised power draw a bit, but nothing massive like in the gtx460.. what's going on?
Click to expand...

gtx460 @ 1.087v and 33% overclock draws 68% more power than a reference gtx460.

hd5850 @ 1.21v and 39% overclock draws 62% more power than a reference hd5850.

Looks like both cards have a similar increase in power draw with overclocking relative to their reference designs. So nothing unusual is going on.
 
toyota said:
yeah but that 5850 at 1010 would easily beat the gtx460 at 900 while using 40 watts less. clearly ATI has the much more efficient architecture.
Click to expand...

I'd like to see benchmarks of the hd5850 @ 1000mhz vs. a gtx460 @ 900mhz. I bet it would be a lot closer than you think.

Here is one example:

http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/3..._overclocked_w_voltage_adjustment/index6.html

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/radeon-hd5850_9.html#sect2

At the highest comparable resolution with the same in-game settings, the gtx460 OC beats the hd5850 OC in this game. There is also a Far Cry 2 benchmark at both sites, be we all know FC2 runs way better on nvidia hardware. So the Resident Evil scores is the only comparable benchmark I could find, but unsurprisingly it does back my theory. I'd love to see a full out review between these two cards with greater than 30% overclocks.
 
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blastingcap said:
it's misleading to say that ON AVERAGE, a 33% oc'd GTX460 is as fast as a 5870@stock or 470@stock, over a large number of modern games at realistic resolutions.
Click to expand...

The gtx460 wins 14 out of 20 vs the 5870 and 18 out of 20 vs the gtx470 @ 1900x1080, how is that misleading?

blastingcap said:
voltage, quiet has nothing to do with it, and good cooling may help, but it may not be enough to completely negate the ov'ing. In any case, it will void the warranty
Click to expand...

It does not void warranty.

blastingcap said:
and that even with 33% oc's they will lose to GTX470@stock and 5870@stock in many games and resolutions, especially higher resolutions
Click to expand...
Wrong,
The review says otherwise, did you read it? Its beats them both in all resolutions.
BUt less at 2500x1600,who buys a gtx460 at this res. ?

blastingcap said:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2468/6 "Those that choose to ignore these recommendations and/or exceed any specification do so at their own peril. This is not meant to insinuate that doing so will necessarily cause immediate, irreparable damage or product failure. Rather, every decision made during the course of overclocking has a real and measureable "consequence." For some, there may be little reason to worry as concern for product life may not be a priority. On the other hand, perhaps precautions will be taken in order to accommodate the higher voltages like the use of water-cooling or phase-change cooling. In any case, the underlying principles are the same - overclocking is never without risk. And just like life, taking calculated risks can sometimes be the right choice."
Click to expand...

Ah are you trying to compare a cpu overclock with a gpu overclock?
Gpu overclocks are covered under warranty,cpu's are not.

ANything else?
 
Read your own review, look at the relevant games and not just the skewed ones, at the actual game benchmarks, not just what they wrote. Far Cry 2? Oh brother. I can see your point but the conclusion is overbroad imho. Just my opinion. I just said people should look at games they care about and come up with their own conclusions.

Unless they recently changed their warranty, overvolting a Palit card does void warranty. Do you know what the difference between oc and ov? Did you even read what I wrote? Apparently not.🙄

happy medium said:
The gtx460 wins 14 out of 20 vs the 5870 and 18 out of 20 vs the gtx470 @ 1900x1080, how is that misleading?

It does not void warranty.

Wrong,
The review says otherwise, did you read it? Its beats them both in all resolutions.
BUt less at 2500x1600,who buys a gtx460 at this res. ?

Ah are you trying to compare a cpu overclock with a gpu overclock?
Gpu overclocks are covered under warranty,cpu's are not.

ANything else?
Click to expand...
 
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toyota said:
yeah but that 5850 at 1010 would easily beat the gtx460 at 900 while using 40 watts less. clearly ATI has the much more efficient architecture.
Click to expand...

Not in games with dx11 tessellation. Its why amd went back to the drawing board.
Also this scare tactic about overclocking is funny.
Nividia released slides at launch, pushing/promising overclocking.
overclocker_dream.jpg
 
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Flipped Gazelle said:
AMD was working on 6xxx long before anyone knew of AMD's comparative deficiency with tessellation.
Click to expand...
Yep. I think it'll be a better comparison to put the 6xxx competitor against the GTX 460, as then you'll be comparing a new architecture against a new architecture (and not one that's three years old).
 
happy medium said:
Well even at full load the card in the review is cool and quiet. I think we are talking about power consumption only in this case.
Click to expand...

Haha my definition of quiet might be different though since it is watercooled. In my case, the more power the card dissipates, the faster I have to run the radiator fans, which I find annoying. My point was that power consumption comes with other considerations (in general, not necessarily for this card specifically) and was in response to the poster who said that people that buy gaming cards shouldn't be talking about power consumption.
 
toyota said:
yeah it probably would be pretty close now that I think about it.
Click to expand...

Yup, they'll trade wins depending on the game. However, it's very hard to find current 5850s that allow for voltage overclocking (something to think about before thinking they will hit 1000mhz).

Here is GTX460 @ 940 vs. 5850 @ 1115

5850 wins in Crysis, RE5, CS:S, L4D2, BC2
GTX460 wins in FC2, Dirt 2, SF:IV
They basically tie in AvP, Hawx, JC2, Metro 2033

We also covered max overclocking in this thread for anyone interested where HD5000 vs. GTX4xx were put to the test by some pretty serious overclockers.
 
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I'd add that 5850s typically do progressively better at higher resolutions (19x12, 25x16), relative to the GTX460.

RussianSensation said:
Yup, they'll trade wins depending on the game. However, it's very hard to find current 5850s that allow for voltage overclocking (something to think about before thinking they will hit 1000mhz).

Here is GTX460 @ 940 vs. 5850 @ 1115

5850 wins in Crysis, RE5, CS:S, L4D2, BC2
GTX460 wins in FC2, Dirt 2, SF:IV
They basically tie in AvP, Hawx, JC2, Metro 2033

We also covered max overclocking in this thread for anyone interested where HD5000 vs. GTX4xx were put to the test by some pretty serious overclockers.
Click to expand...
 
Having a device, any device, that uses 30 or 40 percent more energy to do the same amt. of work is dumb. Step into the 21st century. 🙄
 
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