Final Fantasy XV Demo

[Aikouka]

Anyone else get the demo? I picked up Type-0 today, and of course, I played the demo first. Honestly, I really want to like this game, but I'm really not liking what I've played so far. Sure, the game is really pretty, but I get the feeling that the game needs a lot of play testing. Here are some thoughts...

• I played the game with Japanese voices, but there's one slight problem. The game doesn't turn subtitles on by default, and you can't turn them on until you're out of the tutorial section. Fortunately, they were talking slowly enough and I understand enough Japanese to get the gist of what they were saying. However, in an English release, if you aren't going to make all gameplay-oriented options available at the start, at least turn on subtitles when a foreign language is chosen. Look at it this way... if someone does need them, they're covered, and if they don't, it's only a minor annoyance.
• My biggest complaint about the game has to be the UI. It feels like Square just doesn't have a good hold on what an open-world game needs to be player-friendly, because this game is not. Frankly, I just need either a mini-map or a compass -- something to tell me where I'm going. Now, I know that someone is going to say, "You can just set destination markers!" I don't always want to set or change my destination marker. If there's a quick side quest, I'd rather just leave it set to my main quest and finish the side quest real quick. So, the only way to see where you're going is to access the menu system (via the Options button) and look at the area map. The problems don't end there. The area map only takes up about 40% of the screen -- it's too small! That wouldn't be as much of an issue, but your character's map icon is too big! There should really be a button that gives you a full-screen map view.
• The combat really isn't that good. I liked a description that I heard on how it feels like a weird mash-up between Devil May Cry and Final Fantasy, because it feels like a far worse version of Devil May Cry or any other game like that (e.g. Bayonetta). The problem is that the combat is clunky and slow. There's only three attack-oriented buttons in the game: Square is attack, Triangle is Special Move, and Cross is Warp. The problem is that you can't really use special moves that often, or you'll run out of MP. So, you spend most of your time... mashing Square. You'll usually use Cross if you want to warp to another enemy. There were a few times that I took a ton of damage, because an enemy came at me from behind where he was completely out of my camera's sight until the last second. At best, you might be able to get your defend mechanic off, but what it feels like this game is missing are the usual dodge mechanics in action-oriented games. Battles are just kind of awkward as they exist in real time, which means that a whole other set of enemies can easily join the fray, and if it's nighttime, you sure as hell bet you will get swarmed. That leads to another problem...
• Where's the day/night cycle indicator? Perhaps a clock set to the world's time? The issue that I had is that once it turns to dusk, you have a very short time to get back to camp before it's nighttime. As mentioned above, once it hits nighttime, enemies come out of the woodwork, and you may find yourself in quite a bit of trouble. I was fighting a few of those dog things (just the basic ones, no alphas(?)), and then one of those drop ships appears overhead. Okay, not too much of a problem... and then Goblins show up. It's not like I moved to a new area and aggro'd more enemies -- I was in the same spot the whole time.

 

[cmdrdredd]

Sounds terrible. I don't think SE knows how to make a modern action game by the sounds of it.

 

[Aikouka]

Sounds terrible. I don't think SE knows how to make a modern action game by the sounds of it.

I'm wondering how much player feedback Square plans on taking in from this demo, and as a result, how much of this will change. Although, I don't know if I'd call it terrible, but it definitely feels like a very weird, rigid action RPG. Actually, thinking about it... it feels a lot like Fable, but with uninteresting combat.

One thing that I never mentioned above is that the game feels a lot like a Western RPG... with Japanese characters. The game actually has quests in it much like you'd see in a MMO or CRPG, and the quests are divided up between side-quests (these are usually auto-discarded if you camp) and main quests.

Oh, I remembered another big issue that I ran into while playing. You can't see enemy levels. That probably isn't very surprising to most Final Fantasy fans, as you normally can't see anything about an enemy (other than their name) without using some sort of identification spell. However, it's also not normally an issue because Final Fantasy games (and jRPGs in general) are usually good at keeping you in areas with monsters that are your level. The problem with the demo is that there are various mobs all around (neutral and hostile) and their levels also vary quite a bit.

To be fair, the demo also pulls a Rydia when it comes to your main character. For those of you that didn't play FF4, that means Noctis's level is far below the other characters. He starts at level 7 and the highest party member is 15. It doesn't help that your experience just pools over the course of a day, and you finally gain the experience (and the resulting levels) while camping overnight. There was one night when I went from around level 11 to level 15! That sounds great, right? Not really. The problem is that the enemy difficulty difference was very jarring. Enemies went from taking some time to dispatch to me being able to kill an enemy in a single teleport strike. I just feel like it makes the difficulty a bit uneven.

 

[SandEagle]

thanks for your input. i actually was planning to pick up Type 0 this week, mainly for the demo.
from the FFXV videos online, they mostly show greeny outdoor areas. are there cities to venture out to? im still excited about it though. not sure i want to play Type 0 since its story is mostly military-based.

 

[SAWYER]

The videos I have seen look dumb, horrible character designs

 

[Fulle]

The videos I have seen look dumb, horrible character designs

Yeah, I'm not sure how I feel about the next FF consisting of an all male jpop band, touring the countryside in a convertible. Some of these characters are just over the top effeminate too.

You know, this makes me think that the creators put absolutely ZERO thought into how the game would be received by a western audience. Seems like it's being made for Japanese women, (who outnumber Japanese men as FF players), so meh.

Not going to force my interest on something that's made for an audience I don't fit into.

 

[poofyhairguy]

I have been so much more excited by Final Fantasy spinoffs the last decade than the main series. Youtube videos of the demo are not changing my mind.

 

[cbrunny]

Think they'll make concept-level redirections based on feedback or are you expecting tweaks/relatively minor corrections?

 

[Aikouka]

There is something kind of cool that you find in the demo.

Spoiler

After you fail to kill Behemoth the first time, the game sends you all the way down to the Chocobo Ranch, just so the shopkeep can say, "You shouldn't go to that cave!" Naturally, you get a quest to go to the cave, because... why not! The goblin filled cave wasn't too bad, but at the end, you get something kind of fun... Ramuh! If you thought summons were crazy in some of the previous games, just wait until you see this. It reminds me of grandiose versions of Final Fantasy VII. Here's a video of me using it against the behemoth, Dead Eye: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeVQeQfrEY4 .

You know, this makes me think that the creators put absolutely ZERO thought into how the game would be received by a western audience. Seems like it's being made for Japanese women, (who outnumber Japanese men as FF players), so meh.

The game actually plays a lot more like a western RPG, which leads me to believe that they are trying to appeal to a western audience too. Although, I'm not really sure that they use the bishounen (Japanese for "pretty boy") just to appeal to women.

thanks for your input. i actually was planning to pick up Type 0 this week, mainly for the demo.
from the FFXV videos online, they mostly show greeny outdoor areas. are there cities to venture out to? im still excited about it though. not sure i want to play Type 0 since its story is mostly military-based.

No, you're in the valley the entire time. The demo ends when you defeat the behemoth, sell its horn, and pay Cindy for the car repairs. To note, I found Cindy's name weird, because the Japanese sounds far more like Sidney. It makes sense as she's Cid's daughter and I assume they're making a play off his name (i.e. it's actually Cidney). I'm also waiting for comments on how she's a poor portrayal of women in gaming given she wears super-short jean shorts and a top that doesn't leave much to the imagination. You can see what I mean in a Google Image search.

Think they'll make concept-level redirections based on feedback or are you expecting tweaks/relatively minor corrections?

I'm not really sure, but probably not to a large degree. The reason is that Square may have released a demo, but there's really no way to provide them any feedback. If there's any loud rumbling on the Internet that leads to articles, etc., then they might see that, but apart from that, I doubt that they'll see something like this.

 

[SandEagle]

holy crap, that video was amazing. im even more interested in it now. just wish theyd go back to turn-based like ffx

 

[Newell Steamer]

Pass.

I long for swords and sorcery in Final Fantasy games - not pop stars and neo retro tech.

 

[SandEagle]

Pass.

I long for swords and sorcery in Final Fantasy games - not pop stars and neo retro tech.

did you check the video posted above? the FFXV summon is probably one of the best i've ever seen.

aikouka, did you notice the top of the staff? its shaped like ixion. awesome.

 

[xantub]

I wish they had an option to play the game turn based. I hate twitchiness in my RPGs.

 

[Xellos2099]

I find the graphic amazing but other than that it is a total disappointment. I agree that they want to made this into action rpg but the action is no where near kingdom heart level or devil may cry. And do not get me started on an all male cast.

 

[Lil Frier]

I find the graphic amazing but other than that it is a total disappointment. I agree that they want to made this into action rpg but the action is no where near kingdom heart level or devil may cry. And do not get me started on an all male cast.

I'd love to get you started. Is there something wrong with male characters that women have to be there to keep them from ruining the game or something?

 

[xantub]

I'd love to get you started. Is there something wrong with male characters that women have to be there to keep them from ruining the game or something?

just my 2 cents. How would you feel if they were all women?

 

[Aikouka]

just my 2 cents. How would you feel if they were all women?

We've done that before, and I'm not sure if people really enjoyed the results.

 

[xantub]

We've done that before, and I'm not sure if people really enjoyed the results.

Maybe that's how women feel when playing a game like FF XV and all PCs are men.

 

[Aikouka]

Maybe that's how women feel when playing a game like FF XV and all PCs are men.

Only if they start singing Backstreet's Back.

I'm actually more curious about who really cares about the all-male cast. I get the feeling that most of the recent arguments over gender and stuff are just being made by a very small subset of gamers (or people that aren't even gamers) with a very loud voice. Keep in mind that I also think that applies to both sides. To be clear, people didn't dislike Final Fantasy X-2 because it had an all-female cast. Hell, I don't think anyone really cared for any of the male characters in FFX with the exception of Auron, and maybe Waka.

Also, unless something changes from the demo, Noctis is the character that you play as. In the demo, the rest just kind of did their own thing. It was pretty annoying when you'd be waiting for a teammate to revive you, and even though you're standing right beside one, they just kept ignoring you. :|

 

[Lil Frier]

just my 2 cents. How would you feel if they were all women?

Like was said, it's already happened. I've never played the Final Fantasy series before (all of my interactions with those characters is from Kingdom Hearts). However, I've considered playing some of it, should I ever pick up a PS3. Since I'm not running around trying to find things to call sexist and victimize a gender at every turn, I won't avoid the FF XIII series for having a female protagonist, not would I avoid X-2.

I guess the question is, if it's OK for Halo to only have a male playable character (outside of the create-your-own Reach), and it's OK for Tomb Raider to only have a playable female character, why can't there be single-gender groups without some just-to-complain outcry?

Are there really no groups of friends of soldiers or whatever where it's a single gender, or even a single gender AND race? Why can't any of these games or stories stand on the merits of the story and character development, instead of a constant diversity meter? There was no outcry about the all-female goings-on with other Final Fantasy games, so why does there need to be complaining about the all-male XV? It almost seems like society wants you to be ashamed if your circle of friends isn't 50-50 male and female or inclusive of a certain number of races.

 

[Xellos2099]

I have big issue with all male cast. Do I REALLY want to stare at a guy ass for 60 hours + game? Hell no.

 

[Aikouka]

I have big issue with all male cast. Do I REALLY want to stare at a guy ass for 60 hours + game? Hell no.

I hear people say this about playing male characters in MMOs. My response? "Why do you stare at your character's ass?"

But in all seriousness, I stare at the area in front of my character (i.e. directly above their head).

EDIT:

Oh and according to IGN, Square-Enix wants our feedback on the demo. I believe it requires you to enter the code that you used to acquire the demo from Xbox Live Marketplace or PlayStation Network Store.

 

[poofyhairguy]

I'm actually more curious about who really cares about the all-male cast.

If you think about it that is a weird thing for a FF game. I am not talking about gaming in general, just the FF series. It has had strong female characters long before Lara Croft's pointy boobs said hello to the world.

FF2/4 brought us Rosa and Rydia (who was probably the most powerful character in the game at the end). FF3/6's main character was arguably Terra, Celes EASILY got the best scenes in the entire game (her torture scene, the Opera scene), and Relm had the coolest bug in FF history. FF7's Tifa and Yuffie didn't provide much more than boobs, but for many of us the death of Aerith was the first time a video game made us cry. I could go on, but point being I think major female character is as much Final Fantasy as Chocobos, airships, and a guy named Cid.

I personally don't care though, just pointing that out. Heck nowadays the only Final Fantasy games I care about are ones that aren't in the main line (like The 4 Heroes of Light), or sequels/remakes to the pre-FF 10 games. If they want to have a sausage party in the main line I won't complain, this is only FF 15 and I expect it will take until FF 20 for the series to hit complete rock bottom and be forced to go back to its turn-based "roots."

They do seem to have a reasoning for the just dude thing:

"Speaking honestly, an all-male party feels almost more approachable for players," Tabata told GameSpot in a recent interview. "Even the presence of one female in the group will change their behaviour, so that they'll act differently. So to give the most natural feeling, to make them feel sincere and honest, having them all the same gender made sense in that way,"

http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/03/26/final-fantasy-15-director-explains-reason-for-all-male-cast

 

[Lil Frier]

I agree, and that's the main point I think people don't want to acknowledge: Final Fantasy has long had a mix of respectable characters of either gender, and they've gone all-female before. However, in the name of outrage, the fact that one of, what, 25+ Final Fantasy games is all-male erases any and all previous examples of diversity? The fact that SE has a story to tell about a group of males means that they are sexist, and that the game is offensive?

The degrees to which people want to be offended these days are what's offensive, if anything. Why can't something be all-male or all-female? Why can't games leave politics and morality out of the limelight, for a change? I just want to play a game without having something forced upon me, and I want to be able to discuss games without others trying to call a game shameful for SOMETHING. People want to say men and women are equal, but it's quite clear that sentiment REALLY means that women are more-important, because the complaints of exclusion are ONLY because there isn't a female quota being hit.

Honestly, if Square Enix came out and said that one of the FF XV characters was going to be changed from male to female, would that be better? I'd argue it's worse, because the woman is there to shut people up, not because the role was created with a female in-mind. So, I say that we occasionally admit that not every guy hangs out with girls, for any reason ranging from sexism to social anxiety to plain, ol' differences in interests, and enjoy the games as games. Stop trying to make everything in the media into some kind of moral crusade, for a change.

 

[Aikouka]

FF2/4 brought us Rosa and Rydia (who was probably the most powerful character in the game at the end).

I'm kind of disappointed that you left out Porom. While she's usually always in tow with her brother, Palom, they're both a great pair. Especially as you talk about scenes that really get you... I can't believe you left out this one from Final Fantasy IV? (If you can't stand the voices of the 3D remake, here's the 2D one.) That scene gets me every time! :'(

FF3/6's main character was arguably Terra, Celes EASILY got the best scenes in the entire game (her torture scene, the Opera scene), and Relm had the coolest bug in FF history. FF7's Tifa and Yuffie didn't provide much more than boobs, but for many of us the death of Aerith was the first time a video game made us cry. I could go on, but point being I think major female character is as much Final Fantasy as Chocobos, airships, and a guy named Cid.

My overall feeling on this sort of topic is that we need to stop trying to segment characters by the gender and just start talking about good characters. Stories do not need their own version of affirmative action. (Not saying that you think they do....) Characters should be written to meet the narrative; the narrative should not be written to meet the characters.

I saw Tabata's reasoning for the all-male cast the other day, and I understood where he was going. However... my first thought was, "People are going to s--- all over this...." In essence, he said that a girl can't be in the group because she'd mess up the male bonding dynamic. In other words, you can't ruin the good ole boy's club. Yeah... that's not going to go over well. Here's what he needs to say:

"There's a central theme to the main cast of characters in this Final Fantasy installment: a strong bond of friendship. Previous Final Fantasy games may have exhibited this on a small scale (e.g. Cecil and Kain in Final Fantasy IV), but in Final Fantasy XV, we have a group of long-time friends."

Unfortunately, I don't know the backstory of all the characters and how they met, but I'm assuming that they've been friends for a while. While growing up, your friends were most likely other boys, and that holds true as we see here. It's also worth noting that there are females among the other characters such as Cidney (called Cindy in the demo). Some news sites incorrectly report on her as "the new Cid", but during a conversation, it's pretty clearly said that her father's name is Cid.

I personally don't care though, just pointing that out. Heck nowadays the only Final Fantasy games I care about are ones that aren't in the main line (like The 4 Heroes of Light), or sequels/remakes to the pre-FF 10 games. If they want to have a sausage party in the main line I won't complain, this is only FF 15 and I expect it will take until FF 20 for the series to hit complete rock bottom and be forced to go back to its turn-based "roots."

I agree with you about the main entries, but I still think some of the other games have some major flaws too. Honestly, I never finished Bravely Default. I was so bored by the end of Act III that I just gave up. To be frank, the story is terrible, and the gating is so simplistic (in regard to the other jobs). Strangely enough, I had the same exact complaint about the Xbox 360 RPG called Blue Dragon (uninteresting characters and a bland story), but I really enjoyed that game. I also own the soundtrack, which is fantastic -- not a surprise given it was done by none other than Uematsu Nobuo.

The degrees to which people want to be offended these days are what's offensive, if anything. Why can't something be all-male or all-female? Why can't games leave politics and morality out of the limelight, for a change? I just want to play a game without having something forced upon me, and I want to be able to discuss games without others trying to call a game shameful for SOMETHING. People want to say men and women are equal, but it's quite clear that sentiment REALLY means that women are more-important, because the complaints of exclusion are ONLY because there isn't a female quota being hit.

The thing is... I don't think most of these games actually have a political message. However, they do sometimes use politics as a story element or a driving force in the game, but that doesn't mean there's some takeaway from the game. However, I think that there are a set of progressive types out there that WANT to see a message in things. To them, an all-male cast is taking a step backwards in inclusiveness regardless of how it fits the narrative of the story.

You know what we should really be clamoring about? The lack of robots in our games! Remember when Robo from Chrono Trigger won't allow you to save him to avoid getting hurt ...and to rebuild the forest? You just don't see that anymore! :'(