• We’re currently investigating an issue related to the forum theme and styling that is impacting page layout and visual formatting. The problem has been identified, and we are actively working on a resolution. There is no impact to user data or functionality, this is strictly a front-end display issue. We’ll post an update once the fix has been deployed. Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted.

Federal judge rules U.S. no-fly list violates Constitution

Oldgamer

Diamond Member
(Reuters) - The U.S. government's no-fly list banning people accused of links to terrorism from commercial flights violates their constitutional rights because it gives them no meaningful way to contest that decision, a federal judge ruled on Tuesday.

U.S. District Judge Anna Brown, ruling on a lawsuit filed in federal court in Oregon by 13 Muslim Americans who were branded with the no-fly status, ordered the government to come up with new procedures that allow people on the no-fly list to challenge that designation.

"The court concludes international travel is not a mere convenience or luxury in this modern world. Indeed, for many international travel is a necessary aspect of liberties sacred to members of a free society," Brown wrote in her 65-page ruling.

"Accordingly, on this record the court concludes plaintiffs inclusion on the no-fly list constitutes a significant deprivation of their liberty interests in international travel," Brown said.

The decision hands a major victory to the 13 plaintiffs - four of them veterans of the U.S. military - who deny they have links to terrorism and say they only learned of their no-fly status when they arrived at an airport and were blocked from boarding a flight.

The American Civil Liberties Union, which brought suit against the policy in 2010, argues that secrecy surrounding the list and lack of any reasonable opportunity for plaintiffs to fight their placement on it violates their clients' constitutional rights to due process.

“For years, in the name of national security the government has argued for blanket secrecy and judicial deference to its profoundly unfair no-fly list procedures and those arguments have now been resoundingly rejected by the court," Hina Shamsi, the ACLU's national security project director, said in a written statement.

"This excellent decision also benefits other people wrongly stuck on the no-fly list with the promise of a way out from a Kafkaesque bureaucracy causing them no end of grief and hardships," Shamsi said.

The government contends there is an adequate means of contesting the flight ban and that individuals listed under the policy may ultimately petition a U.S. appeals court directly for relief.

Attorneys for the U.S. Department of Justice, which defended the lawsuit, declined to comment, other than to say they needed more time to read the ruling.

The no-fly list, established in 2003 in the aftermath of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, bars those on it from flying within the United States or to and from the country. As of last year, it included some 20,000 people deemed by the FBI as having, or reasonably suspected of having, ties to terrorism, an agency spokesman said at the time. About 500 of them were U.S. citizens.

Link

---------------------------------

Finally a ruling with some common sense, wonder how much longer before they have another Judge over rule this Judges decision?
 
Good, although I'm sure the government will appeal the decision as high as they can.

Never pass up an opportunity to tear down the govt, huh? Aren't you going to thank Dubya for the chance?

I think the ruling is a good one. It remains to be seen what will develop from here. Regardless of the Admin's preferred position, they'll likely push it up to the appellate level for a more authoritative ruling. That's a good thing if it's upheld, which seems likely.
 
Never pass up an opportunity to tear down the govt, huh? Aren't you going to thank Dubya for the chance?

I think the ruling is a good one. It remains to be seen what will develop from here. Regardless of the Admin's preferred position, they'll likely push it up to the appellate level for a more authoritative ruling. That's a good thing if it's upheld, which seems likely.

Right, because our government is just an easy-going live-and-let-live type that's always willing to admit when it's wrong and doesn't ever act to maintain its power even in the face of Constitutional challenges. Nope, they won't try to alter or circumvent this decision whatsoever. 🙄

And I think Dubya was a generally horrible President and have thought so for years. Your obsessive need to straw man and pidgeon hole is rather pathetic. In addition economically speaking I'm against tax cuts for the wealthy and in favor of stimulus, but I'm also extremely pro-gun and believe in a somewhat re-organized and overall smaller less obtrusive government, although I also support a public option for healthcare. I imagine your brain is boiling simply trying to comprehend an individual such as myself. 😛
 
Last edited:
Never pass up an opportunity to tear down the govt, huh? Aren't you going to thank Dubya for the chance?

I think the ruling is a good one. It remains to be seen what will develop from here. Regardless of the Admin's preferred position, they'll likely push it up to the appellate level for a more authoritative ruling. That's a good thing if it's upheld, which seems likely.

You blast Irish and then in the same post say the exact same thing you blasted him for saying. Unreal.
 
Yet another puerile judgment from a female judge. Whenever you see a really dopey decision you have a 2 in 3 chance its a girly judge. Since 25% of women over 40 are on meds they are probably a factor in these Alice in Wonderland feck-ups
 
:thumbsup: Good decision and I hope it continues to stand

Yet another puerile judgment from a female judge. Whenever you see a really dopey decision you have a 2 in 3 chance its a girly judge. Since 25% of women over 40 are on meds they are probably a factor in these Alice in Wonderland feck-ups

😵 nehalem?
 
Yet another puerile judgment from a female judge. Whenever you see a really dopey decision you have a 2 in 3 chance its a girly judge. Since 25% of women over 40 are on meds they are probably a factor in these Alice in Wonderland feck-ups

WTF? Sarcasm? You can't be serious right?
 
Yet another puerile judgment from a female judge. Whenever you see a really dopey decision you have a 2 in 3 chance its a girly judge. Since 25% of women over 40 are on meds they are probably a factor in these Alice in Wonderland feck-ups

Alt nehalam?
 
You blast Irish and then in the same post say the exact same thing you blasted him for saying. Unreal.

Your deflectors are stuck on max, huh?

Irish used one word in praise of the decision, 14 more raggin' on de gubmint.

Excuse me for pointing out the nihilistic negativity.
 
It should be, but I would've rather seen her challenge it on 6th amendment grounds than declaring that international travel is a right.

The counter to that would be that the no-fly list is not a criminal matter, but rather a civil matter in which the 6th amendment doesn't apply. It's the same sort of weasel move as civil forfeiture.
 
Your deflectors are stuck on max, huh?

Irish used one word in praise of the decision, 14 more raggin' on de gubmint.

Excuse me for pointing out the nihilistic negativity.

The government could have taken action to make the no-fly policy less Draconian. It did not. The DOJ did not have to defend the policy in court. It did. The only reason that this situation may improve is because a judge (not part of the administration or DOJ or Congress for that matter) came to this ruling. She acted in such a way which protects our rights, not diminish them as your favored "de gubmint" has for many many years. This is a case of our system working, however there is no reason it should have come to this. This policy which was defended by the DOJ is exactly what was wanted and therefore it is no great stretch that they may continue to find ways to enforce it.

Your defense of those who wanted this policy and by extension the policy itself isn't deflected by your mention of deflection, which by the way is the sign that you are deflecting. Now you can bring up partisanship and hit people with that although no one has defended Bush or the Republicans or any other party.

Go!
 
Yet another puerile judgment from a female judge. Whenever you see a really dopey decision you have a 2 in 3 chance its a girly judge. Since 25% of women over 40 are on meds they are probably a factor in these Alice in Wonderland feck-ups
You're a misogynistic clown. I'm surprised you didn't post over in the George Will/Rape thread. I bet you'd have lots of enlightening comments to add...
 
Back
Top