Employees with nicotine in their systems to be fired...

[Injury]

Originally posted by: BriGy86

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: BriGy86
what if you have friends that smoke?

you catch second hand smoke (can it be detected) and should you lose your job because of that?

IIRC, ETS (environmental tobacco smoke) does not leave significant amounts of nicotine in your system.

okie dokie... just wondering

Yes, it's the nicotine that's highly tracable, which you really get from second-hand.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: slick230

Where does it end?

Blond hair blue eyes...........:Q

Whew, I'm safe.

 

[EatSpam]

Originally posted by: slick230
Your body is not your own anymore

So? Many/most companies will not hire you if you smoke pot. Doesn't matter if you come to work completely sober.

I know one's legal and one's not, but companies telling you what you can or cannot do is nothing new.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Injury

Originally posted by: BriGy86

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: BriGy86
what if you have friends that smoke?

you catch second hand smoke (can it be detected) and should you lose your job because of that?

IIRC, ETS (environmental tobacco smoke) does not leave significant amounts of nicotine in your system.

okie dokie... just wondering

Yes, it's the nicotine that's highly tracable, which you really get from second-hand.

Um, no. Do you know anyone who is addicted to ETS? Of course not. ETS does not result in significant amounts of nicotine in the body. If it did, people would become addicted to it.

 

[Rebasxer]

There needs to be a law passed stating that someone cannot be fired for what they do on their own free time. Suppose an employer passed said that women aren't allowed to have sex because they could get pregnant and have to take maternity leave. Would that be legal, in some states, yes. The bottom line is that firing smokers is a slippery slope to becoming North Korea with Coporate America at the helm instead of Kim Jung Ill

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Amused
Um, no. Do you know anyone who is addicted to ETS? Of course not. ETS does not result in significant amounts of nicotine in the body. If it did, people would become addicted to it.

I thought he was agreeing with you and he just forgot a word ("don't")

 

[Codewiz]

So what would you people be saying if this was changed from smoking to gay lifestyle?

No one can say it is genetic with any certainty.

So lets assume being gay is a choice, would people be willing to let companies fire people based on sexual preference?

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Rebasxer
There needs to be a law passed stating that someone cannot be fired for what they do on their own free time. Suppose an employer passed said that women aren't allowed to have sex because they could get pregnant and have to take maternity leave. Would that be legal, in some states, yes. The bottom line is that firing smokers is a slippery slope to becoming North Korea with Coporate America at the helm instead of Kim Jung Ill

Completely absurd.

Employers have ALWAYS had the right to fire people for whatever reason, including moral objections. To act as if this is something new and some kind of new threat to our liberty is patently absurd.

 

[GasX]

Originally posted by: Ronstang

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: PHiuR
yeah...read this before. It's not fair.

What's not fair? You agree not to have nicotine in your system and they agree to let you keep your job. If you choose to let nicotine into your system, you're choosing to get fired. Sounds odd, but when you think about it, it's completely under the control of the employee and is completely fair.

Don't like it? Get another job.

Bingo....but they need to make it simpler. If you smoke you CANNOT get healthcare insurance ever again and you will have to bear all the costs yourself. Choices always have costs associated with them but this world has become so pussified it is a concept that seemst to have been lost to history.

Classic slippery slope.

Eat bacon? You're fired
Like Big Macs? You're fired
Buy milk too close to the expiration date? You're fired
Own a classic car without airbags? You're fired
Go back for thirds at the buffet line? You're fired
Want a happy ending at the massage parlor? You're fired
The condom broke? You're fired

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Codewiz
So what would you people be saying if this was changed from smoking to gay lifestyle?

No one can say it is genetic with any certainty.

So lets assume being gay is a choice, would people be willing to let companies fire people based on sexual preference?

Why would you want to work for anyone who doesn't want you to work for them? Do you think your workplace is going to be enjoyable? Do you think you'll have much of a future or chance of advancement?

Why should ANYONE be forced to associate with someone they don't wish to associate with?

Finally, should employees be forced to work for empoyers they don't like? Because if we are to have equal rights and yet follow your lead, employers should have the right to force employees to work for them even if the employee wants to quit.

 

[Darkstar757]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Darkstar757
I am so sick and tired of Companies just runing people lives. This is sick and if something is not done soon we will be living a drone like society. DNA testing is become more and more of a scary thought to me.

How is the company "ruining" anyone's life?

Employment is a MUTUAL agreement. Not an entitlement.

Are you "ruining" your employer's life by having the right to quit at any time and for any reason you like?

If you have that right, shouldn't they?

Finally, from where do you derive the right to force an employer to employ you?

NO not when you are firing people over something that has nothing to do with there job!

 

[nakedfrog]

All hail the corporation, our new overlords.

Originally posted by: Amused
It's chicken sh!t to want more productive workers who don't drain your healthcare plan and stink like open ass?

If they're only smoking when they're not at work, how exactly does that impact their productivity?

 

[Rebasxer]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Rebasxer
There needs to be a law passed stating that someone cannot be fired for what they do on their own free time. Suppose an employer passed said that women aren't allowed to have sex because they could get pregnant and have to take maternity leave. Would that be legal, in some states, yes. The bottom line is that firing smokers is a slippery slope to becoming North Korea with Coporate America at the helm instead of Kim Jung Ill

Completely absurd.

Employers have ALWAYS had the right to fire people for whatever reason, including moral objections. To act as if this is something new and some kind of new threat to our liberty is patently absurd.

And Hitler just wanted Czechoslovakia...

Some people just don't see the potential for abuse

 

[Darkstar757]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Rebasxer
There needs to be a law passed stating that someone cannot be fired for what they do on their own free time. Suppose an employer passed said that women aren't allowed to have sex because they could get pregnant and have to take maternity leave. Would that be legal, in some states, yes. The bottom line is that firing smokers is a slippery slope to becoming North Korea with Coporate America at the helm instead of Kim Jung Ill

Completely absurd.

Employers have ALWAYS had the right to fire people for whatever reason, including moral objections. To act as if this is something new and some kind of new threat to our liberty is patently absurd.

Absurd why because you said so? :roll:Thats why this America bud and as a informed voter I will do as much as I can possible to prevent this behavior from becoming the norm.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Darkstar757

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Darkstar757
I am so sick and tired of Companies just runing people lives. This is sick and if something is not done soon we will be living a drone like society. DNA testing is become more and more of a scary thought to me.

How is the company "ruining" anyone's life?

Employment is a MUTUAL agreement. Not an entitlement.

Are you "ruining" your employer's life by having the right to quit at any time and for any reason you like?

If you have that right, shouldn't they?

Finally, from where do you derive the right to force an employer to employ you?

NO not when you are firing people over something that has nothing to do with there job!

So should employees be forced to work if they want to quit for something that has nothing to do with their job?

In this case, your employer doesn't LIKE YOU or what you do. I'd say that has EVERYTHING to do with your job. Why the fsck would you want to work for someone who doesn't want you, and doesn't like you?

And, yet again, from where do you derive the right to force an employer to employ you?

 

[meltdown75]

the thought police can't be far behind.

 

[marvdmartian]

They're safe until they decide to make a caffiene-free workplace. I'm a little shocked no one has thought of that yet, since it has the negative health benefit of driving your blood pressure up, plus most caffienated drinks also contribute to dehydration.....

of course, anyone foolish enough to ban coffee (or other caffienated beverages) in the workplace will likely face a revolution much that same that King Louis XVI of France faced!! :shocked:

OFF WITH THEIR HEADS!!!!! :laugh:

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Darkstar757

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Rebasxer
There needs to be a law passed stating that someone cannot be fired for what they do on their own free time. Suppose an employer passed said that women aren't allowed to have sex because they could get pregnant and have to take maternity leave. Would that be legal, in some states, yes. The bottom line is that firing smokers is a slippery slope to becoming North Korea with Coporate America at the helm instead of Kim Jung Ill

Completely absurd.

Employers have ALWAYS had the right to fire people for whatever reason, including moral objections. To act as if this is something new and some kind of new threat to our liberty is patently absurd.

Absurd why because you said so. Thats why this America bud and as a informed voter I will do as much as I can possible to prevent this behavior from becoming the norm.

So you believe your assumed rights trump the rights of the employer?

Fine, to have equal rights we'll pass a law stating that employers can force you to work if you want to quit for a "protected" reason.

Say your boss smokes, and you hate it and want to quit. NO!! You cannot quit. You are forced to work for an employer you cannot stand.

Wait, that's not fair, is it? Sucks when the shoe is on the other foot, doesn't it?

Informed? You're far from informed. You're an ignorant, spoiled voter with a twisted sense of entitlement who would abrogate the rights of others to make up rights for yourself.

 

[Codewiz]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Codewiz
So what would you people be saying if this was changed from smoking to gay lifestyle?

No one can say it is genetic with any certainty.

So lets assume being gay is a choice, would people be willing to let companies fire people based on sexual preference?

Why would you want to work for anyone who doesn't want you to work for them? Do you think your workplace is going to be enjoyable? Do you think you'll have much of a future or chance of advancement?

Why should ANYONE be forced to associate with someone they don't wish to associate with?

Finally, should employees be forced to work for empoyers they don't like? Because if we are to have equal rights and yet follow your lead, employers should have the right to force employees to work for them even if the employee wants to quit.

Your first and second questions are irrelevant. You either believe in some right to do what you want in your own home or you don't.

Third question, once again just rephrasing the first two questions.

The last question is relevant. No, you shouldn't have to employee people you don't like. However, if your boss has no problem with you and thought you did good work. Then years later just happens to find out you are gay, there is no reason to fire you.

I fully believe there has to be some limitations to guarantee some privacy in your own home.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Codewiz

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Codewiz
So what would you people be saying if this was changed from smoking to gay lifestyle?

No one can say it is genetic with any certainty.

So lets assume being gay is a choice, would people be willing to let companies fire people based on sexual preference?

Why would you want to work for anyone who doesn't want you to work for them? Do you think your workplace is going to be enjoyable? Do you think you'll have much of a future or chance of advancement?

Why should ANYONE be forced to associate with someone they don't wish to associate with?

Finally, should employees be forced to work for empoyers they don't like? Because if we are to have equal rights and yet follow your lead, employers should have the right to force employees to work for them even if the employee wants to quit.

Your first and second questions are irrelevant. You either believe in some right to do what you want in your own home or you don't.

Third question, once again just rephrasing the first two questions.

The last question is relevant. No, you shouldn't have to employee people you don't like. However, if your boss has no problem with you and thought you did good work. Then years later just happens to find out you are gay, there is no reason to fire you.

I fully believe there has to be some limitations to guarantee some privacy in your own home.

Let me state this one final time:

NO ONE IS TAKING AWAY YOUR RIGHTS.

You have every right to smoke all you want... and your employer has every right to refuse to associate with you. NEITHER OF YOU HAS LOST A RIGHT.

You do NOT have a right to employment. You never did. Your employer never had a right to employ you. Employment is a mutual agreement. BOTH sides can terminate that agreement for whatever reason.

My questions are TOTALLY relevant. This has NOTHING to do with privacy. Your right to privacy protects you from GOVERNMENT intrusions. It has NOTHING to do with an employer's (or friend's, or spouse's) right to refuse to associate with you for personal reasons.

 

[SMOGZINN]

Originally posted by: Phil

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: poncherelli2
why is obesity protected?

Genetics most likely. You cant choose to not be fat IF you have a genetic condition. Smoking however is completely voluntary.

What would be interesting is to see if someone who had the alcoholic gene was fired for drinking outside of company time and sued saying he had a health condition (Alcoholism)

Oh yeah you can,
it's all a functions of calories in / calories out. Genetics might make it more difficult or easier to put on weight, but you can absolutely lose weight.

My father uses an analogy which is entirely un-PC, but here it is anyway:

No-one came out of Belson fat.

It's an extreme point of view and I'm not looking for "OMG JEW HAT3R!!!one!!" posts, but it's a good point.

That is because the ones that were genetically incapable of losing weight died. There are such people, they are rare, but in my studies in I have met some. No matter how little they eat, or how much exercise they do their body simply will not switch over to burning fat, they will quit literally starve to death first.

As for the topic at hand, I think that a employer should have the right to fire people for any reason, including their lifestyle, but what should have happened is his workforce should have stood up and quit on him, smoker or not. I would have. In fact I have before in protest of other draconian rules.

 

[Rebasxer]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Darkstar757

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Rebasxer
There needs to be a law passed stating that someone cannot be fired for what they do on their own free time. Suppose an employer passed said that women aren't allowed to have sex because they could get pregnant and have to take maternity leave. Would that be legal, in some states, yes. The bottom line is that firing smokers is a slippery slope to becoming North Korea with Coporate America at the helm instead of Kim Jung Ill

Completely absurd.

Employers have ALWAYS had the right to fire people for whatever reason, including moral objections. To act as if this is something new and some kind of new threat to our liberty is patently absurd.

Absurd why because you said so. Thats why this America bud and as a informed voter I will do as much as I can possible to prevent this behavior from becoming the norm.

So you believe your assumed rights trump the rights of the employer?

Fine, to have equal rights we'll pass a law stating that employers can force you to work if you want to quit for a "protected" reason.

Say your boss smokes, and you hate it and want to quit. NO!! You cannot quit. You are forced to work for an employer you cannot stand.

Wait, that's not fair, is it? Sucks when the shoe is on the other foot, doesn't it?

Informed? You're far from informed. You're an ignorant, spoiled voter with a twisted sense of entitlement who would abrogate the rights of others to make up rights for yourself.

That's not even a valid point because physically you don't have to work, you can just not show up, and if he makes you show up by physically sezing you, that's called slavery, not equal rights.

Besides, the rights of the employee should always out weigh those of the employer because the employee has need for those rights to protect themselves from the employer, who has a much larger potential for abuse.

 

[Brutuskend]

WHAT A CROCK!

I hope THEY sue the tobacco industry for their lost jobs....

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Rebasxer

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Darkstar757

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Rebasxer
There needs to be a law passed stating that someone cannot be fired for what they do on their own free time. Suppose an employer passed said that women aren't allowed to have sex because they could get pregnant and have to take maternity leave. Would that be legal, in some states, yes. The bottom line is that firing smokers is a slippery slope to becoming North Korea with Coporate America at the helm instead of Kim Jung Ill

Completely absurd.

Employers have ALWAYS had the right to fire people for whatever reason, including moral objections. To act as if this is something new and some kind of new threat to our liberty is patently absurd.

Absurd why because you said so. Thats why this America bud and as a informed voter I will do as much as I can possible to prevent this behavior from becoming the norm.

So you believe your assumed rights trump the rights of the employer?

Fine, to have equal rights we'll pass a law stating that employers can force you to work if you want to quit for a "protected" reason.

Say your boss smokes, and you hate it and want to quit. NO!! You cannot quit. You are forced to work for an employer you cannot stand.

Wait, that's not fair, is it? Sucks when the shoe is on the other foot, doesn't it?

Informed? You're far from informed. You're an ignorant, spoiled voter with a twisted sense of entitlement who would abrogate the rights of others to make up rights for yourself.

That's not even a valid point because physically you don't have to work, you can just not show up, and if he makes you show up by physically sezing you, that's called slavery, not equal rights.

Besides, the rights of the employee should always out weigh those of the employer because the employee has need for those rights to protect themselves from the employer, who has a much larger potential for abuse.

Again, you are not forced to work. Therefore an employer CANNOT abuse you. Forcing an employer to employ you is a form of oppression.

What if a government agent came to your house with a maid and said: You MUST hire this woman? What if the government forced to to shop only at certain stores and employ the services of only certain people against your will.

Again, employement is a MUTUAL agreement. BOTH MUST have the right to terminate at any time.

 

[nakedfrog]

Originally posted by: Brutuskend
WHAT A CROCK!

I hope THEY sue the tobacco industry for their lost jobs....

You've got a good point there, I'm sure Big Tobacco has much deeper pockets than their former employer, and everyone already hates Big Tobacco