Dont mess with this Jaguar

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Silver Prime

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May 29, 2012
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Who do you think would win, Mick Jaguar vs. your choice of zoo lion?

The jaguar wouldn't fair well, since captive lions are 20+% heavier and larger than their wild counter parts, we are talking about a average captivity lion at around 600-700 lbs against a 200-350 lb jaguar? Thats a 400 pound weight advantage.

Even 2 wild tigers had a hard time with a captive lion, but I think a jaguar can at-least stand a good chance against 6 out of the 9 sub-speices of tiger, such as the malay, javan, bali, south china, Indo and sumatran tiger...who are rouhly in the same weight range as a large jaguar. Speaking of which, alot of good new'r unbeknownst data was found, and it looked even more grim for the average tiger against the lion:
http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=17524&PN=5

So to your question...a jaguar wouldn't fair well to any male lion since their weight ranges are quite maintained at 400 lbs for its whole speices. Panthera tigris 350; Jaguar 250 lb, maybe a large jaguar could do well against a small asiatic female lion. Even that, I dont know.
 
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Silver Prime

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Like a Boss:

509069-BS1.jpg


article-2412146-1BA21293000005DC-682_964x628.jpg
 
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Silver Prime

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtouHp3BU8w

Biggest caiman I ever saw.

Mabel starks Jaguar, the same size as her pair of Sumatran tigers.

Mabel-Stark-1926-1024x689.jpg


P 4 P; I think a Jaguar can beat a tiger such as a Bali, Sumatran, Malayin, Javan tiger ect who range the same weights as the larger end of jaguars masses, if some how it was a really large Jaguar and a un-usually small lion, that managed to be a equal weight bout, I'd probably still favor the lion due to his protecting factor only the Leo genus has; a mane that covers the throat and sometimes the belly from disembowling, more fighting experince and better striking method, all felidaes primary killing methods are of strangulation in inter-specifc fights with there genus, Jaguars and lions are uniquely different, Jaguars more so shatter the skulls of there victims with their powerful jaws, lions use haymaker type hits which cause concusions, the rest use paws and claws just to clout the air as a distraction to get to the vital areas... The best seems to ultilize that method is the Puma aka the superior... bear killer. The best throat grabber, would seem to be the tiger tied with the leopard.

Large jaguar next to tabby tiger and lion:
circoarbell-300x225.jpg
 
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Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
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You're thinking of panthers.
All big cats rule, is there another genus so awesome?

Rhino. Don't think a big cat could take one of them down. I've seen video of a group of lions jumping all over a hippo, and all they could do was make it rest for a minute, then it kept on going until they gave up.

A Rhino is much more ill-tempered, and has a weapon. Lion would be in a bad way vs. one of them, IF you could get them both to take the fight seriously.

1 v 1, no cat has a prayer against an adult Rhino. Rhino wins every time.

But cats are still awesome, and I really like the Jaguars.
 

gorcorps

aka Brandon
Jul 18, 2004
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Aren't jaguars incredibly endangered? Seems silly that such a skilled predator can't survive over generations. Must suck to have such cool looking fur.

+1 humanity
 

Silver Prime

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May 29, 2012
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Rhino. Don't think a big cat could take one of them down. I've seen video of a group of lions jumping all over a hippo, and all they could do was make it rest for a minute, then it kept on going until they gave up.

A Rhino is much more ill-tempered, and has a weapon. Lion would be in a bad way vs. one of them, IF you could get them both to take the fight seriously.

1 v 1, no cat has a prayer against an adult Rhino. Rhino wins every time.

But cats are still awesome, and I really like the Jaguars.

Adult bull rhinos are still vulnerable, at-least to lions...
http://teamauthority.myfastforum.org/ftopic623-0-asc-30.php

Indian rhinos are in general much smaller in size/mass and have much smaller horns to defend themselves, tigers do prey on calves and the occaisonal sickly females. Cowie mentions a bull white rhino (the biggest type of rhino) that was injured in a fight with a single male lion, which was destroyed, but I cant find its root quota only a alibie which stated lion(S). Two alibies stated a male lion has killed a rhino on its own yet died in the process, but as for how reliable they are...I dont know yet. In general they wouldn't be targeted since they are all 3; large, aggresive and powerul enough to kill even multiple lions if compelled to.

The true King of beast; is and will always be the African Bull elephant.

There is only one record I know of a Jaguar fighting a tiger, it was in Edmonds menagerie...the jaguar lost, That same tiger (Male bengal) named Nana sahib killed a lion previously by dissembowling the lion who had broken teeth and no belly mane...the tiger was losing the fight but got lucky, the tiger was owned by Mr Jamrach a famous animal seller and traper, Nana sahib attacked a small boy too at ratchcliff highway-Birmingham, the owner smashed the tigers head in with a croe bar and stuffed his hands in the tigers throat to make him release the boy, doing so that tiger was then blinded in one eye.
 
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Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
13,155
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Adult bull rhinos are still vulnerable, at-least to lions...
http://teamauthority.myfastforum.org/ftopic623-0-asc-30.php

Indian rhinos are in general much smaller in size/mass and have much smaller horns to defend themselves, tigers do prey on calves and the occaisonal sickly females. Cowie mentions a bull white rhino (the biggest type of rhino) that was injured in a fight with a single male lion, which was destroyed, but I cant find its root quota only a alibie which stated lion(S). Two alibies stated a male lion has killed a rhino on its own yet died in the process, but as for how reliable they are...I dont know yet. In general they wouldn't be targeted since they are all 3; large, aggresive and powerul enough to kill even multiple lions if compelled to.

The true King of beast; is and will always be the African Bull elephant.

Glancing over that link, I don't see any definitive proof of a single lion taking down a single adult rhino. Multiple lions, yes.....but not even many of them. It seems to be easier for lions to kill an elephant.
 

Silver Prime

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May 29, 2012
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Glancing over that link, I don't see any definitive proof of a single lion taking down a single adult rhino. Multiple lions, yes.....but not even many of them. It seems to be easier for lions to kill an elephant.

Yes as I stated they were just alibies, and I'm still looking for cowies root source which was gestured by a zeta member that a single lion accomplished the feat of injuring a bull white rhino...but yeah; as for now, I only have them attacking them with coalitions and or prides. We are talking about a nearly 5 ton wrecking ball...one lion accomplishing the feat would be insanley incredible.

I personally think its possible, he would have to tire out the rhino and not be hit even once by attacking the back legs to bring it down, since jumping on the back would do little to his thick armor like skin, the 500 lb lion would be a light weight ornament 1/20th the rhinos total mass, back-pack'd for miles. Its possible for a single male lion to accomplish it, since a roman venatio had a Barbary lion complete the task, but we dont know its condition or how reliable the account is. So again, possible...but not probable.

As veritile as rhinos are...a bull elephant of one of the largest would wreck any rhino, there was a few on youtube of the real deal fights, but they took it down for cruelty purposes...since I cant seem to find the ones I saw a while back of a elephant just man handling a white rhino on several occaisons.

I'm more afraid of the all steel construction Terminator Hydrobots. :D

:D
 
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Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
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Yes as I stated they were just alibies, and I'm still looking for cowies root source which was gestured by a zeta member that a single lion accomplished the feat of injuring a bull white rhino...but yeah; as for now, I only have them attacking them with coalitions and or prides. We are talking about a nearly 5 ton wrecking ball...one lion accomplishing the feat would be insanley incredible.

I personally think its possible, he would have to tire out the rhino and not be hit even once by attacking the back legs to bring it down, since jumping on the back would do little to his thick armor like skin, the 500 lb lion would be a light weight ornament 1/20th the rhinos total mass, back-pack'd for miles. Its possible for a single male lion to accomplish it, since a roman venatio had a Barbary lion complete the task, but we dont know its condition or how reliable the account is. So again, possible...but not probable.

As veritile as rhinos are...a bull elephant of one of the largest would wreck any rhino, there was a few on youtube of the real deal fights, but they took it down for cruelty purposes...since I cant seem to find the ones I saw a while back of a elephant just man handling a white rhino on several occaisons.



:D
Oh, anything with the weapons a male Lion has certainly COULD take down a Rhino, but the average 1v1, the Lions usually run. And not that it's really possible, obviously, but if you COULD set it up 10 times in a row, the Rhino's going to win 8-9 of them. Lion has to get in a lucky strike somewhere to win. Puncher's chance.
 

Silver Prime

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May 29, 2012
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Oh, anything with the weapons a male Lion has certainly COULD take down a Rhino, but the average 1v1, the Lions usually run. And not that it's really possible, obviously, but if you COULD set it up 10 times in a row, the Rhino's going to win 8-9 of them. Lion has to get in a lucky strike somewhere to win. Puncher's chance.

I would lean more twards 9.9 out of ten a bull white rhino would win, kill and or drive off a single male lion, its just not worth the risk they can kill badgers, wild pigs, kudu and other small non-dangerous threats to the lion before putting his life on death role, white rhinos have huge horns, some longer than 3 feet, super pointy and sharp. But what makes the lion stand a chance would be his speed, agility, dexterity and killing method, to avoid, elude the rhino and tire him out.

rhinocerous.jpg


Most likely a Barbary lion, but verifying this account would need to go through a historian to seeing how credible it is:
http://www.crystalwebvision.com/aedil/april5.htm

Not really relying on it, but it holds some merits to modern documentation...but I think a asiatic rhino being even smaller than the smaller sub-species of african ones, could be fair game for a season'd male lion in his prime years of a supreme hunter/fighter, after all the javan and sumatran rhinos are about 1/4th the size of their african cousins.

Lions evolved in the open savannah, so they are more exposed to fighting head on, hardly no ambush using jungle-like vegatation for cover, just straight up fighting prowess, so...the lion will be well adjusted into assesing every fight/hunt with a calm demanor, not really calm but attentive/aware and accustomed that is always the case with prey/predator relations through evolution, it will balance its self out some way...after all he rushes and brings down the tallest land animal on earth all by himself (Giraffes), so he has braveness, I'll still be on the look out for a bull rhino kill by a single lion...not counting on it, but in time a youtube vid will eventually show a lone bloody battle of 1 on 1 with two prime specimens in the wild.

Interesting to note, I haven't seen any evidence that a lone bull rhino could rid a coalition or pride that holds numerous prime male lions yet:
005786-JM1.jpg


It seems the rhino has a hint of respect for multiple prime looking male lions, for a good wild life blog showed a rhino stampeding in to scare off a small pride of lions, the pride didn't even budge, while the rhino stoped and was to afraid to get closer until his three bros came in to scare the lot. Sad that lions arnt as big as before, in the game keepers book there was a lion shot by martin johnson that couldent be weighed since he was too heavy for the scale I guess, and he was estimated at 750 lbs, 250 lbs lighter than the fatest captive lions, I can imagine 2 monster sized lions of that mass and power could bring down a bull rhino with the baiting system. Still, a 650 pounder like Victor zeni's lion would be more nimble and get the job done more effciently.

But anyways, Jaguars have the most unique way of killing their prey, and they love the water. lol
 
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Silver Prime

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Jaguars and leopards are similar, and I was pretty amazed how much times a leopard has killed a tiger, theres one account of a tiger named nana sahib killed a jaguar through, but the conditions of the fight seemd unfair.



Not again.

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