Do you support more gun control?

[Painman]

A nat'l moratorium on private gun ownership would make for some damn interesting reality TV.

There'd be bullet-ridden and blood-soaked FBI and ATF jackets adorning thousands of corpses all across the land.

It would spark off a bloody insurrection, and demonstrate exactly WHY we have a 2nd amendment in the very first place.

 

[OCGuy]

Guess who has an actual mandatory gun-buyback plan: Dennis Kucinich. Guess when that will happen? Never.

http://kucinich.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=62819

(April 18) — In the aftermath of Monday’s deadly shooting in Blacksburg, Virginia, Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) is proposing a comprehensive, three-point plan to deal with the violence plaguing America, including a ban on handguns.




Gun ownership is not a R/D issue. There are plenty of Southern Democrats that see the value in private gun ownership.

This issue isn't close to being a problem for gun owners. Gun laws are getting more and more lax across the country.

 

[Painman]

Guess who has an actual mandatory gun-buyback plan: Dennis Kucinich. Guess when that will happen? Never.

http://kucinich.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=62819

(April 18) — In the aftermath of Monday’s deadly shooting in Blacksburg, Virginia, Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) is proposing a comprehensive, three-point plan to deal with the violence plaguing America, including a ban on handguns.

Gun ownership is not a R/D issue. There are plenty of Southern Democrats that see the value in private gun ownership.

This issue isn't close to being a problem for gun owners. Gun laws are getting more and more lax across the country.

Dude, that's from 5 years ago. And Kucinich is a certified moonbat who's congessional seat doesn't even exist as of 2013.

He's never been a mainstream Dem/Lib. Just an agitator. So don't try to paint him as ever being otherwise.

Hell, the guy even wanted to impeach Obama over Libya.

 

[soulcougher73]

Well the day is coming that we will have to take back the country from the gov. So im ok with people owning guns. That is the exact reason why its in our laws of the country to own guns. Be kind of hard to fight back the gov with sticks and stones while they roll in with tanks and full automatic machine guns.

And no i do not own a gun. But ive been thinking about getting a pistol.

 

[dank69]

Don't own a gun and don't support gun control. Not even a tiny little bit.

 

[thraashman]

I, like most liberals, support intelligent gun control. That does not mean more necessarily, that does not mean less necessarily. That means better. Gun control that doesn't do anything to stop gun violence isn't anything but useless. Laws like Florida's stand your ground law hurt gun advocates as much as gun control they dislike because they basically allow vigilantism.

Can't say I know what gun control laws I think should be enacted, removed, updated, fixed whatever. I think better studies need be done to determine the most effective forms of action to fix this. Even if those forms of action don't even touch gun laws but instead touch education, community action, whatever.

 

[cybrsage]

Hell, the guy even wanted to impeach Obama over Libya.

To be fair, Obama did break the law. He broke the War Powers Act. I wish they had started impeachment hearings to that the law would be taken to the Supreme Court and we get a ruling on the Constitutionality of it.

 

[monovillage]

I, like most liberals, support intelligent gun control. That does not mean more necessarily, that does not mean less necessarily. That means better. Gun control that doesn't do anything to stop gun violence isn't anything but useless. Laws like Florida's stand your ground law hurt gun advocates as much as gun control they dislike because they basically allow vigilantism.

Can't say I know what gun control laws I think should be enacted, removed, updated, fixed whatever. I think better studies need be done to determine the most effective forms of action to fix this. Even if those forms of action don't even touch gun laws but instead touch education, community action, whatever.

I understand what you mean and can agree in an intellectual manner. It's pretty much the way I feel about all regulation. It should be targeted and effective.
Most gun owners support the instant background checks and checks for mental instability. Training for CCW permits as long as the fees aren't prohibitive.

 

[Ninjahedge]

Gun crontrol is too helter-skelter now.

As was being voiced by the Legals, it makes it a PITA to get a gun if you apply, but criminals can get one as easily as shopping at Wal Mart.

Both are full of shizznit, of course, but still, there is a point.

I believe there should be a process for gun ownership. They are much less vital than, say, a car and are much more DIRECTLY deadly (balance out deaths by each with hours of active use and you will get a realistic death ratio), so they should have a process that is fair, swift, but thorough when it comes to licensing and purchase.

Example (none of the times are set in stone):

-10 hours training

-Licensing exam, including firing range test (you can't parallel park, you may not get your license. How can you get your gun if you have difficulty hitting the broad side of a barn?)

-Waiting period/background check. Lets face it, there are VERY FEW situations where you would legitimately need a handgun overnight. If you truly want one, you can wait 2 weeks util you are green lighted. Hell, it takes longer for kitchen cabinetry.

-Registration. People should be registered for each type of weapon they own and can own. The number is up for debate.

-Permit tagging or electronic key. This is the hard one. We have it now where they can make wrist bands or other means to make sure YOU are the only one that can fire your gun. There can be provisions applied making your gun registered to yourself, your wife, and your 22 year old kid, but nobody can sneak in, find the gun in the sock drawer, and hold you up with it. Also, this would NOT BE REGISTERED. This is not a government tally sheet. YOU will be able to set and reset your key-bands. They will be issued to you by the licensing division depending on what you are licensed in, but then you can sync it with your own weapons.

That last one, is like I said, difficult.

But we have to find a way to limit guns getting into the hands of:
Kids
Criminals
The mentally unstable

If all it takes to have a gun is patience and some training, a lot less unstable individuals would have them.

If we had those lock bands, it would be much more difficult for someone to use what does not belong to them (hell, these should be standard issue for cops already!)

The key is not banning weapons, but stop changing the subject every time someone says anything about regulating them. Then need regulation and we need to come up with something a bit more universally applied even if it has local provisions.

 

[QuantumPion]

Laws like Florida's stand your ground law hurt gun advocates as much as gun control they dislike because they basically allow vigilantism.

No they don't. Either you are grossly misinformed, or you are simply lying.

Can't say I know what gun control laws I think should be enacted, removed, updated, fixed whatever. I think better studies need be done to determine the most effective forms of action to fix this. Even if those forms of action don't even touch gun laws but instead touch education, community action, whatever.

Send me a PM, I will buy you a kindle or nook copy of More Guns Less Crime to read.

 

[alkemyst]

No they don't. Either you are grossly misinformed, or you are simply lying.



Send me a PM, I will buy you a kindle or nook copy of More Guns Less Crime to read.

They won't read it, they are obviously victims of our media and politics.

There is a big push by the powers that be to leverage the minority vote and gain more gun control on the Martin/Zimmerman case.

It's sad when people think lawful citizens turn chaotic due to buying a gun.

My daily carry includes OC spray and a knife. I haven't had to use my knife yet...it's been close a few times.

 

[QuantumPion]

They won't read it, they are obviously victims of our media and politics.

There is a big push by the powers that be to leverage the minority vote and gain more gun control on the Martin/Zimmerman case.

It's sad when people think lawful citizens turn chaotic due to buying a gun.

My daily carry includes OC spray and a knife. I haven't had to use my knife yet...it's been close a few times.

Maybe in general, but if you read thraashman's post he says he doesn't know what the effect of the laws are and wants studies to be done. I offered to show him the studies that were done. He seemed to be more open minded.

 

[alkemyst]

good reason we need to be able to carry guns:

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/c...harged-with-pointing-gun-at-lake-2332692.html

 

[WackyDan]

Example (none of the times are set in stone):

-10 hours training

I went through two days of training back in the day for my CCW. If your point is that the training mandate does not exist, then you are wrong. It varies by state. I know what you are trying to say... and I'll agree to a degree. I am a gun owner but do feel that in order to purchase a firearm you should be required to take a gun safety course and show proof of that before every purchase...and renew that training every "x" amount of years.

-Licensing exam, including firing range test (you can't parallel park, you may not get your license. How can you get your gun if you have difficulty hitting the broad side of a barn?)

Many CCW courses mandate range time as part of the course. Some do, some don't.

-Waiting period/background check. Lets face it, there are VERY FEW situations where you would legitimately need a handgun overnight. If you truly want one, you can wait 2 weeks util you are green lighted. Hell, it takes longer for kitchen cabinetry.

There is a mandatory background check for firearm purchases now. The FBI provides these. If I am a law abiding citizen, why should I wait? Plus, the reality is, the waiting period does little to nothing to prevent gun related crimes of passion.

-Registration. People should be registered for each type of weapon they own and can own. The number is up for debate.

FUCK THIS. Registration is a master list of legitimate firearm owners - for what purpose? Can you tell me? When I lived in NY, the state knew every handgun I had as it had to be logged on my permit. Here in NC, they maintain a list of every CCW holder in the state that you can request a copy of. The local sheriff's dept knows every time I buy a gun as it is logged by the dealer. That is far enough thank you. Nobody in gov't should have a master list of firearms owned... They should not be able to use that list to profile law abiding citizens or as a means to seizure of weapons. Are criminals required to register theirs?

-Permit tagging or electronic key. This is the hard one. We have it now where they can make wrist bands or other means to make sure YOU are the only one that can fire your gun. There can be provisions applied making your gun registered to yourself, your wife, and your 22 year old kid, but nobody can sneak in, find the gun in the sock drawer, and hold you up with it. Also, this would NOT BE REGISTERED. This is not a government tally sheet. YOU will be able to set and reset your key-bands. They will be issued to you by the licensing division depending on what you are licensed in, but then you can sync it with your own weapons.

Proven not to work... and when I say proven, it has been proven in the field by various law enforcement agencies looking to prevent an officer's firearm from being used against them... The technology would be fucking great if it worked 100% of the time and worked FAST enough.

I would suggest that we could levy hash penalties on anyone who's firearm was stolen from their property or injured a child because they improperly stored it... You start having a zero tolerance policy on stupid shit like that and you will even have the stupid idiots paying attention to the law. My primary carry piece is locked up at all times when not on my person.

That last one, is like I said, difficult.

But we have to find a way to limit guns getting into the hands of:
Kids
Criminals
The mentally unstable

If all it takes to have a gun is patience and some training, a lot less unstable individuals would have them.

If we had those lock bands, it would be much more difficult for someone to use what does not belong to them (hell, these should be standard issue for cops already!)

The key is not banning weapons, but stop changing the subject every time someone says anything about regulating them. Then need regulation and we need to come up with something a bit more universally applied even if it has local provisions.

They are already heavily regulated. Near 27,000 federal, state, and local gun laws on the books across the U.S.

Some would argue that we should toss out most of the laws and regulations and simple provide a common sense approach to gun laws, and enforce the living shit out of the laws that we can trim down to coupled with harsh penalties.... But nobody has the heart to make punishment 1) harsh and 2) stick.

 

[woolfe9999]

Part of it may be that the poll doesn't really ask what you think it asks. The only options are "ban guns", "somewhat more gun control" and "no additional gun control".

Since we have some gun control right now in most places, and quite a bit in some states, not supporting MORE gun control is not at all the same as being "against gun control". And for that matter, voting for some additional gun control isn't "rabidly in favor of gun control". Your problem seems to be that you think only those two extremes exist...

I was referring to the stereotype of liberals being gun banners. I don't think this poll tends to support the stereotype, unscientific as it is. This poll shows only ~5% supporting a ban, and only ~18% supporting any gun control beyond what we already have. Given the proliferation of concealed and open carry permits these days, I'd say we've moved away from gun control on the whole lately, so if you support leaving it where it is, you're probably at least moderate-right on the issue of guns. So either very few liberals voted in this poll, or it seems that at least AT liberals aren't staunch gun control advocates, on average.

And my point goes directly to right wing fears of liberals increasing gun control in the future, which is precisely why I made the point here, because this poll does not support those fears.

 

[corwin]

No and here's why...the laws we already have aren't enforced so why add more to it? The only people troubled by these laws are the ones who obey the laws, leave us the hell alone.

 

[*kjm]

No and here's why...the laws we already have aren't enforced so why add more to it? The only people troubled by these laws are the ones who obey the laws, leave us the hell alone.

:thumbsup:

 

[alkemyst]

Maybe in general, but if you read thraashman's post he says he doesn't know what the effect of the laws are and wants studies to be done. I offered to show him the studies that were done. He seemed to be more open minded.

if he really cared, wouldn't he have looked it up at least?

That's the thing with this, people just react out of fear.

GUNS! NO NO NO BAN THEM!

 

[jackstar7]

if he really cared, wouldn't he have looked it up at least?

That's the thing with this, people just react out of fear.

GUNS! NO NO NO BAN THEM!

Similarly out of fear:

GUNS?! MINE MINE MINE! YOU CAN'T TOUCH THEM!

 

[corwin]

Similarly out of fear:

GUNS?! MINE MINE MINE! YOU CAN'T TOUCH THEM!

Don't you mean out of a constitutionally protected right? I mean, it IS a right after all...and if it weren't for those who want to infringe on that right nobody would have to worry about it...intelligent laws to keep criminals in check are already there, using a tragedy here and there to push for more sanctions against lawful owners is a sad reality though so no, you can't touch my guns now or ever and I would appreciate it if you'd stop trying

 

[alkemyst]

Similarly out of fear:

GUNS?! MINE MINE MINE! YOU CAN'T TOUCH THEM!

I don't think you understand this at all.

you 18 yet?

 

[jackstar7]

I don't think you understand this at all.

you 18 yet?

I think the motives are interesting. I'm not trying to ban anything. I just enjoy the psychology of gun owners. It's fascinating. The gun sales spike during this administration seemingly based on fears of new legislation suggest fear as a motivator.

And I'm not stereotyping all of them as paranoid or fearful or anything like that. But many do have fear as a priciple motivator for ownership.

It's the ones who have the motivation and deny it that are suspect to me. Mature people have no problem admitting fears.

But by all means, attack me based on the age you imagine me to be. I'm sure that's not coming from a vantage of hilarious arrogance.

 

[Ninjahedge]

Wacky, I listed a half dozen regulations.

That, at a federal level, would replace 27,000.

How is reducing the varying laws a bad thing? I am not calling for forbiddance, just a bit more order to the chaos.

As for the cataloging, it would be a way to keep track of who has (basically) what. You get a license for certain weapon types. Pistol, assault rifle, whatever. You have a bit more lattitide, but you are qualified only in certain licensure and we have record of that... say for the National Guard or militia during a time of national emergency...

BUT, there would be no record of number of guns. This is tricky though. Would you be comfortable if you found out your neighbor had a cellar full of modded M16's?


Now, for the bracelets? How did they not work? All I heard was that people did not WANT them, and THAT made them "not work". This is not something that would guarantee compliance, but it would make it more difficult to circumvent than simply going into someone's drawer and pulling out their pistol.

There would have to be some thought put into how it would work. How it could be checked in-situ by a cop (it would not only be your "receipt" for the gun, it would have your licenses/permits on it as well). But you would have to find a way to keep your info private (remember EZ-Pass and the state wanting to use it to track and automatically give speeding tickets?).

The problem is, this issue is too emotionally charged and those that have the most to prove in it are the ones yelling the loudest and making the least sense.

 

[Ninjahedge]

Jack, calm down.


He was just looking for a date....

 

[irishScott]

I think the motives are interesting. I'm not trying to ban anything. I just enjoy the psychology of gun owners. It's fascinating. The gun sales spike during this administration seemingly based on fears of new legislation suggest fear as a motivator.

And I'm not stereotyping all of them as paranoid or fearful or anything like that. But many do have fear as a priciple motivator for ownership.

It's the ones who have the motivation and deny it that are suspect to me. Mature people have no problem admitting fears.

But by all means, attack me based on the age you imagine me to be. I'm sure that's not coming from a vantage of hilarious arrogance.

I'm afraid Obama will take anti-gun measures in some form or other. He's already appointed two very anti-2nd justices to the supreme court. If it's a fear, it's a pretty rational one. I just see it as a potential political reality.

Will any serious anti-gun legislation make it through in Obama's 2nd term? Probably not.